serial cheats and liars

[Hopeful714]

Like what are the chances these guys ever change?

 

I ask because I dated one several yrs ago and browsing here yesterday (in particular one thread (by cry me a river-who stopped posting) stirred up many memories of that time in my life, how messed up he had me, and the long painful

Journey I had to take to see him for what he was, get out of the situation and regain myself back. Not to mention the issues of trust and self questioning and doubt that still linger for me at times. I was so "snowed" it was the best...then the absolute worst time of my life that forever changed me.

 

As I learned, my ex cheated on every woman he dated. And not just once but multiple times as he lied, manipulated and gaslighted. He is with someone now (5th girl in 8 yrs) and they actually made the 2 yr mark and he moved her and her kids in. He is single no kids. I'm like Wow... how can this even work for someone with such patterns?

 

On top of being a cheat, he was emotionally abusive at times and had anger issues. back when I was with him he told me he was an evil monster, jaded, had a dark side and was broken...but would then switch it and appear to be a great guy and decent bf who was loved by all. The whole thing was crazy and made me crazy till I got away and got out of the fog.

 

Anyhow, I'm curious...can these guys really change? They appear to be so in love ...but I'm wondering what is below the surface and is this all a sham for him to appear "normal" to the outside world? Also, if he is not who he appears...how can this girl not see this? Red flags were smacking me in the face early on..yet I eventually saw the truth and had to finally face reality instead of live in denial of what was occurring.

 

Any thoughts, or experiences would be appreciated. Like I said...I was browsing yesterday and seemed to have stirred up some old memories and bad feelings about that time in my life. Can they REALLY change after inflicting so much pain and agony on previous girlfriends?

[elaine567]

I guess they maybe learn, grow up, gain some insight.

If they were in a bad situation and have removed themselves from it, then their behaviour may improve.

The triggers, the stress, the anxiety may no longer be there perhaps and so they feel more at peace with the world.

They may have gone into therapy and have more idea of how to cope with life more productively.

 

But if those are deeply ingrained traits, then my guess is they just learn to hide their bad self well. Of course their real self may then re surface at any time.

[Smthn_Like_Olivia]

I believe they can change with maturity, life experience, and the right partner. YOU can't change him, SHE can't change him. Only HE can change his ways and its because he wants to. Because he's reached a point in his life where he is"satisfied" with his current partner and where he is in life and no longer sees the relevance or value in lying and cheating.

 

I'm not saying your ex has changed. I'm just saying that yes, it is possible, but I wouldn't rely on social media to tell you that. Very few share the bumps and issues of their lives on social media.

 

The real question is, why are you dwelling on this? If he has changed, what impact will it have on your life? You need to let this go and move on.

[Hopeful714]

The reason I dwell is because I have a hard time dealing with the fact that someone could be so awful to me and to those before me and after me..then this person walks away with happily ever after unscathed while leaving the rest with issues of self esteem, trust etc. Geese...it's been almost 3 years and I still am afraid to date. Can't even meet anyone, and Afraid to ever give myself again. I feel there is no hope for me. He was the best and worst I ever had. He even told me I'd never meet another like him again and he was soooo arrogant.

 

I have never forgiven. I can't. I can't forgive someone who showed no remorse at all when I cried and he said more lies ...and awful things to me during the rs to gaslight me while he played his game. I can't forgive someone who just vanished on me at the end and wouldn't even talk because he was caught AGAIN..so I left for good in complete shambles and depressed beyond words trying to fix myself ..then he tries to contact several times MONTHS later most likely to try to release guilt or see if I was still hooked by sending me breadcrumbs via text.

 

Yes I went to counseling early on and for the most part I am fine...unless I get triggered. I guess I will always in a way feel like a fool and because he lives fairly close to me I fear ever running into him as I also fear he would put on a show and look at me with pity as I am still alone. I guess I ask...why do I still have to pay the price for this year's later while he just moves on and becomes this awesome catch like nothing.

 

I realize social media is fake and do not participate but have looked just a few times over the years. Why can't I just forget this forever?

[Hopeful714]

I was told I was crazy. I was told I was bipolar when I would not believe the lies and knew in my gut something was off. My birthdays were forgotten or dismissed. Everything was about him. Everything. As long as I went along with his plan....it was all good. When I deviated from that plan I was "vile" , discarded

And forgotten till he came back for more and I stupidly gave it.

[elaine567]

Red Flags of a Psychopath -

 

That is I guess why he was the best and the worst.

[No Limit]

0%. No wait, -100%.

[Space Ritual]

Regardless of gender, some , albeit in my experience very few, do stop their wayward ways, if they have the courage and selflessness to actually look into themselves and examine how their actions affect others. It takes a lot of intestinal fortitude to be able to do that. Especially when the bulk of it requires the rebuilding of trust through actions and not simple words.

 

Sadly for most people I think the hard work required is too daunting, given the reality of an inexact outcome for most. Infidelity is a "dealbreaker" for many, myself included. So I would be inclined to never give a cheater a second chance. They have to be able to own their actions first and foremost. Again, I think with the myriad of excuses most cheaters come up with it takes a very rare individual indeed who can become that person who is safe to be around again.

[Hopeful714]

Yea...I read all those. And if I had to guess...that would be it.

 

Actually sometimes he would say it's horrible living with "this" and I don't want kids because of "this" but I never came out and asked what "this" was because I always walked on eggshells to keep things good.

 

Thanks for responding. But now what? How do I finally get over this rs? I am older and aging. She is young and vibrant. I like the others had the worst. He even chased someone with a garden tool...lol. And now the new one gets the best? If there even is one? It just sickens me still. I suppose if I just knew for positive that what I thought he was (psychopath) was real and SURE about it then I'd be ok. From all I've read psycho's don't change. Or do they?

[inpeices]

Yea...I read all those. And if I had to guess...that would be it.

 

Actually sometimes he would say it's horrible living with "this" and I don't want kids because of "this" but I never came out and asked what "this" was because I always walked on eggshells to keep things good.

 

Thanks for responding. But now what? How do I finally get over this rs? I am older and aging. She is young and vibrant. I like the others had the worst. He even chased someone with a garden tool...lol. And now the new one gets the best? If there even is one? It just sickens me still. I suppose if I just knew for positive that what I thought he was (psychopath) was real and SURE about it then I'd be ok. From all I've read psycho's don't change. Or do they?

 

 

Ahh hopeful.. I can hear where you are coming from totally, I think learning they have perhaps changed their ways, albeit superficially on social media can be trigger (BUT not necessarily a true representation of what's really going on behind closed doors remember)

I'm three years on from a dreadful betrayal and I thought I could never trust anyone ever again..(and I am in a new relationship and being tested, and doing really well,) and apparently it is healthy not to 100% blindly trust someone, so don't be too hard on yourself... Trust is earned over time, not a GIVEN. You were probably like me, too trusting, a bit niave maybe, and certainly in love or in love with the idea of love.

The thing is, you are still carrying pain from the experience and it sounds like you haven't been able to move forward.. Have a good old research on co-dependancy and personality types.. You may find some clarity to help you on your healing journey as I did.

I would bet at the bottom of it for him are mummy / daddy issues and a disruptive childhood..not that this makes it ok or justifies his treatment of women or behaviour, but I would bet there's something there, and yes, some people turn out just fine regardless.. And others, don't.. The sensitive types ya know..

 

So instead of wondering if he is all fixed etc..or if this new woman has some magical touch to heal him.. How about fixing you and getting your confidence and self esteem up again? However many knocks you might take dating again, I really think you should give it a go..but read up on red flags, and steer clear of those you are drawn to without any substance..I went into an abusive relationship (after the 12yr cheating one) and went through two years of hell.. I decided to set the benchmark way way higher after and I'm very happy with my choice.. Let's see how it goes..

 

Get back in the saddle girl ;-)

[Smthn_Like_Olivia]

In order to move on, you need to stop questioning the why's and how's of his life and his actions and focus on YOU and you only! Stop looking at this as some kind of failure on your part. YOU are the winner in this! Not her and not him. You won because you walked away from the madness. But your happiness will only come when you are able to let this go. Don't measure your life based on your ability to be in a stable relationship because that won't happen until you are satisfied with who you are. You've given this man too much power over your life, even when he's not in it anymore.

 

I truly feel your pain because I was married to someone like this, and I lived it FAR longer than you. The difference is that when it was over, I breathed a sigh of relief. I did not mourn something that was never good for me to begin with. And after that, I lived for ME. My therapy was simply making myself better and doing things that made ME happy. I didn't focus on finding anyone or dwelling on the past. I was 37 years old and starting over with FOUR kids. Talk about no hope! Lol. Today? I'm a year and a half into an amazing relationship with a truly wonderful man that makes my ex seem like some absurd nightmare.

 

Let it go and be happy, sweetie. Just let it go...

[ExpatInItaly]

Yea...I read all those. And if I had to guess...that would be it.

 

Actually sometimes he would say it's horrible living with "this" and I don't want kids because of "this" but I never came out and asked what "this" was because I always walked on eggshells to keep things good.

 

Thanks for responding. But now what? How do I finally get over this rs? I am older and aging. She is young and vibrant. I like the others had the worst. He even chased someone with a garden tool...lol. And now the new one gets the best? If there even is one? It just sickens me still. I suppose if I just knew for positive that what I thought he was (psychopath) was real and SURE about it then I'd be ok. From all I've read psycho's don't change. Or do they?

 

You need to stop keeping up with his life. He shouldn't be on your radar whatsoever. Where are you getting all this information about him from?

[Hopeful714]

Thanks all. I at times think I am finally over it...but the truth is I think about it way too much when triggered...or when I may not be feeling my best. Really though I have come a LONG way. I have what I would call a successful life, am well regarded by many, have much to be thankful for and do live a honest clean lifestyle. This is a far cry from the days of when I was in a zombie like, agorophobic state dazed and confused being totally convinced I encountered pure evil. Sometimes I think it's ptsd.

 

Yes, he had a very troubled childhood that included abuse, an enmeshment with mommy, spoiling, and a suicide by his abusive father (which he used as a pity ploy and excuse for everthing). He knew right from wrong though. He chose to do the things he did.... and felt entitled to do so. Again, his arrogance was like nothing I saw before....but I didnt see all the "bad" until the love bombing was over. But enough about him.

 

So i went about my way yesterday and began to feel better thinking mabey the trigger was that post i read and because this Easter it will be 2 years since the last breadcrumb. (Did he really think Id fall for that again?,,,,uggh) So, on my errands I think I saw him on his bike on the street. like i said we live in the same town. 10 min away actually. So in a sense I feel always on guard.

 

in the past i have gotten some info off social media (that I am not on) but to be honest, i only looked 4-5 times top in 2.5 years just out of curiosity. the woman he is with looks like fool flaunting their rs so pubicily and posting pics of love, gifts, selfies...its incredible. 2 big show offs. Then recently, I did a court search and found he was recently charged (and got off) for a second assualt charge. the first one occured 1 week after we began dating....(the garden tool incident with the ex before me) and beleive it or not...i didnt even know. The stories I could type and tell...the things he said to me...their incredible....unbelieveable. So, I live with knowing I was faked into a rs, and fell for someone who i guess didnt exist? Although sometimes it was bliss.

 

So, i guess i keep wondering...and dwelling because i need to know ...was it real was it fake? Is he Jeckel or Hyde? And which one does this new woman have. it creeps me out knowing there are children living in that house now with a potential for danger. It blows my mind there is a woman who doesnt see what she has....or is really getting the best. the whole thing is mind boggling. And yes...I need to think of something else.

 

I have read on co-dependancy and I realize i was in a bad spot when we met which is why I was easily swallowed up by this. I was naive too and was not aware of the "red flags" however something inside me intuitively told me something was very off early on. I would even go as far as to say it was my fasination, and curiosity of what I found so bizarre that kept me hooked. I kept trying to solve a puzzle. And....now that I write this....I guess I still am. I need to realize there are things we will never solve...or know the answer to.

 

Everything was so upside-down, inside out, chaotic, lies, cheating, insults...yet still...there was this guy...who had such magnitism, who was so beautiful to look at , such an aura and presence that everyone just loved, craved, and desired to be around. heck...he once told me "Everyone is jealous of you.......because your with me."

[Price2Play]

I'm not sure that they do? I've only been in 1 toxic RL & I wonder if she is she same too? I don't dwell on it but I wish her the best & hope she will change for herself so she can be happy for once.

 

It's really sad when peoples perceptions of their actions don't register in their brain.

 

Ohwell, let the past be past. Work on yourself and try to be the best you can be.

[MoreFire]

He can change for a little while but eventually his real self will resurface.

Most serial cheaters lack empathy and real understanding of the consequences of their actions ,they believe they re entitled to have what they want and don't care wether they ll hurt anyone on the way . This ex of yours lacks empathy but perhaps the person he s with represent his ideal and hope she can tame him or improve him.

Edited April 6, 2015 by MoreFire