Why is it always the man's role to approach women?
Why is it that men have to approach women all the time when women rarely approach men? I gather it is due to gender roles in society? It's just frustrating, because in the past there has been three girls that liked me, gave me a string subtle hints that I never once picked up on and then waited for me to approach them. They then got bored waiting and eventually thought "screw this" and found other men.
Two of these women approached me some months to disclose their interest in me from months gone by and then they asked me "Why didn't I approach them". I then told them they were being opaque and I didn't give me the green light to approach". They looked rather confused by this, because men usually approach men regardless and either get with the girl or leave empty handed, and then they approach another girl and the same cycle happens again.
I'm not one of these men, I don't waste my time approaching several women with the aim of getting with one. I've approached women in the past, with moderate success, but I'd love it if one girl was just to approach me, give me the green light to pursue her, instead of leaving subtle hints and then waiting around for me magically recognise these subtle hints and then approach her.
I think I'm in the same situation again and it's boring, girl likes me, does everything she can to talk to me and interact with me, drops a few subtle hints that I don't realise are hints until some two days later and then quietly waits for me to approach her.
It's a boring game and I can't be bothered with games. I don't know if these women think I will reject them, if they dare approach me instead of the other way around, but its annoying. I'm not one of these guys who enjoys the thrill of the chase, I prefer to have my thrills in the bedroom.
I was wondering if other men have this problem? do you like having this problem? Or are you like me and want girls to do their fairshare of approaching?
Actually, women are giving you positive signals all the time. Their method of approach is different and not as obvious as a man's, so you must alter your perception response to effectively consider it.
I can now, with this knowledge, look back and see the opportunities I missed simply because I was clueless and, apparently, like you, don't have the emotional center for more aggressive pursuit of women.
I mentioned this nuance in a recently filed journal. It might be helpful. Take heart
I was wondering if other men have this problem? do you like having this problem? Or are you like me and want girls to do their fairshare of approaching?
Yep. I went to a boys school and had no regular contact with girls my age. Now at uni, if a girl takes a liking towards me, more often than not they'll be signalling a brick wall. Don't like to have the problem and have been working on what to look out for. And yeah, girls should approach if subtle signals don't work.
Well I tend not to take women being friendly into consideration, as I see it for what it is being friendly. Friends of mine, even the more experienced one's, will say a woman "wants them" after being friendly with them, I'd like to know how they know this. Positive signals do not necessarily mean that women are interested in you.
I don't believe the pursuit of a woman should be as complex as the Manhattan Project or the first caveman who invented the wheel. I just haven't got the patience, time or energy to be playing games based around society's outdated gender roles. If a man likes a woman, the man approaches the woman (usually, unless the man is shy, for example). If, a man approaches a woman, then I do not see why a woman shouldn't approach a man, if the woman is keen on what she has seen.
Because women are not very smart and they can't read maps, that way they won't know where the men are so the men have to direct them with gentle words and promise of security and cuddles.
Yep. I went to a boys school and had no regular contact with girls my age. Now at uni, if a girl takes a liking towards me, more often than not they'll be signalling a brick wall. Don't like to have the problem and have been working on what to look out for. And yeah, girls should approach if subtle signals don't work.
Our situation are slightly different, but I understand what you're getting at, Ped! Note I am not talking about body language, I can't read body language and no one person's body language is the same, therefore I do not buy into the body language rubbish that is promoted by con artists. I mean in conversation, girls more often than not leave their hints into an everyday conversation.
It's just if you are as oblivious as I am to the hints, you just presume it is normal conversation and naturally presume they aren't interested in you beyond a platonic level.
I just think if a woman likes a man, a woman should approach the man and leave enough readable hints for him to take the initiative. The women who have left me readable hints and a green light to approach them are the one's I have gone after and had success with, because I know what they want and where they stand.
Both sexes just make life more difficult for the other.
Because women are not very smart and they can't read maps, that way they won't know where the men are so the men have to direct them with gentle words and promise of security and cuddles.
I don't know what women you've met, but the women I've met don't want cuddles they want hot sex in an Anne Summer's changing room.
Well I tend not to take women being friendly into consideration, as I see it for what it is being friendly. Friends of mine, even the more experienced one's, will say a woman "wants them" after being friendly with them, I'd like to know how they know this. Positive signals do not necessarily mean that women are interested in you.
I don't believe the pursuit of a woman should be as complex as the Manhattan Project or the first caveman who invented the wheel. I just haven't got the patience, time or energy to be playing games based around society's outdated gender roles. If a man likes a woman, the man approaches the woman (usually, unless the man is shy, for example). If, a man approaches a woman, then I do not see why a woman shouldn't approach a man, if the woman is keen on what she has seen.
You'll note, from a scientific standpoint, the pursuit of women is far more complex than creating an atomic reaction. This is why scientists (the male kind anyway) live in caves and invent wheels and atomic bombs. Women? Oy!
You'll note I did not mention "friendly" at all in my posting, as I'm all too familiar with that, having intimate knowledge of the friend zone. I think I left a good leather sofa over there. No, a woman who is interested will give you specific signals that are, for her, just like you walking up to a strange woman you find attractive and showing a more obvious attention to. In fact, she may have had her eye on you for months, especially if you're a construction worker working in her hospital (ha L_L ). Seriously, women see all the subtleties, talk about them with their girlfriends and/or sisters and generally invest a good deal more time on such matters than you do.
Sounds great, right?
You know, I really had little understanding of this until getting married, whereupon I lost the "need" or "desire" to overtly approach women. It was then that I really could relax and I started to see all the little things which had been there all along but I just had not processed them correctly because of being hog-tied by my own psychology.
"Free your mind", as Morpheus says to Neo in "Matrix". Very true
Our situation are slightly different, but I understand what you're getting at, Ped! Note I am not talking about body language, I can't read body language and no one person's body language is the same, therefore I do not buy into the body language rubbish that is promoted by con artists. I mean in conversation, girls more often than not leave their hints into an everyday conversation.
It's just if you are as oblivious as I am to the hints, you just presume it is normal conversation and naturally presume they aren't interested in you beyond a platonic level.
Oh okay. When it comes to signals in conversation, my reaction is the exact opposite to signals in body language. If I have hard time with body language, I have a tendency to take a good, fun conversation (especially when the girl starts teasing me or if we start exchanging witty remarks) as a sign. Then it turns out the girl was just messing around the way she would with a friend (I usually get saved the embarassment of starting to chase because she'd do it to another guy and I put 2 and 2 together).
Why is it that men have to approach women all the time when women rarely approach men? I gather it is due to gender roles in society?
Not to be vulgar, but who's going to get penetrated if things work out? It seems like, as a matter of self-preservation, you wouldn't just throw open the gates to everyone. Only to those who have the right credentials and ask nicely.
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I don't believe the pursuit of a woman should be as complex as the Manhattan Project or the first caveman who invented the wheel. I just haven't got the patience, time or energy to be playing games based around society's outdated gender roles. If a man likes a woman, the man approaches the woman (usually, unless the man is shy, for example). If, a man approaches a woman, then I do not see why a woman shouldn't approach a man, if the woman is keen on what she has seen.
It's simple JP, I need to know that you can catch a cougar. To some, it's outdated, but to the men intimidated by aggressive women, and women looking for a "provider," it's not.
I'm just bashful, and don't see anything sexy about my knees knocking together. Really, JP, if I started shaking and stuttering would you still give me your number? (That may not be typical, but still...)
For me, and many of my other female friends, aside from being shy, we just feel that a man is going to get what he wants (or at least go after it). If I've made myself available, and take the time to show interest in you, you must not really want me if you haven't gone for it.
That's not the way all women think, and it's not what all women do or expect, but... for me and the majority of my friends, that's just the way we feel.
My bff and I ended up in similar situations not so long ago when it came to being the aggressors. We both concluded that we didn't want to "wear the pants" in the relationship, and feared that if we had to be that aggressive, the entire relationship might be that way! Wanna go on a date, I always have to ask, etc, etc, etc.
Even if that's not a rational conclusion, that is what was going on in our minds at the time. For her, it was a guy she had a crush on, for me, it was someone I was already involved with.
It's simple JP, I need to know that you can catch a cougar. To some, it's outdated, but to the men intimidated by aggressive women, and women looking for a "provider," it's not.
I'm just bashful, and don't see anything sexy about my knees knocking together. Really, JP, if I started shaking and stuttering would you still give me your number? (That may not be typical, but still...)
For me, and many of my other female friends, aside from being shy, we just feel that a man is going to get what he wants (or at least go after it). If I've made myself available, and take the time to show interest in you, you must not really want me if you haven't gone for it.
That's not the way all women think, and it's not what all women do or expect, but... for me and the majority of my friends, that's just the way we feel.
My bff and I ended up in similar situations not so long ago when it came to being the aggressors. We both concluded that we didn't want to "wear the pants" in the relationship, and feared that if we had to be that aggressive, the entire relationship might be that way! Wanna go on a date, I always have to ask, etc, etc, etc.
Even if that's not a rational conclusion, that is what was going on in our minds at the time. For her, it was a guy she had a crush on, for me, it was someone I was already involved with.
If you were shaking and stuttering around me, I'd probably think you had some kind of allergic reaction to my cologne. I see, what you are saying, but I can be introverted, shy and reclusive at times. So, it's not always easy for me to just to walk up to a girl and "get what I want".
I'm a bit shy around this girl, because she is so vague about her intentions, that I cannot possibly read and if she is interested in me beyond the realms of platonism, she seems friendly, she gave me the widest and nicest of smiles just yesterday, but it doesn't mean anything, if the traffic lights wont turn from red to green. I am interested in her, just like I was interested in the previous girl who was so subtle and vague, that I was so oblivious to it, that I ended up developing a want for a friendship because I thought she wasn't interested.
So, maybe women should be more obvious and direct with men they are interested in, a signal of intention isn't going to kill you women and it enables us "less than observant men" to recognise when a girl is interested, so we can "go for it". I don't mind "going for it" when a woman states her intention in a non-subtle way, it doesn't even have to be blatantly obvious, but a smile or a compliment isn't the way to get men like to realise that a woman is interested. That is why, women are unlucky with men like me, we are too stupid to pick up the hints and you women just presume we aren't interested and both parties move on.
If you were shaking and stuttering around me, I'd probably think you had some kind of allergic reaction to my cologne. I see, what you are saying, but I can be introverted, shy and reclusive at times. So, it's not always easy for me to just to walk up to a girl and "get what I want".
I'm a bit shy around this girl, because she is so vague about her intentions, that I cannot possibly read and if she is interested in me beyond the realms of platonism, she seems friendly, she gave me the widest and nicest of smiles just yesterday, but it doesn't mean anything, if the traffic lights wont turn from red to green. I am interested in her, just like I was interested in the previous girl who was so subtle and vague, that I was so oblivious to it, that I ended up developing a want for a friendship because I thought she wasn't interested.
So, maybe women should be more obvious and direct with men they are interested in, a signal of intention isn't going to kill you women and it enables us "less than observant men" to recognise when a girl is interested, so we can "go for it". I don't mind "going for it" when a woman states her intention in a non-subtle way, it doesn't even have to be blatantly obvious, but a smile or a compliment isn't the way to get men like to realise that a woman is interested. That is why, women are unlucky with men like me, we are too stupid to pick up the hints and you women just presume we aren't interested and both parties move on.
Please see my thread entitled The Worse That Could Happen
Another good reason many of us would rather toss our hair and say "Oh, nevermind" than be the aggressor...
I have to disagree with JP here. Women ARE pretty obvious when they are interested. If one wonders whether a woman is interested or not, she most likely isn't.
As for the original question, it's all a matter of offer and demand. Decent women have more offers than they can handle. Typically, men are more "keen" than women and a woman who seems too keen might be perceived as desperate.
As an adult, it is our responsibility to get rid of our shyness. Otherwise, you only get what you deserve.
Women ARE pretty obvious when they are interested. If one wonders whether a woman is interested or not, she most likely isn't.
Some women CAN BE pretty obvious. And whether the signals are received depends on the type of signal sent and also whether the receiver is properly tuned in. Some guys can't read a signal to save their lives.
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