THIS right here is one of the HUGE problems with online dating

[WintersNightTraveler]

This sort of shopping around is being considerate.

 

I'm a little confused here. Did you somehow miss the sarcasm and interpret my post literally? Or were you requoting my sarcasm for emphasis, since I very obviously made the exact same point you did. To the point where two of our points were nearly identical ("I completely think after the first few rejections its the fault of the rejectee" and "a clearer sign of baggage on the part of the rejectee")

 

Please don't remove the author tag and mix in my text with someone else's while quoting.

 

If you were rebutting to my implicit agreement with another poster that dishonesty and petty game playing is common on the internet, then we can tango if you want. That's too easy.

[carhill]

I'm not trying to change her, control her, or anything else you come up with. I simply brought to light how its rude, dishonest, to be on a dating site when you know you are not emotionally ready to date anyone.

 

Of course no one else that read her thread even realized it, until I pointed it out.

Speaking precisely, for myself, *I don't care*. If she's being rude, she pays the consequences for that. No scholarship required.

[welikeincrowds]

Or were you requoting my sarcasm for emphasis, since I very obviously made the exact same point you did.

 

Of course this, your post was perfect.

 

Also I don't actually know how to add people's names to the quote tag... as you can see

[brainygirl]

 

Of course no one else that read her thread even realized it, until I pointed it out.

 

 

 

Generally speaking, if only one person notices/has a problem with something, the problem lies with the person observing, not the person being observed.

 

I talk with many people on OKcupid, I've met few. That's because the act of conversing leads to the decision of weather or not i want to meet them.

 

I chatted with a man just this week who seemed very nice, until he felt the need to mention my breasts in the conversation for no reason, this after he claimed to be a Christian.

 

Another guy I talked with I decided not to meet because he was just plain rude to me about the fact that I had a kid so young, but still wanted to meet up.

 

I message guys I think I might be interested in, but just because I message you does not mean I will meet up with you.

[WintersNightTraveler]

My goodness, a guy might waste upwards of 100 lines of text conversing with a such a woman whom he would never get the opportunity to see in person

 

Also you chopped off the tits joke. WTF why take out the best part of a sentence and also completely change its meaning by doing so?

[WintersNightTraveler]

Of course this, your post was perfect.

 

Also I don't actually know how to add people's names to the quote tag... as you can see

 

LOL ok I'll settle down then, somehow I got off the leash! It was the tits thing, it really got to me. I felt like I was being quoted by a major news network.

 

OK in way of apology let me try to be helpful. Use the quote buttons within the posts themselves, rather than adding the tag in the editor. Or include something like "QUOTE=welikeincrowds;2942701" instead of just "QUOTE" in the tag.

[meerkat stew]

Lots of pedantry in this thread. Going on a dating site in the immediate wake of a relationship is -wrong period-, end of story. It's wrong for the person doing it, and especially wrong for the people he/she interacts with. The person is, in effect, wasting others' time unduly, and yes, in some cases, causing them emotional pain.

 

OP made a mistake in singling out one poster here as an example, but even a cretin could tell that's not his point, yet of course, this doesn't keep the bandwagon of absurdity from forming up in outrage as it so often does here.

[WintersNightTraveler]

So bad behavior is ok because it's "common"?

 

When did I say "ok"? The point is not to change your judgement of the phenomena from bad to good, it's to not bother judging at all. I believe the philosophical term is "don't give a sh*t."

[Serenitynow]

Lots of pedantry in this thread. Going on a dating site in the immediate wake of a relationship is -wrong period-, end of story. It's wrong for the person doing it, and especially wrong for the people he/she interacts with. The person is, in effect, wasting others' time unduly, and yes, in some cases, causing them emotional pain.

 

OP made a mistake in singling out one poster here as an example, but even a cretin could tell that's not his point, yet of course, this doesn't keep the bandwagon of absurdity from forming up in outrage as it so often does here.

 

It wasnt no mistake. As I said before, it holds much more water this way, rather than just making up a thread about a hypothetical situation.

 

I could care less about her feelings, the same as she doesnt care for the people that are assuming she wants to date.

 

.

[WintersNightTraveler]

but want to remind WinterNights that we aren't talking about one girl who shouldn't be on the dating site, but a whole HOST of men and women seeking to use the site

 

Not sure what the reminder is for. That point goes hand in hand with not getting worked up over individuals who waste your time. If anything I said was cretin-ish, feel free to quote and point out those specific items, since the OP seems to not be able to do this despite my request.

 

I agree with almost your entire post, and it was all well laid out. In fact, you've pretty much mastered the whole not getting upset at the BS idea which was what I was trying to drive home. To your last point about length - heh yes I almost tossed out a quick "tldr" which would have been unfortunate.

 

Your post pretty much could be its own useful how-to thread, so I'm not sure why you're wasting it trying to clean up a thread driven by someone's particular aggressive agenda.

[WintersNightTraveler]

It wasnt no mistake.

[...]

I could care less about her feelings

 

It was no mistake.

 

You couldn't care less about her feelings.

 

Yes posting a specific example is a good start in any argument but if you are going to start singling people out you better have a strong case to go along with it b/c you know fireworks always ensue.

[meerkat stew]

It wasnt no mistake. As I said before, it holds much more water this way, rather than just making up a thread about a hypothetical situation.

 

Still think it was a mistake, wouldn't you rather this have been a constructive thread instead of just a flamefest? Remove reference to individual LS posters and it could have been just that.

 

WinterNightTraveler, your early posts to the thread de-emphasized any single "not relationship ready" person's effect on a dating site. My counter to that is that this is indeed a very real problem on dating sites that causes many quality candidates to flee them altogether due to huge numbers of people doing this very thing. I know people who go straight to match.com and get their profile up within 5 minutes. I shouldn't have to sift through them or try to ESP this fact out of them, and should most definitely not be an unknowing subject of some post breakup rebound experiment on their part. Relationship hoppers do more social damage than cheaters IME, quantitatively if not qualitatively. I don't want to have the next quality woman I meet on match to be unfit because the last guy was recently divorced and did a number on her. There are so many ways how rushing straight to the dating site after a breakup screws the pooch for everyone trying to date from online that I shouldn't have to list any more of them out.

 

I was not calling anyone in the thread a cretin directly, just haven't used that word this week yet and it's Sunday, so was shy on my "cretin quota" and had to work it in somewhere.

[hopesndreams]

Excerpt from a post by shadowplay. She has an active online dating profile, but she doesnt think she can even meet anyone IRL right now.

 

 

 

You and 95% of the rest of the women on dating sites are exactly the same.

 

You post your profile, put yourself out there, but in reality, you have huge amounts of emotional/psychological baggage, and dont even think you can meet anyone IRL.

 

Instead, you USE the guys from the site as an ego boost. Letting them email you, talk about meeting them , and the whole time you doubt you could ever go through with it.

 

If I would have made a post about this on my own, I would have got bashed by women. But here it is, in black and white, so all I have to do now is point it out to everyone.

 

You should NOT be on a dating site if you dont have the balls to meet people.

 

.

 

I found that with men too when doing the online dating thing.

 

I came to the conclusion that people on online dating sites are troubled. Why is it when u chat to others from there that they always talk about the ex?

[WintersNightTraveler]

WinterNightTraveler, your early posts to the thread de-emphasized any single "not relationship ready" person's effect on a dating site. My counter to that is that this is indeed a very real problem on dating sites that causes many quality candidates to flee them altogether due to huge numbers of people doing this very thing. I know people who go straight to match.com and get their profile up within 5 minutes. I shouldn't have to sift through them or try to ESP this fact out of them, and should most definitely not be an unknowing subject of some post breakup rebound experiment on their part. Relationship hoppers do more social damage than cheaters IME, quantitatively if not qualitatively. I don't want to have the next quality woman I meet on match to be unfit because the last guy was recently divorced and did a number on her. There are so many ways how rushing straight to the dating site after a breakup screws the pooch for everyone trying to date from online that I shouldn't have to list any more of them out.

 

I was not calling anyone in the thread a cretin directly, just haven't used that word this week yet and it's Sunday, so was shy on my "cretin quota" and had to work it in somewhere.

 

It is a good word.

 

Meh, I am just surprised at the particular mix of pragmatism and idealism. I shouldn't be, since I do that all the time. Just not on this subject I suppose. Those people who are sh*tting in the online soup would be in the dating population with or without online dating. People have had to deal with rebounds and non committment and not getting called back and such since well before match.com or okcupid.

 

But you are probably right in that the online dating dynamic may exacerbate the problem by allowing contact so easily. But at the same time, that's one of the points of OLD, you're contacting a ton more people than you would otherwise. Casting the larger net you're bound to catch more boots. So complaining about the boots when the alternative is the original, much smaller net, seems off to me.

[meerkat stew]

Just read the thread that resulted in this one, and now agree totally with Serenity. He got bandwagoned in the other thread merely for calling someone out on something she absolutely should be called out on by any thinking poster. "Don't take your crap out on me," I believe was her reply. So more power to ya Serenity, would have done the same thing faced with certain entitled princess elements here on LS.

 

"Don't take your crap out on me" indeed... No accountability, no consideration... none. Question me or be so bold as to actually offer any shred of criticism? Well, Mr. Man, -you- are the one with the problem, not me. :lmao:

 

So glad I've mastered net dating to the point I can screen the princesses out on the front end.

[zengirl]

I actually agreed with you, in that she should get the stones up to meet some of these guys or else it's a waste of time (hers too), but not with this whole bitterness attitude.

 

It's not always about attention. Really, I've come to the conclusion that most people simply don't know what they want to do any given day. I think shadow will eventually meet someone from the site. Will she meet every guy who wants to? Certainly not.

 

I am only on dating sites when I'm pretty willing to meet. But I'm not going to meet everyone either. Not everyone who messages me. Not everyone I message. I don't need loads of messaging, generally, to want to meet a fellow. But I never feel obligated until I've agreed, and it's certainly a small percentage of the men who message me that I find interesting. This is mostly due to men doing silly things, like ignoring the age range the site clearly asks me to specify, messaging me with low compatibility numbers and seemingly nothing in common (Many of these men like to tell me "We seem to have things in common" without listing these or having any trace of it in their profile), messaging me with a blank or close-to-it profile, or saying stupid things, and I'm not even just talking about the offensive ones (Yeah, my pretty smile isn't anything to start a meaningful conversation on; sorry; I wrote plenty, so read it and say something clever).

 

And, you know what? If I message someone and they don't respond? (Which has happened.) That's totally cool. A "No, thank you" or a "Yeah, after thinking about it, I'm not that into meeting" --- also cool. Maybe less cool if a fellow has been going back and forth and drops off the planet entirely without a note about it, but still perfectly cool.

 

You need to get over this entitlement complex. And it's YOU who has one if you expect anything from anyone because they put up a dating site profile. Generally, I expect people not to outright lie to me in the profile or the messages (common courtesy), though even that happens, obviously. But other than that? Nobody has to meet you. Nobody has to meet anyone. Get over it. Stop worrying about all the ways other people aren't living up to what you want them to be, because that's just treating them like objects or cogs in your life and not like the complex, whole people they are with their own **** to deal with.

[Scottdmw]

The most important part is bolded. This issue is under your control, not the other peoples'.

 

That's easy to say. Are all of your emotional responses under your control? I doubt it.

 

Look, I've been trying for years to not be bothered by things like this. It's not that easy. I agree that the ideal is for me not to be affected by it. But, I don't think that means I have no right to say that it's wrong when a woman does this, or to expect that she could do better.

 

 

 

This is the other thing I don't understand. SP or any such woman is not playing with you at that point. You haven't even met. She's playing with herself. No, not in that sexy way, but in that her acts are based primarily around her own motivations (accomodating her confidence, anxieties, schedule, etc) rather than yours. As well they should, any rational person will still be motivated by self interest that early in a relationship. You should be too. You guys don't know each other well enough to be very altruistic about it.

 

It seems to me like you are excusing bad behavior in women. I don't see what's so hard about expecting that a person communicating with you on a dating site, talking about meeting you, is going to meet you. That seems like normal human courtesy. When you let women off the hook on things like this, you basically teach them that it's okay to not be courteous. You will get what you expect out of people on things like this.

 

If a woman is on a dating site talking to men, and she full well knows she has no intention of ever meeting those men, she is using them. That is wrong. Why are you so ready to say that it's not?

 

 

 

Only once or twice, if he has good sense.

 

No need to guess that I can say it, I will say it. I completely think after the first few rejections its the fault of the rejectee, in the type of brief online dating intro we are talking about.

 

This whole thing is just a slight variation on how some guys whine incessantly about how few responses they get.

 

Sure you can bitch a bit about it, it's no fun. But to make it seem like a big deal? Tacky and self defeating.

 

I wouldn't say it's a big deal. But, I just don't think it's useful to excuse this kind of thing. Okay, it happens. But, why should we all say that it's okay?

 

Scott

[WintersNightTraveler]

That's easy to say. Are all of your emotional responses under your control? I doubt it.

 

Perhaps I should have said "affect" rather than control. I actually worried it would be interpreted that way. The point was you can affect your own emotions (to some degree), whereas you can't affect whether there are flakes on a dating site at all. You are correct in that we can't control them entirely.

 

 

 

Look, I've been trying for years to not be bothered by things like this. It's not that easy. I agree that the ideal is for me not to be affected by it.

 

Yep it is.

 

I am not sure why this has taken you years. I find your posts rational and generally on target so I would expect you to be very methodical about these things.

 

Keep trying to not be bothered I guess.

 

 

But, I don't think that means I have no right to say that it's wrong when a woman does this, or to expect that she could do better.

 

Yes you have the right to say whatever you want. I can point out when I feel it's not constructive. You already know it's better to not be bothered. Putting thought into the rightness or wrongness of it just moves you further away from that goal.

 

 

It seems to me like you are excusing bad behavior in women. I don't see what's so hard about expecting that a person communicating with you on a dating site, talking about meeting you, is going to meet you.

 

"Excuse" relates to blame (or lack thereof). My entire point is that the blame doesn't get you anywhere here.

 

Yes as you say it's not hard at all to have this expectation. However, it is also naive, in the online dating world at least. Just because it's an easy expectation doesn't make it a useful expectation.

 

 

When you let women off the hook on things

 

Again with the blame/judgement. The "hook" you think you have doesn't really exist. What are the consequences of their actions? None really, and frustration at these actions adds zero consequences.

 

 

 

you basically teach them that it's okay to not be courteous.

 

First off, we're not teaching them anything. These people are adults with well engrained habits and personality traits. Not that you can't teach an old dog new tricks, but a bit of online dating passive aggressiveness ain't going to do squat.

 

Secondly, this is mildly condescending and very much reflects a pretty useless us versus them attitude? aka rephrase as Let's learn them rude b*tches some manners!

 

I don't actually think you feel that way or are rude like that. I am trying to point out how the additude goes nowhere by making an exaggerated parody.

 

 

You will get what you expect out of people on things like this.

 

Nope. Your expectations won't affect their behavior. You've been trying for years, right? I bet you still see flakes. Probably moreso, since more people are online than years ago.

 

You may get better at weeding out the wrong folks, but that's a completely different sort of expectation.

 

 

 

If a woman is on a dating site talking to men, and she full well knows she has no intention of ever meeting those men, she is using them. That is wrong. Why are you so ready to say that it's not?

 

I couldn't resist that tit joke rant on Serenity. In a nasty, illogical and counterproductive manner he called out a specific poster who simply posted her honest thoughts asking for advice. If he really gave a crap about improving the situation he could have pointed out to her how her actions could affect the guys she doesn't go out on dates with. Instead he posted a baggage laden rant. I felt hyperbole would make the point better than rational discourse, and I wanted to get in a good dig. I feel I succeeded.

 

Now things are just snowballing, as many guys seem to find this a sore point so the discussion goes on and on. I don't think the OP even bothered replying to my points, the hyperbole or subsequent discussion.

 

As to whether the phenonmenon in general is wrong or right, I just don't care. OLD is what it is, and I just use it to try to get dates.

 

But by all means you guys keep focusing on this, since I just reactivated my OKC account and don't mind if the competition is distracted!

[Art_Critic]

You post your profile, put yourself out there, but in reality, you have huge amounts of emotional/psychological baggage, and dont even think you can meet anyone IRL.

 

Can the same be said about you ? bet it can..

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but you seem to be working thru many issues as well, just like shadow is.. and you are online dating sites..

[CaliGuy]

Ah see, that's never been a problem for me. I am plenty confident. It's just out here in California we're presented with nothing but PSYCHOTIC people (both men and women). I've pretty much given up on dating while I am here (hope to relocate to somewhere in Western Europe when the opportunity comes). It's not that I am not confident but simply a byproduct of no longer willing to deal with the crazy people here.

 

Cheers.

[Scottdmw]

Perhaps I should have said "affect" rather than control. I actually worried it would be interpreted that way. The point was you can affect your own emotions (to some degree), whereas you can't affect whether there are flakes on a dating site at all. You are correct in that we can't control them entirely.

 

.......

 

As to whether the phenonmenon in general is wrong or right, I just don't care. OLD is what it is, and I just use it to try to get dates.

 

But by all means you guys keep focusing on this, since I just reactivated my OKC account and don't mind if the competition is distracted!

 

 

Well, thanks for trying to help anyway. I do appreciate the effort. I think there is some truth to what you say.

 

I actually think the best possible thing to do would be for me to be emotionally unaffected by all this, yet still tell women when I think they're doing something wrong. You may find that a fruitless endeavor and perhaps it is, but I feel like nothing ever gets better if you don't try to do something.

 

Scott

[SincereOnlineGuy]

 

You should NOT be on a dating site if you dont have the balls to meet people.

 

 

 

 

Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, perhaps you don't understand who dating sites are FOR???