Can you really date a man (or woman) whose first language is not English?

[ToThinkIs]

Obviously, when I ask this question, I mean in a situation such as mine where English IS my first language.

 

I met a guy not long ago who seems great, we have amazing sex and physical chemistry, I like hanging out with him, etc. His first language is not English, though he can speak it and understand it. However, I would not call him fluent by any means , and definitely not "mother tongue" level.

 

I am no foreigner (pun intended) to dating foreign men. In fact that's all I've dated for quite some time. But the ones prior all had a very high level of English. When I consider someone on a fluent/mother tongue level, I don't just mean they know vocabulary, but that they are also partial to cultural nuances of language-- intonation, jokes, sarcasm, witty repartoire, etc. Still, i've had at least one relationship break up in part because, despite his excellent english, it was still difficult to do "native" behaviours in English for him (things like expressing himself fully in an argument when we fought, and in essence leaving things unsaid, which built up over time.) I understand that and despite being multi=lingual myself, I admit I would have difficulty having a whole relationship in my second or third language.

 

I am a cerebral person with a very proficient grasp of English. I speak 3 other languages on a conversational to fairly fluent level, but none of them are shared with this guy....he speaks one I am still trying to learn and will not be "fluent" in anytime soon, if ever. Communication is very important to me-- it is a definite turn on for me to have great conversations, to have someone joke with me intelligently, for someone to get my sarcasm, to have witty banter with, joke with, and even argue with effectively.

 

This guy is about 5 years younger than me (I never date younger men- he's in his late 20's and I'm in my early 30's) so maybe with time his english would improve. It is certainly not terrible now, and he won't admit it, but I'm going to guess he sincerely understands maybe 70% of what I say if I were to speak at a high level of English like I do to other native speakers. I definitely find myself "dumb-ing down" my speech (eg- using somewhat easier words) when I speak to him. He's asked me not to do that so he can learn but I suppose I get frustrated having to explain what so many words mean.

 

When he writes me texts and emails he makes a lot of errors. Spells words incorrectly, grammar is not great, etc. It irritates me, which is silly, because I know on the inside he is not stupid, but my "default" knee-jerk thought when I have someone write me a text that spells "stupid" as "stooped" is to sigh and slap my forehead in frustration. I have to stop and remind myself that even though I can speak my second language very well, I can't really write it and would probably do worse than him if I tried to write it at all. He has an engineering degree from his country, and in his mother tongue I am sure he speaks very eloquently.

 

I don't want this to get too long but I am worried to waste time on this individual. We have a nice connection now, but it is new and probably confused by initial feelings of lust and "cutesey" feelings that may not be there in a few years as with most relationships when they get out of the honeymoon period, and I am worried that even if he improves we will never be "equals" in the communication department.

 

I have other concerns but maybe that's for another post-- for now I'm curious if others have dated a partner with whom they did not share a first language, and at least one of you was forced to communicate in a second/third/etc language, and how you dealt with it down the line. Cheers.

[kolleamm]

If he's your best option go for it.

[soccerrprp]

Yes, as long as it's Italian:) No, really, broken English is a good starting point. I wouldn't date someone who couldn't communicate (verbally) at all with me. Not at my age now anyway. The other exciting thing is that it will also, hopefully, force you to learn another language!

[ToThinkIs]

If he's your best option go for it.

 

Lol. No offense but that was a sh*te answer! What does that mean "if he's your best option"? I'm in my early 30's , not 50 for chrissake. I don't think I've reached desperation level yet where I have to take "whatever I can get".

 

I'm asking because from what I do know of him I sincerely like him and think he's an intelligent person, but it's only been barely a month and it's hard to tell if this communication issue will be an issue long term. It's not like we can't speak and he's struggling to pull a sentence together....he speaks very well. Maybe what I'd call an advanced conversational level. But what I consider fluency/mother tongue is not where he's at and I'm worried that will cause a drift in the future.

 

But thanks for telling me to be desperate! haha

[Haydn]

Of Course OP, Happened to me quite a few times and still happening. Have a wonderful daughter from a beautiful Hungarian.

[Omei]

Lol. No offense but that was a sh*te answer! What does that mean "if he's your best option"? I'm in my early 30's , not 50 for chrissake. I don't think I've reached desperation level yet where I have to take "whatever I can get".

 

I'm asking because from what I do know of him I sincerely like him and think he's an intelligent person, but it's only been barely a month and it's hard to tell if this communication issue will be an issue long term. It's not like we can't speak and he's struggling to pull a sentence together....he speaks very well. Maybe what I'd call an advanced conversational level. But what I consider fluency/mother tongue is not where he's at and I'm worried that will cause a drift in the future.

 

But thanks for telling me to be desperate! haha

 

LOL!!! nice reply

 

Just think in a year he will be great at it

[Gaeta]

Accept him as he is now, do not count on the fact his English may get better.

 

How long has he been living in your country? If he's just been there for a few years yes his speaking level of English may improve but if he's been there for years then what you see is what you get. If he wants to improuve his grammar he definitely needs to take matter into his hands and take night courses.

 

If you learn a language later in life you will get to a certain ceiling and not progress beyond. I know, I have been speaking English for 25 years, I also work in English, and I wish I could raise my level of English but it's not happening.

[ToThinkIs]

Of Course OP, Happened to me quite a few times and still happening. Have a wonderful daughter from a beautiful Hungarian.

 

Hey. So I have to ask-- forgive if it's impolite-- but, I assume you are a man, right? It seems often that men have foreign wives, and relationships form based largely on the fact their potential mates are, well....beautiful.

 

it seems to happen less the other way around-- a woman with a beautiful man she's incapable of fully communicating with.

 

I know that sounds impolite or improper or sexist or whatever, but hey, anonymous message boards, why hold back? I'm not trying to imply you personally only married your Hungarian wife because she was beautiful, but I just seem to find that really beautiful women often don't have to be conversational masters either. Men often are ok with having ok conversation with someone they are super attracted to. I suppose if that was what you did I wouldn't get that answer anyway...oh well.

 

Obviously I am incredibly attracted to him and it's some of the best sex I've ever had in my life but that's not enough for me to last for a long time. Sometimes I find myself missing that effortless sarcasm and witty banter that came so innately to exes. And yet it's not like he can't have a conversation...he can obviously. We aren't talking in gestures. But at this stage its definitely not the same as other relationships . I don't know.

[ToThinkIs]

Accept him as he is now, do not count on the fact his English may get better.

 

How long has he been living in your country? If he's just been there for a few years yes his speaking level of English may improve but if he's been there for years then what you see is what you get. If he wants to improuve his grammar he definitely needs to take matter into his hands and take night courses.

 

If you learn a language later in life you will get to a certain ceiling and not progress beyond. I know, I have been speaking English for 25 years, I also work in English, and I wish I could raise my level of English but it's not happening.

 

Actually, i am currently in HIS country! So it's not his fault, and actually his level of English is great for someone who has never even been to my country. The onus could be on me to learn his language but realistically my career will probably eventually take my back to my home country, though it might not be for another couple years.

 

He is still young (mid-20's) and pretty proficient already, so feasibly he could get much better. The written part is much worse than his verbal ability. Sometimes I also worry that if we do stay together, and he comes back to my country with me, that his limited english will make him appear less-confident and able to get jobs in his chosen field. Despite being fully competent here in his own language, he's expressed once or twice a certain nervousness about needing to start over again in my country , and seems to be fully a language issue (well, i'm sure starting over in any new country is scary enough). But he's still young enough to manage that I think. If he was 45+ maybe it would be harder.

[Elle1975]

I certainly hope so.. English is my second language.

 

I can relate to what you are saying though. If I speak and write English fluently, I sometimes miss the subtlety of my first language.

 

I also often feel like my IQ gets chopped by 20 points as soon as I open my mouth. I get judged based on my accent. I have had doctors or nurses talking to me as if I was a 5 y old toddler. I try and keep it light; I smile and say "I know I have an accent, but feel at ease, I understand you just fine".

 

What I would advise is to communicate in his native language indeed. A couple years is more than enough to speak his language correctly, at least in a non formal manner. And it's a good plus for your resume.

 

I hate my accent. I would trade it in a second if I could. My friends say "you must get all the guys!". Not at all. Usually the first thing they ask me is "so, do you plan on staying in the US?". I understand the concern, but it gets old to be seen as a foreigner, and not as just a girl on date.

[Haydn]

No worries,

 

Still a man last time checked (5 Minutes ago)

 

I am in the UK but work a lot in Europe so we are all one big happy family us Europeans! Never married, we are no longer together, ended a long time ago but she studied at the London school of economics so converstation was never boring.

 

I learn`t the language almost to a fluent level, i learn`t the idioms and subtle parts of the language. Her English is the same. Our daughter is fluent in both obviously.

 

I think you are confusing the mail order bride system, which is frankly sad but this is not the thread for that.

 

Oh and i am a beautiful man.

 

Good luck it can be overcome!

 

 

Hey. So I have to ask-- forgive if it's impolite-- but, I assume you are a man, right? It seems often that men have foreign wives, and relationships form based largely on the fact their potential mates are, well....beautiful.

 

it seems to happen less the other way around-- a woman with a beautiful man she's incapable of fully communicating with.

 

I know that sounds impolite or improper or sexist or whatever, but hey, anonymous message boards, why hold back? I'm not trying to imply you personally only married your Hungarian wife because she was beautiful, but I just seem to find that really beautiful women often don't have to be conversational masters either. Men often are ok with having ok conversation with someone they are super attracted to. I suppose if that was what you did I wouldn't get that answer anyway...oh well.

 

Obviously I am incredibly attracted to him and it's some of the best sex I've ever had in my life but that's not enough for me to last for a long time. Sometimes I find myself missing that effortless sarcasm and witty banter that came so innately to exes. And yet it's not like he can't have a conversation...he can obviously. We aren't talking in gestures. But at this stage its definitely not the same as other relationships . I don't know.

[ToThinkIs]

No worries,

 

Still a man last time checked (5 Minutes ago)

 

I am in the UK but work a lot in Europe so we are all one big happy family us Europeans! Never married, we are no longer together, ended a long time ago but she studied at the London school of economics so converstation was never boring.

 

I learn`t the language almost to a fluent level, i learn`t the idioms and subtle parts of the language. Her English is the same. Our daughter is fluent in both obviously.

 

I think you are confusing the mail order bride system, which is frankly sad but this is not the thread for that.

 

Oh and i am a beautiful man.

 

Good luck it can be overcome!

 

Beautiful man...hahaha touché my friend. I didn't mean mail order brides, of course-- I've had PLENTY of guy friends/aquaintances say they are willing to sacrifice/do not immediately notice some personality flaws, if you will, when a woman is particularly beautiful. I'm not faulting them-- nature made them so-- but I think it's pretty common to find women needing more of an emotional basis to start relationships and men not always needing it at first....sounds cliche but c'est la vie, it is what it is.

 

Then again, I'm sure many women have overlooked personality deficits because they were really attracted to someone. So maybe my point is moot eh? Oh well.

 

He too is a lovely looking man and I'm told I'm a lovely looking woman but god knows how long a relationship lasts on looks alone. I suppose I get frustrated because, listen, I'm an IQ of 155 type of person with a significant education and career, and I don't want to spend time with someone I'll have a superficial relationship with on a long term. I'm intelligent, I'm sarcastic to a fault sometimes, but I think I have a good sense of humour and I need to have that engaging banter with someone. Fantastic shagging can't carry me forever! I mean it helps don't get me wrong...

 

I've been to Europe a lot :-) You may all be geographically close to one another but people from each country definitely have their own thing going on....hehe.

 

I've been in this (his) country for almost three years but I am, sadly, one of those people who never learned the local language as well as I could have. I could make excuses about being too busy for language classes (and sincerely I often work 15 hours a day) and the fact that a large portion of people (especially professionals) speak English and when they see I am foreign they automatically switch to English. In addition my second language is very widely spoken here (think kind of like spanish is so common in parts of the States or something) and I often revert to that at work and in general. I could have tried harder but its only in the last year that I've been improving in the first local language (his language). Still, I think it will take me longer than another year or two to master it...but who knows. In the last month he and I have taught each other words a lot. In a joking way I even told him to talk to me only in his language in bed-- double plus as I learn new words (perhaps not all appropriate-for-public phrases but nonetheless) and it just sounds much sexier than english :-)

 

I suppose anything can be worth a try....I'm not old, don't get me wrong, but i also am at an age where I don't want to waste an incredible amount of time on each person I date. Normally I can weed people out on personality incompatibilities or whatnot after a few dates but with him I sincerely like being with him but it's "weird" sometimes because I know that he is not being 100% himself verbally because once in a while things are just lost in translation. And I'm hoping that can work itself out...

Edited July 17, 2014 by ToThinkIs

[kolleamm]

Lol. No offense but that was a sh*te answer! What does that mean "if he's your best option"? I'm in my early 30's , not 50 for chrissake. I don't think I've reached desperation level yet where I have to take "whatever I can get".

 

I'm asking because from what I do know of him I sincerely like him and think he's an intelligent person, but it's only been barely a month and it's hard to tell if this communication issue will be an issue long term. It's not like we can't speak and he's struggling to pull a sentence together....he speaks very well. Maybe what I'd call an advanced conversational level. But what I consider fluency/mother tongue is not where he's at and I'm worried that will cause a drift in the future.

 

But thanks for telling me to be desperate! haha

 

So you basically just told yourself that liking this guy would make you desperate? That's the vibe I'm getting here. Going for your best possible option does not make you desperate in any sense. You said it not me.

[Candy_Pants]

I dated only foreign men for a couple years (I was living abroad). A few didn't even speak English!!

 

I asked politely if they wanted help with English and then I acted accordingly. At first I was annoyed by their corrections on my Italian, but I got over it quickly.

[soccerrprp]

At first I was annoyed by their corrections on my Italian, but I got over it quickly.

 

My Italian is quite rusty. Wish I had someone to "correct" me. But certain you're feeling more confident with your Italian thanks in part to the "correction", right?

[Candy_Pants]

My Italian is quite rusty. Wish I had someone to "correct" me. But certain you're feeling more confident with your Italian thanks in part to the "correction", right?

 

Certo. Italiano non é facile. Io lavoro in un ristorante italiano con gli italiani. Un sacco di correzioni per me! Gratis!

[Blade96]

Can you really date a man (or woman) whose first language is not English?"

 

Why the hell not? My (online for now) bf is from Belarus. (I'm a canadian girl) and is not near fluent in English. But I am studying Russian, so ....meh. We communicate in Russian only.

Edited July 18, 2014 by Blade96

[Elle1975]

I suppose I get frustrated because, listen, I'm an IQ of 155 type of person with a significant education and career, and I don't want to spend time with someone I'll have a superficial relationship with on a long term.

 

An IQ of 155 is far from being the norm, the average is about one hundred. I would also think that learning another language wouldn't be an issue.

 

The issue here is tolerance.

[FortunateSon]

I certainly hope so.. English is my second language.

 

I can relate to what you are saying though. If I speak and write English fluently, I sometimes miss the subtlety of my first language.

 

I also often feel like my IQ gets chopped by 20 points as soon as I open my mouth. I get judged based on my accent. I have had doctors or nurses talking to me as if I was a 5 y old toddler. I try and keep it light; I smile and say "I know I have an accent, but feel at ease, I understand you just fine".

 

What I would advise is to communicate in his native language indeed. A couple years is more than enough to speak his language correctly, at least in a non formal manner. And it's a good plus for your resume.

 

I hate my accent. I would trade it in a second if I could. My friends say "you must get all the guys!". Not at all. Usually the first thing they ask me is "so, do you plan on staying in the US?". I understand the concern, but it gets old to be seen as a foreigner, and not as just a girl on date.

Elle, what is your native language?

[ASG]

Hmm.. You know what, I'm not sure I could date someone who spoke broken english..

 

English is not my first language, at all. But I am fluent and only have a hint of an accent. But I find that I'm a bit of a snob when it comes to the language. I'm slightly turned off by broken english. Literally, even the hottest of guys start looking less than if they don't speak a level of english that I deem appropriate. Which is obviously completely unfair and arbitrary.

 

I think I would be more forgiving if it was my first language though, since it is a fairly difficult one. Someone speaking broken portuguese? Fine! Someone speaking broken english? Next!

 

I think because I reached such a level of proficiency, I expect other people to reach the same level...

 

As a result, since moving to the UK I have exclusively dated guys whose first language was English...

[Elle1975]

Elle, what is your native language?

 

French. I pretty much learned English when I came in the US.

[FortunateSon]

French. I pretty much learned English when I came in the US.

I would have never guessed, obviously I can't hear your accent, but your are always very well "spoken" on here.

[Blade96]

I would have never guessed, obviously I can't hear your accent, but your are always very well "spoken" on here.

 

It is not difficult if you want to put the time in. The first time I began to ever study russian. I taught myself for maybe 4 or 5 months before I went to university for it (I did it as one of my two majors). Then I was already writing in complete sentences (not just one or two words) My university prof was shocked when he first met me "How'd you learn to write like that in just 4 months?" LOOL. Still makes me smile when I think about it.

 

In october 2013 I returned to Russian after an absence of 6 years. Only a few months in and when I was writing to my friends on facebook (and VK, the Russian version of fb) I had people telling me, a few of them said they never knew I was not native at first, because I write very well for a foreigner they told me.

 

Obviously Elle put work into her language to learn to write so well.

[fortyninethousand322]

I could. And I have.

 

She spoke Arabic, as I did (though I was not quite as good at it obviously). She spoke English pretty well though.

 

I didn't hold any mistakes against her, nor she me. It was actually kind of cute, because she was a really smart person.

[SleeplessIn]

Some years ago, I dated a guy from Central America who had come to the U.S. When he arrived he knew "Hello", "Please", "Thank you" and "Okay" in English, and that's about all he knew when we started dating. I had Spanish in high school that I never fully learned although I was good at remembering the words for things ("mesa" for "table", etc.). It took us about 6 weeks to be linguistically comfortable together.

 

The first couple of weeks, we sort of communicated with "sign language" (pointing, nodding, things like that) while we talked in our own languages. The next couple of weeks, I realized that although I could not make out all the words he was saying in Spanish, I somehow sort of knew what he was saying.

 

The last couple of weeks, I fully understood what he was talking about even when I didn't actually know a lot of the words, and I had begun dreaming in Spanish, lol!

 

Also, he only had a 10th grade education, he'd had to quit school to care for his mother. I have a year of college and am a voracious reader, so I learn a lot about a lot of things. But his education was a "classical" one, he knew much more about world history than I, he'd studied classics in literature that I had not studied, and so forth. I never felt there was any sort of intellectual gap between us, and once we got rolling with our communication we found ways very easily to share sarcasm, puns and various other types of reference.

 

We are still friends, and when we occasionally talk on the phone, he talks to me in English (he learned from me) and I talk to him in Spanish -- odd how that worked out, but funny still to us.

 

You don't have to fully master another language in order to be conversationally decent in it and able to share subtleties.