Date Rape

[elaina]

Hello again, Elaina, thanks for responding!

 

Hello again, Tami-chan, you're welcome!

 

Actually, it does...because many are false accusations and just as many are unreported...

 

Um... correct me if I'm wrong, but did Sanskrit say that this wailing woman accused him of rape? It seemed to me more he just didn't want to have sex with her. That's fine, but I can safely say he doesn't truly love her. (Correct me if I"m wrong Sanskirt.) His post on this woman who was crying who he refused sex with has nothing to do with date rape.

 

unless, of course, you do not think that is pertinent to the discussion of date rape?

 

 

Well, date rape usually includes rape... unless this woman raped him after he refused to have sex with her?

 

 

I will give of myself if it will make me happy or it will give me joy. Nobody is truly altruistic. If I cook for my child, or donate my kidney to her it is so because I love her and doing so makes ME happy..

 

Of course loving someone else makes the person who loves happy (at least, most of the time.) That is not illogical at all.

 

sitting there in front of your computer and assigning your values because you do not think somebody does not seem to know what true love is ..is not cool...jmho.

 

Um...lol, what are you doing to me? You are stating my opinion/belief is not cool, and are judging me for my statement, while you are giving your opinion/belief through your statement, lol. Oh the irony!

 

 

 

I doubt that you will be saddened by anything I share on this board-

 

Try me.

 

but...okay...If I am making a person happy and I in turn become miserable by making him happy, that's when people of sound mind would tell me to LAUNCH! That's not true love...that's probably something that someone has to talk to a mental health professional with.

 

LIke you said before, if you do soemthing for someone (like you cook for your daughter), then you are happy with doing things for her, right? That gives you pleasure because you are showing care and taking care of your daughter. Well, it works the same with with someone you love romantically.

 

Again, thanks for responding.

 

Tami

 

 

Again, you're welcome.

[tami-chan]

Tami-Chan, this kind of looks like trying to start something, but like with other posters I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt.

 

Benefit of the doubt? Why, thank you...I think. Not sure why though <shrug>

 

Of course, everyone has a role to play in their own satisfaction. But at the same time, both people should have some concern for the other person's enjoyment.

 

Really? I think YOU said this:

 

it is the guy's responsibility to make sure that his partner is enjoying what is going on

 

Are you taking that statement back?

 

Anyway, my point is, it CAN be difficult for men to DISCERN if a woman is a willing sex partner if she sends out mixed signals. Of course, it does not help that, as evidenced by the numerous posts here on LS that there are women who enjoy being "taken" (sexually). There are many women who want, nay, PREFER men to be "aggressive"- to just "go for the kiss" (which can be "assault"-if there was no consent, no?). Women have to be responsible for their actions, too...I mean c'mon, where is personal accountability? All parties have to be accountable for his/her actions.

[elaina]

By the way, Tami-chan,

 

If one's lover (who I'm assuming one chooses as one's lover for good reasons) put his/her lover's needs/desires/enjoyment/pleaure before his/her own, and the other did the same for him/her, than both of them would receive joy and enjoyment in doing things for each other. It works both ways.

[that girl]

Benefit of the doubt? Why, thank you...I think. Not sure why though <shrug>

 

 

 

Really? I think YOU said this:

 

 

 

Are you taking that statement back?

 

Anyway, my point is, it CAN be difficult for men to DISCERN if a woman is a willing sex partner if she sends out mixed signals. Of course, it does not help that, as evidenced by the numerous posts here on LS that there are women who enjoy being "taken" (sexually). There are many women who want, nay, PREFER men to be "aggressive"- to just "go for the kiss" (which can be "assault"-if there was no consent, no?). Women have to be responsible for their actions, too...I mean c'mon, where is personal accountability? All parties have to be accountable for his/her actions.

 

Okay so you are obviously starting something.

 

Repeatedly on this thread I have said that sex is something two people should enjoy together.

 

Once in response to a specific comment I said it was the guy's responsibility. While in general I try to stick to gender neutral phrasing, the thread has tended towards the male aggressor/passive female. I don't think that is the only possible scenario, but it is the reason that once I used guy instead of person.

 

You talk about personal accountability but only for women.

 

No, I do not consider a kiss assault. If you kiss someone and they push you off, you have not committed assault. If you continue kissing someone who is either pushing you off or laying their prone, it is a form of assault.

 

I think if either person is getting mixed signals about whether or not the person is interested, the smart and kind thing to do is ask in some way. The person who is taking action by either penetrating or engulfing the other person has the responsibility to make sure the other person is into it. Mixed signals happen and people can make mistakes, but the goal should be an act that both people welcome and enjoy.

[somedude81]

Hmm, I'll just reply to this. How did I tease him? Well I was dressed in very provocative clothing as I had just been out clubbing, not with him in particular though. He asked me to hang out when I got back to my dorm and I agreed as I was still wide awake at the time. So given my clothing and the time at which we went to hang out I probably did seem like a tease to him especially after we got in his bed to watch a movie.

 

Now we were just friends. I did not like him in any, shape, or form but I was alone at his apartment with him with none of my friends around.

Thanks for the background info.

 

So late at night, a guy friend who you were not attracted to, wanted you to hang out with him after you got back from clubbing. You went into his apartment and even got in his bed.

 

Yeah, that's a dangerous situation if you didn't plan on having sex. I can understand why you thought you were being a tease for doing those things, while not wanting to have sex.

 

That's when I got scared. I was scared if I said no, of what his reaction might be as he was pretty persistent on trying to have sex with me even after I pushed him off of me when he tried to kiss me. I was scared he might get violent and so I went with it. I also felt like I owed him because of how I was dressed and he seemed to have thought that my whole coming to hang out with him that night meant I wanted to have sex. Although his invitation to hang out did not imply sex was going to happen (might I add I was more naive then also) as he said "let's just watch a movie since you're bored and up and so am I".

So you did try to resist. Pushing a guy off you is the same thing as saying no. A decent man would have immediately stopped. If I was in that situation, I would have asked the girl to leave because I clearly wanted to go further while she didn't.

 

While you didn't owe him anything, it was naive to go into his place late at night and climb into his bed, believing that sex wasn't on his mind. And no, a man isn't going to invite a girl over and imply that sex is going to happen. Have you ever heard of somebody inviting the other person in "for coffee."

 

And yes I did feel violated after that, I felt horrible. I didn't say anything though because as I said before technically he didn't rape me as I did not verbally say no to him. After my fear took over I just laid there and let him have sex with me, then when it was over I asked him to take me home. I never spoke to him after that either although he tried to call and text me. So no technically I am not a victim of date rape, but I did feel as though I was violated.

After hearing more details and how you did physically resist, it does seem that a rape happened.

[tami-chan]

Hello Elaina~~~

 

Um... correct me if I'm wrong, but did Sanskrit say that this wailing woman accused him of rape? It seemed to me more he just didn't want to have sex with her. That's fine, but I can safely say he doesn't truly love her. (Correct me if I"m wrong Sanskirt.) His post on this woman who was crying who he refused sex with has nothing to do with date rape.

 

Let's examine the post, shall we?

 

No it's not. It's the responsibility of grown adults to seek their own enjoyment, not for one gender to provide it to the other.

 

Way back in college, I had a woman in my bed who started crying when we were about to have sex. She was perfectly willing, but I stopped, not because she was apparently not enjoying things, but because I estimated she was going to be crappy in bed, and was thus undeserving of my effort.

 

Her response? "What's wrooooonnnnnnnnnnggggg?? Waaaaaaaa."

 

What do you think....? Do you think maybe you misunderstood or created a story in your head or maybe read another post of his? Because the "no idea what true love" response you posted was from this post. You can correct yourself in the process, if you so deem it necessary.

 

Well, date rape usually includes rape... unless this woman raped him after he refused to have sex with her?

 

Ahh...lol..but his post was a response from a previous posts-where he was I believe, making a point how many women send out conflicting signals, etc.etc..like this one, who was crying while they were making out and then got more upset when he stopped....I mean seriously, even I, got confused by what that woman wanted ! !

 

Of course loving someone else makes the person who loves happy (at least, most of the time.) That is not illogical at all.

 

Well, sure..but if I want to be loved in return, do you then think that I do not have any idea what true love is? That's ridiculous.

 

Um...lol, what are you doing to me? You are stating my opinion/belief is not cool, and are judging me for my statement, while you are giving your opinion/belief through your statement, lol. Oh the irony!

 

I am judgng YOUR statement(it is explicitly said) ..as not cool...you are judging a person as not having any idea what true love is,..based on what? You do see the difference, don't you?

 

Try me.

 

will keep you in mind...thanks!

 

LIke you said before, if you do soemthing for someone (like you cook for your daughter), then you are happy with doing things for her, right? That gives you pleasure because you are showing care and taking care of your daughter. Well, it works the same with with someone you love romantically.

 

Sure...but the particular post that you quoted, that I was referring to seemed really far removed from even being a "romantic relationship"....I am just confused how you were able to draw that conclusion about sanskrit not having any idea about "true love":confused:!

 

Have a good night, elaina!

Tami

[tami-chan]

By the way, Tami-chan,

 

If one's lover (who I'm assuming one chooses as one's lover for good reasons) put his/her lover's needs/desires/enjoyment/pleaure before his/her own, and the other did the same for him/her, than both of them would receive joy and enjoyment in doing things for each other. It works both ways.

 

No kidding...thanks!

[that girl]

While you didn't owe him anything, it was naive to go into his place late at night and climb into his bed, believing that sex wasn't on his mind. And no, a man isn't going to invite a girl over and imply that sex is going to happen. Have you ever heard of somebody inviting the other person in "for coffee."

Correct me if I'm wrong SomeGuy81, but you are a commuter student in college, right?

 

I'm several years out of undergrad, but when I was in college it was not at all unusual to hang out on someone's bed because it was often the only seat in the place. Hanging out in someone's bed to watch a movie in college is different than randomly crawling in bed with a date in my experience.

 

I didn't say anything though because as I said before technically he didn't rape me as I did not verbally say no to him.

Aerogurl, he did rape you. You pushed him off when he tried to kiss you and he kept pushing you until you finally permitted him to have sex with you. You didn't consent, you stopped fighting.

 

Could you have screamed no and hoped he stopped or someone came in? Definately. But you were scared he might get violent so you didn't. Any decent guy would have stopped at some point while you just laid there. He is a rapist.

 

I'm not suggesting you try to press charges or anything. It sounds far too late for that. But I would call what happened rape.

[tami-chan]

Okay so you are obviously starting something.

 

How is this? because I am not agreeing with you?

 

Once in response to a specific comment I said it was the guy's responsibility. While in general I try to stick to gender neutral phrasing, the thread has tended towards the male aggressor/passive female. I don't think that is the only possible scenario, but it is the reason that once I used guy instead of person.

 

Not a fair statement, I believe, but that is just my humble opinion.

 

You talk about personal accountability but only for women.

 

Actually, I said both genders have to be accountable for their actions. However, the hot issue is personal accountability of women-date rape of women are more reported than date rape of men which makes me believe that it happens more to women. So ,since it happens more to us, we MUST be PROACTIVE in protecting ourselves. We cannot leave it to the men to "read" and "understand" the cues. Not to say, that there our men need more education in this area, they do...as a society we do...that is obvious.

 

No, I do not consider a kiss assault. If you kiss someone and they push you off, you have not committed assault. If you continue kissing someone who is either pushing you off or laying their prone, it is a form of assault.

 

Well..good for you. Because it CAN be ASSAULT (sexual) if there is no consent. Read up on it.

 

I think if either person is getting mixed signals about whether or not the person is interested, the smart and kind thing to do is ask in some way. The person who is taking action by either penetrating or engulfing the other person has the responsibility to make sure the other person is into it. Mixed signals happen and people can make mistakes, but the goal should be an act that both people welcome and enjoy.

 

I agree.

[that girl]

So ,since it happens more to us, we MUST be PROACTIVE in protecting ourselves. We cannot leave it to the men to "read" and "understand" the cues. Not to say, that there our men need more education in this area, they do...as a society we do...that is obvious.

Yes, women should be proactive about their own safety, but that doesn't let men off the hook.

 

How is this? because I am not agreeing with you?

No, because you are being nitpicky and overly aggressive. I used "person" numerous times because I think most of this stuff applies to both people, yet you jumped on the one use of man like I was somehow contradicting myself. Then in this post you get with the snarky again with the whole "Good for you" bit.

 

It just seems unnecessarily angry. Generally I have tried to express my disagreement with posters (someguy, floridaman and a few others) respectfully, I can't always claim that with Sanskrit since I think some of what he has posted is terrifying, but I've tried. I think most of the posts on this thread have been constructive.

 

I don't get why you are so critical of what Elaina and I have posted when Sanskrit is suggesting men should push women as far as they can in hopes wearing down her resistance because that is what women really want (despite the number of female posters who have said they want a guy who looks for active consent).

[tami-chan]

Yes, women should be proactive about their own safety, but that doesn't let men off the hook.

 

never said that.

 

No, because you are being nitpicky and overly aggressive. I used "person" numerous times because I think most of this stuff applies to both people, yet you jumped on the one use of man like I was somehow contradicting myself. Then in this post you get with the snarky again with the whole "Good for you" bit.

 

I can't help it if that is how you are taking my posts, tg. I say, you need to just lighten up. I understand you feel like you have been "owned" by that little statement that you posted but you know what? why don't you just say it plainly that that statement was wrong...end of story.

 

Look, I think it is GOOD that you do not think a guy "going for a kiss" cannot be interpreted as assault. You are one woman less, men have to worry about when it comes to that. At least that is clear in your mind....and that is snarky?

 

It just seems unnecessarily angry. Generally I have tried to express my disagreement with posters (someguy, floridaman and a few others) respectfully, I can't always claim that with Sanskrit since I think some of what he has posted is terrifying, but I've tried. I think most of the posts on this thread have been constructive.

 

I see..either you are projecting YOUR feelings of anger...or you assigning that negative emotion to my posts to rile up other posters-c'mon tg, you are better that that. I make this limited response to you and I get this from you? I have this little sign in my den that says "No whining allowed"-seems appropriate here.

 

I don't get why you are so critical of what Elaina and I have posted when Sanskrit is suggesting men should push women as far as they can in hopes wearing down her resistance because that is what women really want (despite the number of female posters who have said they want a guy who looks for active consent).

 

Well, first of all, I do not think that is what he is suggesting ( of the stuff that I have read from him-have not read everything as some can be lengthy...]. Second, it is really not my problem if you do not "get" me...

[Taramere]

And since you have nothing else, you start in with personal attacks on me.

 

I can tell you one thing. I would not be so ignorant and bitchy as to yawn in response to a man who checked that I was comfortable with his advances. Yet oddly bitchiness of that variety doesn't seem to bother you. You don't mind the kind of woman who responds thuggishly to men who are polite and considerate towards her. What you object to is the temerity of any woman dishing your own shoddy attitude right back to you.

 

I have no duty to go along with this charade that you're interested in having a reasoned discussion as opposed to pursuing a horrible and creepy little campaign to discredit people who complain of rape. If you think I've launched a personal attack then hit that alert button, but how ironic that someone who's so enthusiastic about accusing rape complainers of faux victimhood should grab that position for himself eagerly in response to a couple of negative comments on a message board. I note your earlier comments where you regarded women who disagree with you as "bullies."

 

"IME," in addition to including my own personal experiences, includes reading on this board and others, where women of whatever nationalities make it quite clear they like assertive men, and that a patronizing, permission-seeking attitude towards sex is a turn-off. There are active threads on this board right now describing the consequences for men who are too polite in seeking sex.

 

Again, I don't suppose you have any problem at all with those women who reject men for treating them politely and considerately. Presumably you approve of them for conforming to this notion that women prefer men who demonstrate a total lack of class.

Edited October 10, 2010 by Taramere

[sanskrit]

This is what creeps me out the most about responses like yours in this thread. You and others are arguing that all you need is a woman's consent (either explicit or implicit, i.e., "she didn't say No" or "she came in to my apartment") to push your sexual agenda onto her. You don't even mention, wonder, or consider if she would want to have sex with YOU. You don't give a sh*t what she thinks; it doesn't seem to matter to you. As long as she didn't say No, you're golden!

 

Why would any guy want to continue "intercoursing" with a woman who is unresponsive or not enjoying herself? Is that some kind or turn-on in the male mind that I'm not aware of? I had always assumed that was a mental disorder known as necrophilia.

 

What creeps me out the most about responses like yours in the thread is the uncanny ability you display in filling in unmentioned details you have utterly no idea about in an attempt to smear those with whom you do not agree and most certainly do not know.

 

In the particular instance in question, the woman had enthusiastically disrobed, taken my clothes off, yanked on my wingwang for a bit, pulled me on top of her, and then in some emotional fit of uncool, all too characteristic of confused females, started crying for some unknowable reason. Then when my "enthusiasm" shrank due to this sad display, and I rolled over to go to sleep, she began rubbing on my back and wailing, "What's wrong?"

 

That very year, another woman who slept in my bed totally untouched due to her being drunk slandered me to mutual acquaintances as prospectively gay because I DIDN'T F_CK her.

 

Yet another jumped up and straddled me, took both our clothes off, and at the moment of truth, decided she didn't want to, yet refused my demands that she then leave, passed out and farted in my bed all night.

 

Another pulled me in her bed, wouldn't do anything, and then when I called her a tease, proceeded to hunt me down on campus the next day, sleep with me, then sleep with my best friend (unbeknownst to her, and unbeknownst that it would get back to me), then came back to me claiming that "sex was sacred to her and that the honorable thing for us to do would be to date."

 

Another would come to my house, get in bed on weekends, and then lead me through a tortuous ritual of disrobing her, 30 minutes per piece of clothing, then whine the whine I've heard so many times, "Whaaaaat's wrroooong?" when I lost interest and would go to sleep.

 

Blablabla on and on and on, that's just a few from one... single... year of my 30 years of putting up with the ridiculous vicissitudes of women where the issue of sexual consent is concerned.

 

So keep on self-righteously accusing experienced men in this thread of being callous monsters only seeking to get their rocks off. If we were actually anything like that (and it's a miracle I am not), it would be mostly due to the doings of women, not our "depraved" selfish Mr. Man natures.

[that girl]

I say, you need to just lighten up.

In a date rape thread?

 

I understand you feel like you have been "owned" by that little statement that you posted but you know what?

No, I don't feel "owned" or like you pointed out some foolishness on my part that I should be embarassed about.

 

Look, I think it is GOOD that you do not think a guy "going for a kiss" cannot be interpreted as assault. You are one woman less, men have to worry about when it comes to that. At least that is clear in your mind....and that is snarky?

Uh didn't you just say that a kiss without consent is assault and I should look it up. And I'm one less woman men have to worry about?

 

I think you're trolling.

[sanskrit]

I think LS has some very misogynistic posters and I think some posters are just being thoughtless.

 

Why must you continually make broad insulting comments about people you don't know as opposed to discussing the points and issues raised?

 

But the US has a 13% rape conviction rate (scarily low)

 

Admittedly some of those are convictions that should have happened. But can't you see that there's also a possibility that the low conviction rate may actually have to do with the prevalence of accusing the innocent? of false accusations?

[florence of suburbia]

What creeps me out the most about responses like yours in the thread is the uncanny ability you display in filling in unmentioned details you have utterly no idea about in an attempt to smear those with whom you do not agree and most certainly do not know.

 

In the particular instance in question, the woman had enthusiastically disrobed, taken my clothes off, yanked on my wingwang for a bit, pulled me on top of her, and then in some emotional fit of uncool, all too characteristic of confused females, started crying for some unknowable reason. Then when my "enthusiasm" shrank due to this sad display, and I rolled over to go to sleep, she began rubbing on my back and wailing, "What's wrong?"

 

That very year, another woman who slept in my bed totally untouched due to her being drunk slandered me to mutual acquaintances as prospectively gay because I DIDN'T F_CK her.

 

Yet another jumped up and straddled me, took both our clothes off, and at the moment of truth, decided she didn't want to, yet refused my demands that she then leave, passed out and farted in my bed all night.

 

Another pulled me in her bed, wouldn't do anything, and then when I called her a tease, proceeded to hunt me down on campus the next day, sleep with me, then sleep with my best friend (unbeknownst to her, and unbeknownst that it would get back to me), then came back to me claiming that "sex was sacred to her and that the honorable thing for us to do would be to date."

 

Another would come to my house, get in bed on weekends, and then lead me through a tortuous ritual of disrobing her, 30 minutes per piece of clothing, then whine the whine I've heard so many times, "Whaaaaat's wrroooong?" when I lost interest and would go to sleep.

 

Blablabla on and on and on, that's just a few from one... single... year of my 30 years of putting up with the ridiculous vicissitudes of women where the issue of sexual consent is concerned.

 

So keep on self-righteously accusing experienced men in this thread of being callous monsters only seeking to get their rocks off. If we were actually anything like that (and it's a miracle I am not), it would be mostly due to the doings of women, not our "depraved" selfish Mr. Man natures.

 

Thanks for the examples. Why is it you want to have sex with us again, since we're such pitiful, manipulative, slutty idiots?

[that girl]

In the particular instance in question, the woman had enthusiastically disrobed, taken my clothes off, yanked on my wingwang for a bit, pulled me on top of her, and then in some emotional fit of uncool, all too characteristic of confused females, started crying for some unknowable reason. Then when my "enthusiasm" shrank due to this sad display, and I rolled over to go to sleep, she began rubbing on my back and wailing, "What's wrong?"

 

One page ago you said you backed off because she wasn't worth the effort, at which point she started crying.

 

Now she just started crying because her crazy lady brain made her?

 

But either way, your response to a prospective sexual partner crying you went to sleep?

 

WTF is wrong with you?

 

That very year, another woman who slept in my bed totally untouched due to her being drunk slandered me to mutual acquaintances as prospectively gay because I DIDN'T F_CK her.

Obviously that is crazy, but I don't see why it is that big of a deal. You took the high road so if it ever comes up, you just roll your eyes and say "She was way too drunk to do anything with, so I let her sleep it off."

 

 

Another would come to my house, get in bed on weekends, and then lead me through a tortuous ritual of disrobing her, 30 minutes per piece of clothing, then whine the whine I've heard so many times, "Whaaaaat's wrroooong?" when I lost interest and would go to sleep.

Foreplay bores you?

 

You seem to have an odd habit of going to sleep when women get naked with you. Obviously the drunk woman should be left alone, but with the other two it just seems like some messed up power play. I'm sure some guys are reading your post with their jaws on the floor because they wouldn't turn down a lady who liked a lot of foreplay.

 

 

You don't like women do you Sanskrit?

[sanskrit]

I do not think that women who like a man to be agressive want a man to totally ignore whether or not they are into the act. But even if we assume they do, wouldn't you rather take the risk of a woman being dissapointed by your lack of agression than risk a woman feeling that she was forced into sex?

 

See my prior post. Every man has to put up with BS from women in bed over the years. I've had so many women state with absolute certainly that "I'm not having sex with you," then five minutes later we ARE in fact having sex OF HER DOING, that it boggles the mind, and am tired of this issue being strictly couched as "bad, insensitive things" a man does in being assertive about seeking sex, and never ever about the mountains of mixed signals and crap that men have to put up with dealing with women who may or may not even know what they want in the moment.

 

I learned long ago that when she gives the signs of acceptance of sexual advances, to just follow through with it until she says "no." It's really simple, if you don't want sex, say no and leave, GTFO out. That's the woman's responsibility as gatekeeper, not the man's to have to indefinitely decipher the bottomless pit of female emotion and indecisiveness.

 

Most people want to be good in bed and being good in bed is about making sure your partner is having a good time.

 

A woman's pleasure in bed is not solely the man's responsibility, and as far as women making sure their partner is having a good time :lmao: keep selling that. No man with any experience with women is buying it. If women were graded on their sexual skills compared to the elaborate, near infinite demands on men in that department, most women would do well to get a C- (but hey, that's ok we are much more charitable and easy to please than women) The expectations are radically different.

 

Efforts? Everything you've just described is about a man using a woman's body for his own pleasure and assuming she'll orgasm spontaneously from his agression.

 

and like others, you just fill in details as it suits you, but I'm sure that doesn't seem absurd to you.

 

A woman who has sex when she doesn't want to is pretty likely to have been raped.

 

That's not the legal definition of rape in any state to my knowledge, despite that it is close to the bogus politicized feminist definition.

[TaurusTerp]

One page ago you said you backed off because she wasn't worth the effort, at which point she started crying.

 

Now she just started crying because her crazy lady brain made her?

 

But either way, your response to a prospective sexual partner crying you went to sleep?

 

WTF is wrong with you?

 

 

Obviously that is crazy, but I don't see why it is that big of a deal. You took the high road so if it ever comes up, you just roll your eyes and say "She was way too drunk to do anything with, so I let her sleep it off."

 

 

 

Foreplay bores you?

 

You seem to have an odd habit of going to sleep when women get naked with you. Obviously the drunk woman should be left alone, but with the other two it just seems like some messed up power play. I'm sure some guys are reading your post with their jaws on the floor because they wouldn't turn down a lady who liked a lot of foreplay.

 

 

You don't like women do you Sanskrit?

 

Girl, you are naive. Those aren't incidents isolated to Sanskrit. I guarantee any guy that's over 25 has a long list of experiences identical to those of sanskrit.

 

And having to convince a woman that clearly wants to have sex but is giving you "i dont knoooowww, we probably shouldn't" is not foreplay. At least not good foreplay. It's just irritating as hell, and lowers my opinion of her.

[tami-chan]

In a date rape thread?

 

not on the topic, silly, on assigning emotions.

 

No, I don't feel "owned" or like you pointed out some foolishness on my part that I should be embarassed about.

It was a foolish statement, wasn't it?

 

 

Uh didn't you just say that a kiss without consent is assault and I should look it up. And I'm one less woman men have to worry about?

Actually I said it CAN be assault-not IS assault...let's be careful here . Yes, you are one less woman, men would worry about if that is clear to you-that a man "going for a kiss"...is not assault. Why would they worry about that with you? If you have made that determination, that to YOU any man who "goes for a kiss" with you (and by "any man", I mean, presumably, a date or some such-not some whino in the corner or some stranger in a coffee shop) is not assaulting you? See "rape", "sexual asssault", "sexual harassment" are for the most part highly subjective. I said "good for you" that you have made the clear to YOURSELF. I am seeing it from your angle and you seem to STILL take offense-"WTF is wrong with you?" <..sorry, just saw you ask somebody that-thought I'd borrow it!>

 

I think you're trolling.

This is rich:rolleyes:!

[sanskrit]

I can tell you one thing. I would not be so ignorant and bitchy as to yawn in response to a man who checked that I was comfortable with his advances.

 

Phew, why do I even type? Surely you get that the "yawn" was figurative and symbolic of her being turned off, not an actual yawn. Wasn't going to draw attention to that, but it's the second time you have brought it up now.

 

Yet oddly bitchiness of that variety doesn't seem to bother you.

 

Wonder why.

 

I have no duty to go along with this charade that you're interested in having a reasoned discussion as opposed to pursuing a horrible and creepy little campaign to discredit people who complain of rape.

 

No of course, you have no duty, no accountability for any insulting thing you want to post, I get that. Par for the course. And you still haven't read the Sommers article I linked.

 

If you think I've launched a personal attack then hit that alert button,

 

I've been on the internet, in one form or another, since the 80s, allll the way back to telnet type forums and BBS. It's very rare for me to complain to moderators about a post. You see, I'm a man, who is perfectly comfortable having a heated discussion here without tattling on posters merely because I do not agree with them (and of course don't even know them). You see, I'm not interested in shouting any POV down because I actually want to learn from those who don't believe as I do. I'm not doctrinaire in the least, which is more than I can say is reflected in several of the posts in this thread.

 

You see, I have no interest whatsoever in personally insulting anonymous internet folks because that would make me look like an idiot.

 

but how ironic that someone who's so enthusiastic about accusing rape complainers of faux victimhood should grab that position for himself eagerly in response to a couple of negative comments on a message board. I note your earlier comments where you regarded women who disagree with you as "bullies."

 

1. I never accused rape complainers of false victimhood, merely stated the well documented fact that many rape accusations are false. Or rather, cite please.

 

2. My complaints about posters making personal attacks is that it contributes nothing to the discussion, and wastes my time by having to call attention to such dishonest argument techniques, not that it "victimizes" me in some way.

 

 

Again, I don't suppose you have any problem at all with those women who reject men for treating them politely and considerately. Presumably you approve of them for conforming to this notion that women prefer men who demonstrate a total lack of class.

 

Straw man. Do better.

[sanskrit]

Thanks for the examples. Why is it you want to have sex with us again, since we're such pitiful, manipulative, slutty idiots?

 

Why? Because I can.

 

Nice try at putting words in my mouth btw.

[Taramere]

Phew, why do I even type?

 

I don't know Meerkat. Perhaps it's a compulsion you have.

 

Surely you get that the "yawn" was figurative and symbolic of her being turned off, not an actual yawn. Wasn't going to draw attention to that, but it's the second time you have brought it up now.

 

I wonder how "figurative" all the other weird and wonderful examples of rudeness and bizarre female behaviour you've provided on this board are.

 

On the other hand, like does attract like. If you have such a steady parade of monstrous women traipsing in and out of your life, start looking closer to home for the reason.

[sanskrit]

One page ago you said you backed off because she wasn't worth the effort, at which point she started crying.

 

Reread, I lost interest, and my erection, after she started crying for no reason.

 

But either way, your response to a prospective sexual partner crying you went to sleep?

 

WTF is wrong with you?

 

Actually, I gave her a towel and told her to shut the hell up so I could get some sleep. Not a thing is wrong with me, as evidenced by her profuse apologies the next day. Apparently there was a BF in the picture I didn't know about whom she was about to cheat on. Incidentally, they have been happily married for 20+ years and I was invited to the wedding. Oh, and she came onto me at least once (memory fails, probably more than once), and had an affair with a friend of mine after they were actually engaged.

 

WTF is wrong with -me- indeed :lmao:

 

Foreplay bores you?

 

Somewhere in the hour of two of disrobing, yes, women's little "giving in" games begin to bore me.

 

You seem to have an odd habit of going to sleep when women get naked with you. Obviously the drunk woman should be left alone, but with the other two it just seems like some messed up power play. I'm sure some guys are reading your post with their jaws on the floor because they wouldn't turn down a lady who liked a lot of foreplay.

 

They should learn a lesson from it. The fastest way for a man to get more sex than he wants or needs in life is to learn early that if women do obnoxious, disrespectful things, call them on it by rejecting them. More often than not, they come crawling back apologizing for their nuttiness, as they know full well it's a -them- problem and not a -me- problem. Once they know what's what, "who's the boss" as it were, all the little games miraculously disappear.

 

You don't like women do you Sanskrit?

 

Sometimes I like them less than other times, like any normal human being. Thank god they LOVE me though

[tami-chan]

nevermind...lol