[rubies_for_horses]

i know there aren't many BS on here that have stayed with the WS, but for those that are present: how do you set about really healing? my husband and i do normal, every day things all the time and have a good sex life (4-5x/wk) - but we don't talk much about the A. we are in MC - which we started about a month ago (1x a week sessions). we talk about it there, but we kind of clam up at home. everyone says that communication is important - and i agree. but i also think that dredging it up when things are good is not helping.

basically, it's been 2 years - and i have no idea if we're healing, or if we're stuck in the same place. he seems to be really struggling lately, and i don't know how to help him.

[Lizzie60]

Originally Posted by rubies_for_horses

i know there aren't many BS on here that have stayed with the WS, but for those that are present: how do you set about really healing? my husband and i do normal, every day things all the time and have a good sex life (4-5x/wk) - but we don't talk much about the A. we are in MC - which we started about a month ago (1x a week sessions). we talk about it there, but we kind of clam up at home. everyone says that communication is important - and i agree. but i also think that dredging it up when things are good is not helping.

basically, it's been 2 years - and i have no idea if we're healing, or if we're stuck in the same place. he seems to be really struggling lately, and i don't know how to help him.

so I take it that you are the WS... right?
maybe you should ask your therapist about that lack of communication at home.. maybe he/she would give you tips on how to approach the subject.

[porter218]

Well I worked things out with my WS and to be honest I don't think it ever fully heals. The best thing for you to do is just spend quality time with him and build new memories with him. The more exciting and fun stuff you do together, the further back the bad memories get pushed. But if he wants to dredge it up then let him do it all he wants, and when he doesn't want to talk about it then leave it alone. You obviously can't take back what happened so just move forward and try to make you current life with him as happy as possible. And always try to make him feel comfortable in the fact that it will never happen again(assuming you are the WS?).

[Owl]

OK...we're four years into recovery, and I think as well recovered as you can get after an affair.

For me at least, there were several things that had to happen for me to consider us "recovered".

I needed to understand what motivated her to cheat. Why/how/when/where/what/etc... I needed to know the full truth of what happened. I needed to understand what it was that she felt was lacking in our relationship, so that I could ensure that she never had that reason to cheat again.

The destroyed trust took a long time to heal. She had to SHOW me she was trustworthy. She had to (with her actions) demonstrate that she was now trustworthy. That she'd learned good boundaries, that she was happy in our marriage after the changes had been made...I needed some 'proof' if you will that it wouldn't happen again.

I had to rebuild a lot of self-esteem as well. What she did really made me wonder at what was wrong with me...it took me a couple of years to realize it WASN'T ME that was wrong...it was more about HER failings than mine.

Communication IS key in this. You need to talk through what happened to get to the same point I did...you need to understand it, understand how it affected each other, and figure out how to heal from what it did to you, and to him.

You need to see an MC who understands the impacts from infidelity, and knows how to heal a marriage from them. Take a look at marriagebuilders...lots of good information there.

You CAN heal from this, but it takes WORK as well as time.

[silktricks]

What OWL said is spot on. In addition I'd add that for me it was important that if I brought up the affair he wouldn't freeze up and get all defensive. I needed to know that anything was fair to talk about at any time. I needed to know that he wasn't going to protect himself from my hurt by pretending it didn't exist.

Communication is, as you said, the key. If you sense your husband is feeling bad, why don't you ask him if there's anything troubling him. Either of you burying your head in the sand isn't, in the long run, going to help your relationship.

As the other posters have said, it sounds like you were the WS. You need to make it very clear to your husband that what happened was your problem and not his fault. That said, the marriage obviously had issues, and the biggest was probably poor communication. Work on it.

and the best of luck.

[twice_shy]

Originally Posted by porter218

Well I worked things out with my WS and to be honest I don't think it ever fully heals.

I think you are correct, never fully.

But haven't you ever asked yourself, "don't I deserve better than to be with a cheater?" I know you must have your reasons for working it out, but I just have to wonder if you wouldn't be happier with someone else, or at the very least without a WS.

[smartgirl]

Owl and Silktricks really covered the bases. I would add that real transparency has to be there for anything to work. My H tried to keep a number of secrets over the first 7 months which came out anyway and have made recovery all the harder. Your H has to see that you have really changed. Not that you have changed just enough to keep him from leaving.

In addition, I would say talking about it is key. You may not want to be reminded of what you have done, but that won't make it go away. The natural tendency of most men is to avoid talking about things. But if the two of you can't talk about this when you are alone, then I would say in general the communications in your marriage is weak and may not be good enough to support the M going foward. As in all subjects, often it is the wife who must draw her H out. By taking a let sleeping dogs lie approach, you are really just leaving him to stew in his own juices. If you love him, do what is best for him not what is best for you.

Two years is nothing. We are at two years and I am still struggling with many aspects of this. The fact that he must still have contact with the OW at work is a big part of it. But it was the lack of honesty and openess afterwards that has cause the most damage. Be sure you don't make the same mistake.

[rubies_for_horses]

thank you for the advice.

smartgirl: i am perfectly willing to talk whenever he wants to do so - and i have kept no secrets from him. i am NC with the OM -and i have no interest in ever seeing him again. however, it is my husband who seems to want to avoid talking about it. i don't know how to draw him out about it. i've asked him directly if we can talk about it - but he always seems to avoid the subject. he goes to counseling, but he's not that talkative.

lately, he just seems to want to avoid mention of it altogether. of course - i do too - because it's less painful that way - but i'm not sure that it's helping our situation.

[mopar crazy]

My IC told me to not bring up the A b/c it was like pulling a band-aid off from a wound and not allowing it to heal. Well, I HAD to know, it was eating me up. He never wanted to talk about his A but he did. He knew if I wanted answers he needed to tell me.

Five years later I am healed but I will never forget. There are times one of us will bring up the A and it doesn't bother me as much anymore. However, if I sit and think about it and continue to do that I become depressed so I try not to do that.

Continue w/ the counseling. If your H doesn't want to talk about the A, do not bring it up.

[smartgirl]

Originally Posted by rubies_for_horses

thank you for the advice.

smartgirl: i am perfectly willing to talk whenever he wants to do so - and i have kept no secrets from him. i am NC with the OM -and i have no interest in ever seeing him again. however, it is my husband who seems to want to avoid talking about it. i don't know how to draw him out about it. i've asked him directly if we can talk about it - but he always seems to avoid the subject. he goes to counseling, but he's not that talkative.

lately, he just seems to want to avoid mention of it altogether. of course - i do too - because it's less painful that way - but i'm not sure that it's helping our situation.

I wish there was a cure for the terminally non-verbal. My H is normally the same way and is a professional conflict avoider. He could win the Olympics in that event.

He was more verbal and articulate that I thought possible in the first year and a half after the A, but he was the WS and I guess felt he owed it to me. At first much of the talk was about the facts, then it began shifting into discussion about ourselves, how our issues led to the A and how we needed to change.

Is he even willing to talk about how to improve your relationship/communication? I'd say that off hand, he needs to understand that claming up is exactly the kind of behavior that can lead to affairs. When one person is unhappy, they owe it to their partner to be open about that and about what might be done to fix it. Otherwise, you will both find yourself being unhappy.

Talking doesn't have to mean discussing the details of the affair. But understanding how he is feeling is critical to the healing equation. If you aren't getting the right kind of help from your therapist, you might want to consider talking to another. This isn't healthy for your H or your relationship.

As a first step, would he be willing to do some reading? Has he already? I would suggest "After the Affair" and "the New Male Sexuality" (have to get that one through Amazon as it is older). The second one really speaks to the male mindset and might be the most helpful for him overall. I thought it was very enlightening as well.

[rubies_for_horses]

actually, i'm reading "after the affair" now - and i find it really helpful - especially when the author talks about the feelings of the betrayed spouse. it helps me understand my husband better. it's hard to read though and realize that i'm the root of all these horrible feelings. i guess he would probably read it, if i really asked him to - but like i said - it's been 2 years. the facts are all out - we've discussed it. i think we know why i had the affair - what else is there to talk about? isn't there some point at which you stop talking about it and you start to move on and heal? where you start to try and have a normal life that doesn't include conversation about it? he is willing to talk, but it seems painful and often counter-productive.

our counselor is a very good listener, but she isn't big on making suggestions about how to heal our relationship. we've only had 3 hard-core sessions, so i'm withholding judgment. however - i think that i need a more proactive counselor. i guess we'll wait a few more sessions and see what we think.

[silktricks]

Originally Posted by smartgirl

I wish there was a cure for the terminally non-verbal. My H is normally the same way and is a professional conflict avoider. He could win the Olympics in that event.

I would bet huge amounts of money that every BS would say the same thing about their WS .

[silktricks]

Originally Posted by rubies_for_horses

i think we know why i had the affair - what else is there to talk about? isn't there some point at which you stop talking about it and you start to move on and heal? where you start to try and have a normal life that doesn't include conversation about it? he is willing to talk, but it seems painful and often counter-productive.

Talking about "it" doesn't necessarily mean talking about the affair, nor about why you had it. It means talking about your relationship now. What's on, what's off. Where are the problem areas?

The deal is that the "normal life" you had included not taking care of each other. That's why your relationship broke - right? So now "normal life" needs to include the things that make your relationship good. Communication is usually number one.

[soda]

As someone whose wife has been engaged in a couple of EAs...you need to get out of any sense of denial mode that you might be in. If you're blaming him for the affair, or making him shoulder "half" of the burden, he's always going to struggle with it. Even now that my wife and I are in MC and attempting to heal our relationship, I have a lot of thoughts about divorcing her ass for what she did...and denied...and tried to place me at fault for. Your husband may always struggle...every action has consequences, and sometimes the best you can do is bust your butt to make the situation the best it can be.

I hate to be a pessimest...but life is not an Etch-a-Sketch...you can't "start over."

[smartgirl]

Rubies, I put up a thread "attention male BS" to try and round up more input for you. There are some really thoughtful guys out there and maybe they can help. Check that thread too.