[transcontinental]

As one may have guessed, I'm a female (can't decide if I'm a girl or woman! ). And I'm 19 this year.

It's a long story, so bear with me for a bit...

There's Z (19y/o), whom I met 2 years ago and love a lot. It's been a rollercoaster ride once we hit the 6month plateau, because we've been long distance from the start. We're transcontinental- he's in the US, I'm in Asia. 2 months ago he broke up with me (our 2nd breakup) and I really worked and put in effort at getting over him. I let myself meet new people, so I was actually rather perplexed when he came back a month later and said he wanted to be with me.

During that one-month break he refused to initiate conversation or anything; it was always me. Also, someone ('T', 27 y/o) had also entered my life. T is a lot closer to me geographically-speaking, though still overseas. But he was older (8 years, though it doesn't feel that way...) and has the money when it comes to travelling to meet up. He has a girlfriend whom he will be breaking things off with this coming weekend. [I know it's easy to jump in and judge him because he has a girlfriend... but it's just a case of a man who's bad at breaking things off.]

So after Z came back, me and T were walking on very thin ice. At first I made a little joke of having an affair with him, but within days I was torn. I was cheating on Z, and ... it's not fair to any of us.

So I broke things up with him a week ago, and it hasn't been easy.

I can't be with Z LD for another 2 years... it'd just repeat, this roller coaster of emotions. "2" is a magical number because by then I'd be 21 and graduated from my degree course. Yet I love him.

I've been thinking that perhaps I'm missing the idea of being with someone - not the person himself - but that has been proven otherwise.

T knows most of what's happened between Z and me. He was a sort of a comfort-pillar, but he was always respectful of me. Even now he tells me that he's unwilling to "come on too strong" to me, and I'm thankful for that.

I spoke to Z earlier today... and he told me that he won't fight for me. It's beneath him; it's childish. I should be able to decide, to choose myself. And I'm exasperated. I told him... All you have to do, is to say the word, and show how you actually want me. Words are cheap.

And he still refuses to fight for me. To fight over me.

Even when we were together and Z became aware of T he never saw him as "competition". It never once crossed his mind to be defensive of me, to do a little something more than "making me happy".
----------------

Am I asking too much of Z - or any male for that matter?

I'll freely admit that right now I don't know what.. or who I really want. At this stage of life, T can provide for me, while Z can't. In fact, I'd have to fly over to his country... he hates my mother, so he's unwilling to come down (though after the last break up he said he would come down.. when he got the money. Which I can say by the pace of his saving, would be in about a year's time. He has a part time job, not studying, but he has family bills to contribute to and such.)

My thoughts are all over the place at the moment, but I would greatly appreciate any thoughts on this.

One learns in my course of studying that people draw comfort from sharing their burdens to strangers

[blind_otter]

I think it's asinine and childish to insist that men fight over you, too. I agree with Z. You're an adult, ostensibly. Make your choice and go with it. Why on earth would you need the ego stroking of two men fighting with each other to "win" you?

[Trialbyfire]

Do you have real feelings for either one of these men? I don't see it. What I see is "me, me, me".

[transcontinental]

Originally Posted by blind_otter

I think it's asinine and childish to insist that men fight over you, too. I agree with Z. You're an adult, ostensibly. Make your choice and go with it. Why on earth would you need the ego stroking of two men fighting with each other to "win" you?

Hello blind_otter,

I don't quite know how to explain it... it's not just about being fought over, granted it can be nice for my ego to be stroked. Non, it's the feeling that he's not willing to do much to keep me with him. I initiated the break up because I couldn't feel the spark or connection anymore - we have nothing in common and we have few mutual friends. I can see this working out if we're in the same country, but that won't be till at least 2 years.

In the period of 2 years though, Z doesn't look like he's going to initiate conversation or indeed, anything, with me. He seems impossibly passive at this point of them and I'm frustrated; I want some sort of signal other than mere words that yes he does want me and would do something to keep our connection...

Originally Posted by Trialbyfire

Do you have real feelings for either one of these men? I don't see it. What I see is "me, me, me".

Hello Trialbyfire,

at this moment it's all "me, me, me". But I love Z; there's just been so many memories we've shared. And I can love T... but I don't want to go with him, then leave him after 2 year to be with Z. I'm not sure if you understand... ok, how about, I'm not ready to love T until Z is out of my life...?

-----

Thanks, both of you. Both of your questions cut to the point, but you're helping me look at this from other angles... thanks again.

[bish]

Originally Posted by transcontinental

So after Z came back, me and T were walking on very thin ice. At first I made a little joke of having an affair with him

well gee, that explains why you and T are on thin ice. You NEVER, EVER joke about having an affair with another man, much less an X.

That is grounds for T dumping you right then and there.

but within days I was torn. I was cheating on Z, and ... it's not fair to any of us.

How were you "cheating" on Z? He broke up with you.

T knows most of what's happened between Z and me. He was a sort of a comfort-pillar, but he was always respectful of me.

Even though you weren't respectful to him by teasing him about having and affair with Z.

Even now he tells me that he's unwilling to "come on too strong" to me, and I'm thankful for that.

I spoke to Z earlier today... and he told me that he won't fight for me. It's beneath him; it's childish.

I agree. he shouldn't have to "fight" for you. But then again, why does he care? he was the one that broke up.

I should be able to decide, to choose myself. And I'm exasperated. I told him... All you have to do, is to say the word, and show how you actually want me. Words are cheap.

So basically, T is second fiddle to someone that broke up with you, and if Z says he wants you, you are going to dump T like yesterday's trash.

But if Z continues to say he won't fight for you and doesn't want you, then the guy you would treat like trash, all of a sudden, is worthy.

Thats pretty damn lousy and T is being treated like dirt.

And he still refuses to fight for me. To fight over me.

Again, I don't blame him one bit. T should realize this too and refuse to fight for you...especially if he found out that he is 2nd fiddle and only a backup plan.

Am I asking too much of Z - or any male for that matter?

thats asking too much of any male, or female. And its pretty damn narcissistic and conceited on your part. Not to mention that whoever loses gets dumped like trash, but if one says they aren't playing your game, then the potential trash is now winner only by default.

Way to play 'em!

I'll freely admit that right now I don't know what.. or who I really want.

Then why in the hell are you making them play your silly game of "fight for me"???

At this stage of life, T can provide for me, while Z can't. In fact, I'd have to fly over to his country... he hates my mother, so he's unwilling to come down (though after the last break up he said he would come down.. when he got the money. Which I can say by the pace of his saving, would be in about a year's time. He has a part time job, not studying, but he has family bills to contribute to and such.)

And this is the guy you are treating T like crap for?? Oh my.

My thoughts are all over the place at the moment, but I would greatly appreciate any thoughts on this.

Here is my thought. Leave both men alone and quit playing with them.

Be by yourself until you figure out what you want. And by that time, hopefully, it will be someone other than Z or T.

[Untouchable_Fire]

Originally Posted by transcontinental

I spoke to Z earlier today... and he told me that he won't fight for me. It's beneath him; it's childish. I should be able to decide, to choose myself. And I'm exasperated. I told him... All you have to do, is to say the word, and show how you actually want me. Words are cheap.

And he still refuses to fight for me. To fight over me.

Even when we were together and Z became aware of T he never saw him as "competition". It never once crossed his mind to be defensive of me, to do a little something more than "making me happy".

As a man, I would never "fight" for a woman who asks me to fight. If she cannot choose me without hesitation, I will not choose her. Your in a situation where you won't fight for him... so he doesn't trust it's worth the effort to fight for you.

Words are cheap, but so are women who play emotional games. Don't be like that.

You have all the evidence in front of you to make a choice. So do it.

[Trialbyfire]

Originally Posted by transcontinental

Hello Trialbyfire,

at this moment it's all "me, me, me". But I love Z; there's just been so many memories we've shared. And I can love T... but I don't want to go with him, then leave him after 2 year to be with Z. I'm not sure if you understand... ok, how about, I'm not ready to love T until Z is out of my life...?

This answers your question, doesn't it? You want to be with Z but are using T to try to get to him. It doesn't work that way and if you look at it clearly, it's a pretty cruel way to use T.

You cannot manipulate Z to want you more. He's either all in or he's not.

[Karyyk]

In other words, you want someone to make your choice for you. That's not how it works. Honestly, what you really deserve is for both of them to drop you and avoid you like the plague.

While many women may "ask" for this, no man should do it. There are times to fight for the one you love, but when she basically shows you she doesn't love you isn't one of them. I've learned that the hard way.

You might try being considerate of someone else for once in this fiasco.