He's religios, I'm agnostic - deal breaker?

[No_Go]

I am dating a man from a little while and I like him a lot, he is smart, educated, interesting and romantic. However, Christianity is a big part of his life. I am open to it, but I am not a believer. I am a scientist, and I consider myself agnostic. I am open to learn about his beliefs, even go to church with him, but for me this is just a way to understand him better, I don't think I am going to become a believer.

 

Would this be a deal breaker? He said it is not for him, but I think he is internally hoping I will change in time. As said, I am open to listen but not to acquire beliefs. I'm also afraid I'm already falling for him, so I need to decide relatively fast to stay together or part ways...

[d0nnivain]

It can be. It will be more of an issue if you both try to have kids together.

[barcode88]

You need to tell this to him, not us. Only he will be able to tell you if it is a dealbreaker.

[preraph]

Well, you need to emphatically tell him that you have been there done that and aren't going to devolve, and then see how he feels. Also, if there's going to be kids, you need to see if you can agree on church and religion for them.

 

People mix religions all the time. I truly don't see much difference between agnostic dating Christian and Christian churchgoer dating someone who was raised Christian but doesn't practice it. And there's A LOT of those. Unless someone is a fanatic, it doesn't bother me much. I wouldn't like a fanatic agnostic either. I wouldn't like any fanatic. What I have told people in the past to soothe them a bit about my being not into any organized religion is that I was raised with Christian values and still think they're as good as any for the most part.

[No_Go]

You need to tell this to him, not us. Only he will be able to tell you if it is a dealbreaker.

 

He said it is not, but being a devil's advocate, what else he would say in an early dating stage...

 

He is difficult to figure out, very religious, politically liberal, sexually open... liek two people in one.

[alphamale]

It can be. It will be more of an issue if you both try to have kids together.

indeed....

[No_Go]

I truly don't see much difference between agnostic dating Christian and Christian churchgoer dating someone who was raised Christian but doesn't practice it.

 

Ha, actually good point, I forgot to say I was raised Christian, more precisely nobody in my family was a strict believer, but we followed it for major holidays etc.

 

So I also feel like it is workable, but still deep inside I am worried to get too involved with him, and then need to separate because of our different beliefs.

[badpenny]

Oh, you mean a hypocrite...!

 

Seriously though, it's curious because those who are Religious would normally cry off physical contact prior to marriage.

 

He seems to be religious in the way it suits him to be. He is known as a 'cherry-picker'. In other words, he adheres to God's word, providing it suits him to do so.

 

Ask him what the Bible/Church says about sexual intercourse outside marriage.

If he prevaricates and explains why he doesn't agree with the church, ask him what else he doesn't agree with.

 

I'm not suggesting you be argumentative - I'm saying that he seems to have double standards, so it's impotant to know what he stands for, and what he WON'T stand for...

[barcode88]

He said it is not, but being a devil's advocate, what else he would say in an early dating stage...

 

He is difficult to figure out, very religious, politically liberal, sexually open... liek two people in one.

 

If you asked and he said it isn't a problem, I would just take that at face value. His input is going to be the biggest tell whether it's an issue or not.

[GorillaTheater]

Sit down and talk about it. If this guy is that serious about his faith, I imagine he has the exact same concerns. Air them out.

[Haydn]

I`m a non believer my GF is a big believer. I don`t knock her belief and nor does she try to convert me. I listen to her and ask questions and vice versa.

 

Have a chat about it. See if you can both see light? (Sorry)

[pteromom]

Do you respect his faith?

 

Do you believe he respects your beliefs?

 

Would you be ok, if things progressed, to marry in his church?

 

Would you be ok, if things progressed, if he took your children to church and taught them his faith, and raised them with Christian principles?

 

If your answer to any of these questions is "no", then there is no point in continuing.

[Mrin]

As others have mentioned, this is really a question for the two of you to answer. Aside from the marriage and kids issues, there is one thing you need to be really comfortable with his belief - If he's devout, he sincerely believes in the afterlife. And he believes the only way you can have salvation in the afterlife is to accept Jesus. So imagine the sadness he might feel with the thought of spending eternity without the woman (or children) he loves. For the devout, that's just not a concept. That's a very real thing.

 

As the less spiritual half of most of my relationships, it took me a while to fully grasp this. For me, it was just a matter of principle or belief. For them it is about something much bigger.

 

Anyhow, I just wanted to share that.

[No_Go]

Interesting point. I think I will bring this up casually in a conversation to hear his take on this.

 

As others have mentioned, this is really a question for the two of you to answer. Aside from the marriage and kids issues, there is one thing you need to be really comfortable with his belief - If he's devout, he sincerely believes in the afterlife. And he believes the only way you can have salvation in the afterlife is to accept Jesus. So imagine the sadness he might feel with the thought of spending eternity without the woman (or children) he loves. For the devout, that's just not a concept. That's a very real thing.

 

As the less spiritual half of most of my relationships, it took me a while to fully grasp this. For me, it was just a matter of principle or belief. For them it is about something much bigger.

 

Anyhow, I just wanted to share that.

[No_Go]

Yes to all, maybe questioning a little the kids question (i.e. I would be fine with raising kids with his faith, but giving them the chance to decide for themselves in the end).

 

The more I see him, the more I think he is actually more open-minded than my atheist friends and exes. But church is nevertheless a big part of his life (I'm cool with that).

 

 

Do you respect his faith?

 

Do you believe he respects your beliefs?

 

Would you be ok, if things progressed, to marry in his church?

 

Would you be ok, if things progressed, if he took your children to church and taught them his faith, and raised them with Christian principles?

 

If your answer to any of these questions is "no", then there is no point in continuing.

[No_Go]

Thankfully he is not crying this off with me Apparently he was till recently but he changed his mind. I don't want to ask why because it is too early for us to talk in detail about exes, but the hint that I got is that there was an ex involved who changed his mind (for two of us the chemistry is off the chart - it will be a huge pain to keep celibacy)

 

 

Oh, you mean a hypocrite...!

 

Seriously though, it's curious because those who are Religious would normally cry off physical contact prior to marriage.

 

He seems to be religious in the way it suits him to be. He is known as a 'cherry-picker'. In other words, he adheres to God's word, providing it suits him to do so.

 

Ask him what the Bible/Church says about sexual intercourse outside marriage.

If he prevaricates and explains why he doesn't agree with the church, ask him what else he doesn't agree with.

 

I'm not suggesting you be argumentative - I'm saying that he seems to have double standards, so it's impotant to know what he stands for, and what he WON'T stand for...

[maysj18]

I am dating a man from a little while and I like him a lot, he is smart, educated, interesting and romantic. However, Christianity is a big part of his life. I am open to it, but I am not a believer. I am a scientist, and I consider myself agnostic. I am open to learn about his beliefs, even go to church with him, but for me this is just a way to understand him better, I don't think I am going to become a believer.

 

Would this be a deal breaker? He said it is not for him, but I think he is internally hoping I will change in time. As said, I am open to listen but not to acquire beliefs. I'm also afraid I'm already falling for him, so I need to decide relatively fast to stay together or part ways...

 

I'm a scientist, too. And a Christian. The two are not mutually exclusive.

 

Anyways, it may be very hard, honestly. If you read a thread I recently posted, you'd see that I'm dating an atheist and having a very, very hard time with it. It's just something that I, and most Christians, want to experience and share with someone in the long term. I think it's awesome you're going to church and actually trying to be a part of his life, despite your differences. If his Christianity is not a deal breaker for you, you need to ask if your views are for him. They may not be. He also needs to be talked to about his expectations. That could be a real downfall if he has the idea that you might change- that's totally not fair to you. As long as those bases are covered, you all might be fine. Just DEFINITELY talk about it.

 

Being agnostic is also different than atheism, so I see that as having a much greater chance in the long run.

[SawtoothMars]

As others have mentioned, this is really a question for the two of you to answer. Aside from the marriage and kids issues, there is one thing you need to be really comfortable with his belief - If he's devout, he sincerely believes in the afterlife. And he believes the only way you can have salvation in the afterlife is to accept Jesus. So imagine the sadness he might feel with the thought of spending eternity without the woman (or children) he loves. For the devout, that's just not a concept. That's a very real thing.

As the less spiritual half of most of my relationships, it took me a while to fully grasp this. For me, it was just a matter of principle or belief. For them it is about something much bigger..

 

Hmm... you do realize that there is no marriage in heaven. Jesus was specifically asked this question. I lean towards thinking that means our idea of romantic love will not exist... so technically you wouldn't be somebodies special someone. Though I'm not sure...??

 

Yes to all, maybe questioning a little the kids question (i.e. I would be fine with raising kids with his faith, but giving them the chance to decide for themselves in the end).

The more I see him, the more I think he is actually more open-minded than my atheist friends and exes. But church is nevertheless a big part of his life (I'm cool with that).

 

Kids will decide for themselves anyway! I don't see a problem here.

 

I'm a scientist, too. And a Christian. The two are not mutually exclusive.

Anyways, it may be very hard, honestly. If you read a thread I recently posted, you'd see that I'm dating an atheist and having a very, very hard time with it. It's just something that I, and most Christians, want to experience and share with someone in the long term. I think it's awesome you're going to church and actually trying to be a part of his life, despite your differences. If his Christianity is not a deal breaker for you, you need to ask if your views are for him. They may not be. He also needs to be talked to about his expectations. That could be a real downfall if he has the idea that you might change- that's totally not fair to you. As long as those bases are covered, you all might be fine. Just DEFINITELY talk about it.

Being agnostic is also different than atheism, so I see that as having a much greater chance in the long run.

 

Yeah... she is agnostic. I was agnostic for a while and it developed into a rock solid faith.

 

I personally don't think it's smart for YOU to be dating an atheist. They are not open minded people as a general rule. If they were open minded they would by definition be agnostic.

 

My mother is Christian and my father is atheist. He actively thinks people who believe in God are stupid. I love him... but he is an insufferable @ss much of the time. I prefer people who know what they don't know. If you catch my meaning.

[littlesister1234]

It really depends. From personal experience, my mom was a devout catholic and my dad (protestant) left the church for a few years before meeting her. They had a mutual respect and understanding about everything, and kept their beliefs to themselves, because it didn't really play a role in the relationship or raising us, the kids. You need to ask your partner how important it is to him that you are a part of his religion. I also have a friend who is very religious and she had a fiance for 8 years who couldn't stand having bibles and crosses all over the house. He was not religious. She couldn't deal with that fact and left him. She did eventually find someone else, who shared her beliefs with God. Like I said, ask him to see if there is a tolerance on both sides, cause it really is a toss up sometimes.

[maysj18]

Hmm... you do realize that there is no marriage in heaven. Jesus was specifically asked this question. I lean towards thinking that means our idea of romantic love will not exist... so technically you wouldn't be somebodies special someone. Though I'm not sure...??

 

 

 

Kids will decide for themselves anyway! I don't see a problem here.

 

 

 

Yeah... she is agnostic. I was agnostic for a while and it developed into a rock solid faith.

 

I personally don't think it's smart for YOU to be dating an atheist. They are not open minded people as a general rule. If they were open minded they would by definition be agnostic.

 

My mother is Christian and my father is atheist. He actively thinks people who believe in God are stupid. I love him... but he is an insufferable @ss much of the time. I prefer people who know what they don't know. If you catch my meaning.

 

Of course it's a problem. It's a dealbreaker. I can take care of myself and I know he's not my forever partner. I actually just made a post about our relationship within the last hour.

 

Not to get philosophical, but we will know people from earth in Heaven. It is a heartbreaking thought to imagine eternity without the person you love (not just romantically; this goes for anyone). It's equally as hard to imagine a person you love spending their eternity somewhere..else. If you catch my meaning. I've had these thoughts before about my current boyfriend and it makes me so sad because I see someone beautiful who is just spiteful and ignorant, but at the same time, I know God knows his heart better than I do, loves him more than I ever could, and would be so heartbroken over his loss in a way that I could never understand. So, he has every chance in the world, but it's up to him. That makes it easier.

[No_Go]

Maysj18,

 

Thank you for your input: it is valuable as you are in a similar situation.

 

I read your "Hard decision" thread and see where you're coming from. To comment first on your situation... It seems to me that in your case the things are just worn off in a way (quite young couple, presumably first relationship for both, chemistry going away), but also he shows disrespect with his comments towards your beliefs... But still, if I were you I would not break up with him before he graduates. It will hurt him and will likely affect his ability to concentrate, and I think you do not want that. If you can though, get an idea is he applying for jobs in your area, and if so, discourage him from doing that (unless is purely a coincidence and his dream job is close to you). He'll likely get the hint but it won't be as painful as the "betrayal" of a break up in a hard time for him.

 

Regarding my case: I want to be understand him better and be part of his life, plus I am not opposing Christianity (nor any other belief system that is not hurting me in some way).

 

I am honestly keen on being part of his activities in church and bible reading because 1) I want to understand him better 2) I am interested what the religion is bringing to people (as a passive observant, most of the religious people that I know are happier than the atheist ones..) 3) we want to build a common social circle and the church is one of the places to do it.

 

On the other side: 1) I am not sure that I can truly become a believer (although I respect the Christian values and traditions) 2) there is some social pressure against religion in my circles (I agree that science and religion are not mutually exclusive, but most of my friends in the lab are hardcore atheists...) 3) most important, I do not want to be a Christian for the reason of not losing him, if I become one, I want to be due to internal reasons (and I'm afraid to lose him obviously, so I feel like the former can happen).

 

I think I will wait for a little while, so I can see everything more clearly after the initial chemistry wears off a bit, and go into a sincere conversation with him...

 

I'm a scientist, too. And a Christian. The two are not mutually exclusive.

 

Anyways, it may be very hard, honestly. If you read a thread I recently posted, you'd see that I'm dating an atheist and having a very, very hard time with it. It's just something that I, and most Christians, want to experience and share with someone in the long term. I think it's awesome you're going to church and actually trying to be a part of his life, despite your differences. If his Christianity is not a deal breaker for you, you need to ask if your views are for him. They may not be. He also needs to be talked to about his expectations. That could be a real downfall if he has the idea that you might change- that's totally not fair to you. As long as those bases are covered, you all might be fine. Just DEFINITELY talk about it.

 

Being agnostic is also different than atheism, so I see that as having a much greater chance in the long run.

[SawtoothMars]

Of course it's a problem. It's a dealbreaker. I can take care of myself and I know he's not my forever partner. I actually just made a post about our relationship within the last hour.

Not to get philosophical, but we will know people from earth in Heaven. It is a heartbreaking thought to imagine eternity without the person you love (not just romantically; this goes for anyone). It's equally as hard to imagine a person you love spending their eternity somewhere..else. If you catch my meaning. I've had these thoughts before about my current boyfriend and it makes me so sad because I see someone beautiful who is just spiteful and ignorant, but at the same time, I know God knows his heart better than I do, loves him more than I ever could, and would be so heartbroken over his loss in a way that I could never understand. So, he has every chance in the world, but it's up to him. That makes it easier.

 

From a Theological standpoint... I don't really see where the Bible gives a depiction of heaven. I know Muslims talk about their 72 virgins or whatever... but as a Christian this isn't well defined. I would technically define heaven as "being in God's presence" and hell as the opposite.

 

Also... I don't think people choose to believe or not. In my experience God chooses. So, you should pray for him.... and ask God to change his heart.

 

Maysj18,

Thank you for your input: it is valuable as you are in a similar situation.

I read your "Hard decision" thread and see where you're coming from. To comment first on your situation... It seems to me that in your case the things are just worn off in a way (quite young couple, presumably first relationship for both, chemistry going away), but also he shows disrespect with his comments towards your beliefs... But still, if I were you I would not break up with him before he graduates. It will hurt him and will likely affect his ability to concentrate, and I think you do not want that. If you can though, get an idea is he applying for jobs in your area, and if so, discourage him from doing that (unless is purely a coincidence and his dream job is close to you). He'll likely get the hint but it won't be as painful as the "betrayal" of a break up in a hard time for him.

Regarding my case: I want to be understand him better and be part of his life, plus I am not opposing Christianity (nor any other belief system that is not hurting me in some way).

I am honestly keen on being part of his activities in church and bible reading because 1) I want to understand him better 2) I am interested what the religion is bringing to people (as a passive observant, most of the religious people that I know are happier than the atheist ones..) 3) we want to build a common social circle and the church is one of the places to do it.

 

On the other side: 1) I am not sure that I can truly become a believer (although I respect the Christian values and traditions) 2) there is some social pressure against religion in my circles (I agree that science and religion are not mutually exclusive, but most of my friends in the lab are hardcore atheists...) 3) most important, I do not want to be a Christian for the reason of not losing him, if I become one, I want to be due to internal reasons (and I'm afraid to lose him obviously, so I feel like the former can happen).

I think I will wait for a little while, so I can see everything more clearly after the initial chemistry wears off a bit, and go into a sincere conversation with him...

 

I'm sorry to hear your social circle is intolerant. I went through this myself after I converted. I felt the pull strong enough that I was willing to lose some friends.

 

I would encourage you to study the Bible, but not to read it as you would a science or history textbook. This is what trips people up in Revelations and other apocryphal writing. In the very beginning the creation story is not meant to tell you how the earth was made or how long it took. It is telling you Who made it and Why... and giving you a view into the natural order of things.

 

I don't think you will have any problems because you have respect for one another. It's really that simple.

[No_Go]

I'm sorry to hear your social circle is intolerant. I went through this myself after I converted. I felt the pull strong enough that I was willing to lose some friends.

 

I would encourage you to study the Bible, but not to read it as you would a science or history textbook. This is what trips people up in Revelations and other apocryphal writing. In the very beginning the creation story is not meant to tell you how the earth was made or how long it took. It is telling you Who made it and Why... and giving you a view into the natural order of things.

 

I don't think you will have any problems because you have respect for one another. It's really that simple.

 

I am trying to comprehend how to read/study the bible, but as my man mentioned, my mind of a beginner is likely not a bad thing.

 

Social stigmas... I think for my thirty years I managed to get rid of most of my fears, but this is still a predominant one. Well, maybe it is time to say good riddance and stop being dependent on people's approval (issue extending far beyond the topic of the thread).

[SawtoothMars]

I am trying to comprehend how to read/study the bible, but as my man mentioned, my mind of a beginner is likely not a bad thing.

Social stigmas... I think for my thirty years I managed to get rid of most of my fears, but this is still a predominant one. Well, maybe it is time to say good riddance and stop being dependent on people's approval (issue extending far beyond the topic of the thread).

 

When it comes to the Bible... it's both very simple and mind numbingly complex. Especially once you start understanding the original context and looking at the Greek, Aramaic, or Hebrew. Example... in the Garden of Eden story with Adam and Eve. The word we translate as "Serpent" who tempts them... is the word for a hissing sound, which ancient Hebrews also used for Magicians or conjurers. It doesn't change the meaning, however it adds depth and complexity to your understanding of what is going on in the passage.

 

So, you have to be prepared to read the Bible and have a lot of it seem like nonsense. I've been at it for 16 years and still find lots of it goes over my head.

 

In regards to your social circles... I got tired of it and eventually left my science job to work in sales. Most people are accommodating and nice though, so I wouldn't worry about it much.

[No_Go]

Oh, thank you for this example, it actually makes me excited to think about reading/studying it.

 

Haha, and off topic, regarding the science / out of science transition, sadly I have to face something similar.. I got tired of the arrogance and lack of structure, after years of being sure that working in basic science is my dream..

 

When it comes to the Bible... it's both very simple and mind numbingly complex. Especially once you start understanding the original context and looking at the Greek, Aramaic, or Hebrew. Example... in the Garden of Eden story with Adam and Eve. The word we translate as "Serpent" who tempts them... is the word for a hissing sound, which ancient Hebrews also used for Magicians or conjurers. It doesn't change the meaning, however it adds depth and complexity to your understanding of what is going on in the passage.

 

So, you have to be prepared to read the Bible and have a lot of it seem like nonsense. I've been at it for 16 years and still find lots of it goes over my head.

 

In regards to your social circles... I got tired of it and eventually left my science job to work in sales. Most people are accommodating and nice though, so I wouldn't worry about it much.