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Wanting answers ... Do I have a right to ask?


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I joined LS a year ago completely distraught in mostly an EA. Advice flowed in to stop then as it only got harder and it only got worse. Many chimed in with doses of truth and honestly my feelings were hurt by true words spoken to me. But I didn’t listen. I thought my A was different, I thought I could handle it. Because although he was honest and sometimes a little mean and indifferent with me he would throw lines and emotions at me to reel me back in and I took that bait so willingly. Anything to feel his love. Or the crumbs that I confused as love. And mostly he’s been not so nice. As the affair progressed to a PA and intermittent break ups and make ups, everything got harder and the fog grew thicker.

 

Every day. Every week it’s good and bad. Happy and sad. All on his terms. His calls/textshave become more frequent. Our intimacy has become more loving. But he still pulls away when things seem too good. And I’m left confused. And then he dives right in again full throttle. And I take it. I take his push pull. I take his mean words. And I take his distant calls and texts and then I run to him when he asks me to. I do anything he asks. he has even asked me for money. And against my better judgement I’ve loaned him the money. And I tell myself how pathetic and ridiculous I am. I know he’s using me. I know it. Why am I allowing this?

 

I left my job to hopefully get away. But he’s only made more effort to see me. But he never gives me false hopes. He is honest that I am only an OW to him. Sometimes he’ll say it’s more than The sex. Sometimes he’ll say he loves me. He always calls. Always text. But sometimes he’ll back off and decrease calls/texts. But never for full days. But in between he’ll also be cruel and talk of other women. And I’m literally hanging on a thread. Fearful today is the last day he’ll call. Fearful he’ll never look and me or hug me like he does sometimes. Fearful that I need him.

 

I’m afraid of who I am emotionally. Why I obsess so much over him. I’ve had to stop IC until my health insurance kicks in. But I’m in a real bad place in this A and I see no way out. I don’t Understand how I got here. I discovered I am a codependent though. And I feel that has a lot to do with my part in the affair.

 

For those that don’t know. I am a MW but we are in a place where we sleep in different beds. We have discussed staying for kids. We both have gone through major life changes. We are dealing with that and the marriage is on the back burner. I know that’s not good. It’s not fair. We are like roommates. I never thought I’d end up here. I’m not proud of myself. I know many will judge me. I’m not looking for pity. But this is what an affair looks like. It’s ugly. It’s hopeless. The highs and lows are endless and the good moments never outweigh the bad

I hope to one day write that I became a better person and left and healed.

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Hi grasshopper,

 

No judgement from me as I have been where you are. I’m sorry that you are struggling so much. It sounds like there is a big part of you that wants to get away and there’s a big part of you that can’t let go. I’ve been there and it’s hard.

 

I think that it will be very hard for you to pull away from him at this point but I really believe that you’ll be able to as you continue to work on yourself. Right now, you’re relying on him for validation and self-worth. You need to be able to find those from within yourself. Because you’ve had to pull back from IC from the time being, is there some other way that you can continue on with this? Podcasts, books, meeting with good friends?

 

I’m glad you’re continuing to post and reach out. That’s a good sign that you want to change and I really that you’ll be able to if you continue to work at it. I thought I’d always be stuck in the same place and making the same choices but I am in a much better place these days.

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That sounds like an absolutely miserable way to live your life.

 

I'm sorry. I hope you get some good counselling and you find your way out of both the affair, and your marriage.

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Yours sounds a lot like mine. In my opinion, this is not just what an affair looks like but also what an abusive relationship looks like. The thing about abusers is that they are not always hurtful. They can be kind and loving too, and it’s this that keeps you hooked. But those who are not codependent won’t keep hanging on after the fiirst sign of hurtful behavior.

 

Mine talked about other women too. It’s a manipulation tactic. He told me he could get with any of his wife’s friends if he wanted to. Even then, I thought he must think I’m really stupid if I believed they wouldn’t immediately go tell his wife.

 

I’ve come to believe that what MM was doing to me was a form of bullying. It was like the jock in high school who goes after the shy girl in secret because he can and because it makes him feel powerful. MM actually told me he had someone like this when he was young. He told me I was like her.

 

You have the right to say no. You don’t even have to explain. I know you’re in a difficult spot because you don’t seem to have much support outside of the crumbs you get from MM. But try to get the support where you can, from friends, maybe family, here, anyone you trust and can confide in. And you also have yourself. When you leave him you will begin to realize your own strength and power, and that you can rely on yourself to be your own protector.

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Yours sounds a lot like mine. In my opinion, this is not just what an affair looks like but also what an abusive relationship looks like.

 

This makes the whole situation even more heartbreaking. The husband is also an alcoholic, which means grasshopper is currently in two different, abusive relationships.

 

Peace will only be found when you are able to leave both of these relationships. I am concerned for your children, who are being raised in a home with a very unhappy mother and an alcoholic father.

 

As I said earlier, I do hope that you get the help that you need OP.

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  • 2 weeks later...
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I want answers but I’m fighting asking them. For fear of the truth. For fear of lies. For fear that it will push him away and make him angry. For fear of looking weak and vulnerable. I just want to know what has changed. Why contact has decreased. Why content of conversation has changed. I want MM to say “I’ve tired of you” or something instead of leaving me in limbo. Leaving me wondering what’s next. Will he discard me? Ghost me? Has he found someone new?

 

Do I even deserve answers? NO.

I’ve always told him I know my boundaries. I know I’m just an OW. I know I do not have any rights in this. But he had rights to ask me for money. And rights to demand my time on his terms. Why is it that I’m the one who has to keep quiet and renain drama free and not bring up stuff to not upset him.

 

Is there a moment,a time frame where I should feel it’s ok to ask.

Do I ask? Where I stand? Do I sit idly by and wait?

 

How do I keep my sanity through this? Because some moments I feel like I can’t get through the day without him. Surely people break up and lose people they “love” all the time. How does one cope and not contact and not make themselves look weak and vulnerable.

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Frankly I don't understand all of this talk about who has rights and who doesn't. Sounds like YOU decided that he has all the rights while you have none.

 

People have the right to ask whatever they want, but they may not get the answer they want. He has the right to ask you for money but you also have the right to decline that request. You have the right to ask him questions but he has the right to answer your questions however he sees fit.

 

Yes people lose people they love all the time. Either through parting ways or through death. It's never painless but it's a part of life. There is never going to be a when ending this is not going to feel painful. Endings hurt but you have to face the pain and get through it.

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You have allowed him to get by with whatever he wants and you've put yourself in the box of having to be easy going and no drama.

 

I say **** that. Contact him if you want to contact him, say what you want to say. If it drives him further away so be it.

 

You have to reach the point where you just aren't willing to be treated this way and be willing to see it end if he doesn't want to give you more than the scraps he's been tossing you.

 

It's about loving yourself and wanting and demanding more from YOURSELF.

 

It's very painful and very difficult. But if you just keep going with the flow you'll keep getting exactly what you've been getting, or even less.

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Bittersweetie

Grasshopper...you may remember my story. My xAP ghosted me not once but twice. And even now, almost a decade later, I don't know why for either. I remember at one point thinking, what could he actually say that would make me feel better? And the answer, for me, ended up being nothing really. I finally let all the questions go because it just wasn't a positive outlet for my energy.

 

Also, I agree with anika a bit, in that it seems you have placed all your power in AP's hands. Like his answers will either complete you or allow you to move on or guide your next steps. But here's the thing: your power, your healing, comes from YOU. Your direction, comes from YOU.

 

I know it is hard to accept that answers may never come. I've been there. I stewed for 15+ years wondering why my friend hurt me so badly. But all that time I wasted was time I could've been investing in other friendships. Time I could've invested in myself, as I never fully healed and moved on.

 

I realize you have a lot going on, and that it's hard to face things sometimes. Please try to focus and use your mental energy on YOU. Steps you can take to get your power back. What you can do to make positive changes in your life. Finding my way is right, love and demand more of yourself. It's kind of like a train...if you can get the engine moving in the right direction, then the rest of the train will follow.

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Why am I allowing this?

 

This is the same question I ask myself when you post... I don't have the answer. Only you have the answer.

 

Do I even deserve answers? NO.

I know I do not have any rights in this. But he had rights to ask me for money. And rights to demand my time on his terms. Why is it that I’m the one who has to keep quiet and remain drama free and not bring up stuff to not upset him.

 

Of course, you have rights. Healthy relationships are equal partnerships. The fact that you feel like he has all the rights in this relationship and you have none, tells you that this relationship is unbalanced and unhealthy. He does not have the right to ask you for money. Absolutely not!

 

If you remain quiet and drama free - that is your choice. It is your choice to give up your rights and let him walk all over you... As such, I would say that you have no boundaries. You are a codependent, people pleaser, to the point of putting your own well being at risk. The thing you lack right now more than anything - self protection. And, that's frightening...

 

I hope to one day write that I became a better person and left and healed.

 

I hope so too. This is so unhealthy for you, and for your children. It is unhealthy for your children to be raised in a dysfunctional family, with a father who is an alcoholic. If you don't believe us, your children will tell you this one day... Perhaps, you will hear it and understand it more then.

Edited by BaileyB
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You’re in a one-down position where you have no rights and no commitment. This “relationship” is a dead end. Hopefully you’ll open your eyes to that fact before you waste any more years of your life.

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I mean, I'm sure you know that this relationship has built-in limits, even if your spouse was to magically disappear never to return. Because there can never be mutual trust and respect due to the cheating on the spouse, so this relationship has a very eroded foundation and really can't be anything except broken.

 

I mean, you have to assume he is dating other people and looking for one who he doesn't know cheats on her spouse so he can trust her. I mean, these days everyone knows the saying, If they'll do it to their spouse, they'll do it to you, so there's no way this isn't centermost in his mind.

 

That said, you have the right to ask anything you want, but be prepared for the answer, because I think it's going to be that he can't commit to you.

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NotADayGoesBy

You’ve been given a lot of good advice that I hope you’ll consider. You obviously know this isn’t healthy for you and have given it a lot of thought.

 

I completely understand the addiction aspect, so I see why it’s hard to end it. But my question is: if you both were free, would you really want him? He sounds pretty awful from how you described him. If the answer is no, then maybe what you really need is help breaking the addiction so you can have more time and energy to address the other problems in your life.

 

I’ve read of betrayed spouses “blowing up” an affair. What if you did that to yourself suicide bomber style? Blow the hell out of it—tell H, the other spouse and then there is no turning back. You will have gotten him out of your life for good. Crazy I know, but give it a thought. At the very least, go at your OM with all our questions in the same spirit. Don’t back down; be unrepentant. I wonder how he react if you were all business and not to be pushed around? Although I agree with a PP who said you never get answers or closure. Even if you do, you only feel good for a day or so. Then new questions and “why’s” creep in and you’re back where you started. I speak from experience. There is no happy ending and “closure “ is a myth. It’s like getting fired; you’ll never feel good about it.

 

I’m sorry things are so difficult for you right now.

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Why is it that I’m the one who has to keep quiet and renain drama free and not bring up stuff to not upset him.

 

Because you want/need him more than he wants/needs you. The one who cares the least has the most power in a relationship.

 

There is one way to reclaim your power. You know what it is.

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Grasshopper, you know that we have a lot in common, both being in unsatisfying marriages, both having an affair with a mm who is very upfront about having no intention of leaving his marriage (or in my case, even having a self-described good marriage and sex life), both enduring the endless cycle, or ferris wheel, of more contact followed by less contact, both having our moods and entire sense of well-being contingent on the level and the nature of the contact.

 

Obviously, the answer is to get off the ferris wheel. But, given that I don't think that's happening for either you or I at this point, here is a different way of looking at things to change your perspective.

 

You (and I) are nothing more than fun and games to him when he is bored. Describing the periods of lesser contact as him "pulling back emotionally" is giving him too much credit, and the situation too much meaning. He is not in contact because he is busy with his wife, his children, friends, hobbies, watching football, chores, basically his real life. You are on the backburner, without so much as him giving it a second thought. Then, when he is bored again, you will hear from him. At least in my case, it really is that simple.

 

So, are we fools for putting up with this. Absolutely! But at least take it for what it is so you don't drive yourself completely insane wondering what you have done wrong. Part of the reason we don't call them out on this is that we have no ability or leverage to change it, as this is basically what we signed up for in the beginning, thinking we could handle it when clearly we can't, or hoping it either was or will be something it never has been or will be .

 

So, unless we can take it for what it is without going literally insane, we really do need to get off the ride.

Edited by Aloha123
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Also, I should add, I do think you are correct that they run in the other direction when they start to feel smothered or start to catch on to how attached we are to them. So that is another reason we try to stay "low maintenance". Because we know that if we start to appear needy, not only will our needs not be met, but it will drive them further away and make things worse.

Ironically, the best thing we could do to actually end things is to become higher maintenance and express our dissatisfaction, because that really might send them packing for good.

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I'm in a similar place - it's been so low contact that it's almost irritating, when I've gotten to a point of being past him something pops up on my phone. Obviously the clear thing to do is end it (again) I just have to be in a place to block when I do. Ending it is easy; meaning it, really meaning it (as in, no thinking you can just do a friendly, distant response when he drops by again) is the hard part.

 

Everything Aloha says is pretty accurate. I had a wine that reminded me of MM once; I think it was called 'convenient distraction.' End of day, we are convenient distractions when other amusements have exhausted themselves. That may not always be the case, but in your and my situation (where contacted has dwindled to LC, has dwindled to almost nothing) it's not enough to sustain any sort of real relationship.

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Thank you all for your replies. I read them for support because surely I don’t share this shameful part of my life with my closest friends or confidants. And somehow this shameful part of my life seems to be everything to me. It’s as if I’m living a fraudulent life. From my own self searching i realized that I likely found a distraction and an escape in this person from the real unhappiness within me, that I’m not prepared to face. And I have to fix that real quick because I’m only making things worse for myself.

 

I re read what I write on these threads and I think of how I would perceive reading someone’s similar post. Surely I would empathize because I’ve been there but there’s also a point where I’d think “pull up your big girl pants (no pun intended :) ) and walk away”. I know I should be in control of my own life and my own emotions. I think I’ve given him control because then I can blame him for how wrong things are in my life versus me trying to fix my own mess.

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You have the right to ask anybody any question you want.

 

 

The thing you have to consider is you may not like the answer you receive (if you're not ghosted). So ask yourself if you're strong enough and then ask your question. It might just give you the power boost you need to move on.

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Bittersweetie
I think I’ve given him control because then I can blame him for how wrong things are in my life versus me trying to fix my own mess.

 

Grasshopper, this is a really valuable insight. It is so much easier to deflect things than take responsibility for our own actions. It can be terrifying and also not good for the self-esteem (who really wants to admit they are a bad person?). But as someone who walked through that dark tunnel, it is worth it. I am healthier and more authentic now. I am stronger. I'm not going to say it's "easier" to deal with things now, but I do feel the muscles I built after the affair and d-day help me cope better. I used to be the person when something bad happened thought "now everything sucks." Now I'm like, "well THAT sucks." It's an improvement...I guess? :D

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It’s great to get opinions here but your friends are people you should be able to talk to. Wouldn’t they feel bad if they knew you were hurting and kept this from them? If they’re really your friends, they would be there for you - whether they approve of what you’re doing or not.

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It’s great to get opinions here but your friends are people you should be able to talk to. Wouldn’t they feel bad if they knew you were hurting and kept this from them? If they’re really your friends, they would be there for you - whether they approve of what you’re doing or not.

 

This ^ exactly.

 

You would probably be surprised at some of the secrets your friends have. Some of the closest bonding experiences I've had with friends is sharing our deep dark "shame".

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When we came out of NC into LC, I asked one question. I didn't bury it in other words. I asked him if he was reconciling with BW. He answered "That's not possible." I wasn't sure if that meant from MM or BW point of view, so I reworded the question. I asked "Do YOU want to reconcile?"

 

Think of the one question you want the answer to and really think about the wording that forces him to answer it honestly.

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OP.

this is your life, and no one is going to look out for you but you. You have every right to ask whatever questions you need to, but before you go through that exercise, I would advise you to really consider whether or not you could trust him to give you honest answers? Will he just give answers designed to maintain the image he has of himself? If so, they may do you more harm than good and may not be helpful in any way at all.

 

 

Have you considered turning inwards for the answers you need? In the end, you may well find you can trust him to be truthful anyway, and you'll have to find your answers on your own. In the end, that's likely for the best anyway.

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