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Long-term problem; unable to get dates


LightWave93

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My last thread got somewhat derailed with wild speculation and I'd rather have a discussion based on the facts, as I feel that's the best course of action to help me. I am willing to listen to advice offered and genuinely do appreciate the support, but it's frustrating for both myself and others if the information becomes inconsistent.

 

So, to start afresh;

 

 

Mid-twenties Male. For the last four years I've had great difficulties with my dating life, to the point where it is completely dead. Unfortunately neither myself or anyone else has come to a concrete reason as to why, and any suggestion I've taken on board to improve my circumstances has not helped.

 

According to friends, family, strangers (online & in real life), mental health professionals and dating/life coaches, I am; attractive, social, confident, intelligent, mature, hard-working, kind and honest. I wouldn't have agreed with these opinions many years ago as I struggled with social anxiety and depression, but over time I've slowly come to accept that I am a good person with much to offer. I'm not the most confident person in the room, but neither am I the grumpy guy standing with his arms crossed in the corner.

 

In terms of my lifestyle, I've tried a number of different things to improve both my own development and my chances with women. I've volunteered on a regular basis, gone to many different clubs and events, worked hard towards my degree and career, and have worked on my health. I'm currently in my last year at university which has a wide age range of students, and I'm disappointed I've missed out on a romantic / sex life.

 

For the most part, I am invisible to the opposite sex. I don't like using scales, but for the sake of this discussion I will highlight that past a certain level of attractiveness (7/10), I've rarely had much interaction with such women. Generally speaking, even though I go to bars / clubs regularly I've never had any sort of contact with a girl in those environments (although more recently there have been some *possible* signs). I'm quite comfortable around women, and I do have a lot of female friends, so it's not as if I can't talk to them; I've never been described as creepy or awkward, had a lot of positive compliments about my character, and I am able to flirt / physically escalate. I'm not interested in my female friends for reasons.

 

Tinder and such like have been a disaster. I've been on different forums etc to have my profiles and bio reviewed only to be told I'm fine, and although I have had some minor success (EG. 200+ matches in two days), I've not been able to get dates or hookups from them. I've also had my conversations reviewed and apparently they are fine too. I've had experiences where I may get a girls number, but they ghost the moment I suggest a meet (when otherwise, up until that very much, they have been quite receptive).

 

So yeah, looking for suggestions or ideas really.

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Happy Lemming

Simple question...

 

Do you have the confidence/ability to walk up to a woman in a bar/pub and strike up a conversation??

 

Yes or No??

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I read the comments from the other day about “possible signs” and I think you just need to be more confident - you shook that all off. Bad luck can turn around in a second. I think you are over analyzing and just need to be yourself and the rest will work out.

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Simple question...

 

Do you have the confidence/ability to walk up to a woman in a bar/pub and strike up a conversation??

 

Yes or No??

 

Simply put, at this stage, no.

 

Way back when, I had social anxiety, so that was a no-go.

 

Now-a-days, I have the history of lack of success behind my back albeit with no major confidence / social issues. Given a lot of women are very attractive (read: out of my league) and are often around larger / handsome men, I simply pass it off as being an environment I'm not suited for. I'm not the typical "bar guy". I do better at parties where there's mutual acquaintances, for example a few nights back when I got talking to two different girls and was making them laugh throughout the night.

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I'm not the typical "bar guy". I do better at parties where there's mutual acquaintances, for example a few nights back when I got talking to two different girls and was making them laugh throughout the night.

 

So... when you were talking these 2 girls up did you ask for their phone number?

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So... when you were talking these 2 girls up did you ask for their phone number?

 

No. Neither were available. I'm highlighting that I can in fact speak to women I'm not familiar with. :)

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Simply put, at this stage, no.

 

Way back when, I had social anxiety, so that was a no-go.

 

Now-a-days, I have the history of lack of success behind my back albeit with no major confidence / social issues. Given a lot of women are very attractive (read: out of my league) and are often around larger / handsome men, I simply pass it off as being an environment I'm not suited for. I'm not the typical "bar guy". I do better at parties where there's mutual acquaintances, for example a few nights back when I got talking to two different girls and was making them laugh throughout the night.

 

 

 

Nobody realistically is out of your league, yes we cant date movie stars but everyone else is fair game if you want to try.

 

 

I can tell you this its SO easy to get into a defeatist way of thinking, I suffer from it.

 

 

You have a good base to work on, I'd work OLD on as many platforms as possible.

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Happy Lemming
Simply put, at this stage, no.

 

OK... then we are going to have to find a way to make that happen, to get over this fear in baby steps.

 

Let me try again... If you went into a sports bar, could you ask the guy sitting next to you his opinion on the local sports team?? Something along the lines of [Do we need a new coach?? Offense?? Defense??]. Is that something you could do??

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I didn't read your last thread so this might have been suggested already - do you have friends or family that can introduce you to/set you up with people? I know that's a very old fashioned thing that people don't do anymore, but let them know you would be interested in meeting someone if they thought you two would hit it off.

 

Maybe a small group thing composed of a friend or two and their dates and their single friends?

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You have a good base to work on, I'd work OLD on as many platforms as possible.

 

I may be "above average" in attractiveness and be a generally all-round good guy, but in terms of women I think it's best to bat within your own league (whatever mine is). Unfortunately due to a lack of success, I wouldn't even know where mine is.

 

OK... then we are going to have to find a way to make that happen, to get over this fear in baby steps.

 

Let me try again... If you went into a sports bar, could you ask the guy sitting next to you his opinion on the local sports team?? Something along the lines of [Do we need a new coach?? Offense?? Defense??]. Is that something you could do??

 

Oh, I make small talk with people all the time; always doing so with cashiers, fellow customers etc and often get a laugh or two. In your particular example, no, because I don't know anything about sport (and the type of lads who frequent bars would probably have interests such as those, which I don't have).

 

I didn't read your last thread so this might have been suggested already - do you have friends or family that can introduce you to/set you up with people? I know that's a very old fashioned thing that people don't do anymore, but let them know you would be interested in meeting someone if they thought you two would hit it off.

 

Maybe a small group thing composed of a friend or two and their dates and their single friends?

 

Up until today, I would have answered "No". They've all considered it, and don't know anyone.

 

A friend of mine mentioned he knew a single girl who was looking for single guys on our course (apparently there aren't many), so maybe it'll happen, but I don't know who the woman is yet.

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I said it on your last thread and I will say it again as I feel you dodged the matter, but this will be my only post on this thread.

 

Given you don't have any glaring basic issues (looks, personality, social status, education) it's pretty obvious to me there's something off with your masculine energy when interacting with women. I hope you get to work on that by researching it and don't dismiss that this might be your problem.

 

Recapitulating: I've had a handsome, nice, intelligent friend hit on me in my 20s and I had zero attraction for him as he was unable to show clear desire for me in his way of acting, body language and how he looked at me. Zero masculine energy and it felt like he was just a good friend. I think that's the only plausible explanation and I firmly advise you look into that. Good luck.

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Happy Lemming

To Lightwave93:

 

You need to find a process that takes the fear away, as it relates to approaching women and conversing with them. Talking to the local "lad or bloke" sitting on the bar stool next to you is simply a means to an end... Practice for when its time to talk to a woman at a bar.

 

Read some articles in the paper or web-site and try to talk to that guy sitting next to you. Ask him some questions, most people will have no problem educating you about a particular sports team or sports rule. It doesn't have to be meaningful or make sense. Its the practice of doing it that takes the fear away and gets you one step closer to your goal of dating a woman.

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I may be "above average" in attractiveness and be a generally all-round good guy, but in terms of women I think it's best to bat within your own league (whatever mine is). Unfortunately due to a lack of success, I wouldn't even know where mine is.<snip>

 

Never limit yourself and your thinking. Look, I am no expert but what is your frame of mind like when you go out? Do you believe in possibility? How has your OLD experience been?

 

It sounds to me that you have the skills but lack the opportunity to use them which all told isn't too bad. What I also understand is bad experiences have negatively effected you, people don't understand, well some here don't how badly that can effect ones outlook.

 

See the positive in the situation and take small steps, I am useless at dating but when I take a small step I feel better, even if the step is fairly insignificant.

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<snip>

Given you don't have any glaring basic issues (looks, personality, social status, education) it's pretty obvious to me there's something off with your masculine energy when interacting with women. I hope you get to work on that by researching it and don't dismiss that this might be your problem.<snip>

 

I believe I said this in the previous thread, although I can understand if it got lost in a sea of posts; I believe I do have masculine energy, albeit not as much as some other men. It's something I've looked into, and the suggestions are along the lines of; talk slowly, maintain eye-contact, physically escalate etc. I do all of these. I also go to the gym. Unless you can specifically identify what it is you are talking about, then I can only go by what I have read online and thus dismiss the idea as "having not worked".

 

Also, since he was your friend, I suspect that is why.

 

To Lightwave93:

 

You need to find a process that takes the fear away, as it relates to approaching women and conversing with them. Talking to the local "lad or bloke" sitting on the bar stool next to you is simply a means to an end... Practice for when its time to talk to a woman at a bar. <snip>

 

I'm confused; in that very post I spoke about how I make small talk with everyone. Does that not accomplish exactly what you have suggested?

 

Never limit yourself and your thinking. Look, I am no expert but what is your frame of mind like when you go out? Do you believe in possibility?

 

How has your OLD experience been?

<snip>

 

I go out to have fun with friends. Anything else is a bonus. OLD was poor. I was on every major site, and no luck.

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It's not about looks at all. It's more along the lines of what you said below. Well... if you are certain you already do that, and have a good body language, I probably don't have additional ideas to offer.

 

No it was not because he was my friend. It was his lack of masculine energy.

 

Again, good luck!

 

the suggestions are along the lines of; talk slowly, maintain eye-contact, physically escalate etc. I do all of these.

 

Also, since he was your friend, I suspect that is why.

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On your previous thread, you said you'd recently been at an event and about three women wanted to dance with you. Did you dance with them? If not, why not?

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I forget, OP have you mentioned your height? (And the rest of you yoyos, please don't pile on me about male height. If you don't believe it's a major factor in attracting women, we'll agree to disagree.)

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I forget, OP have you mentioned your height? (And the rest of you yoyos, please don't pile on me about male height. If you don't believe it's a major factor in attracting women, we'll agree to disagree.)

 

Nothing wrong with his height, I think he is 6', nothing wrong with his looks either, he is good looking nor his general appearance, his mannerisms, the way he speaks or dresses. He isn't shady or creepy or anything else that would put girls off.

Her parents would love him too...

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Happy Lemming

I'm confused; in that very post I spoke about how I make small talk with everyone. Does that not accomplish exactly what you have suggested?

 

If you can make "small talk with everyone", then logic would dictate you have the ability to talk to women in a public setting, but yet you said you could not.

 

Why do you think that you can have "small talk with everyone" in a public setting, but don't have the ability to talk to a woman in a public setting?? As women are part of everyone, do you see my logic trail??

 

Let me try something different, take the bar/pub out of the equation. Do you think you could talk to a woman at a bookstore or used bookstore?? Hold up a book and ask her if she has read this author?? Does she recommend him/her?? Then continue the conversation as normal chit-chat about books, authors, etc.?? Would you have the confidence or ability to accomplish that task??

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I am sure there are salesmen out there who can talk to everyone, entertain and become everyone's friend but when it comes to selling stuff, they just cannot seal the deal.

 

Maybe that is part of the issue here.

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Happy Lemming

Oh, I'm not asking him to "seal the deal"; I was just asking if he had the ability to approach a woman and talk to her. One step at a time, we have to walk before we can run.

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Do you think you could talk to a woman at a bookstore or used bookstore?? Hold up a book and ask her if she has read this author?? Does she recommend him/her?? Then continue the conversation as normal chit-chat about books, authors, etc.?? Would you have the confidence or ability to accomplish that task??

 

To be fair to the OP, how many guys actually get loads of dates or even more than a couple of sentences from a woman who's in a place where solitary activity is the goal? I think it's rude to interrupt a person who's happy in their own world. If a guy needs a recommendation, that's what the staff are for.

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To be fair to the OP, how many guys actually get loads of dates or even more than a couple of sentences from a woman who's in a place where solitary activity is the goal? I think it's rude to interrupt a person who's happy in their own world. If a guy needs a recommendation, that's what the staff are for.

 

 

I have always turned down guys who I don't know who have attempted to speak to me in public with the intention of securing a date.

Bottom line is I do not know who they are, that is the main problem.

 

Guy here who was a bit of an expert on cold approaches said it would take him 50 cold approaches in the middle of a big UK city to get one proper date, ie she actually showed up and they go out on a date.

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LivingWaterPlease

Lightwave, I know this is difficult to do but I'd suggest forgetting about it and throwing yourself into life, finding things that you are passionate about. A person who is involved in his/her interests passionately is very attractive to the opposite sex.

 

I'm not talking about finding out what you like to do and making time for it. I'm talking about finding things you're passionate about. You may have done so. If so, it's just a matter of time until someone is attracted to the passion for life they see in you.

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