Lesbian affair? What to believe?

[BigRed72]

Hi, I am new here, and I have a situation that has been going on for a while and would like any input I can get. I have been married for 18 years and have 2 daughters ages 16 and 14. I've had a good relationship with my wife other than stress put on our marriage by a drug addiction I have battled. I was addicted to opiate pain killers for seven years. However, I was an extremely functional addict as I managed to work, go back to college and then grad school during this time maintaining a high level of success. Emotionally however it took a toll on my wife and we became disconnected. Our sex life has always been phenomenal and I believe she would say the same. About four years ago I bought a business and started a new career. The business took up so much time. I spent a lot of late nights at my store and not with my family. My wife has a career so she had her own schedule and she got neglected emotionally and issues that we were working on concerning my past addiction were shelved. About that same time our church got a new pastor. I had known him my whole life and we were friends. However he had some issues not known to the congregation and died unexpectedly 1 year after they arrived. He was young and had a family, a wife and kids. His wife and my wife had become friends and car pooled our children to school. My wife was with her when she found him on the sofa dead. My wife was there for her during this time and I thought it was great. What happened next shocked many. Our denomination ordained the pastors wife to minister and appointed her to be our pastor (our church allows female pastors). This turned out to be a poor decision.

 

My wife continued to be her main source of support and help. As time went on my wife and this woman became extremely close and soon this woman had replaced me emotionally in my wife's life. They had become almost inseperable. This obviously was a problem but I didn't want to seem like a jerk who made an issue out of my wife helping out a newly widowed woman who had been given the responsibility of being the pastor of a church of 300 people. So I let it go. It got worse. My wife started changing. She kept her phone with her at all times and put lock and passcodes on it. I wasn't allowed to use her phone. She quit her job. She started spending most of her time either with this woman or she would have her kids at our house, all the time. I hired some more help so I could start being home more. But when I come home no one was there a majority of the time. On weekends they would make plans and not tell me. My wife started neglecting our home and it became an utter mess, however, she would help this woman clean her house. Needless to say it developed into major problems for me. We started arguing about the relationship. People in the congregation were becoming concerned. I know of at least two church leaders who went to our female pastor and told her the relationship looked unhealthy and was starting to look bad. Nothing changed. I didn't know how to deal with it as my wife would rage if I tried to convince her to back off this relationship. My wife come from a bad childhood and has some issues from that and I believe that combined with the emotional neglect from me contributed to the closeness of their relationship. My wife was at this woman's every beck and call and she called a lot. When she needed something, anything, no matter how trivial or small my wife would go running. This happened over a period of about two years. I relapsed after almost five years of being clean and the relationship became the main trigger for my use. This obviously made things worse as it gave my wife ammunition to use on me during our arguments. Before she had approached my addiction with love and concern, but now it was a ball bat used to beat me down.

 

People were suspecting things. I would get mad and couldn't fathom any such thing. My wife had never given me any notion that she has been unfaithful in any way especially a lesbian affair. Finally after a year of not working and putting a strain on our finances and my young business, and a year of intense arguing, she got another job and backed off a bit. However, this lady was still the center of my wife's attention. Then just a little over a year ago we got the news that they were going to pull her out of the position of pastor and give her a job at our headquarters across our state. The last couple of weeks she was here my wife pretty much lived at her house, helping her pack and spending time with her. She even stayed all night on three occasions despite the fact we only live three miles away. We argued about this and about why the lady only asked my wife to help her pack. At this same time I needed help at my business. I had asked her to take a day or two off from work or at least help me after work with some tax issues. She said she couldn't take off and she was helping her "friend" the rest of the time. I begin to wonder if the whispers weren't right about this being more than a friendship. The week of the move finally arrived and my wife tells me she has to go on a short business trip, which happened to be the same time her friend was moving her stuff. I sniffed a lie and called her on it. She was planning on going with her and helping her unpack. This made me very angry and we argued. I told her to go but when she got back she could sign divorce papers. She didn't go. The next couple of days went pretty good and we even talked about all of it and tried to work through some of my problems with the relationship. My wife planned on visits to and from this woman and we would have to come to some kind of compromise in light of the fact she was moving three hours away and my wife couldn't just jump up and run across the state every time her friend needed her. So I was trying to compromise for my wife. Then it happened.

 

I am an insomniac and the following weekend I was having trouble sleeping. I came to our bedroom at around 2 am and saw my wife's phone on the bed beside her and it was stuck loading an app. I snuck her phone into the bathroom and begin to read through her text messages from her friend. What I found destroyed me. The first on I found that jumped out at me said, " I want you to eat my ______." I'll let you fill in the blank. There were a number of texts of this nature most all were from this woman to my wife, with very few responses from my wife, of that nature with the exception of one exchange.....her friend said "Is ##### home?" (talking about me). My wife, " yes but I beat him here but I would rather be there with you kissing you all over your body." There were also some pornographic pics of buff men showing their erect packages off proudly. Now keep in mind this was our pastor I'm talking about. Well, I read the texts over and over and over, got sick and finally confronted my wife. She was like a deer in headlights. She started screaming that I didn't understand and that it was a huge misunderstanding. She said that the texts were actually between her friend and old boyfriend that her friend had started texting this way because she was sexually needy. She said the rest were her and her friend "joking" with one another poking fun at the conversation between her friend and this man. I had a hard time believing this but I love my wife more than life itself and wanted to believe her. My wife begged me not to leave and promised that I was the only person she had ever been with (she was a virgin when we married). She grabbed me and held me and cried. I finally fell asleep. When I woke the texts were deleted from her phone and my phone. We argued and I left. I then went to my store and confronted her friend and our pastor by means of messaging. She denied any affair and said I had it wrong. She gave me a similar story to what my wife did but slightly different which only made it harder to believe. When I started questioning her into a corner she went quiet and hasn't spoke to me since.

 

Since this time my wife tried planning trips to see this woman against my wishes, I had a nervous breakdown which led to me even getting arrested during one of our arguments over my wife going to see this lady and we have been on a roller coaster in our marriage. I have done my best since finding the texts to be the best husband possible. I have been clean since the week the woman left and I have done everything I know to do to save our marriage. We have had some of the best times in years in our marriage but just when things seem to be going good this woman will stick her head back in by inviting my wife to come visit or coming back to this area to events where she would meet my wife. And then we would be back to square one. Finally, about two months ago my wife demanded she was going to visit. I resisted but backed off due to advice from a counselor I've been seeing. She went and stayed one night and two days. I then relinquished again and let her go without resistance to this woman's daughter's graduation. She had planned on staying for a full week but compromised and stayed three days. I nearly went crazy. Before she went she promise that we would all sit down and work through this and find closure and compromise when she got back, as I have unanswered questions and obvious concerns about the relationship. It hasn't happened and last week she went across our state again to see this woman against my wishes. The woman had asked my wife to come help her move and transport an item she had sold to someone in our area. I even offered to go do this for her but my wife adamantly was against that because I would make her friend uncomfortable. So she went and didn't even tell me when she left. She stayed one night and come home. SO tell me I'm not crazy for suspecting something bad here. I would really like any opinions I can get. I am at my ropes end with this and don't know what to think or believe.

[whichwayisup]

Your wife needs to make a choice. You or this woman. She is cheating and really it doesn't matter that it's with a woman or a man, the damage is done. She's detached from you, distanced herself from the family unit and embraced this woman and her kids into her own life, pushing you out.

 

Damn right you should be pissed, as well as feeling hurt and betrayed.

 

Put your foot down and stand up to your wife. She is treating you like garbage and excluding you. She doesn't want to deal with your react of meeting or speaking to this OW.

 

And, this OW is INTRUSIVE in your lives! Friends don't act the way this woman has! WTF. There's a line that's been crossed even if nothing physical has happened between them...They are too involved and spend way too much time together.

[Bryanp]

Your wife has been having a sexual affair with this woman for a long time and you have allowed her to cheat on you and humiliate you in the worst possible way. If she was with a man would you have acted same way? This is the same thing. Apparently there have been no consequences to her actions.

 

Your wife now has completely no respect for you whatsoever. If you do not respect yourself then who will? I would suggest the following:

1. Get tested for STD's

2. See an attorney and file for divorce. Enough is enough! Good luck.

[Standard-Fare]

Wow, what a story.

 

It's not what you want to hear, but I think you should formally start the process of filing for divorce. Once you've met with a lawyer and taken a few initial steps, inform your wife.

 

If your wife vehemently objects (I'm guessing she'll bring out the drama), tell her you'd only feel comfortable pausing the process if she agrees to: a) break off her relationship with the pastor and return her focus back to you and your family and b) to go to counseling together with you.

 

Emphasize that things have gone way, way too far and that it's time for make a decision on who she wants. If she wants the pastor, she can't continue having you.

 

Whether or not she's having a sexual affair, (and from what you've written, it sounds like there's a 99 percent chance of that), the bond between these women is all-consuming, and it's a betrayal to your marriage.

[JS84]

Stop living in denial and file for divorce. Your wife has been cheating on you for quite some time and you've just been putting your head in the sand.

[Standard-Fare]

I read through your story a second time and it only became more flabbergasting. It's just ludicrous that this pastor and your wife are trying to conceal their intimacy behind the guise of "a normal female friendship."

 

A healthy friendship between two grown women doesn't involve repeated long-distance travels and overnights against the wishes of your husband. (And you haven't even talked about how this might be affecting your daughters -- sounds like your wife is pretty checked out on that.)

 

There's elements of obsession and desperation here, in a way that only sex could explain.

 

I want to strengthen my initial advice. DEFINITELY start filing for divorce and don't give your wife a say in the matter. You've really put up with far too much already.

 

It will be interesting to see how she and the pastor will handle things once it's undeniable to the world that they're lesbian lovers. I'm sure they get off now on the illicit nature of their "secret" affair, and they'll be pretty overwhelmed when their little fantasy world has to confront reality. I predict that the pastor won't be able to handle the pressure and public scrutiny of it, and will make your wife miserable by keeping her at a distance.

[atreides]

OP some great advise, not much to add other than you are now enabling and in my opinion following bad advise from your counselor.

 

She obviously begged to stay with you which gives you leverage and all the more to file for divorce to get her if you choose to work through this for her to never have contact again with this woman.

 

She said compromise... lol pelase don't fall for it any further, she has gaslighted the hell out of you.

[aliveagain]

At some point your going to see a lawyer because you'll finally have enough. Many at your church probably suspect their relationship and talk about your marriage behind your back. You need to decide that you no longer want to be in infidelity. Your allowing her to cheat and since there have been no consequence's she will continue. You need to stop acting in fear of loosing your marriage because as it is you have already lost it. Expose them, serve her with divorce papers, it takes time to divorce and you can stop the process anytime up to the final decree. Your wife is openly dating another woman, if your ok with that do nothing, if you want to survive this, take action. The worst thing you can do is nothing.

[harrybrown]

Have you exposed this affair?

 

If she will not stop, you can't fix the marriage by yourself.

 

File for D. Tell her to go to her lover.

 

She is gone.

[jackslife]

Sorry buddy. No good news from my POV.

 

1. your wife has had an affair

2. you need to see a lawyer

3. you need to set in motions your plans for divorce.

 

Don't forget you have been cuckolded and humbled in front of your church and friends. As the saying goes the BS is always the last to know. For your own self respect and for the respect from your community you need to be seen to be strong now and do the right thing.

 

Kick her out, full 180.

[Standard-Fare]

Also, every time your wife tries to to insist, "I'm not having an affair," you need to stand your ground and respond: "YES YOU ARE."

 

Wife: We're just friends, we're not lovers.

You: Yes you are.

Wife: I'm not violating our marriage by visiting my friend.

You: Yes you are.

Wife: You have the wrong idea in your head.

You: No I don't.

Wife: I would never betray our marriage.

You: Yes you would.

[bubbaganoosh]

IMO, find a lawyer, file, hand her the papers and show her where to sign. Tell her that she's free to pursue her relationship with this woman and when she goes, she can have half of the joint possessions but the kids stay with you and she's going to have to pay support.

 

Chances are she's going to balk on this and if you have any interest in keeping her as your wife (why I don't know) then you tell her that the only chance she has is by submitting to a polygraph test and if she fails the test for any reason, then she's gone and there is no compromise left.

 

I would also put all the checking and savings and any other financial properties in your name and change accounts until this matter is cleared up. She can't make a three hour trip with no gas in a car and no current car insurance.

 

Make it as tough as possible and what ever you do, don't fall into the trap of feeling sorry for her. Just remember what those text messages said. Her story was a line of BS that stretches around the block.

[Zeurich]

She is BI-Sexual person that is all I can say! That can be abnormal for lot of people but not in the country I am living.. but don't forget your drug addiction might be guided her to this situation. And in a time she might need some one to share her emotional pain this lady might be given a shoulder. If I were you I will try to work it out as a family. I am sorry but for me church is not deciding anything for me. It is my life not pastors or church life. I am not going to talk about that because simply I am interested in a religious war here. I respect every ones believes and ideas and rituals and everything.

[Mr. Lucky]

What I found destroyed me. The first on I found that jumped out at me said, " I want you to eat my ______." I'll let you fill in the blank. There were a number of texts of this nature most all were from this woman to my wife, with very few responses from my wife, of that nature with the exception of one exchange.....her friend said "Is ##### home?" (talking about me). My wife, " yes but I beat him here but I would rather be there with you kissing you all over your body." There were also some pornographic pics of buff men showing their erect packages off proudly. Now keep in mind this was our pastor I'm talking about.

Quoted this part because most BS would kill for this kind of clear-cut proof of the affair. One of the toughest things to deal with is the lies, uncertainty and gaslighting, all cleanly resolved and removed in your case.

 

Sorry but your wife has chosen and it isn't you. You'll need to do the hard work involved in planning your life accordingly. Good luck and keep posting...

 

Mr. Lucky

[pteromom]

Well, it is pretty obvious she is in an affair.

 

But since she is denying, focus on the part that she cannot deny.

 

She is neglecting your marriage to care for this "friend" of hers. She's leaving you alone and lonely, while making sure to meet her friend's seemingly endless needs.

 

If she is committed to this marriage, she needs to agree to reasonable boundaries. Meeting her "friend" for lunch once a week. Talking on the phone every few days. Not texting with her friend during your time together. If she doesn't want to agree to create reasonable boundaries, that's yet another clue that her friendship with this woman is out of balance.

 

But really, I would just leave. She's in an affair. If you leave, I bet she moves in with this woman right away.

[oldshirt]

Well, it is pretty obvious she is in an affair.

 

But since she is denying, focus on the part that she cannot deny.

 

She is neglecting your marriage to care for this "friend" of hers. She's leaving you alone and lonely, while making sure to meet her friend's seemingly endless needs.

 

If she is committed to this marriage, she needs to agree to reasonable boundaries. Meeting her "friend" for lunch once a week. Talking on the phone every few days. Not texting with her friend during your time together. If she doesn't want to agree to create reasonable boundaries, that's yet another clue that her friendship with this woman is out of balance.

 

But really, I would just leave. She's in an affair. If you leave, I bet she moves in with this woman right away.

 

 

 

I agree ^^^^^

 

 

Even if she does not happen to be doughnut-bumping with this woman, it doesn't really matter from your point of view. She has still abandoned you and your home for this other person.

 

 

(you don't mention children, do you have kids? is she taking care of them at all with this going on???? If you don't have kids, do you want them some day because you certainly aren't going to get any under this arraignment)

 

 

 

 

What would you do if she was having a torrid and inappropriate affair and spending all her time and sleeping over at another man's house?? There really isn't any practical difference here. They are simply using the fact this other woman (in fact we might as well start calling her OW now) doesn't have a penis as a loophole to pull the wool over your eyes and keep you from interfering with their affair.

 

 

Quite frankly you should view this and handle this exactly as you would an affair with a man.

 

 

- gather evidence.

 

 

-confront them and blow it up.

 

 

- kick out your wife until you reach a decision and come up with a game plan on what you want to do.

 

 

- expose the affair to this OW's family and the church hierarchy ( I am sure they are really going to love that. Good bet she will lose this job over it.

 

 

- consult an attorney and accountant to protect your assets from them and educate yourself on what a divorce with entail.

 

 

- decide whether you want to attempt reconciliation or divorce.

 

 

- if divorce then work with your attorney to come up with the best strategy and best outcome for you.

 

 

- if reconciliation consult a counselor and come up with a list of criteria and boundaries and come up with a plan to address with her and what she would have to do to maintain the marriage and have it be a healthy and happy marriage.

 

 

.......my guess is she will opt for the OW at this point if she is presented with a reasonable ultimatum. This affair sounds very entrenched and I doubt if she will give up the OW and choose you and your marriage.

 

 

I am sorry this is happening to you.

 

 

Anyway, even if their panties haven't hit the floor together it doesn't really matter.

[oldshirt]

For what it's worth, I went through something similar back in my late 20s. I was staying with a LTR GF after got discharged from Operation Desert Shield/Desert Storm until I could get back to my old job and find a place of my own.

 

 

One night she didn't come home from work until about 3 or 4 in the morning. The next day all she could talk about was a gal she met through friends the night before and they went out partying on a Monday night until about dawn.

 

 

For the next couple weeks she wasn't getting home until almost dawn and then sleep about all day and then as soon as she woke up she was off to see "Angela" again.

 

 

This went on for a couple weeks until I found a place and moved on my own as she wasn't around and I rarely saw her. I got settled in to my new place and would call her to see if she wanted to get together but she was always going out with "Angela" and friends.

 

 

One day they were going to a picnic at the lake and I tried to invite myself so I could meet this "Angela" and new friends she had. The look on her face when I asked that, told me everything I needed to know. She looked like she just got caught fcking the neighbors dog. I knew then that this was more than just a garden variety friendship between girlfriends.

 

 

I confronted her about it and asked if this was more than friendship and she acted all freaked out and denied it to the ends of the earth but she basically told me that she wanted to hang out with "Angela" and her new friends and would 'consider' doing something with me if "Angela" was busy and they couldn't go out.

 

 

She also told me that she didn't feel comfortable having any kind of romantic/sexual activity with me anymore and twisted it around and blamed that on me because historically in our relationship I had been the one that was reluctant to commit and didn't propose or anything like that after 4 years.

 

 

A couple weeks later she and "Angela" moved in together and I haven't seen or heard from her since. I assume they lived happily ever after.

 

 

My point of my little story here is when women fall in love with each other, it happens quickly and it is a bond that is very close, very emotional and very tight.

 

 

When that happened to me, a part of me wanted to blame myself and that I was so bad of a BF that she not only dumped me but dumped the entire male race as well.

 

 

But then I quickly accepted that she simply preferred the emotional connection and bond that women can share and she preferred that comfort with women instead of men.

 

 

It was about her and not me.

 

 

You wife is probably somewhat similar. sometimes men just simply can't provide the emotional connection and closeness that some women need and can only come from other women.

 

 

Some people call them lesbians. I'm not sure it really is an actual sexual orientation vs whether some women need what only other women can offer.

[Morgoth]

Sorry for your troubles. I am not surprised at all. I am guessing this is a Christian Church? If so, Christians are THE WORST hypocrites of all. My family experienced the worst kind of a trauma in a Christian Church. I experienced my first sexual experiences at church. My advice to is to be extremely cautious letting anyone at church have access to your loved ones, Pastors, preachers, deacons, priests. Good luck to you.

[HereNorThere]

Gather electronic evidence, hire a P.I., expose to your family and friends, divorce.

 

Yup, she's already blown her 15th billion chance. I'm amazed at how many spouses on here can literally watch their partner falling apart, dying in front of them and not care. Sadly, I see very, very little remorse from people in affairs. I guess the guilt is too much live with so they dissociate, justify, rationalize, blameshift, whatever.

 

I am even more surprised that people allow this to happen. Right now you are condoning this. Why is she doing it, well, because she can. Personally, I would get screenshots of all the texts, compose a nice email about the situation, attach said screenshots and move on with my life. It can't hurt any worse than supporting someone who is in another relationship.

[Mr. Lucky]

When that happened to me, a part of me wanted to blame myself and that I was so bad of a BF that she not only dumped me but dumped the entire male race as well.

Had a similar situation when I was younger with a GF that left me for another woman when our relationship had run its course. I rationalized it that she'd realized she'd never reach that peak of sexual nirvana with any other man. Sounds so much better than "dumped the entire male race" ...

 

Mr. Lucky