On the "Whys" of the Affair

[GoldenR]

I guess I'm looking for some education here...

 

Getting into IC to find out why the WS had the A is always said to be a necessity. I'm asking, why?

 

My pov has always been, they did it bc they wanted to, it's just that simple.

 

But obviously there's more to it, bc many ppl that know much more than me about this say so. So, whether it's bc mom cheated on dad when you were little, or dad abandoned the family when you were 3, or there was sexual abuse, whatever the reason....how exactly does finding out why stop the WS from doing it again?

 

I just don't see how finding out the why of it will stop the WS from doing it again.

[Chica80]

Because as much as we want to make things black and white. They aren't always so.

 

There is a reason someone chose to have an A vs choosing something else. If you want to fix things and make them better you get to the root of the problem. Otherwise it will always be a sort of "option" when things go bad, or trigger again.

[merrmeade]

I guess I'm looking for some education here...

 

Getting into IC to find out why the WS had the A is always said to be a necessity. I'm asking, why?

Before you ask "why" for your premise, why don't you ask if your premise is correct? Or better yet, how about if you ask why people - the BS as you seem to indicate - are encouraged to get into therapy. Or even better than either of those, back further up and say that there is much about the betrayed spouse experience that you don't understand or the advice they often receive—for example, "the necessity" to get into IC in order to "find out why the WS had the A." Or are there other reasons?

 

There are many reasons.

[Arieswoman]

GR,

You ask;

 

I just don't see how finding out the why of it will stop the WS from doing it again.

 

I agree.

 

Cheaters cheat because they choose to cheat. End of. Period. Full-stop.

 

We are all responsible for our own behaviour.

[waterwoman]

I agree with aries to a certain extent - they do it because they wanted to - but once that has been established and they take responsibility for poor choices, I think it's healthy to look deeper into the reasons.

 

I will never never never take responsibility for my H's affair - that was on him entirely. I do however take some responsibility for the poor state of our marriage beforehand. A poor marriage usually involves two normal human beings messing up by accident rather than design, cock-up rather than conspiracy - that's OK, its normal, unfortunate but normal, laziness might be the biggest fault there. Getting too close to someone else and then starting an affair is not accident, it's not OK, it's deliberate, it's cruel.

 

We have addressed the weaknesses in our marriage, it was on H alone to address his action and the causes of them. If he doesn't look into his 'why' how can he do that?

[burnt]

Cheaters cheat because they choose to cheat. End of. Period. Full-stop.

 

JUST based on what we read on this site alone, not all cheaters fall into the SAME category.

 

Some WS cheat because they are serial cheaters--they need to have multiple partners; they seek the constant ego boost and thrill and deception; they like to play games to feel any sense of self-worth.

This group will always look to cheat.

 

Some WS cheat, but then they stop and really want to change their ways. This group of WS have genuine remorse and do what they can to fix the problem and work on their marriage.

This group will learn not to go down the affair path again.

 

The second group of WS seem to have some variation of the following theme:

"I was happy with BS; then came along life and we drifted; I fell into an affair to feel WANTED and loved again. Now I realize I need to work on my marriage."

For this group, the affair was a walk-up call to work on their marriages--and in many cases the affair actually makes them more responsible and aware in their own marriages in the long run--as SICK as it may sound to the BS.

 

So, back to the OP, you DO need to ask the "why"s because you need to understand whether your WS cheated because he's a serial cheater, or whether you and your WS need better communication for both of you to feel wanted and loved in the marriage.

 

After examining the "why", if you find out your WS is a serial cheater, then you you know for sure he will cheat again.

 

If you find out he drifted because both of your drifted from each other, then after working on the marriage, you may have some trust and hope that he will not cheat again.

[road]

Why does not matter. Because even if we all believed the cheating

was justified it will never lessen the pain, triggers, and all the

damage from the affair.

 

 

Why because they wanted to is the answer as to why they cheated.

They made the calculation that what one does not know will not hurt

them. They count on that there never will be a D day.

 

 

Yet we all know how an affair plays out. Sometimes the WS get caught

and times the BS never finds out.

[Mrs. John Adams]

Finding out WHY does not keep a wayward from cheating again.

 

Proper boundaries, transparency, unselfishness, commitment, regret, sorrow, remorse....these are the things that keep a wayward from repeating.

 

Why is answered simply....because we wanted to. That's really the why. However....what is broken inside to allow the WANT to happen? and this could be a million reasons....not excuses...true reasons....circumstances, opportunities.

 

Life does not come with guarantees. When I said my vows I meant them....and I never ever thought that i could be a person that would cheat...I would have bet my life on it....and my husband would never have cheated...had I not cheated first.

 

I am certain in my own mind that i will never cheat again....I am certain he will never cheat again....

 

But I am also smart enough to never say never again. I do everything I possibly can to assure that I don't...and after examining myself for the past 33 years...I know what I need to do to remain faithful. Figuring out why is not the reason....because i am not sure I will ever figure out all of the intricacies of the WHY that make me who I am.

[BluesPower]

JUST based on what we read on this site alone, not all cheaters fall into the SAME category.

 

Some WS cheat because they are serial cheaters--they need to have multiple partners; they seek the constant ego boost and thrill and deception; they like to play games to feel any sense of self-worth.

This group will always look to cheat.

 

Some WS cheat, but then they stop and really want to change their ways. This group of WS have genuine remorse and do what they can to fix the problem and work on their marriage.

This group will learn not to go down the affair path again.

 

The second group of WS seem to have some variation of the following theme:

"I was happy with BS; then came along life and we drifted; I fell into an affair to feel WANTED and loved again. Now I realize I need to work on my marriage."

For this group, the affair was a walk-up call to work on their marriages--and in many cases the affair actually makes them more responsible and aware in their own marriages in the long run--as SICK as it may sound to the BS.

 

So, back to the OP, you DO need to ask the "why"s because you need to understand whether your WS cheated because he's a serial cheater, or whether you and your WS need better communication for both of you to feel wanted and loved in the marriage.

 

After examining the "why", if you find out your WS is a serial cheater, then you you know for sure he will cheat again.

 

If you find out he drifted because both of your drifted from each other, then after working on the marriage, you may have some trust and hope that he will not cheat again.

 

This is about the best explanation that I have heard.

 

There are a variety of reasons, but these are some of the main ones. At some point, when one or both of the partners stop tending the garden that is their marriage, in a certain percentage of marriages someone is going to cheat. The rest will be miserable.

[understand50]

All,

 

I think the "why" is always at the moment "I did it, because I wanted to and could" The real questions is how did the WS arrive at the point of cheating, what was happening that allowed them to break their vows.

 

1) As Mr Blunt stated, there are the serial cheaters, and they never did or will commit to the marriage. If want to stay married, a open marriage or swinging is the only option.

 

2) The committed spouse who falls for a ONS, or brief fling. I think it is good to go over how they found themselves in the situation where their morals and self control could be overwhelmed and they debased themselves. I think in this case, it is a whole host of things, from being mad at their spouse, infatuated with the AP, even if for the second, and also curiosity on what it would be like to have sex with someone new. In this case, given the remorseful and repentant spouse, I think the odds are low that it will happen again. Assuming full discloser, and remorse.

 

Of course there are others, the fling, and such, but I think they are rifts off of the main two above. I think trying understand "why" can be and is helpful, but one must also accept that the WS may not really know "why". You will never get a really satisfactory answer, past what they relate. Sometime good people go stupid things. How this fits into reconciliation or divorce and then the relationship going forward is much more important.

 

My two cents.....

[JohnAdams]

I think it is important for a WS to get into IC in some situations. Not to find out WHY they had an affair, but why they are broken. In some cases, they may not need IC. An exit affair is pretty clear as to why, but, it would have been much better to just exit.

 

 

GoldenR, I am curious. I know on other threads you have stated that when you found out about your wife's affair you divorced and found someone who loves you and someone you can trust. Congratulations! For someone who has moved on, your ws's actions still seem to bother you. How long have you been divorced? Do you still interact with your ws, possibly due to children? I am reconciled instead of divorced and was just curious about the perspective of a divorced bs.

 

 

Thanks, and best of luck to you.

[somanymistakes]

Why does not matter. Because even if we all believed the cheating

was justified it will never lessen the pain, triggers, and all the

damage from the affair.

 

Knowing why doesn't mean that the cheating was justified.

 

However, exploring the why can help point out to a WS where their planning strategies were flawed, and bring home to them that it was their choice, and that they can choose better in the future.

 

If all someone says is "I don't know, it just happened, sorry" they're not engaging with their own responsibility at all.

 

Let's say you go to counselling and the WS's story is that the spouse was too busy and they never had sex anymore so they felt 'neglected'. As we all know, there are more mature ways to handle feeling neglected than running off and having an affair - so why weren't they used? Digging into the whys can help you find the personality/judgment flaws that need to be corrected - and for the betrayed spouse who actually wants to stay together, to help flag up warning signs they might want to look out for and communication angles that need to be regularly checked.

 

Examining the why and the how does not mean approving of those choices.

[BTDT2012]

The why is not for the BS, it is for the WS to understand him/her self better. Why they made the choices they made, what is broken inside themselves.

[cocorico]

I guess I'm looking for some education here...

 

Getting into IC to find out why the WS had the A is always said to be a necessity. I'm asking, why?

 

<snip>

how exactly does finding out why stop the WS from doing it again?

 

I just don't see how finding out the why of it will stop the WS from doing it again.

 

My H found IC very helpful. Because infidelity was so out of character for him, he wanted to know what had allowed him to act so contrary to his values. He needed to know what was stopping him from doing the thing he knew - and everyone around him told him - to be right (i.e. dump the xW).

 

IC helped him to understand how a perfect storm of circumstances played into a climate of his deepest fears and hopes, which made him vulnerable to the A. Knowing and understanding that dynamic has given him tools to deal with other situations where he may find himself vulnerable.

[aliveagain]

So you never go down the same slippery slope that led you to an affair. You need to be able to recognize the behaviors that got you into trouble so you can change them, who want's to be with a partner that isn't safe? Affairs are just temporary fixes, the truth is they destroy everything that is good in your life. No one ever really wins.

[cocorico]

 

who want's to be with a partner that isn't safe?

 

 

If you plan on reconciling, I'd say that IC as well as MC are vital if the M is to be sustainable. Likewise, if the APs end up together, counselling helps the fMP to "fix" the dysfunctional behaviour, instead of dragging it into the other R.

[Got it]

For myself, going to therapy and looking at the why was really looking at the thought process, justifications, etc. that were the beginning of the slippery slopes. It goes back much farther just having had an affair, but how you handle conflict, communication, the internal dialogue, etc. that were the steps that ultimately resulted in an affair.

 

The why doesn't minimize, justify, or make the affair okay/acceptable. It is getting you to understand how to be a better partner, how to be more self aware, so that you learn to - express how you feel, don't compartmentalize, understand how you are feeling, keep score, etc. etc.

[GoldenR]

GoldenR, I am curious. I know on other threads you have stated that when you found out about your wife's affair you divorced and found someone who loves you and someone you can trust. Congratulations! For someone who has moved on, your ws's actions still seem to bother you. How long have you been divorced? Do you still interact with your ws, possibly due to children? I am reconciled instead of divorced and was just curious about the perspective of a divorced bs.

 

This was more in response to several very similar threads we've had here lately, where I kept seeing the same advice being given, that being, "to get yourself into IC to figure out why you did this, how you were able to do this".

 

I'm going to TJ my own thread here.....As far as the ex, I see her very rarely. I saw her last month for the first time in 2+ years. It was for our 24 yr old daughter's open heart surgery. She's still the same selfish, egomaniacal bitch she's always been. She made this big production when she showed up the night before the surgery, saying how she took 2 weeks off of work and how she was going to stay every night with our daughter there in the hospital. I was annoyed, to say the least. From the day my daughter was born with heart problems, XW couldn't be bothered to every stay the night with her, NC she was uncomfortable there. I'm dead serious here. Our daughter was born, they tell us she may not make it as she has a totally jacked up heart, and XW can't be bothered to stay at the hospital with her. So I did, happily. For her first 3 months, I slept at the hospital with her, and then all throughout her life, we've spent over 400 days in the hospital total in the hospital....always me with her. Which was fine with me. But then she'd get angry that I had the closer bond with our daughter.

 

Anyway, she shows up, days she's staying with her. Daughter just kind of looks at me. Ex walks out of the room, and my daughter says she wants me, not her mom. I told her that she was a grown adult, that she needs to tell her. She thinks about it, then asks if I'll be upset if she lets her mom stay with her. I tell her no, I won't. So she just goes with it and mom is all set to stay the entire time.

 

I slept on a chair in the waiting room the first night to make sure my daughter survived that first night, as it's ashtrays the roughest, then I went home, which was about 140 miles away.

 

On day 2, XW calls me and says, she's actually leaving after 5 nights. Then on day 3 she calls me again and says she's leaving the next day bc she can't get any sleep there and she needs her sleep. I wasn't surprised, told her I'd be there the next day you take over. The next day I get there and she's already gone. My daughter has been having a really rough time there as it turned out that one of the many meds that they were giving her was causing severe migraines, causing her to cry, loudly at times, for hours. My first night there, before we went to sleep, my daughter told me that she was very sorry if she wound up keeping me awake at night bc of her pain. I told her that I wasn't there on vacation, I was there to help her. I asked her what that advance apology was all about. She said her mom would get mad at her any time she was in pain, bc it kept her awake. This made my blood boil. Her daughter was there, crying....wailing with level 10 pain, and she's telling her throughout this to stop crying, that she just needs to take the pain bc it's part of recovery and to stop crying bc she's keeping her awake. Yes, this is all real. I told my daughter I was sorry she went thru that with her mom, and not to worry about that with me. And for the next 3 days, her migraines would hit. She'd cry and or her head into my chest and hold me until the pain meds kicked in 45 mins or so later when she'd finally pass out.

 

So yeah....same old selfish bitch. I was tempted to call her and explode on her, but decided against it. I just think it's wasted breath. She will never get it anyway.

 

So there you go....lol.

[GoldenR]

JA - irt your other questions. I kicked my XW out for good in early 2002. Our 2 daughters stayed with me....the ex didn't even try for custody. Met my W in 2005. Married in Aug 2007. Contact w/XW was always limited bc she made no effort ever to have any kind of relationship with our daughters.

[Mrs. John Adams]

This was more in response to several very similar threads we've had here lately, where I kept seeing the same advice being given, that being, "to get yourself into IC to figure out why you did this, how you were able to do this".

 

I'm going to TJ my own thread here.....As far as the ex, I see her very rarely. I saw her last month for the first time in 2+ years. It was for our 24 yr old daughter's open heart surgery. She's still the same selfish, egomaniacal bitch she's always been. She made this big production when she showed up the night before the surgery, saying how she took 2 weeks off of work and how she was going to stay every night with our daughter there in the hospital. I was annoyed, to say the least. From the day my daughter was born with heart problems, XW couldn't be bothered to every stay the night with her, NC she was uncomfortable there. I'm dead serious here. Our daughter was born, they tell us she may not make it as she has a totally jacked up heart, and XW can't be bothered to stay at the hospital with her. So I did, happily. For her first 3 months, I slept at the hospital with her, and then all throughout her life, we've spent over 400 days in the hospital total in the hospital....always me with her. Which was fine with me. But then she'd get angry that I had the closer bond with our daughter.

 

Anyway, she shows up, days she's staying with her. Daughter just kind of looks at me. Ex walks out of the room, and my daughter says she wants me, not her mom. I told her that she was a grown adult, that she needs to tell her. She thinks about it, then asks if I'll be upset if she lets her mom stay with her. I tell her no, I won't. So she just goes with it and mom is all set to stay the entire time.

 

I slept on a chair in the waiting room the first night to make sure my daughter survived that first night, as it's ashtrays the roughest, then I went home, which was about 140 miles away.

 

On day 2, XW calls me and says, she's actually leaving after 5 nights. Then on day 3 she calls me again and says she's leaving the next day bc she can't get any sleep there and she needs her sleep. I wasn't surprised, told her I'd be there the next day you take over. The next day I get there and she's already gone. My daughter has been having a really rough time there as it turned out that one of the many meds that they were giving her was causing severe migraines, causing her to cry, loudly at times, for hours. My first night there, before we went to sleep, my daughter told me that she was very sorry if she wound up keeping me awake at night bc of her pain. I told her that I wasn't there on vacation, I was there to help her. I asked her what that advance apology was all about. She said her mom would get mad at her any time she was in pain, bc it kept her awake. This made my blood boil. Her daughter was there, crying....wailing with level 10 pain, and she's telling her throughout this to stop crying, that she just needs to take the pain bc it's part of recovery and to stop crying bc she's keeping her awake. Yes, this is all real. I told my daughter I was sorry she went thru that with her mom, and not to worry about that with me. And for the next 3 days, her migraines would hit. She'd cry and or her head into my chest and hold me until the pain meds kicked in 45 mins or so later when she'd finally pass out.

 

So yeah....same old selfish bitch. I was tempted to call her and explode on her, but decided against it. I just think it's wasted breath. She will never get it anyway.

 

So there you go....lol.

 

Sounds like you hate her for many reasons...and have for a very long time....one wonders how good the relationship was to begin with if you have resented her egotistical self for at least 24 years.

 

I don't find it hard to believe that you would have a very hard time then understanding reconciliation or anything that has to do with it.

 

I was a good mom....John did nothing for our children....he did not feed them...( they were breast fed) he did not change diapers...he did bathe them...he did not discipline them....

 

John was the breadwinner...I was the stay at home mom...totally and completely devoted to taking care of my husband, my children and my home.

A Christian wife became a slvt for lack of a better word to describe me.....you then you look at the situation and wonder how did this happen....why did this happen?

how did my little perfect wife who completely and totally adores me...change right before my eyes? and after I confessed to him and asked him what he wanted me to do.....does he then make the decision to throw me away? even though i had made a horrible terrible choice. So WHY is an important question that has plagued him all these years.I get it when betrayed spouses are confronted with infidelity that is so completely out of character for their spouses...I understand why they choose to reconcile.

 

But I also understand when you are married to a person who has always shown selfish characteristics and who has been irresponsible and neglectful...that the betrayed spouse has chosen divorce. I understand why that was the best choice for you and why you might have a hard time understanding a man like my husband choosing reconciliation.

 

All wayward spouses are not the same...just like all betrayed spouses are not the same...but we often apply our own situations to those who post here. I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt because i know who i was and who i became and who i am now.

 

I also understand how some betrayed spouses just have no reason to consider reconciliation.....

 

Why is a difficult question to answer....and for some it really doesn't matter why...because their decision to divorce is the best one for them....but for those who reconcile....why is haunting...because no one wants to be caught off guard and destroyed a second time.

[JohnAdams]

GoldenR, thanks for answering me. I can certainly understand how you feel this way and I do not blame you.

 

Sounds like you had a bad situation most if not all of your marriage. Sounds like good riddance. Sounds like her affair was an exclamation mark on a very bad situation.

 

I hope all is working out for you now in a new situation and all goes well.

[Lovetoo]

Good post. I think it's important to know why. But knowing why alone won't stop it. You must go further.

 

The idea that some pole cheat because they need the ego boost and attention and will never stop I don't agree with. If they need an ego boost and attention so bad that tell you they have voids that need to be filled. More than likely these voids did NOT begin with the spouse but stem from something they missed much deeper and younger.

 

I say all this because, many times you notice girls being "boy crazy", doing anything for attention. They grow up to be women who do anything for love. If that woman doesn't know that her lack of a male father figure contributed to her void and tendacy to degrade, demean and accept less for male attention, then she will always choose that life. But even after knowing why, you still have to work in order to keep the deficiency of a father from affecting you present/future.

 

I'm typing on my phone and hope my ideas make sense.

[GoldenR]

Sounds like you hate her for many reasons...and have for a very long time....one wonders how good the relationship was to begin with if you have resented her egotistical self for at least 24 years.

 

I don't find it hard to believe that you would have a very hard time then understanding reconciliation or anything that has to do with it.

 

I was a good mom....John did nothing for our children....he did not feed them...( they were breast fed) he did not change diapers...he did bathe them...he did not discipline them....

 

John was the breadwinner...I was the stay at home mom...totally and completely devoted to taking care of my husband, my children and my home.

A Christian wife became a slvt for lack of a better word to describe me.....you then you look at the situation and wonder how did this happen....why did this happen?

how did my little perfect wife who completely and totally adores me...change right before my eyes? and after I confessed to him and asked him what he wanted me to do.....does he then make the decision to throw me away? even though i had made a horrible terrible choice. So WHY is an important question that has plagued him all these years.I get it when betrayed spouses are confronted with infidelity that is so completely out of character for their spouses...I understand why they choose to reconcile.

 

But I also understand when you are married to a person who has always shown selfish characteristics and who has been irresponsible and neglectful...that the betrayed spouse has chosen divorce. I understand why that was the best choice for you and why you might have a hard time understanding a man like my husband choosing reconciliation.

 

All wayward spouses are not the same...just like all betrayed spouses are not the same...but we often apply our own situations to those who post here. I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt because i know who i was and who i became and who i am now.

 

I also understand how some betrayed spouses just have no reason to consider reconciliation.....

 

Why is a difficult question to answer....and for some it really doesn't matter why...because their decision to divorce is the best one for them....but for those who reconcile....why is haunting...because no one wants to be caught off guard and destroyed a second time.

 

 

Thanks for your reply, Mrs JA. I am a fan of your insights here on LS.

 

I don't think that all WS are the same. It's just that I usually don't weigh in on the ones that I think are remorseful and deserve R.

 

My XW changed a lot after giving birth. She became someone that I didn't recognize. I kept hoping she'd come back, but it never happened.

 

Thanks again for commenting!

Edited March 24, 2017 by GoldenR

[TunaInTheBrine]

I just don't see how finding out the why of it will stop the WS from doing it again.

 

Because insight alone isn't enough to facilitate change. Insight only signals the beginning of change. When insight into the why is obtained, it is up to the person to then do the (often) painful emotional work of getting closure around their past.

 

There are often MANY multiple and very complicated reasons for affairs, and the process of change takes time. Frankly, most people aren't willing to do the work because it's simply easier not to, at least in the short run.

 

The more that people have an emotionally compelling reason or reasons to change, the more likely they are to follow through eventually. It just takes insight, patience, a willingness to work through, and hope.

[burnt]

To OP, GoldenR and all other posters on this thread, who wrote "asking the WHY doesn't matter", please read the highlights of the initial thread written by OP:

 

I've been in 7 relationships in my life, and I've been cheated on in 6 of those 7 relationships.

 

First high school girlfriend ---

...

Got there just in time to see my gf waking out the front door with her hand holding a guy's hand, leading him to his car, where they proceeded to have a quickie. I waited for the car to stop rocking,

...

 

Serious girlfriend from high school/early college --- cheated on me 11 times. I only caught her 5 times ("only" - lol), and dumped her after the fifth.

 

College girlfriend/fiancee --- cheated on me 7 times. I only knew about two of them, left her after I found out about the 2nd one.

 

2nd college gf --- almost the same as high school gf #1.

 

Wife (now ex) --- cheated on me 7 times. I only caught two of them.

 

First gf after D --- I met her at a bar. She told me she lived with a guy but they were done.

...

She had given me a key, so I sneak in quietly and creep to the bedroom to find her ex bf

...

 

The question you really need to ask and reflect on is "WHY" you chose that many partners with such a consistent pattern of cheating and WHY you chose to stay with them repeatedly even after knowing about their cheating history.

 

I am not saying this to criticize you--I'm saying this with the hope that you realize you can only control your own actions, not the cheaters; but there's something about yourself you need to examine in your IC to understand why you repeatedly chose to be with such dysfunctional and deceptive partners.

 

And for all the posters here who have said "no point in asking the WHYs",

imagine the OP had asked the WHY years ago...