Is this friendship potentially toxic?

[baloo2]

Hi

 

I met a man about two months ago on a dating site (one for those seeking long term relationships-a 'serious' one). We seemed to hit it off rather well and quickly moved to almost relationship territory, and talked online for hours daily. One day I get in from work and he drops the bombshell that he has only just recently broken up with an ex, assuring me he doesn't love her and he IS single, that he is going to visit her after visiting his parents in his native country (as a friend) and he is worried that I'll do a runner on this basis. I feel despondent at this point and think about ending all communication, and feel very trepidatious about his sincerity toward me (I've been hurt a lot of times in the past). He convinces me and reassures me that I have nothing to worry about. Hence, it continues as it had before. However, I still have this niggling doubt in my head regarding the relationship with the ex girlfriend.

 

Then one day I get in from work and he sends me an email telling me cannot proceed romantically with me because he has realised he IS still in love with the ex girlfriend. Naturally, I feel down because I didn't do a runner when I should have. So we talk for a while and he insists he wants to be my friend. I proceeded as such post revelation but friends have told me it is not a good idea, because it's not really a friendship, despite everything he says, based on the fact that we met on an online dating site. They think it's about keeping me on the back burner.

 

It is also really strange, because it was almost as it was before only there are no sexually intimate exchanges but we still chat for hours, seem even closer now, and he even does nice little thoughtful things for me, like going out his way to contact me (he doesn't have internet access at home yet-he goes into his work to contact me). I don't however understand the motivation for his wanting to be my friend, especially as we met online and have never acutally met physically. What is he getting from this friendship? He tells me now that it is because I am wonderful person, am intelligent and insightful. But I don't understand how he can apparently 'flick a switch' and move from intimacy to friendship. Do I steer clear or proceed with caution? I absolutely love talking to this man and he seems to as well. But sometimes he can get to me by saying things he possibly shouldn't e.g. "I love your laugh"... What do I do?

[ADF]

Your friends are likely correct--he wants to keep you on the back burner. But even if they're wrong, so what? This man has treated you horribly. Why be friends with him?

[WTRanger]

How has he treated the OP horribly? Because he was honest with her, by telling her that he is indeed thinking about retying with his ex? Because he prevented things from progressing into extremely hurtful territory? Why does everyone want honesty, but when someone is honest they are all of a sudden this huge jerk? Because the honesty wasn't want you expected or built up in your head? Remember, the truth can be brutal.

 

If it's not really a friendship, why are you so despondent? It's not like it was a relationship either. This guy has been up front with you. Would you rather have him string you along in your "almost relationship" then 8 months down the road drop the bomb that he's back with his ex and that his ex was always in the picture? You think you feel despondent now! You've only known this guy for 2 months, and you've never met in person. How much of this is because you've built this fantasy world in your head? We all do it sometimes, and I know I've done it. You have to separate what you've made up in your head about what is supposed to happen versus what really IS happening. You need to stop listening to your bruised Ego and see that all he has done is be honest with you. Sure, it wasn't the honest you were looking for, but he's not BS'ing you either. Who gives a rat's ass if you met on a dating site? I've met a few friends on dating sites where we just didn't work out as a couple, but instead learned that we ended up being decent friends. All it took was honesty.

 

He's told you what he wants. A friendship and nothing more. What do you want out of this?

Edited December 11, 2009 by WTRanger

[baloo2]

I am saying other people have said that it is not a good idea to be friends. Not me. I've not understood why. I want to be friends and try to keep an open mind.

 

I am now defending what they say because I can kind of see where they're coming from. We had phone sex quite recently and that sort of thing. It's more complex than it sounds. A lot of affection between us, for friends only... And I think I in his position would not say to a woman I've just relegated to friendship status "Oh, I love your laugh".....

[You'reasian]

I am saying other people have said that it is not a good idea to be friends. Not me. I've not understood why. I want to be friends and try to keep an open mind.

 

I am now defending what they say because I can kind of see where they're coming from. We had phone sex quite recently and that sort of thing. It's more complex than it sounds. A lot of affection between us, for friends only... And I think I in his position would not say to a woman I've just relegated to friendship status "Oh, I love your laugh".....

 

Bottom line: he's been honest and upfront.

 

He's moving on. You say the two of you met on a serious-relationship dating site (i can't stand dating sites) and you consider him a friend. He's looking for a serious relationship. He probably wants more - with someone who wants more with him

 

Decide what you want to do, bang other dudes, be friends with this guy - whatever but do something and stick to it.

Edited December 12, 2009 by You'reasian

[ADF]

How has he treated the OP horribly? Because he was honest with her, by telling her that he is indeed thinking about retying with his ex? Because he prevented things from progressing into extremely hurtful territory? Why does everyone want honesty, but when someone is honest they are all of a sudden this huge jerk?

 

But he WASN'T honest!

 

He led to OP into believing he wanted to be with her, and that he was jusy seeing his ex "as a friend." Do you believe that? I don't. Then he discovers--gasp!--that he really wants to be with his ex after all. What a surprise!

 

Obviously, he went to see his ex with the idea that something might be rekindled. To think he didn't is totally naive. So he ditches OP, breaks her heart, and now has the gall to say, "let's be friends?" Give me a break!

 

He has treated her horribly, played her, jerked her around. He didn't keep her out of hurtful territory--he plunged her into it.

[deux ex machina]

I am saying other people have said that it is not a good idea to be friends. Not me. I've not understood why. I want to be friends and try to keep an open mind.

 

I am now defending what they say because I can kind of see where they're coming from. We had phone sex quite recently and that sort of thing. It's more complex than it sounds. A lot of affection between us, for friends only... And I think I in his position would not say to a woman I've just relegated to friendship status "Oh, I love your laugh".....

 

I'm going to have to agree with ADF here, and what you wrote above just confirms it. I don't believe you have been treated well, and I don't believe he is a friend who has your best interests in mind.

 

Guard your heart carefully.

[baloo2]

Thank you for kind words. Last night we talked on instant messaging for 8 hours straight. I try not to let my heart get in the way. But it's hard when he is so affectionate and caring toward me, even after 'dumping' me. Perhaps he values friendship a lot more than I can understand.

[Mary3]

RUN !

 

If you have ANY feelings for him at all............

[Peaceful Guy]

..(he doesn't have internet access at home yet-he goes into his work to contact me)...

 

..or he talks to you WHILE he's at work! get away from this ****er.. really! he sounds like a total loser, user, emotional abuser.. get away from this guy!

[baloo2]

..or he talks to you WHILE he's at work! get away from this ****er.. really! he sounds like a total loser, user, emotional abuser.. get away from this guy!

 

Hi, Why do you think he is such ****er? I think I am not seeing what others are seeing here.. what am I missing? OK, he still does thoughtful things for me like send me sweet little pictures etc.

[Peaceful Guy]

Hi, Why do you think he is such ****er? I think I am not seeing what others are seeing here.. what am I missing? OK, he still does thoughtful things for me like send me sweet little pictures etc.

 

well, i guess im taking a chance on being a bit of a jerk so that you dont have to!, if that makes any sense.. that said, let me really think about it! be back in a few..

[Peaceful Guy]

Hi

 

I met a man about two months ago on a dating site (one for those seeking long term relationships-a 'serious' one). We seemed to hit it off rather well and quickly moved to almost relationship territory, and talked online for hours daily. One day I get in from work and he drops the bombshell that he has only just recently broken up with an ex, assuring me he doesn't love her and he IS single, that he is going to visit her after visiting his parents in his native country (as a friend) and he is worried that I'll do a runner on this basis. I feel despondent at this point and think about ending all communication, and feel very trepidatious about his sincerity toward me (I've been hurt a lot of times in the past). He convinces me and reassures me that I have nothing to worry about. Hence, it continues as it had before. However, I still have this niggling doubt in my head regarding the relationship with the ex girlfriend.

 

Then one day I get in from work and he sends me an email telling me cannot proceed romantically with me because he has realised he IS still in love with the ex girlfriend. Naturally, I feel down because I didn't do a runner when I should have. So we talk for a while and he insists he wants to be my friend. I proceeded as such post revelation but friends have told me it is not a good idea, because it's not really a friendship, despite everything he says, based on the fact that we met on an online dating site. They think it's about keeping me on the back burner.

 

It is also really strange, because it was almost as it was before only there are no sexually intimate exchanges but we still chat for hours, seem even closer now, and he even does nice little thoughtful things for me, like going out his way to contact me (he doesn't have internet access at home yet-he goes into his work to contact me). I don't however understand the motivation for his wanting to be my friend, especially as we met online and have never acutally met physically. What is he getting from this friendship? He tells me now that it is because I am wonderful person, am intelligent and insightful. But I don't understand how he can apparently 'flick a switch' and move from intimacy to friendship. Do I steer clear or proceed with caution? I absolutely love talking to this man and he seems to as well. But sometimes he can get to me by saying things he possibly shouldn't e.g. "I love your laugh"... What do I do?

 

ok, lets try a few mental exercises to step outside of your current perspective.. first, the other woman..

 

lets say she was to post here instead of you.. "my boyfriend has been acting so strange lately.. the other day he told me he needed a little space.. OUT OF NOWHERE!.. i mean, he's done this kind of thing before, but this time it FEELS different. im getting jealous all the time, something i NEVER do. i was actually starting to think about marriage, and then all of a sudden he's like, "i need to think about some things.." what gives? also, and i know this is wrong.. but i checked his email to see if he was talking to someone else.. nothing.. now i still feel jealous, but i cant talk to him about it because i feel so guilty! H E L P!!!"

 

okay, before you get all exited about the prospect of him leaving her for YOU.. think about this.. his ex is someone that hes known for a LONG time, much longer than you for sure.. you can look at the way he's behaving with her and expect the EXACT SAME THING when he gets tired of you.. ready to feel jealous, uncertain, low??? if you get with him under these circumstances, can you really expect him to not do the same thing to you? if it worked once, and it worked well, why would he stop?

 

also, about him talking to you online.. IM talking to you online.. the little pictures.. here you go.

 

 

really, im sorry, but this guy's a jerko!!! learn it now, or learn it later.. i had to learn this one for myself, the hard way!

[Peaceful Guy]

well, sorry if im a total dream crusher! the truth is, you deserve better, and better IS out there!

[baloo2]

OK, I hear you. But he had broken up with the ex girlfriend and moved to another country for his work. They HAD technically finished (on the basis of distance and 'other things', and I guess he thought he was ready for a new relationship. He has not been to visit her yet. He is going over Christmas. They had been together half a year, not lived together. Therefore, not a hell of a lot longer than he's known me. However, I think I still see what you're saying....

 

 

 

ok, lets try a few mental exercises to step outside of your current perspective.. first, the other woman..

 

lets say she was to post here instead of you.. "my boyfriend has been acting so strange lately.. the other day he told me he needed a little space.. OUT OF NOWHERE!.. i mean, he's done this kind of thing before, but this time it FEELS different. im getting jealous all the time, something i NEVER do. i was actually starting to think about marriage, and then all of a sudden he's like, "i need to think about some things.." what gives? also, and i know this is wrong.. but i checked his email to see if he was talking to someone else.. nothing.. now i still feel jealous, but i cant talk to him about it because i feel so guilty! H E L P!!!"

 

okay, before you get all exited about the prospect of him leaving her for YOU.. think about this.. his ex is someone that hes known for a LONG time, much longer than you for sure.. you can look at the way he's behaving with her and expect the EXACT SAME THING when he gets tired of you.. ready to feel jealous, uncertain, low??? if you get with him under these circumstances, can you really expect him to not do the same thing to you? if it worked once, and it worked well, why would he stop?

 

also, about him talking to you online.. IM talking to you online.. the little pictures.. here you go.

 

 

really, im sorry, but this guy's a jerko!!! learn it now, or learn it later.. i had to learn this one for myself, the hard way!

[baloo2]

And I do have to make sure you know that he has told me we're JUST friends. Thus TECHNICALLY he's not cheating his gf. Does he need to talk to another girl for such prolonged periods though when he has a girlfriend already? Is that healthy, even if he's telling himself we're JUST friends? OK, I am confused at that I must say...

 

 

 

well, sorry if im a total dream crusher! the truth is, you deserve better, and better IS out there!

[Peaceful Guy]

And I do have to make sure you know that he has told me we're JUST friends.

 

i know.. i mean, i cant REALLY say what hes thinking.. but, it does sound like your having romantic feelings for him, or at least that's in there somewhere...

 

Does he need to talk to another girl for such prolonged periods though when he has a girlfriend already?

 

i dont know, but something doesn't add up.. when ive been in situations similar to the one you described, there was some sort of romantic intent. your interactions with him actually kind of remind me of when i went off to college and started talking to an old girlfriend of mine.. it wasnt just flat out said, but a meeting was kind of implied, and there was really no doubt what would happen then..

 

Is that healthy, even if he's telling himself we're JUST friends?

 

well, maybe he's confused too.. i suppose i jumped on the defensive, but let me ask.. aren't you single? don't you want someone that's a friend and also a lover? maybe its totally harmless for him to be talking with you.. its hard to tell.. but if youre asking if this friendship is potentially toxic for you, then my answer is definitely yes! i feel like ive said just about all i can here, i hope it helped, and please forgive me for the stuff i got wrong! bye..

[baloo2]

Oh I admit it! Yes. I am going to fall for this guy. I probably will.. He wants to arrange to meet sometime? We're in separate continents.As 'friends'? OK, I am jealous of the ex girlfriend, and I shouldn't be if we're just friends but damn-why oh why did it start off romantic and then fall flat? Oh, I am despondent as ever now!

[WTRanger]

You are despondent because you have built this fantasy outcome in your mind. Look at the facts for what they are. You've never met this guy in real life, you've only known him for 2 months, and he's still linked to his ex. Yet, it your mind, it seems as if you have already earmarked this guy as your future husband. Try not to let your mind advance things before they even happen.

 

Your brain has created this little fake world where he is the prince in shining armor come to save you. Yet you have never even met him! If he's on another continent the chances of the two of you meeting are slim at best! If you do meet him, will he be the same as in your mind or will he be a disappointment?

 

It sounds as if you are worried about a future you cannot control and you are worried about his/your past which cannot be changed. With all of this worry, you are forgetting about the most critical time, the present. The now. This very moment. How many local guys are you going to pass up to chase someone in another country?

 

Honestly, it is very simple. If you want a commitment from him and he only wants friends with the occasional phone sex, then you need to stop talking to him. It is as simple as that. You never have to worry about running into him, he's no where near your home town! You cannot compromise your feelings for "just friends." It will eat you alive. You are feeling bad now, but as long as you persist these feelings you are only going to feel 1,000 times worse as time passes. And yes, if you permit it you persist it. It is about you, and only you. First and foremost, you must be happy. Then figure everything else out.

[baloo2]

I think you're right. And it is simple. Truth is am bored and lonely in my life and felt we connected on a deep level. The phone sex was a mistake, and he admitted it. We no longer talk intimately. He puts a stop to all that right away. But I am cynical of him, I do think his motivation for friendship is to have a pretty girl on standby (who he is probably quite emotionally attached to). That may be a boost to his ego. To get on in this life, I have to be cynical.

 

You are despondent because you have built this fantasy outcome in your mind. Look at the facts for what they are. You've never met this guy in real life, you've only known him for 2 months, and he's still linked to his ex. Yet, it your mind, it seems as if you have already earmarked this guy as your future husband. Try not to let your mind advance things before they even happen.

 

Your brain has created this little fake world where he is the prince in shining armor come to save you. Yet you have never even met him! If he's on another continent the chances of the two of you meeting are slim at best! If you do meet him, will he be the same as in your mind or will he be a disappointment?

 

It sounds as if you are worried about a future you cannot control and you are worried about his/your past which cannot be changed. With all of this worry, you are forgetting about the most critical time, the present. The now. This very moment. How many local guys are you going to pass up to chase someone in another country?

 

Honestly, it is very simple. If you want a commitment from him and he only wants friends with the occasional phone sex, then you need to stop talking to him. It is as simple as that. You never have to worry about running into him, he's no where near your home town! You cannot compromise your feelings for "just friends." It will eat you alive. You are feeling bad now, but as long as you persist these feelings you are only going to feel 1,000 times worse as time passes. And yes, if you permit it you persist it. It is about you, and only you. First and foremost, you must be happy. Then figure everything else out.

[O'Malley]

And I do have to make sure you know that he has told me we're JUST friends. Thus TECHNICALLY he's not cheating his gf. Does he need to talk to another girl for such prolonged periods though when he has a girlfriend already?

 

I'm curious if his girlfriend (if she ever really was his ex) knows about his conversations with you. Somehow I doubt it, and I also doubt he was ever entirely truthful with you. Some people just enjoy seeking attention outside of their relationship.

 

If you want to be just online friends, fine, but treat him like one of your women friends. No flirting, no phone sex -- don't place yourself on the back burner.

[baloo2]

So again he initiated the messaging last night. Spent three hours talking. Well well well. Why does he need me at all if he has a girlfriend waiting for him? Odd, odd, odd!

[2sunny]

So again he initiated the messaging last night. Spent three hours talking. Well well well. Why does he need me at all if he has a girlfriend waiting for him? Odd, odd, odd!

 

because the other gal may not be readily available as you are. he's using you to stroke his ego. he's told you that you weren't his first choice so why are you spending so much time stroking his huge ego - that seems to think it needs two women.

 

bottom line is - HE is willing to hurt YOU - and YOU are letting him. tell him he's chosen her and that there will be no more contact. this way you will have time and energy for an available man when he comes along... as long as he's around - you're too distracted by him to make room for someone new. he knows this - that's why he continues to take up your time and energy. cut him off.

[baloo2]

because the other gal may not be readily available as you are. he's using you to stroke his ego. he's told you that you weren't his first choice so why are you spending so much time stroking his huge ego - that seems to think it needs two women.

 

bottom line is - HE is willing to hurt YOU - and YOU are letting him. tell him he's chosen her and that there will be no more contact. this way you will have time and energy for an available man when he comes along... as long as he's around - you're too distracted by him to make room for someone new. he knows this - that's why he continues to take up your time and energy. cut him off.

 

I know you're right.

 

He knows that? Is he being sneaky? I guess you think that he is using friendship as a pretense to continue contacting me. I guess it doesn't take Einstein to work out from his perspective that if I once had feelings for him, then they could develop further. He must know that, which makes him manipulative. I have tried to reign in our conversations. Tell me, would you do the same in his position? Dump a girl or guy then continue to talk to he/she endlessly knowing where it could leave that person? Does anyone or has anyone done that, completely innocently (i.e. without an ulterior motive?).

[sugarmomma]

He knows that you are needy for attention (anythime you message for 8 hours straight) and he plays on that. He is just using you to fill the time. Just two lonely people looking for love. Go out and find a real person.