three wrongs don't make a right

[matt229]

My wife had an affair with another man while we were engaged. I don't think she had full blown sex but she kissed him, told him she loved him, and talked, emailed and chatted *very* sexually explicity things back and forth. They worked together and it probably lasted for several months. I found out when I snooped in her emails and I confronted her. We were both very upset and I agreed to forgive her and we got married. Flash forward four years. My wife and I now have a one year old and I have been living away from her for a year while in medical school. I recently snooped in my wife's emails and found out that she has been calling and emailing the same guy again and basically asking him to come out and visit her. When I found out about this I was totally PO'd. I was completely faithful to the girl for the entire 8 years that I'd known her but I decided that enough was enough and I decided to sleep with another woman to retaliate. I have absolutely no feelings for the other woman and I just had sex once to get back at my wife. It was stupid of me to let my anger dictate my actions and I really didn't do it to overtly hurt my wife. I have subsequently confronted my wife about her talking to this other man and I told her what I did in response. I forgave her again but she said what I did was unforgivable. She thinks that a single, loveless physical act is a bigger offense than having an ongoing, non-full blown sexual relationship with another man. At this point, I just don't think we're going to last anymore. It's really a shame that I had such a beautiful son with her and he's the biggest reason I still care about everything.

[whichwayisup]

Both are bad, but she's been having an on-going relationship with another man. She's been putting energy into another man, she's been allowing feelings with him to grow. She's been lying and hiding it from you, betraying you, betraying her son. She's having an emotional affair with this guy and that is just as damaging as a sexual one, even a fling just as bad.

 

You purposely screwed another woman, out of spite to piss off/hurt your wife. It hurt her, and it hurt yourself, let alone it hurt your son too as right now your marriage is in complete shambles.

 

I suggest you both head to the marriage counsellor's office and try to salvage what is left. Find out WHY she chose to continue to cheat and have an emotional affair with another man. You two are missing something, needs are not being met and you've grown apart.

 

Anyway, I hope she's willing to try to fix this, and you too. If not, well, you both can be the best co-parents, share custody and just not live under one roof, though I hope it doesn't lead to that. One time you two loved eachother, got married and had a child. What happened?

[MrsHellnoFire]

My wife had an affair with another man while we were engaged. I don't think she had full blown sex but she kissed him, told him she loved him, and talked, emailed and chatted *very* sexually explicity things back and forth. They worked together and it probably lasted for several months. I found out when I snooped in her emails and I confronted her. We were both very upset and I agreed to forgive her and we got married. Flash forward four years. My wife and I now have a one year old and I have been living away from her for a year while in medical school. I recently snooped in my wife's emails and found out that she has been calling and emailing the same guy again and basically asking him to come out and visit her. When I found out about this I was totally PO'd. I was completely faithful to the girl for the entire 8 years that I'd known her but I decided that enough was enough and I decided to sleep with another woman to retaliate. I have absolutely no feelings for the other woman and I just had sex once to get back at my wife. It was stupid of me to let my anger dictate my actions and I really didn't do it to overtly hurt my wife. I have subsequently confronted my wife about her talking to this other man and I told her what I did in response. I forgave her again but she said what I did was unforgivable. She thinks that a single, loveless physical act is a bigger offense than having an ongoing, non-full blown sexual relationship with another man. At this point, I just don't think we're going to last anymore. It's really a shame that I had such a beautiful son with her and he's the biggest reason I still care about everything.

 

 

Well your wife has repeatedly disrespected your relationship and you let your anger get the best of you.

It's debatable what is the bigger betrayal. You were upfront after the affair. She has lied to you for years. Also, some consider an EA more damaging than a one-nighter PA. Depends what is the lesser of two evils.. but does it really matter anymore. Your wife seems unfulfilled and is seeking attention and gratification elsewhere with the same man no less. She told him she loved him and now still has the same chat bit with him? I can see why you were infuriated. I'm not saying you're off the hook, but your wife doesn't seem too satisfied in the marriage, in which her emotional relationship was bound to eventually turn physical, if not already. Doesn't sound like she's going to be honest about her feelings anytime soon either.

[matt229]

Well your wife has repeatedly disrespected your relationship and you let your anger get the best of you.

It's debatable what is the bigger betrayal. You were upfront after the affair. She has lied to you for years. Also, some consider an EA more damaging than a one-nighter PA. Depends what is the lesser of two evils.. but does it really matter anymore. Your wife seems unfulfilled and is seeking attention and gratification elsewhere with the same man no less. She told him she loved him and now still has the same chat bit with him? I can see why you were infuriated. I'm not saying you're off the hook, but your wife doesn't seem too satisfied in the marriage, in which her emotional relationship was bound to eventually turn physical, if not already. Doesn't sound like she's going to be honest about her feelings anytime soon either.

 

I was a loyal, "boy scout" for 8 years and never did anything with any other women. I'm a reasonably attractive guy and can hookup pretty easily if I say yes but, until she burned me twice (that I know of), I went out of my way to be a loyal person. Honestly, I think that the only thing holding my wife back from having full-on sex the first time was that we were living together while engaged. Years later, I think the only thing keeping her from physically cheating while I was away at med school was the fact that she has our son and he keeps her busy. I also think that if she wanted to see another person at any time, then she should have been upfront and filed for divorce (or never followed through with getting married in the first place). If she had just had a one-night stand with the guy it wouldn't have bothered me as much as an ongoing relationship. When we were engaged, she threw a party and actually invited him to our party at our house. I met him and the entire time, they were having an emotional relationship (plus kissing and god knows what else) behind my back. After going through a lot of emotional pain, burying it and following through with getting married, finding out that she's talking to him again was too much and I lost it. Yes, I retaliated and screwed another woman but I'm not calling her, emailing her, and chatting with her. It's still wrong, but I have no emotional attachment to anyone but my wife. She said that they're just friends now but that's complete b.s. She cheated and burned me once and the second time was just re-opening an old wound and she knows it because it's still behind my back and she was deleting the emails (I caught one in her deleted items folder that was inviting him out). How does that saying go..."fool me once shame on you...fool me twice shame on me??"

[whichwayisup]

So, what do you want to do now? Divorce? Lay it all out and give it your best for the sake of your son to make it work? What does she want? Will she completely end things with the OM? IS the OM married, if so, will his wife be told of the affair?

 

You might benefit now to just go to counselling on your own so you can deal with everything.

[matt229]

So, what do you want to do now? Divorce? Lay it all out and give it your best for the sake of your son to make it work? What does she want? Will she completely end things with the OM? IS the OM married, if so, will his wife be told of the affair?

 

You might benefit now to just go to counselling on your own so you can deal with everything.

 

 

Honestly, I don't know what I want at this point and I don't know what exactly she wants anymore. My problem is that I'm a sentimental fool and still care about her and wouldn't mind a happy ending to this story. Most people in my camp think I should just look out for myself and/or get a divorce. I feel horrible about my son having to grow up in a broken home.

 

She told me that she couldn't forgive me for what I did and refused to let me stay in the house so I could visit my son this weekend. She said she couldn't forgive me for having actual sex with another woman. I told her that a one night physical act (my cheating) means nothing to me compared with an longer term ongoing relationship with milder physical acts (what i know of her cheating) but she doesn't have any problem applying double standards.

 

We have a lot more issues. 1. Since she's had our son, she really doesn't like sex anymore with me, which has been very difficult for me. Before, she wanted sex all the time. 2. She had a huge fight with my parents and both sides haven't talked to each other for a year (My folks haven't seen my son since the day he was born) and I've had to play the middleman trying to reconcile things. 3. She talks total trash about me to all of her friends. As an example, i bought her a $300 pearl necklace for her birthday and all she did was tell me how much she hated pearls and told her friends the same. 4. She hates the fact that I started medical school, which does take a lot of time right now and forced me to live away a lot for the past year, but she tells everyone that I abandoned her and my son even though her parents are around 100% of the time to help continuously and I'm doing this to benefit all of us.

 

I think there might be too many problems at this point to fix and we both have just added to that pile with cheating.

[whichwayisup]

My problem is that I'm a sentimental fool and still care about her and wouldn't mind a happy ending to this story

 

Then if this is how you are and maybe what you want, then because of your son, give it your best. This way if it doesn't work out, atleast YOU know you tried.

Question is, is your wife willing to do the leg work and work her tail off to get the marriage back on track?

 

I am a strong believer if both spouses have enough faith and want it to work, then they'll do everything possible to make it so. So, with that being said, I am encouraging you to be the bigger person here, step up to the plate and talk to your wife about fixing this mess. Though the OM has to be OUT of the picture forever if this has a chance of working.

 

Do a site search of Thumbingmyway and click on his profile, then click on all threads started by Thumbingmyway. I think the insight he has, plus the faith - You can learn alot from reading his story.

[MrsHellnoFire]

Well if she didn't sleep with him yet, your one-nighter just gave her some reason to do so. Continually hurting eachother just leads to nothing but pain, pain, and more pain. It's a non-stop cycle.

You both need counselling and both to be on track at keeping all other men and women who are hindering your relationship OUT of your life. Set goals and start working on your problems one at a time.

But is she willing to work at this marriage??? She already confessed love for another man and invited him over... I'm thinking she will more likely use your recent affair as an excuse to test the waters and cheat all the way.

[Cobra_X30]

I think there might be too many problems at this point to fix and we both have just added to that pile with cheating.

 

Matt,

 

This is more than likely the case. You have a bright future ahead.

 

Learn from this. Really learn, sit down and figure out where you went wrong.

 

Find a woman that actually loves you, and use this experience to build a wonderful life together!

[whichwayisup]

When I allegedly had an "affair" in 2002 with the "other guy" that I "kissed him, told him she loved him, and talked, emailed and chatted *very* sexually explicity things back and forth" Matt229 was very emotionally unstable, often breaking things in my home when he got angry, constantly calling me names like worthless b*tch, ugly c*nt, stupid wh*re, etc. I was already friends with the "other guy" before anything had happened and needed a shoulder to cry on and just "escape" from my relationship. But I had made the conscious effort and decided that when it got to be more physical rather than an escape via virtual online stuff (i.e. after the kiss),

 

Sorry that you felt abused, but if you felt abused by Matt, WHY did you marry him anyway? You seem to justify your behaviour, your affair, it is NOT his fault that you chose to cheat. Just like it's not your fault that he chose to have a ONS (one night stand).

 

Bottomline here, DO you want to salvage this marriage? You two OWE it to your one year old son to give it your best.

 

One more thing, even though you say you ended the A, it was wrong to continue the friendship as the feelings still grew over time. Fact that this guy was going to come visit you, is just wrong too. Who cares where he stays, HE is no friend of the marriage itself, I hope you see that.

 

I have ask too, why did you keep those emails if the A was over?

 

If you needed support, you should have talked to a woman friend, a family member, or even sought out counselling. Bringing another man into your life only helped cause all this drama that's going on now.

 

Yes, you both are at fault, you both cheated, so now what do YOU want? Do you love your husband enough to give him a chance? Or would it be best to walk away now, and learn how to respect eachother enough to be GOOD and LOVING co-parents to your son but not under the same roof.

[cj1988]

There is always 2 sides to every story, even mine. But no reason could ever justify cheating emotionally or physically for either of you.

 

Sounds like you both have no respect for each other RIGHT NOW.....get help and see if you have anything left, if not....be civil for your baby and call it quits before it gets even worse !

[matt229]

I had a hard time back when my wife and I were engaged because I got kicked out of law school, gained some weight, and was depressed sometimes. I admit that I was moody at times and, in retrospect, I definitely needed some help. I broke a shoe rack and I punched a hole in the wall. I admit it. But, if my wife was unhappy enough, she should have left me or asked me to move out instead of cheating with another man behind my back. She proudly wore the engagement ring that she picked out and we lived under the same roof but there was no law forcing her to do any of that.

 

If people on this forum read the chat transcripts and emails that I read from my wife's PC, then they would understand why I don't trust my wife with other men. I guarantee they were as explicit as any total hard core porno (i.e extended discussion on anal, masturbation, etc.). You wonder why I got POd when she's STILL emailing and phoning the same guy that she did that with, she went out with with, she kissed and she confessed love for and invited to OUR place for a party...???

 

Later on, what my wife failed to mention about me "abandoning" her is that when I left for medical school, she had a high paying job as an attorney and we had agreed that my parents would help out with my son while I would be away for two years (but still visiting whenever possible). My wife also failed to mention that she was practically fired from her job (she always told me she was surfing the internet and shopping online), lost a huge source of income, and fought tooth and nail with my parents to the point where they were no longer in a position to help each other out. My wife then moved into her parents house where there are three other adults capable of helping out. Her parents help out tremendously but she still acts like she's doing everything all by herself. Meanwhile, I worked my @ss off in medical school, am on scholarship, on the dean's list every term, and became eligible for honor society. My wife doesn't think my hard work will benefit our son in the future and all she does is give me a hard time for "abandoning" her and my son (whom I absolutely love).

 

I fully admit that my anger got the best of me and I decided to retaliate and have sex with another woman. I know it was wrong and I should have signed divorce papers before doing it. I'm fully willing to tell the world what I have done without hiding anything because I'm not afraid of the truth.

[whichwayisup]

You two need to take this to marriage counselling and not air your dirty laundry in a public forum.

 

YOU BOTH have put your son IN an awful place because NEITHER of you are putting HIM first. You two are blaming eachother and neither of you are taking responsibility for your own actions - Well, a tiny bit, but not enough to make a big difference. I see Matty full of remorse due to his ONS, but I'm not too sure you see that your EA online and the kiss was actually really wrong. It did alot of damage and therefore the mess you're both in is the evidence of it.

 

If your marriage ends, I hope to god BOTH of you can be co-parents on good terms and let the crap go. I hope you both are fair, have joint custody and do not bring ANY of your own crap affect the life of your kid.

[Trialbyfire]

Okay you two, both of you need to grow the hell up, for the sake of your child. You empower each other's dysfunctional sides.

 

I don't see this marriage being repaired due to your inability to be mature with each other and your own selfish needs.

 

I hope to God that the two of you can split but keep things amicable for the sake of the child. You should both smarten up and think with your heads, instead of your selfishness.

[whichwayisup]

I think forums can be deceiving. Matt229 told me about his cheating through an instant message. Then after arguing for about 2 hours, I left the conversation. He later left a message on my voicemail to tell me he's sorry...but that never came up intitially...he just kept telling me that I started it.

 

And he found out about YOUR cheating by stumbling across emails and text messages.

 

He forgave you after your cheating the 1st time around, yet you cannot forgive him for his cheating?

 

You still don't understand what I am saying. (re-read my other post reply to you again and read TBF's reply as well.)

 

Pointing fingers, playing the blame game IS NOT GOING TO DO ANYTHING BUT PISS YOU BOTH OFF MORE! Also, coming to a forum for advice is what you're going to get, and it doesn't matter in my eyes, probably doesn't matter in most of the other posters eyes who is right and who is wrong here - Bottomline is, you and your husband need to make a decision and go from there. Either fix your marriage by going to marriage counselling and learn how to BE a couple, learn how to communicate and listen, or end it completely and get a divorce.

[Trialbyfire]

I think forums can be deceiving. Matt229 told me about his cheating through an instant message. Then after arguing for about 2 hours, I left the conversation. He later left a message on my voicemail to tell me he's sorry...but that never came up intitially...he just kept telling me that I started it.

How old are you two, that you're communicating life changing issues through IM? I'm assuming that you both remain within the same general geographical location. Discuss all issues face-to-face but make certain your child is being cared for out of hearing range. The last thing this poor little mite needs to hear are two childish adults yelling/screaming and breaking things.

 

Listen to WWIU. Get some marriage counseling or get a divorce. My recommendation is the latter.

[Trialbyfire]

I am 29 and Matt229 is 34. We are not in the same geographical location and are in different states across the US.

Then get on the phone so there's less room for misunderstanding.

[Darth Vader]

Yes, You're very wrong for cheating on your wife!

 

Your wife on the other hand, Probably HAS had sex with OM and just refuses to talk about it!

[matt229]

I originally posted on this forum and then invited my now ex-wife to take a look at it because she always argued to death about how she never really cheated, etc. and I wanted to get other people to weigh in on the whole thing. I'm writing this now because I'm still disappointed over everything and the fact that my son will be raised in a broken home. I wasn't raised like that and it bothers me a lot. We should have gone to counseling but it was taken out of my hands.

 

Anyway, she divorced me in early 2008. I was away at medical school (working my butt off as usual) and she started pressuring me to agree to divorce terms (i.e. she wanted to secure $$$ from me for child support, etc.) I just kept asking her to just wait until I got back from school and we could deal with it. I was incredibly busy and the whole discussion was really stressing me out. I couldn't figure out what the big hurry was so I got into her emails and saw that she had been going out with some guy who told her that he didn't feel comfortable dating her due to the fact that she was still married. That, I suppose, explained her hurry to pressure me into getting through a divorce. I confronted her with what I found and told her that I would only deal with any divorce during the summer. Well, low and behold, I got notice of a default judgment a week before my finals (just before summer). She had taken full custody of our son and I had no idea it had gone on. The original service notices had been rerouted and I never received them. I had to petition the court and get shared custody. I told her that it was all on her and that I thought we should have gotten counseling for the sake of our son.

 

Here I am in 2009. I'm still neck deep in med school and my ex is out dating some guy. We're semi-friendly but it seems one-sided a lot of the time. As odd as it sounds, I still have feelings for her and certainly miss my son a great deal. I haven't had time to see him much and I haven't had time to date or move on so maybe that's my problem. It's just a big shame that people can't sit down and work out their problems, especially when there are kids involved. Good luck to anyone going through divorce now. It's been really hard on me because I'm the family type of guy. I would encourage people out there to stop fighting, get some real help, and start talking.

[Chrome Barracuda]

I originally posted on this forum and then invited my now ex-wife to take a look at it because she always argued to death about how she never really cheated, etc. and I wanted to get other people to weigh in on the whole thing. I'm writing this now because I'm still disappointed over everything and the fact that my son will be raised in a broken home. I wasn't raised like that and it bothers me a lot. We should have gone to counseling but it was taken out of my hands.

 

Anyway, she divorced me in early 2008. I was away at medical school (working my butt off as usual) and she started pressuring me to agree to divorce terms (i.e. she wanted to secure $$$ from me for child support, etc.) I just kept asking her to just wait until I got back from school and we could deal with it. I was incredibly busy and the whole discussion was really stressing me out. I couldn't figure out what the big hurry was so I got into her emails and saw that she had been going out with some guy who told her that he didn't feel comfortable dating her due to the fact that she was still married. That, I suppose, explained her hurry to pressure me into getting through a divorce. I confronted her with what I found and told her that I would only deal with any divorce during the summer. Well, low and behold, I got notice of a default judgment a week before my finals (just before summer). She had taken full custody of our son and I had no idea it had gone on. The original service notices had been rerouted and I never received them. I had to petition the court and get shared custody. I told her that it was all on her and that I thought we should have gotten counseling for the sake of our son.

 

Here I am in 2009. I'm still neck deep in med school and my ex is out dating some guy. We're semi-friendly but it seems one-sided a lot of the time. As odd as it sounds, I still have feelings for her and certainly miss my son a great deal. I haven't had time to see him much and I haven't had time to date or move on so maybe that's my problem. It's just a big shame that people can't sit down and work out their problems, especially when there are kids involved. Good luck to anyone going through divorce now. It's been really hard on me because I'm the family type of guy. I would encourage people out there to stop fighting, get some real help, and start talking.

 

dude your better off. Trust The OM will be her downfall as well. He's not comfortable dating her because she's still married? Dude be happy, you can start over and once your out of med school, your gonna be ballin!!!

 

just graduate first, lol. and focus on you. Stop caring about her, your son is right now your only concern.

[blueintheface]

I think you should cut your losses sad to say. Also the way the 2 of you deal with problems is a major issue. Maybe you could read up more about communication for your own benefit and future.

[Reggie]

I'd bet dollars to doughnuts your wife went physical with that guy, initially. Who talks about anal and mastrubating with some "friend"?

It would have been better if you had not cheated in return. But, your wife sounds like a Narcissist and you are better off without her.

[Dexter Morgan]

I have subsequently confronted my wife about her talking to this other man and I told her what I did in response. I forgave her again but she said what I did was unforgivable.

 

I think its unforgivable, and what the hell where you thinking by cheating? yes I know, she did first, but it doesn't make it right. If its bad enough to cheat, then get a divorce.

 

Ok, now with that out of the way, if you think she didn't have sex with the OM, think again. she doesn't get in contact with him, do sexual chats on the internet, and ask him to come see her if she just had a few kisses with the guy. She boned him...you know it, I know it.

 

So she did the unforgivable. here it was that YOU were willing to forgive her TWICE, but she isn't willing to forgive you? utter bullsh#t. Thats what people get for forgiving cheaters.

 

 

She thinks that a single, loveless physical act is a bigger offense than having an ongoing, non-full blown sexual relationship with another man.

 

Again, if you think she didn't have sex with a guy she wants to come visit her, think again. She boned him back then, and she was planning to screw him if he came to see her. You don't go far away just for a kiss. Especially with the sexual chats between them.

 

 

At this point, I just don't think we're going to last anymore. It's really a shame that I had such a beautiful son with her and he's the biggest reason I still care about everything.

 

I hear ya my man. I have 2 beautiful boys. but there is no way I would have been able to stay with her for them. I'd be hella angry in my own house and they would have seen it. I can bottle things pretty well, but sooner or later, I would have blown.

 

Are you considering divorce?

[Dexter Morgan]

"Originally Posted by WifeofMatt229

I think forums can be deceiving. Matt229 told me about his cheating through an instant message. Then after arguing for about 2 hours, I left the conversation. He later left a message on my voicemail to tell me he's sorry...but that never came up intitially...he just kept telling me that I started it."

 

What happened to these posts from WifeofMatt229????

[Dexter Morgan]

Geez, my bad...talk about coming into this thread late!!

 

Anyway, she divorced me in early 2008.

 

Well, at least you are free from a double-standard cheater. I know you don't want your son to be in a broken home, but as long as he has you and you love him, it will always be ok.

 

But be thankful you are free from that wretch of a "woman".

 

Again, what you did was wrong and you should have freakin' known better.

 

but what you should have done was not try to forgive her twice and just divorced her to begin with.

 

 

I couldn't figure out what the big hurry was so I got into her emails and saw that she had been going out with some guy who told her that he didn't feel comfortable dating her due to the fact that she was still married.

 

smart man, he should, however, run for the hills.

 

 

That, I suppose, explained her hurry to pressure me into getting through a divorce. I confronted her with what I found and told her that I would only deal with any divorce during the summer. Well, low and behold, I got notice of a default judgment a week before my finals (just before summer). She had taken full custody of our son and I had no idea it had gone on.

 

Isn't that the bitch of things. I know this situation was different because you cheated too....but men will ALWAYS get the shaft in a divorce when it comes to our kids. Unless we can prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the mother is unfit, we will never get custody unless the x agrees to it. Like my lawyer said for a reason i wouldn't get custody, "you have a d!ck".

 

Infidelity SHOULD be considered in custody.

 

 

Here I am in 2009. I'm still neck deep in med school and my ex is out dating some guy. We're semi-friendly but it seems one-sided a lot of the time. As odd as it sounds, I still have feelings for her and certainly miss my son a great deal. I haven't had time to see him much and I haven't had time to date or move on so maybe that's my problem. It's just a big shame that people can't sit down and work out their problems, especially when there are kids involved. Good luck to anyone going through divorce now. It's been really hard on me because I'm the family type of guy. I would encourage people out there to stop fighting, get some real help, and start talking.

 

 

I am so sorry this is happening to you with regards to your son. Do you get regular every other weekend visitation and one night a week? or are you too far away for that right now?

 

And when the time comes and you are out of school, is she trying to bar you from seeing him with regular visitation?