I want to learn from this breakup

[acephoenix]

First of all, thank you so much for helping me begin my healing process after my breakup. For those unfamiliar, you can find the details here.

 

My healing process is peculiar - I prefer to acknowledge & feel my emotions, understand the events that happened, and use that to grow so if I end up feeling the same way again, I'm better equipped to handle myself. Keeping myself busy/distracted only keeps emotions at bay for me and doesn't help me learn/grow from the experience.

 

I've accepted that she [26/f] needs time & space to deal with her issues. It doesn't matter that I disagree with her choice to step away because of her fear of failure or believe that simply communicating her struggle would've let us work through it together. Because if she was unable to feel comfortable enough to do that, she was simply not ready to be in a mature relationship and by extension, not someone I could've been able to trust & rely upon to support me during tough times. Sure, she might grow from this in the future, but during the time we dated, everything above was true.

 

But upon reflecting, I believe there were situations that I'm not sure if I handled correctly and I'd like your help on being better should I encounter them again. Please let me know if you need more details:

1. During our first time being intimate, she told me that she had never had sex before. I asked her about the guy she dated for 2.5 years (and was sure she was going to marry), and her answer was that she was afraid of messing up & getting pregnant. When I asked her what about with me, she said she wasn't worried about that anymore...
   
2. She kept showing signs of commitment issues & attachment to her ex's. She kept photos of her serious ex, met with another for coffee/lunch a week before our first date (and told me about it during the first date), and spoke very negatively about all her ex's when telling me about her past. When she told me she had feelings for me, she phrased it as "I'm falling for you & that is scaring me". She'd also shield herself from being hurt every time I had something I needed to think over by being incredibly nonchalant and appearing to not care.
   

Both of these put incredible pressure on me. Nevertheless, I tried to be incredibly flexible & supportive, and told her that she could take all the time she needed because I was in no rush to get anywhere. But one of her complaints was that I wasn't myself after the first few dates - which is true because I was trying to be supportive & accommodating, and I was always afraid of triggering her commitment issues... I feel as though this may have made it difficult for her to trust me (her being unable to read me) and me being accommodating may have made her feel even more pressured...

 

What I am wondering about & would like to learn for the future:

1. Could I have handled either of these situations more effectively? If so, how?
   
2. Is it possible to be flexible while avoiding triggering commitment issues but also be 100% yourself at the same point? If so, how?
   
3. If these flags pop up again, should I go for the nearest exit or should I try to be supportive again? I want this to inform my future self, not bias it.
   
4. During the time I was seeing her (3 months), I was working through doubts of my own by just giving things time. That affected my ability to be natural all the time with her. How do I be natural during the early stages of dating without letting my premature doubts affect me?
   

[DarrenB]

 

What I am wondering about & would like to learn for the future:

1. Could I have handled either of these situations more effectively? If so, how?
   
2. Is it possible to be flexible while avoiding triggering commitment issues but also be 100% yourself at the same point? If so, how?
   
3. If these flags pop up again, should I go for the nearest exit or should I try to be supportive again? I want this to inform my future self, not bias it.
   
4. During the time I was seeing her (3 months), I was working through doubts of my own by just giving things time. That affected my ability to be natural all the time with her. How do I be natural during the early stages of dating without letting my premature doubts affect me?
   

 

I'll start off by saying this is probably in the wrong section. Posting in 'Coping' may have been the more appropriate choice. You've already got thread/s in the Breakup section so this is just going to get moved into that as a 'bumped post'. Completely irrelevant to say I know, but a lot of people do it and I don't think they understand.

 

Moving on...

 

1) Doesn't matter. Maybe you could have, maybe not but it's not something to analyze or think of. You'll only think about it more and begin to reminisce when you shouldn't. You might want to know out of curiousity and for future reference but it's genuinely not worth bothering to dwell on or try and analyze. Think of it as trial and error, nothing more. 3 months with someone is definitely not enough time to let it concern you this much, simple.

 

2/3) I'll merge 2/3 with my opinion. Of course it's possible to remain flexible whilst avoiding commitment problems, however it's up to you whether that develops onwards or not. Purely just based on the compatibility and chemistry between the person you're currently dating. Not everyone is going to be like your ex. You may some extremely similar and some extremely different, but that's not the point. If uncertainty and frustration only after 3 months with someone can draw you to such tension and conflict then I think that's the main sign it will not work and the relationship will deteriorate from that point onward. Again I say, don't compare the people you date to this specific ex. If you want to progress in a new relationship it's more beneficial for you to leave this behind.

 

4) Acknowledge and work out your doubts before you attempt to progress in a more romantically/intimately involving relationship or connection. Get to know the person, but get to know yourself also. I think every person you're with will teach you something completely new about yourself. Some people would consider it a myth but I think it's a true statement, personally.

 

It's 6:30am and I'm insanely fatigued this morning, so apologies in advance if any of this is bewildering. Take care!

[Been]

Man I'm just going to be brutally honest with you.

She has issues about being in a relationship-yet she almost got married???

Has a shrine devoted to one of her exs and keeps in contact with other exs??

BAD NEWS.

If your driving down a road and their are SIGNS posted saying in a couple of miles slow down due to road work do you speed up?RED FLAGS are warnings for you to STOP dating someone before you get hurt.

You see RED FLAGS RUN away don't walk!!!Dont try to navigate around them.

[basil67]

You're not unusual. Most people want to understand what happened and learn from it. However, it's a mistake to ever think that you'll fully understand what happened with another person.

 

I think your problem is that you vastly overestimate how much your own behaviour would have made a difference.

 

If you were your normal self, she may have gotten scared and run. But as you found out, wrapping her in cotton wool also doesn't work. Why? Because she's broken and not ready to date. You were in a no win situation from the start.

 

I'm wondering why you talk about 'premature' doubts. Apparently you knew from a few dates in that she was broken. This caused you to twist yourself in knots to not upset her. That's not a premature doubt - that's a huge red flag.

 

Lastly, I don't understand why her not being concerned about losing her virginity to you was a weight on your shoulders. I suspect you may have been overthinking this bit.

[Been]

And honestly she's the worst type-a manipulator. Like I've posted in other threads the more you let them talk the worse it is for you.

I would bet money that 90 per cent of what she tells you is suspect.

As far as being a virgin you have to know that's not a true story.

[LargoLagg]

Whenever I heard girl tell me she was afraid of {whatever} with me, it was like an inoculation against falling for that person. In the end, they were always right - I always left them, and it was always for cause.

 

Whatever the root cause, that's just messed up, and that manifests itself in other ways in their lives too. They don't believe in themselves.

 

My advice? ALWAYS listen for that sentiment.

[acephoenix]

You're not unusual. Most people want to understand what happened and learn from it. However, it's a mistake to ever think that you'll fully understand what happened with another person.

 

I think your problem is that you vastly overestimate how much your own behaviour would have made a difference.

 

If you were your normal self, she may have gotten scared and run. But as you found out, wrapping her in cotton wool also doesn't work. Why? Because she's broken and not ready to date. You were in a no win situation from the start.

 

I'm wondering why you talk about 'premature' doubts. Apparently you knew from a few dates in that she was broken. This caused you to twist yourself in knots to not upset her. That's not a premature doubt - that's a huge red flag.

 

Lastly, I don't understand why her not being concerned about losing her virginity to you was a weight on your shoulders. I suspect you may have been overthinking this bit.

 

Thanks! It really did feel like a no-win situation.

 

My premature doubts were actually not related to these issues at all - I was mostly thinking about compatibility factors. I had realized I was overthinking compatibility factors and just needed to give this girl a chance for feelings to develop, and not freak out that I wasn't in love with her in just 3 months of dating her. As for these flags, I had noticed them initially and decided I was going to be supportive.

 

Her losing her virginity to me was never an issue. It was that she valued it so highly that she didn't even lose it to the guy she thought she was going to marry. That's what stressed me out about it... And her reason was "being afraid of messing up"... well, then what has magically changed in the last 2 years that you're no longer afraid of messing up!?

[acephoenix]

I'll start off by saying this is probably in the wrong section. Posting in 'Coping' may have been the more appropriate choice. You've already got thread/s in the Breakup section so this is just going to get moved into that as a 'bumped post'. Completely irrelevant to say I know, but a lot of people do it and I don't think they understand.

 

I'm sorry about that! How can I move it into the right thread?

[basil67]

well, then what has magically changed in the last 2 years that you're no longer afraid of messing up!?

 

Self confidence? Learning to not sweat the small stuff? I can only see this as a positive in her situation.

[acephoenix]

Self confidence? Learning to not sweat the small stuff? I can only see this as a positive in her situation.

 

That's a very fair point! I did my best to not sweat it, but every time we'd get intimate, I'd get scared of pushing too far or doing anything to aggravate her knowing how much of a big deal it used to be for her. This would in turn affect me because I would end up being in my head and not in the moment... I guess you're right, I shouldn't have overthought this one.

 

But hey! This is a great learning moment for me!

[ff12343]

Ok so I read both of your threads. My story from 1 year ago is identical to yours. Girl made a move on me and shortly after red flags popped up everywhere. Every time I asked what was wrong I got a completely different response.

 

Just like you I over analyzed everything. So much I broke out a bit on my body. A few people nailed an important fact. "Don't over analyze anything."

 

Someone else also mentioned something that is spot on. "She's a manipulator". Yep.

 

Trust me, you don't want to chase. They lie to protect your feelings. If they cared, they wouldn't go. All this nonsense with her ex's is very bad news. You don't want that. But regardless it doesn't seem like she has those feelings for you despite any physical activity. I learned that the hard way too.

 

You seem to be going off of her "words" and not her "actions". Think about that one.

[acephoenix]

Someone else also mentioned something that is spot on. "She's a manipulator". Yep.

 

Trust me, you don't want to chase. They lie to protect your feelings. If they cared, they wouldn't go. All this nonsense with her ex's is very bad news. You don't want that. But regardless it doesn't seem like she has those feelings for you despite any physical activity. I learned that the hard way too.

 

You seem to be going off of her "words" and not her "actions". Think about that one.

 

Can I ask why you guys think she's a manipulator?

 

For me, it was her actions that made me realize she is being genuine. For instance, why was she trying to get me to go to her friend's party or why was she trying to book bowling lanes 1 hour before we she decided she was going to break up? Why was she going out of her way to be incredibly caring and supportive leading up to the last minute.

 

And when I asked her how the decision got made, she told me that the her near breakdown in front of me 2 days before was what led her to the decision to end it. I believe her because I've seen her make decisions before that followed the exact same format: freak out at possibility of failure, decide not to try, and then use choice-supportive bias to support the fear driven decision. Once, I overthought her attitude towards physical intimacy and she got upset at me for overthinking, and made it clear that she is the type of person who means what she says - she's not a typical girl.

 

So I guess what I'm saying is that I don't think she was being manipulative or lying to me. She has genuine commitment/vulnerability issues that I knew of and I had told her I knew - I once jokingly called her "Chandler" and whenever her fear came up, I would seriously tell her that while I could support her, the solution had to come from her, not me. The reality is just that these issues came up with me and she couldn't handle them. It really sucks that she was unwilling to lean on me, but these are deep rooted anxiety or fear issues that she needs to deal with, and I unfortunately cannot be with someone who cannot handle these emotions or lean on me for help when they face them. Questioning her genuineness without proof will only make me overthink on subject matter where there is no evidence to support theories I'll come up with.

 

My goal now really is to look back at a few instances where I feel I could've been better and or figured a way out of some of the no-win situations I faced.

[Miss Clavel]

okay, i'm gonna have a go at what happened, **** happens. now it's over.

 

 

you sound like a great guy and i think you can do better. sue me.

 

and, speaking from experience, if you're in someone's bed and you can't get out of your own head, you're in the wrong bed. period.

 

let. it. go. love is an art, not a science.

[jstar845]

It’s great that you have reached out for support. The healing process you utilize is beneficial as it allows you to learn and grow in relationships. Thus, in the future you can evaluate and improve. This is wonderful as some individuals do not think along the same lines. Its seems you know how to make the improvements in future relationships. I’m wondering if you have thought about what you want in a relationship and evaluated this within yourself?. I wish you the best.

[acephoenix]

I’m wondering if you have thought about what you want in a relationship and evaluated this within yourself?

 

It's great that you're asking this. I had decided shortly after the exchanges on this thread that I need to do a few things:

- Develop a clear sense of my own value system

- Work towards deriving the bulk of my confidence from within me, and learn to not rely extensively on social approval or external validation for my self-confidence and self-esteem

- Think about what kind of relationship I want right now, what I have to offer, and what are the reasons I need / signs I need to see in order to tell someone I "love" them or that I want to "marry" them.

 

I'm taking these steps because I realized that I had been so focused on my career for the last 3 years that when this relationship happened, I began deriving so much social value and confidence from it that I was a wreck when it all ended. I began leaning on my friends too heavily for that value, and eventually realized I needed to be a properly functioning person on my own before I could go out and date again. I also found myself wondering many times while I was dating her about what it meant for me to say "I love you" and what my criteria for good reasons for marrying someone was, and I didn't have any good answers...

 

So all in all, I want to take some time to focus on myself and figure myself out so when I am dating again, I don't rely on the other person for confidence and spend so much time trying to figure my own values out, and instead just focus on figuring out how I feel about the other person. Obviously, I understand that I shouldn't make dumb evaluations against an imagined template and instead should go in with an open mind and give the other person a chance.

 

I think I've learnt all the logical lessons I need to have learnt at this point. I just need to get over the disappointment and sadness of not having been able to find out whether my past relationship could have been successful had it not been for her anxiety issues, because on some level I did really like her...

Edited December 8, 2016 by acephoenix