Enchanted Girl Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 most women cannot or will not give an honest answer to this question Most men only want to hear the answers they want to hear. Although I'm lying when I say that and know stereotyping is stupid. I think it's just the ones who have issues who are this way.
Stung Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I can't be the only one who thinks it's incredibly arrogant, misguided and condescending when male posters snark about how women in general don't know what they want or will lie about it if they do, can I? Every time I read that I think, well, now I know why THAT one is having trouble with women.
Pyro Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I can't be the only one who thinks it's incredibly arrogant, misguided and condescending when male posters snark about how women in general don't know what they want or will lie about it if they do, can I? Every time I read that I think, well, now I know why THAT one is having trouble with women. I do wonder how many of the said male posters have a GF/wife.
skydiveaddict Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Most men only want to hear the answers they want to hear. Although I'm lying when I say that and know stereotyping is stupid. I think it's just the ones who have issues who are this way. No enchanted girl, Alpha is entirely correct
sally4sara Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 For me, it has always been a combination of three factors backed with a fourth. If one of the three is lower then the other two have to be better. Humor (it indicates other qualities like intelligence) Looks Skill set. Like the Flobot's song "Handlebars". Gotta be able to do something useful. The fourth? Confidence. Or call it self worth if you'd prefer, but it is the reason why a guy will believe he can show me why I should stick around. I don't care about your money. I can make as much as I need.
Enchanted Girl Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I can't be the only one who thinks it's incredibly arrogant, misguided and condescending when male posters snark about how women in general don't know what they want or will lie about it if they do, can I? Every time I read that I think, well, now I know why THAT one is having trouble with women. Exactly. You'll also notice that pyro is never on these threads agreeing with those men and he's the one out of them who is having no problems with women. It is not a coincidence.
Pyro Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Exactly. You'll also notice that pyro is never on these threads agreeing with those men and he's the one out of them who is having no problems with women. It is not a coincidence. Over the years I have taken advice from both men and women. Sorry boys but you are wrong.
skydiveaddict Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Over the years I have taken advice from both men and women. Sorry boys but you are wrong. No we are not wrong the situation changes completely when you are in a committed relationship
Eeyore79 Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Looks obviously have something to do with it; I won't date someone who repulses me. But a guy can make himself appear a lot more attractive by being fit, well groomed, a snappy dresser, etc. There's this guy in my building who isn't particularly handsome, and when I saw him in baggy sweat pants and an old tshirt I wasn't attracted to him... he seemed badly dressed, poorly groomed, lacking in confidence, broke; like he couldn't even take care of himself, let alone me. Not that I need taking care of, but when I assess a guy I tend to think whether we could build a decent future and support a family together, and this guy didn't come across as a confident successful guy. But then he dropped a few pounds, got new glasses and updated his wardrobe... I saw him going out one Saturday night in a funky shirt and slim fit jeans, expensive looking watch, and he actually smiled at me and cracked a cheeky joke... and I thought YOWSA! He still didn't have a handsome face, but he came across as well dressed, sophisticated, confident, wealthy, like the type of guy I'd be proud to be seen with... in two seconds he went from my "No way" list to my "Would like to date if I was single" list!
Art_Critic Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I have always found that just being myself and making them laugh was what always worked for me.. Then lay on some respect and throw in some romance.. If all else fails show them the Amex Platinum laugh:
Pyro Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 No we are not wrong the situation changes completely when you are in a committed relationship why would I take dating tips when in a relationship? Throughout my years of dating I have taken advice from both genders. Its not the end of the world to take advice from women. Some of them do give good advice. It doesn't make you less of a man to ask them for help.
SassyKitten Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I'll just go with non-physical qualities, as the physical qualities are ones that a lot of women look for: *Genuine, completely honest, etc. *Intelligent with a curiosity to keep learning. *Empathy, i.e. the kind of man I can get a hug from if I'm having a bad day. *An interest in travelling. As in real travelling, not Carnival Cruise travelling! *Politically and socially liberal. *Great sense of humor, especially in the sarcastic, satirical, etc. sense!
dispatch3d Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 lol make a thread asking what women are into, then all the guys say "Oh looks matter the most!". Just like the other 30 threads you guys made saying "Do looks matter?" then had a debate with 40 guys and 10 women. yeah girls will sleep with model-looking guys. How much do they matter? **** if I know I"m not a women. And asking them straightup doesn't seem to give any straight answers either. The two guys I've known who were the best with women had AVERAGE looks at best! Mayyybe slightly above average. So whatever. Seriously, just let them talk. Hopefully they talk in terms of things that are improvable (better fashion sense, funny, good vibe, etc.), than things we can't do anything about..... my 2 cents...
SassyKitten Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 yeah girls will sleep with model-looking guys. How much do they matter? **** if I know I"m not a women. And asking them straightup doesn't seem to give any straight answers either. The two guys I've known who were the best with women had AVERAGE looks at best! Mayyybe slightly above average. So whatever. As a woman, I agree that this is often, but not always the case. Probably because the further away from a 10 a man is, the harder he has to try to make up for it with his non-physical traits, same goes for women. When it comes to looks, I don't expect someone to look like a model, at the very least I expect them to look like their health is important to them.
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 And I also agree that people saying that you have to be physically attractive are oversimplifying it as well. Good hygiene is good to have like you said, but people are attracted to different physical types. Thank heavens not everyone is looking for the same things I can't be the only one who thinks it's incredibly arrogant, misguided and condescending when male posters snark about how women in general don't know what they want or will lie about it if they do, can I? Every time I read that I think, well, now I know why THAT one is having trouble with women. Oh... what kind of trouble are you suggesting? My point was that we often don't want to admit to ourselves or others what are bad tendencies are... I myself for example tend to be attracted to women who superficial and controlling. I absolutely hate to admit that about myself... but it's true. I've thrown myself into some terrible relationships because of that. Does my comment make more sense now? I do wonder how many of the said male posters have a GF/wife. Are you counting quantity or quality? I seem to be pretty good on quantity, but fairly bad on quality. I find it so annoying that men here say this every time a fellow asks a woman's opinion. Healthy, reflective women know what they like. Unhealthy women or women who struggle to reflect might not know or be able to quantify it. The same is true of men. I agree with you that many people are not emotionally healthy, probably most. . . Fairly sad. That said, I don't think anyone can tell you what all women like. Not a man. Not a woman. Sorry I wasn't quite clear on that post. I was not trying to imply that emotionally healthy women don't know what they want or will lie about it. My point was that in my experience most women are not emotionally healthy... and men too, and that asking their opinion on this topic is pointless.
dispatch3d Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Another thing about the good-looking debate. It's kind of a self fullfulling prophecy. Like a guy gets a lot of action, and he mostly is going for looks. He assumes since he gets so much that he must be attractive himself, and therefore is good looking. That doesn't really work though. Just because A and B exist doesn't mean A causes B or B causes A. The other part is I would assume younger girls are probably more materialistic than older woman. So when we were younger the girls were all chasing the popular good-looking jock with all the friends+connections. It made them look better. These same guys are the ones who slowly got the skills to deal with women, because they HAD to. I mean I'll never know how much looks matter to women. I would have to become a women to have a true idea. Otherwise I'm putting my male slant on things, and as you women have probably noticed looks do matter to us. As much as we pretend to value other things more (I'm sure some of us do, but many wouldn't turn down a hot girl regardless of attitude...).
zengirl Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Sorry I wasn't quite clear on that post. I was not trying to imply that emotionally healthy women don't know what they want or will lie about it. My point was that in my experience most women are not emotionally healthy... and men too, and that asking their opinion on this topic is pointless. Ah. Well, true enough. And, you know what, I think the people who are super firm about what they like in superficial ways (i.e. I will only date a guy above 6'0'' who plays bass guitar, has a PhD in neuroscience, and has chiseled abs, or whatever. . . it doesn't really matter what the requirements are; just their specificity) is a little bit weird, as is anyone who'll date just anyone. Though not entirely pointless. The thing to do with advice (only in my opinion, of course) is to get loads of it, consider the sources (really, anything on an anonymous web board should go pretty far towards the bottom of the "reliability of sources" list in my book), think over the ideas, and decide what you think makes sense to you. Talking about things is never pointless, as it allows us to come up with our own ideas. So long as the OP or no one here goes and changes everything they are on the basis of some posts on a message board, I don't see an issue.
Pyro Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 (edited) Are you counting quantity or quality? I seem to be pretty good on quantity, but fairly bad on quality. quality. quantity is good for practice and to learn from mistakes. perhaps asking women for advice will help gain the quality ones. Edited August 7, 2010 by Pyro
classof2014 Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I know Im gonna get flamed for this but I honestly believe money, power, prestige, and looks are all HUGE factors. I mean I'm not saying their dealbreakers but they make dating a lot easier. Let's look at almost every old celebrity. All of their wives are like 20 years younger (Rolling Stones, Bruce Willis, Rod Stewart, John Mellancamp, etc.). Almost all younger men also date beautiful women if the woman is physically attracted to him. Sure gold-digging among the older men group is rampant, but many of these women like the security that comes with money and a steady job. They also like the prestige of being able to date a celebrity or someone with a specialized skill (i.e. surgeon). The whole confidence thing is WAY overrated. I know lots of really great, pretty successful, well-kept middle aged guys (my dad's friends) and none of them are dating/married to supermodels. All of his single friends have pretty bad dating lives to tell you the truth. I hate to tell you, but if your young enough, finding a way to get rich, getting a good lawyer and a prenup is probably your best chance for landing the hot chick
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 why would I take dating tips when in a relationship? Throughout my years of dating I have taken advice from both genders. Its not the end of the world to take advice from women. Some of them do give good advice. It doesn't make you less of a man to ask them for help. Pyro, What your saying is correct, but you should be mindful of what advice you get and from who. In my experience women generally are good at giving advice for dates, and very specific issues. Big picture relationship stuff men tend to give good advice for. Thats just my experience.
Pyro Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Pyro, What your saying is correct, but you should be mindful of what advice you get and from who. In my experience women generally are good at giving advice for dates, and very specific issues. Big picture relationship stuff men tend to give good advice for. Thats just my experience. In my opinion, which alot of it stems from advice that I have gotten over the years on here is that either gender is capable of giving excellent advice and not so excellent advice, but everyones experiences vary. Makes life interesting that way.
zengirl Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 I know Im gonna get flamed for this but I honestly believe money, power, prestige, and looks are all HUGE factors. I mean I'm not saying their dealbreakers but they make dating a lot easier. Let's look at almost every old celebrity. All of their wives are like 20 years younger (Rolling Stones, Bruce Willis, Rod Stewart, John Mellancamp, etc.). Almost all younger men also date beautiful women if the woman is physically attracted to him. Sure gold-digging among the older men group is rampant, but many of these women like the security that comes with money and a steady job. They also like the prestige of being able to date a celebrity or someone with a specialized skill (i.e. surgeon). The whole confidence thing is WAY overrated. I know lots of really great, pretty successful, well-kept middle aged guys (my dad's friends) and none of them are dating/married to supermodels. All of his single friends have pretty bad dating lives to tell you the truth. I hate to tell you, but if your young enough, finding a way to get rich, getting a good lawyer and a prenup is probably your best chance for landing the hot chick How many of those relationships seem happy? Big, messy divorces are also rampant. I think one should decide on what they're looking for. The hottest girl even if she's mean and crazy? Or only likes you for your success and will leave you if/when you fail? Of course, the advice there would be: Have plastic surgery to become as beautiful as you can be, earn loads of money, have tons of success, and get famous. Pyro, What your saying is correct, but you should be mindful of what advice you get and from who. In my experience women generally are good at giving advice for dates, and very specific issues. Big picture relationship stuff men tend to give good advice for. Thats just my experience. I think it's fine if that's your personal experience, but I wonder how much of that experience is colored by your own thoughts---you may tend to trust men, as people of your own gender, more with the big picture stuff, thus it's seemed like better advice to you, or you may have been closer to the men who've given you advice that panned out, etc. I find it interesting that you've broken it down like that, as most of the men I know generally refuse (Not like an "I refuse!" but just don't know what to say) to give big picture relationship advice, really, as they do much better with specific problems in general. They're naturally apt to problem solve something tangible. . . but anything abstract, and they just go all "????" That's just my male friends, though. And I don't know if it's a same-gender thing and they're better at dealing with abstractions together, though I have trouble picturing them sitting around talking about their abstract feelings towards dating. Not that I've discounted their advice on big picture stuff when they've given it, but it seems to stump them more. Then again, maybe abstractions just stump most people more!
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 quality. quantity is good for practice and to learn from mistakes. perhaps asking women for advice will help gain the quality ones. I'm good at keeping them around. It's just I seem to go for the bad ones. I should probably read that book about why guys prefer bitchy women. I think it's fine if that's your personal experience, but I wonder how much of that experience is colored by your own thoughts---you may tend to trust men, as people of your own gender, more with the big picture stuff, thus it's seemed like better advice to you, or you may have been closer to the men who've given you advice that panned out, etc. I find it interesting that you've broken it down like that, as most of the men I know generally refuse (Not like an "I refuse!" but just don't know what to say) to give big picture relationship advice, really, as they do much better with specific problems in general. They're naturally apt to problem solve something tangible. . . but anything abstract, and they just go all "????" That's just my male friends, though. And I don't know if it's a same-gender thing and they're better at dealing with abstractions together, though I have trouble picturing them sitting around talking about their abstract feelings towards dating. Not that I've discounted their advice on big picture stuff when they've given it, but it seems to stump them more. Then again, maybe abstractions just stump most people more! Many of my guy friends are in long term relationships. They are very good at driving overall strategy, but I think women are much better at situational advice. I suppose a good example would be when I want to know when would be a good point in the relationship to ask a woman to move in with me... I ask my male friends. When I want to know the best way to ask... I get advice from my female friends. Does that make sense?
Untouchable_Fire Posted August 7, 2010 Posted August 7, 2010 Ah. Well, true enough. And, you know what, I think the people who are super firm about what they like in superficial ways (i.e. I will only date a guy above 6'0'' who plays bass guitar, has a PhD in neuroscience, and has chiseled abs, or whatever. . . it doesn't really matter what the requirements are; just their specificity) is a little bit weird, as is anyone who'll date just anyone. Though not entirely pointless. The thing to do with advice (only in my opinion, of course) is to get loads of it, consider the sources (really, anything on an anonymous web board should go pretty far towards the bottom of the "reliability of sources" list in my book), think over the ideas, and decide what you think makes sense to you. Talking about things is never pointless, as it allows us to come up with our own ideas. So long as the OP or no one here goes and changes everything they are on the basis of some posts on a message board, I don't see an issue. I think people who are overly picky about certain traits or attributes when dating do that to either make themselves feel deserving, or as a defense mechanism. Like you say the most important thing is to consider the source when getting advice. I've seen some of the best advice I've ever heard come off this message board. There are some specific posters that in my opinion are completely amazing. I don't see them on the Dating section much though.
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