Long list of hurts... too sensitive?

[VeryBrokenMan]

My wife ended her affair about 3 months ago and I'm undecided if I want to remain married. So I've been thinking a lot about our relationship and tried to put together a list of pros and cons and the problems in the relationship. But I very easily came up with this list of hurts or problems, did not have to think much, they just flowed out. I'm wondering if my judgement is clouded and maybe I'm being too sensitive.

 

Pattern: Pressuring me to have kids before I was financially ready (long time ago)

Pattern: Making the big decision unilaterally about kids, with no compromise

Pattern: many double standards – big one that comes to mind is always saying she would leave me if I had an affair

Pattern: never being happy with me being thin and athletic

Pattern: trying to change me / picking at my traits: crossing arms / hands on hips

Pattern: Being dishonest and omitting truth / details about big and small items

Pattern: Being angry/upset with me and giving me a grievance but never having examples for me to fix

Pattern: painting ALL my actions with a broad brush – words like ALWAYS/NEVER

Pattern: Being manipulative / managing relationship / talk about training husbands – makes me think it is just a game.

Pattern: Not keeping conversations/thoughts private, even though I’ve told her repeatedly not to share with her family and friends.

Pattern: Blaming me entirely for relationship problems in the past / with me usually accepting all responsibility

Pattern: taking our life style and income for granted, feel extremely used after the affair

Pattern: being emotionally distant / no emotional intimacy

pattern: never telling me how she really felt about anything

pattern: not being able to talk about intimate details / fantasies

pattern: always expecting me to change for her to be happy

pattern: Hinting / inability to tell me what you want/desire/expect from me

Pattern: Putting me last every time she gets overwhelmed with life

Pattern: showing me little affection unless she wanted something

Pattern: Flirting with other men our entire relationship

Pattern: Talking about how attractive other men are in front of me

Pattern: Making me feel insecure by her actions / comments / flirting

Pattern: Belittling/criticizing me in front of the kids to make herself feel better

Pattern: Using sex as a weapon / reward

Pattern: Rejecting sex for years when she decided

Pattern: Never initiating sex unless she wanted to get pregnant, then it was game on

Pattern: me saying yes to everything possible financially(trips/cars/houses/furniture/etc) / she saying no to sex/intimacy anytime she wanted

 

Could not have phone sex or send me naked pics yet did with affair partner

Not realizing how addicted she was to Facebook / or how damaging it is and not considering my opinion when I warned her about Facebook in 2013

 

 

Does everyone have hurts and resentment like these after years of marriage? Or is it possible I can't see any good right now?

[jm2013]

My wife ended her affair about 3 months ago and I'm undecided if I want to remain married. So I've been thinking a lot about our relationship and tried to put together a list of pros and cons and the problems in the relationship. But I very easily came up with this list of hurts or problems, did not have to think much, they just flowed out. I'm wondering if my judgement is clouded and maybe I'm being too sensitive.

 

Pattern: Pressuring me to have kids before I was financially ready (long time ago)

Pattern: Making the big decision unilaterally about kids, with no compromise

Pattern: many double standards – big one that comes to mind is always saying she would leave me if I had an affair

Pattern: never being happy with me being thin and athletic

Pattern: trying to change me / picking at my traits: crossing arms / hands on hips

Pattern: Being dishonest and omitting truth / details about big and small items

Pattern: Being angry/upset with me and giving me a grievance but never having examples for me to fix

Pattern: painting ALL my actions with a broad brush – words like ALWAYS/NEVER

Pattern: Being manipulative / managing relationship / talk about training husbands – makes me think it is just a game.

Pattern: Not keeping conversations/thoughts private, even though I’ve told her repeatedly not to share with her family and friends.

Pattern: Blaming me entirely for relationship problems in the past / with me usually accepting all responsibility

Pattern: taking our life style and income for granted, feel extremely used after the affair

Pattern: being emotionally distant / no emotional intimacy

pattern: never telling me how she really felt about anything

pattern: not being able to talk about intimate details / fantasies

pattern: always expecting me to change for her to be happy

pattern: Hinting / inability to tell me what you want/desire/expect from me

Pattern: Putting me last every time she gets overwhelmed with life

Pattern: showing me little affection unless she wanted something

Pattern: Flirting with other men our entire relationship

Pattern: Talking about how attractive other men are in front of me

Pattern: Making me feel insecure by her actions / comments / flirting

Pattern: Belittling/criticizing me in front of the kids to make herself feel better

Pattern: Using sex as a weapon / reward

Pattern: Rejecting sex for years when she decided

Pattern: Never initiating sex unless she wanted to get pregnant, then it was game on

Pattern: me saying yes to everything possible financially(trips/cars/houses/furniture/etc) / she saying no to sex/intimacy anytime she wanted

 

Could not have phone sex or send me naked pics yet did with affair partner

Not realizing how addicted she was to Facebook / or how damaging it is and not considering my opinion when I warned her about Facebook in 2013

 

 

Does everyone have hurts and resentment like these after years of marriage? Or is it possible I can't see any good right now?

 

I'll be only 8 years married but some things on your list stuck out to me as well with my wife. I don't know about you, but my wife is almost trying to guilt me back into the marriage. When I uncovered the affair she went straight to Church I think to "show" she is remorseful and changed. Who knows. I think you are in a similar thinking pattern to where I am now though you are only 3 months in and I'm over a year. This is the most disconnected I've ever felt to my wife one year later. Her affair is a complete turn off. Nothing to celebrate ever again.

 

What you're doing I think is realizing your marriage wasn't the best before the affair. After the affair you kind of start realizing these things. My wife was a complete monster during her affair. My wife would try to reward my with sex for working out with her which she would end up denying later. I used to get so pissed off. All the while she was screwing somebody else. But it's ok now because she's a "changed" person. Friggin BS. She's a cheating, lying you know what who's been working hard on this PR campaign to rebrand herself.

[BeatsByDirk]

I'm only 6 years in and I have a list half that size. That's marriage, many times the traits that attracted us become annoying or we get caught in behavior patterns.

You were married 31 years how did you put up with this. Stand up for yourself today! What do you need, what do you want, those are the only questions for you to ask!!!

Read your list, she likes alpha dudes! You are not alpha but you are a great provider and support system.

Please look out for yourself! You are the only one that can

[jbrent890]

I'm sorry bro, but if my wife did a 1/4 of the things you listed on top of the cheating, I would have left. Dude your wife does not give a crap about you. She doesn't love you, she is dependent on you. I would never stay with someone that doesn't appreciate me. You have been selfless for far too long, I think its time for you to be selfish. This includes leaving your wife and finding someone that appreciates you. You will be surprised how many women out there would kill to be with someone like you. Your wife is never going to understand how good she had it until you leave her.

[jm2013]

How do you know your wife ended her affair? Is she putting in work to try and salvage your marriage? I'm starting to get a craving for me own independence too. The crap my wife used to bug me with is getting even more annoying now that she betrayed me. It was ok before because I thought we were in for the long haul. Things were annoying that's what happens with years of marraige. You deal with the little annoyances because you love that person. When you go out and screw around on your spouse you lose your credibility, trust and everything in-between. If I drew a table with the people she's screwed including me and labeled features in each column I would absolutely dominate it. Yet she managed to f it all up. It must be embarrassing to wreck your marriage for some goofy looking, good for nothing, idiotic sob. So weird. You seem to be in limbo right now.

 

I asked my counselor what the rates were for male BS's and Women Bs's. It sounds like women who are betrayed are able to get over it more than men. I think it's something in most men's DNA where that kind of betrayal can be too much. Recovery really depends on the person. My wife's only glimmer of hope was the child we created together. The hardest part is walking out the door and saying goodbye to your kids and tossing yourself into the every other weekend roll.

[NotCamelot]

I would like to see your list of GOOD or POSITIVE things. There is a reason you married her.

 

 

After D-Day, it is so easy to see the bad stuff. The good stuff seems to be all gone at that point. I am not saying you need to stay married. I am saying: look at all sides. If you are trying to decide what to do based on a list, be fair and list it all.

 

 

I don't know your situation. We all deal with this differently. And no one here can tell you what to do. That is what you need to figure out.

 

 

It's just that your list struck me as odd since it is so one-sided. If she is that bad, why did you marry her? I am guessing that was not the case at that time.

[Seachan]

Your lack of boundaries - refusal to stand up for yourself and your marriage - preceded (notice I didn't say "cause") your wife's violation of boundaries.

 

VBM, *WHY* do you want to stay with her? Don't you deserve better?

[HereNorThere]

The truth is that we all have things our partner's do that hurt of from time to time, but you learn put up with them because they put up with you as well. That's just a natural part of being loyal.

 

The good part is that you don't have to worry about any of these things now. See, once the loyalty is gone, you are under no obligation to continue to tolerate these things.

 

Are you going to sit around and mope or start your new life? The old one is long dead by now and has been for some time.

[beatcuff]

OP reread the list from the point was that really on me. you appear to be blaming her for EVERYTHING wrong in your life when in fact YOU allowed it to happen.

[angie2443]

OP reread the list from the point was that really on me. you appear to be blaming her for EVERYTHING wrong in your life when in fact YOU allowed it to happen.

 

Good people don't treat you like crap just because you have poor bounderies. They treat you like crap because of who they are. I understand that OP needs stronger bounderies, but, from the list, his wife just sounds like a selfish, nasty, person. Stronger bounderies from him won't change this, but they might help him get out of a bad relationship.

[gettingstronger]

I feel like just like the WS, you are rewriting your marriage history-I think its pretty normal as you continue to process this- you are looking for all the red flags you missed, looking at her under a microscope- while I don't think this is a bad thing, I do think you are leaning towards divorcing her-

 

I can not tell you if you should or should not- all I can say, is be honest- I know you don't feel like she deserves it, and yo may be right-but for your own peace of mind- be honest, tell her you are on the fence but willing to try- hash out all the things in your mind with her as calmly as possible-

 

I have made a ton of mistakes in reconciliation, I have said some really horrible things-but I have been 100% honest about my intentions and for that I feel really good-

[Realist3]

My wife ended her affair about 3 months ago and I'm undecided if I want to remain married. So I've been thinking a lot about our relationship and tried to put together a list of pros and cons and the problems in the relationship. But I very easily came up with this list of hurts or problems, did not have to think much, they just flowed out. I'm wondering if my judgement is clouded and maybe I'm being too sensitive.

 

Pattern: Pressuring me to have kids before I was financially ready (long time ago)

Pattern: Making the big decision unilaterally about kids, with no compromise

Pattern: many double standards – big one that comes to mind is always saying she would leave me if I had an affair

Pattern: never being happy with me being thin and athletic

Pattern: trying to change me / picking at my traits: crossing arms / hands on hips

Pattern: Being dishonest and omitting truth / details about big and small items

Pattern: Being angry/upset with me and giving me a grievance but never having examples for me to fix

Pattern: painting ALL my actions with a broad brush – words like ALWAYS/NEVER

Pattern: Being manipulative / managing relationship / talk about training husbands – makes me think it is just a game.

Pattern: Not keeping conversations/thoughts private, even though I’ve told her repeatedly not to share with her family and friends.

Pattern: Blaming me entirely for relationship problems in the past / with me usually accepting all responsibility

Pattern: taking our life style and income for granted, feel extremely used after the affair

Pattern: being emotionally distant / no emotional intimacy

pattern: never telling me how she really felt about anything

pattern: not being able to talk about intimate details / fantasies

pattern: always expecting me to change for her to be happy

pattern: Hinting / inability to tell me what you want/desire/expect from me

Pattern: Putting me last every time she gets overwhelmed with life

Pattern: showing me little affection unless she wanted something

Pattern: Flirting with other men our entire relationship

Pattern: Talking about how attractive other men are in front of me

Pattern: Making me feel insecure by her actions / comments / flirting

Pattern: Belittling/criticizing me in front of the kids to make herself feel better

Pattern: Using sex as a weapon / reward

Pattern: Rejecting sex for years when she decided

Pattern: Never initiating sex unless she wanted to get pregnant, then it was game on

Pattern: me saying yes to everything possible financially(trips/cars/houses/furniture/etc) / she saying no to sex/intimacy anytime she wanted

 

Could not have phone sex or send me naked pics yet did with affair partner

Not realizing how addicted she was to Facebook / or how damaging it is and not considering my opinion when I warned her about Facebook in 2013

 

 

Does everyone have hurts and resentment like these after years of marriage? Or is it possible I can't see any good right now?

 

I'm sure most of those are valid, and some seem pretty iffy, but that matters not; that is your perception. Perception equals a person's reality.

 

My perception of your list is that you are not viewed as her equal. She settled, in her mind. That dynamic is a mighty tough one to overcome. Her view of you is set in stone, and in many ways you helped form that view. The only way you can change her view is to leave, and show her what she lost.

[Be_Strong]

Your list says so much more about you than it does about your wife. It seems that you're a total and complete beta husband in your marriage, causing your wife to have zero respect for you. Whether you divorce or not, you need to learn to step up, be assertive, be a leader in your household, set and hold boundaries like Realist3 mentioned, and ultimately demand respect.

[violet1]

I feel like just like the WS, you are rewriting your marriage history-I think its pretty normal as you continue to process this- you are looking for all the red flags you missed, looking at her under a microscope- while I don't think this is a bad thing, I do think you are leaning towards divorcing her-

 

I can not tell you if you should or should not- all I can say, is be honest- I know you don't feel like she deserves it, and yo may be right-but for your own peace of mind- be honest, tell her you are on the fence but willing to try- hash out all the things in your mind with her as calmly as possible-

 

I have made a ton of mistakes in reconciliation, I have said some really horrible things-but I have been 100% honest about my intentions and for that I feel really good-

I agree with this. I was reading your other thread and it sounds a bit like you are rewriting your marital history.

You are in pain so I completely understand. I know it's natural for emotions to flip flop after the initial discovery. A lot of things on your list sound like things that have happened in the past. Did you have built up resentment towards her before the affair? Have you expressed to her how you feel?

 

 

I'm not going to tell you what you should do regarding your marriage, but I do suggest seeing a therapist. If you are going to give reconciliation a chance than I strongly suggest a marriage counselor. Her last phone call to the OM that was mentioned in your other thread really bothers me. I'm not saying reconciliation isn't possible, but it's going to take a lot of work especially on her part. I'm so sorry for your pain and I do wish you the best.

[2.50 a gallon]

VBM

 

Most of your list. My Ex kept a Book of Bad in her head. "Two years ago, on October 23rd, you said this, or you did that"

 

Caught her cheating, kicked her to the curb and walked away, without ever looking back. That was over 30 years ago.

 

Twenty years ago I began a relationship with one of the sweetest gals I have ever met. Giving, loving, generous, she does all of my laundry, folds it neatly and puts it away. On the other hand I do all of the dishes and most of the cooking. In 20 years we have had maybe 5 fights, and they did not last long. Without thinking I flushed the john whilst she was taking a hot shower. I never heard her say them words before and I am never going to let that happen again.

 

I Googled my Ex a few years back, remarried and divorced a second time. The years have not been kind to her, very old looking and easily pushing 200 plus pounds. While my lady takes care of her face nightly and easily looks 20 years younger. And though now a 60 plus year grandmother of a 20 year old, she still has an hour glass figure, flat stomach and fantastic legs. Total eye candy when she is coming out of the shower.

 

Divorce, the best thing that ever happened to me.

[jm2013]

VBM

 

Most of your list. My Ex kept a Book of Bad in her head. "Two years ago, on October 23rd, you said this, or you did that"

 

Caught her cheating, kicked her to the curb and walked away, without ever looking back. That was over 30 years ago.

 

Twenty years ago I began a relationship with one of the sweetest gals I have ever met. Giving, loving, generous, she does all of my laundry, folds it neatly and puts it away. On the other hand I do all of the dishes and most of the cooking. In 20 years we have had maybe 5 fights, and they did not last long. Without thinking I flushed the john whilst she was taking a hot shower. I never heard her say them words before and I am never going to let that happen again.

 

I Googled my Ex a few years back, remarried and divorced a second time. The years have not been kind to her, very old looking and easily pushing 200 plus pounds. While my lady takes care of her face nightly and easily looks 20 years younger. And though now a 60 plus year grandmother of a 20 year old, she still has an hour glass figure, flat stomach and fantastic legs. Total eye candy when she is coming out of the shower.

 

Divorce, the best thing that ever happened to me.

 

I love reading stories like this. Ever since my wife cheated I have been wondering the same things. All the what ifs. What if I met somebody real and I can really enjoy life with? If I stay with my cheating wife I'd never know. 2,5,10 or 20 years down the road she could open those legs again for somebody else. I'm not sure if that's the risks I'd like to take. Much better in this world in my opinion. I don't care how sorry she is. Sorry is when you step on somebody's foot accidentally. Affairs are pretty much telling your partner F U.

[Bartlett67]

Wow. I can really relate to your list. I'd have to add a few of my own, but there is, as our MC points out, a serious problem with resentment on my part for all that I sacrificed and suffered, only to be betrayed on every single level. 21 years of marriage in. We are now on the topic of resentment. He's doing a lot to make it better than it was pre-affair. Nearly two years in, we'd already be finished if he hadn't made such an effort. It sounds to me, OP, like divorce would be incredibly therapeutic for you. Imagine being done with her crap. A chance at starting fresh with someone who hasn't already f'd around on you could be just what the doctor ordered. What are the pro's to staying with the lying cheater?

[VeryBrokenMan]

Wow. I can really relate to your list. I'd have to add a few of my own, but there is, as our MC points out, a serious problem with resentment on my part for all that I sacrificed and suffered, only to be betrayed on every single level. 21 years of marriage in. We are now on the topic of resentment. He's doing a lot to make it better than it was pre-affair. Nearly two years in, we'd already be finished if he hadn't made such an effort. It sounds to me, OP, like divorce would be incredibly therapeutic for you. Imagine being done with her crap. A chance at starting fresh with someone who hasn't already f'd around on you could be just what the doctor ordered. What are the pro's to staying with the lying cheater?

 

I'm not seeing any Pro's right now other than she is a beautiful woman that says she loves me. Just not sure if it's true love. And I do love her and that has not changed. And she is making a real effort to salvage things for whatever reason.

[badkarma2013]

My wife ended her affair about 3 months ago and I'm undecided if I want to remain married. So I've been thinking a lot about our relationship and tried to put together a list of pros and cons and the problems in the relationship. But I very easily came up with this list of hurts or problems, did not have to think much, they just flowed out. I'm wondering if my judgement is clouded and maybe I'm being too sensitive.

 

Pattern: Pressuring me to have kids before I was financially ready (long time ago)

Pattern: Making the big decision unilaterally about kids, with no compromise

Pattern: many double standards – big one that comes to mind is always saying she would leave me if I had an affair

Pattern: never being happy with me being thin and athletic

Pattern: trying to change me / picking at my traits: crossing arms / hands on hips

Pattern: Being dishonest and omitting truth / details about big and small items

Pattern: Being angry/upset with me and giving me a grievance but never having examples for me to fix

Pattern: painting ALL my actions with a broad brush – words like ALWAYS/NEVER

Pattern: Being manipulative / managing relationship / talk about training husbands – makes me think it is just a game.

Pattern: Not keeping conversations/thoughts private, even though I’ve told her repeatedly not to share with her family and friends.

Pattern: Blaming me entirely for relationship problems in the past / with me usually accepting all responsibility

Pattern: taking our life style and income for granted, feel extremely used after the affair

Pattern: being emotionally distant / no emotional intimacy

pattern: never telling me how she really felt about anything

pattern: not being able to talk about intimate details / fantasies

pattern: always expecting me to change for her to be happy

pattern: Hinting / inability to tell me what you want/desire/expect from me

Pattern: Putting me last every time she gets overwhelmed with life

Pattern: showing me little affection unless she wanted something

Pattern: Flirting with other men our entire relationship

Pattern: Talking about how attractive other men are in front of me

Pattern: Making me feel insecure by her actions / comments / flirting

Pattern: Belittling/criticizing me in front of the kids to make herself feel better

Pattern: Using sex as a weapon / reward

Pattern: Rejecting sex for years when she decided

Pattern: Never initiating sex unless she wanted to get pregnant, then it was game on

Pattern: me saying yes to everything possible financially(trips/cars/houses/furniture/etc) / she saying no to sex/intimacy anytime she wanted

 

Could not have phone sex or send me naked pics yet did with affair partner

Not realizing how addicted she was to Facebook / or how damaging it is and not considering my opinion when I warned her about Facebook in 2013

 

 

Does everyone have hurts and resentment like these after years of marriage? Or is it possible I can't see any good right now?

 

*****************************************************************

 

I am a BH as well ..IMHO sir you have put up with WAY more than most men or any BH i know of...

 

I mean no disrespect but does she have to have someone in bed with her when you come home for it to finally get to you...She has NO respect for you or your marriage...AND no amount of crying ..pleading or begging will EVER get it back...

 

Again im not hammering you..but 1/2 way thru that list...Only one question came to mind...you are still putting up with her SHI*&Y behavior and her Affair...you are still there.. IN GODS NAME WHY?

[jm2013]

I'm not seeing any Pro's right now other than she is a beautiful woman that says she loves me. Just not sure if it's true love. And I do love her and that has not changed. And she is making a real effort to salvage things for whatever reason.

 

Take advantage of all the sex and stuff before you bail. One thing I personally forgot to do was make myself happy during most of my marriage. I spent time catering to my wife and her needs and neglected my own. Lately I'm feeling so much better and doing a lot more with my kids, health and business. Lately I've been envisioning my own place with nobody bitching at me and being able to do the things I want to do without feeling pressured from my cheating wife.

[Bartlett67]

I'm not seeing any Pro's right now other than she is a beautiful woman that says she loves me. Just not sure if it's true love. And I do love her and that has not changed. And she is making a real effort to salvage things for whatever reason.

 

Perhaps,if she wants to reconcile,one of the conditions should be that you can explore *your* end of the open marriage equation while she waits to see if you ultimately decide she's worth it. I mean, she called off monogamy unilaterally and without even doing you the courtesy of telling you, so that you could do as you wished just as she did. Im not even saying that you should(necessarily) treat her to the entire sh*t sandwich, but maybe just an open understanding that she needs to prove herself faithful beyond doubt while you explore your options. It's a modest proposal, really.

[VeryBrokenMan]

Perhaps,if she wants to reconcile,one of the conditions should be that you can explore *your* end of the open marriage equation while she waits to see if you ultimately decide she's worth it. I mean, she called off monogamy unilaterally and without even doing you the courtesy of telling you, so that you could do as you wished just as she did. Im not even saying that you should(necessarily) treat her to the entire sh*t sandwich, but maybe just an open understanding that she needs to prove herself faithful beyond doubt while you explore your options. It's a modest proposal, really.

 

I've seriously considered that. Not sure what the reaction would be and I'm almost certain I would not follow through. But maybe the realization of me with another women would do her some good.

[VeryBrokenMan]

Believe me, you are not beating me up any worse than I've beat myself up over staying. Your comments are received and appreciated.

 

 

*****************************************************************

 

I am a BH as well ..IMHO sir you have put up with WAY more than most men or any BH i know of...

 

I mean no disrespect but does she have to have someone in bed with her when you come home for it to finally get to you...She has NO respect for you or your marriage...AND no amount of crying ..pleading or begging will EVER get it back...

 

Again im not hammering you..but 1/2 way thru that list...Only one question came to mind...you are still putting up with her SHI*&Y behavior and her Affair...you are still there.. IN GODS NAME WHY?

[VeryBrokenMan]

Take advantage of all the sex and stuff before you bail. One thing I personally forgot to do was make myself happy during most of my marriage. I spent time catering to my wife and her needs and neglected my own. Lately I'm feeling so much better and doing a lot more with my kids, health and business. Lately I've been envisioning my own place with nobody bitching at me and being able to do the things I want to do without feeling pressured from my cheating wife.

 

We've been going through the hysterical bonding phase so sex has been often. I'm guilty of thinking of her first almost exclusively and unfortunately just realizing that.

[Bartlett67]

I've seriously considered that. Not sure what the reaction would be and I'm almost certain I would not follow through. But maybe the realization of me with another women would do her some good.

 

I have little doubt that it would be a huge gift from you to her. Either it would be an opportunity for personal growth in the sense of learning what she most cherishes in life, or it would allow her to sink to her appropriate level and watch herself age in the harsh mirror of the ww-meat market. If she's still with the OM, she could learn what it's like to trust someone she knows to be a cheater-- character building galore for her. Maybe you should treat her to a bit of that, and get all the makeup sex you want while your at it. What's good for the gander...