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xOW - an update I guess


The Other Man / Woman The other side of the story: Support and discussion for those who find themselves involved with a committed partner.

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Old 22nd December 2017, 11:30 AM   #1
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xOW - an update I guess

Me again. I've been debating whether or not to post a new thread because I am worried I'll get a lot of unsympathetic responses.

I think I'm posting because I don't want to talk to xMM - not sure it's all that healthy. Equally don't want to talk to my friends and family because I care about what they think of me.

Anyway, my A has limped on and off for the last 6 months or so. Mainly I've called things off (99% of the time actually) for a whole host of reasons. After periods of NC (instigated by me always) a way back has materialised and I've got back into the A.


About a month ago we met to say "goodbye". We cried and we talked and we seemed to part knowing it was over and feeling heartbroken but resolved. However, after this meeting we had a minor scare - my xMM panicked that I might be pregnant with his child (I wasn't and wasn't panicked but he got into a tailspin) and had to face the reality of possibly and imminently coming clean and losing everything (he said he'd have to tell his W because he'd want to be involved in our non-existent child's life).

After the danger had passed (thankfully no pregnancy) he asked to meet "just to talk" and suggested we go for counselling to try and find a way back to being friends and not hating each other. I didn't hate him but I was really fed up of feeling hurt all the time (yes, partly my fault).

I said meeting wasn't a good idea - it would be too tempting for both just to fall back into the A because we're both addicted to it and to the comfort it very fleetingly provides when we're together.

Unfortunately my resolve waivered. He came to see me perform (I'm in a large group) and then invariably we ended up right where we started. He shouldn't have come (he wasn't going to) and I shouldn't have run straight back into his arms like an addict.

The days that followed were truly horrible (and I deserve to feel horrible I know that). I felt undone again and raw. He was still resolved to 'do the right thing' and that he couldn't bear the anxiety and panic that came with the A. He said things had changed for him majorly - although he loved and missed me the fear had become too great and he was too scared to continue. At which point I should rejoice and be glad he's freed me - and I am but his track record is he comes back. Maybe this is different? Time will only tell.

I understand, from reading many ex-MM's posts on here - mainly my great and treasured source of reality-doses - Mr Jenkins (a stranger in life but a friend on here), that at some stage the fear and anxiety of potentially losing it all becomes too much for the MM and they choose their family and end the A.

There has been no D-Day here but he has confided in his best-friend (that would have been really hard as he likes to be seen as a really great family man) and he's also had the fright of a possible D-Day (in his mind at least).

My xMM has told me he's staying for many reasons - children (first and foremost), maintaining his family unit (which includes his W), his extended family, his status, his worry his family wouldn't accept me, his worry our relationship is just a stressful as his M so why swap one difficult situation for another difficult one, his status as a 'good guy', etc and his fear of starting over again / the unknown (i.e. life with me). He said "his fear paralyses his love" for me. Fear of losing his life as he knows it and fear of the unknown.

I asked him if he still loves his wife and he said "I think so. Not as much as you but maybe I will in time. But who knows".

I think this is honest. He doesn't know how he feels about her as a romantic partner but he does see her as a member of his immediate family and he can't and won't turn his back on her without giving it more time. Plus he has two children and he has said over and over about not ever wanting to be a part-time dad.

He said he tried to talk to his W about not being happy / problems with their M but she wasn't receptive. He said she's never been a person to talk about her problems or have difficult conversations. He said he might try again but for him it's just about surviving now rather than trying to save his M. He just wants to work with her as a unit for their children.

I can't fault him for this - after all this is the right thing to do.

It's also the right thing for me - that this A end and that I move on.

I just wonder if / when he'll come back. We said some awful things to each other during the 'panic time' and vowed never to go near each other again and even after that awful period, we ended up together again.

As a result he's said to me "I can't say unequivocally it won't happen again because it happened after all we said and after the intense fear I feel about being discovered...I just feel I should do the right thing but I still want you. I just feel I can be different this time".

I've said to him in reply that it's over for me irregardless. I can't allow him to pick me up and put me down again. I can hear myself say these words but then I feel a longing for him and I miss him. Crazy because I don't miss the feeling of being a mistress and all that comes with it.

Jenkins said once that he told his xOW that he was staying for his kids (or played that card up) to minimise her pain. My xMM hasn't really done that - he's told me all of the reasons he stays. He said if I ever chose to tell his W that would be a consequence of his actions. So I think he's been honest - he hasn't said "I just stay for the kids" but he's also said "I don't know how I feel about my W but I need to try harder".

I guess it's irrelevant why he stays because he is and he never has once told me otherwise. I think I'm just posing these questions here because I don't want to speak to him about it and I feel alone.

I want this affair to end - because it was making me ill. I feel rejected by him but that's false pride.

He said to me "I love you, I really do but I love my family life more. I know I am in love with you and I think I am in love with my wife. But I'm not sure. I'm not even thinking about that aspect - all I'm thinking about is getting over you and focussing on my kids".

That's all I suppose I need to know but I guess just typing it all out helps with the acceptance that it's over and that is probably a good thing.

It's over. As it should be. I know that. I'm not a terrible person - I've done a terrible thing falling for the flattery of a married man but I wouldn't wilfully destroy lives, especially after being told 'you're just simply not enough'. I should never have gone near him and I should be thankful that it's over with just me and him hurting and I am.

Thanks for reading - go easy. I'm pretty fragile right now.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 11:49 AM   #2
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Hi Serendipity, nice to hear from you again. I was hoping that you would come back and say that you finally kicked this man to the curb.

He can only come back if you let him come back. The choice is yours, you have all the control.

He really is the worst kind of MM. He comes and goes, gives you hope and then takes it away... why you have allowed him in your life for so long, I will never understand.

I hope that you find the strength to finally walk away and put this chapter of your life behind you...
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Old 22nd December 2017, 12:01 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by Serendipity55 View Post
I just wonder if / when he'll come back.
All great stuff apart from this ^^^
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Old 22nd December 2017, 12:07 PM   #4
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All great stuff apart from this ^^^
Which is why I say, he can only come back if she let's him come back. It is your decision serendipity, if this pain and uncertainty continues. Your decision alone.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 12:10 PM   #5
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I want this affair to end - because it was making me ill. I feel rejected by him but that's false pride.
It's obvious you two have no will power so NC has to happen. Make it impossible for him to contact you, change your number if need be. Block him on all social media and remember, NC is for you to grieve and heal. It isn't about him, it's about you. No friendship, even causal can happen, it won't ever work.

Get counseling asap so you can gain strength and grieve this loss in a healthy way.

Be strong, don't be afraid of the pain that you'll feel. It's final, not continuous like what you've been feeling throughout your A.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 12:13 PM   #6
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Hi Serendipity, nice to hear from you again. I was hoping that you would come back and say that you finally kicked this man to the curb.

He can only come back if you let him come back. The choice is yours, you have all the control.

He really is the worst kind of MM. He comes and goes, gives you hope and then takes it away... why you have allowed him in your life for so long, I will never understand.

I hope that you find the strength to finally walk away and put this chapter of your life behind you...
He isn't mean or malicious, he's selfish and sure maybe he is a 'nice good guy' but his behavior towards all in life (wife, kids, family, extended family) is a big fat LIE. He LIES to them all every single day. He may be 'honest' with you on some level but he truly is a gifted and skilled liar. His wife, kids, family - All important to him but he still wants you on the side...on his terms as long as he doesn't have to give anything up. It's good this A is over.

Everybody here agrees, you have the power. Who cares if he tries to come back! If you want him GONE from your life then don't let him back in.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 12:23 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Serendipity55 View Post
Me again. I've been debating whether or not to post a new thread because I am worried I'll get a lot of unsympathetic responses.
Oh please. Don't be silly. There is nothing more therapeutic than having all the lovely ladies on here pass judgement on you, jump on you and attack you and crucify you all at the same time.

Quote:
I asked him if he still loves his wife and he said "I think so. Not as much as you but maybe I will in time. But who knows".
of course he loves you. and he also loves his wife. and his family. thats why he isn't leaving them for you. if you want him you -- then i guess you have to put an ultimatum down and stick to it. do you really want him to leave his family? he's going to be a mental mess for a very long time. you will have to deal with it and him. do you love him back enough to want to do that?


Quote:
I think this is honest. He doesn't know how he feels about her as a romantic partner but he does see her as a member of his immediate family and he can't and won't turn his back on her without giving it more time. Plus he has two children and he has said over and over about not ever wanting to be a part-time dad.
Quote:
I just wonder if / when he'll come back. We said some awful things to each other during the 'panic time' and vowed never to go near each other again and even after that awful period, we ended up together again.
Quote:
I guess it's irrelevant why he stays because he is and he never has once told me otherwise. I think I'm just posing these questions here because I don't want to speak to him about it and I feel alone.

I want this affair to end - because it was making me ill. I feel rejected by him but that's false pride.

He said to me "I love you, I really do but I love my family life more. I know I am in love with you and I think I am in love with my wife. But I'm not sure. I'm not even thinking about that aspect - all I'm thinking about is getting over you and focussing on my kids".
It all sounds to me that you are in a major affair with a MM. Its not just physical and humping each other because you have nothing better to do with your time. You two are in a major emotional affair as well.

This guy has a family and kids he can go home to and find love and fall back on at anytime he needs to or choses to. You don't, do you? This affair is too intense for you and its screwing you up mentally and internally. You are getting the **** end of the stick here.

Sorry if this is coming across a too blunt and rude -- but perhaps you need a reality check. You need to decide what you want of and out of your love life. Odd's are this affair will just keep on coming and going until either he gets caught or you find another person to fall in love with who isn't attached and married.

Last edited by jjgitties; 22nd December 2017 at 12:26 PM..
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Old 22nd December 2017, 12:54 PM   #8
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He isn't mean or malicious, he's selfish and sure maybe he is a 'nice good guy' but his behavior towards all in life (wife, kids, family, extended family) is a big fat LIE.
Well, if memory serves... Serendipity's husband passed away very young and very tragically, leaving her with an infant daughter to raise. In her grief, this "acquaintance" or family friend stepped into her life and he has done nothing but come and go from her life, giving her false hope by telling her that he loves her more than his wife while insisting (for the most part) that he will never leave his wife and children. And, every time she tried to pull back or end the relationship, he gaslights her and eventually finds a way to get back into her life. Just as his suggestion that they attend counselling such that they can continue to be in each others life as friends is a selfish thing to do, maintaining the tie and preventing Serendipity from moving on with her life.

Perhaps he didn't intend to be mean and malicious, but his actions have been exactly that.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 12:57 PM   #9
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Well, if memory serves... Serendipity's husband passed away very young and very tragically, leaving her with an infant daughter to raise. In her grief, this "acquaintance" or family friend stepped into her life and he has done nothing but come and go from her life, giving her false hope by telling her that he loves her more than his wife while insisting (for the most part) that he will never leave his wife and children. And, every time she tried to pull back or end the relationship, he gaslights her and eventually finds a way to get back into her life. Just as his suggestion that they attend counselling such that they can continue to be in each others life as friends is a selfish thing to do, maintaining the tie and preventing Serendipity from moving on with her life.

Perhaps he didn't intend to be mean and malicious, but his actions have been exactly that.
If this is in fact the case, this guy is evil and bad news. He is preying on a single lonely woman to keep getting sex on the side. OP really needs to get her life in order and find someone who really loves her.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 1:01 PM   #10
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If this is in fact the case, this guy is evil and bad news. He is preying on a single lonely woman to keep getting sex on the side. OP really needs to get her life in order and find someone who really loves her.
Which is why, those of us who have followed her story feel particularly protective of Serendipity... this man has taken advantage of her during a very vulnerable time in her life and there is nothing to respect about that.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 1:06 PM   #11
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If this is in fact the case, this guy is evil and bad news. He is preying on a single lonely woman to keep getting sex on the side. OP really needs to get her life in order and find someone who really loves her.
As all the "judgemental, crucifying and attacking" woman on this forum have been telling her for a long long time....
But never mind we needed a man to point out the obvious...
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Old 22nd December 2017, 1:14 PM   #12
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(((Serendipity)))

Lovely to see you back again (well, not really, because that normally means things have become tough again - but you know what I mean!). I'm honoured that you consider me a friend on here - know that the feeling is mutual and that I have learned a lot and taken great comfort and support from many of your very wise posts.

I'm really sorry things have been tough for you. You are both clearly addicted to each other and there are clearly genuine feelings both ways - just such tragic, impossible circumstances in which they've been allowed to develop. Yes, I think many MM become confused about their feelings for their wife because the feelings they experience in an A just blow them away. But many, including myself, and your MM, realise that it is the very fact that it is an affair - secret, forbidden, new, etc that heightens those feelings even more and that it is very unfair to compare the feelings in a long established marriage to these - and by extension, that it would be a MASSIVE risk to end the marriage and stake everything on a relationship that is largely untested in the real world. This doesn't undermine the feelings developed - they were genuine in my A for both participants, and this is clearly the case for you both too.

Of course, it's torture all round when it comes round to the heartbreaking ordeal of realising it has to end,, and would have been so much better for all of us if we'd managed to avoid the A in the first place, which changes us forever. But humans are humans, and people generally learn the hard way..... In the length of time it takes me to write this post, you can guarantee that several affairs have started somewhere in the world. Affairs that are destined to cause lots of pain, but the participants can't see it yet.

It's likely your MM is completely lost, torn and tortured. I've been there too. The difference is, that when I knew it had to end, I stayed away. Even though I had to often, metaphorically, lock myself in a room and throw away the key...I forced myself day after day after month.... And eventually year. I knew that if I slipped up, I would be causing untold damage directly to my wife, to the OW and myself and indirectly to lots of other people. This is what your MM needs to do for you I think. He needs to have more willpower and do it as an act of love. Even though it may not feel like it at the time, to stay away once a situation has been deemed impossible, is indeed an act of love. I truly hope he finds it in his heart to give you that gift, because there's such an exciting world out there, full of possibilities and promise.... If you could only be freed from your chains.


Oh, and by the way, I did indeed play up the 'kids' angle with the OW. It wasn't a lie - that genuinely was a huge factor. But it's true that were other factors as well, such as love for my wife (I had to believe it was possible to fully love her if I was going to attempt reconciliation) and obviously I didn't overplay that angle as it could have been quite hurtful.

I'll be back to post more soon. Thinking of you and crossing everything for you S. J x

Last edited by jenkins95; 22nd December 2017 at 1:19 PM..
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Old 22nd December 2017, 1:26 PM   #13
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(((Serendipity)))

Lovely to see you back again (well, not really, because that normally means things have become tough again - but you know what I mean!). I'm honoured that you consider me a friend on here - know that the feeling is mutual and that I have learned a lot and taken great comfort and support from many of your very wise posts.

I'm really sorry things have been tough for you. You are both clearly addicted to each other and there are clearly genuine feelings both ways - just such tragic, impossible circumstances in which they've been allowed to develop. Yes, I think many MM become confused about their feelings for their wife because the feelings they experience in an A just blow them away. But many, including myself, and your MM, realise that it is the very fact that it is an affair - secret, forbidden, new, etc that heightens those feelings even more and that it is very unfair to compare the feelings in a long established marriage to these - and by extension, that it would be a MASSIVE risk to end the marriage and stake everything on a relationship that is largely untested in the real world. This doesn't undermine the feelings developed - they were genuine in my A for both participants, and this is clearly the case for you both too.

Of course, it's torture all round, and would have been so much better for all of us if we'd managed to avoid the A in the first place, which changes us forever. But humans are humans, and people generally learn the hard way..... In the length of time it takes me to write this post, you can guarantee that several affairs have started somewhere in the world. Affairs that are destined to cause lots of pain, but the participants can't see it yet.

It's likely your MM is completely lost, torn and tortured. I've been there too. The difference is, that when I knew it had to end, I stayed away. Even though I had to often, metaphorically, lock myself in a room and throw away the key...I forced myself day after day after month.... And eventually year. I knew that if I slipped up, I would be causing untold damage directly to my wife, to the OW and myself and indirectly to lots of other people. This is what your MM needs to do for you I think. He needs to have more willpower and do it as an act of love. Even though it may not feel like it at the time, to stay away once a situation has been deemed impossible, is indeed an act of love. I truly hope he finds it in his heart to give you that gift, because there's such an exciting world out there, full of possibilities and promise.... If you could only be freed from your chains.

I'll be back to post more soon. Thinking of you and crossing everything for you S. J x
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Old 22nd December 2017, 1:27 PM   #14
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He will be back. Xmas is a very busy time for families so he is putting you away in your box for a while so that he can enjoy the holidays with his wife and children and extended family. He is taking a break from you so he can have a fun Christmas without feeling guilty. Once it's around mid January and life is back to normal he'll come looking for his fun on the side again. This will only end when you end it.

I see you are still pestering him for answers regarding his feelings for his wife. You still desperately want to hear and believe that he loves you more or that he doesn't love his wife. It's been a theme in all of your threads. Stop viewing this as some sort of competition between you and his wife. Love from your MM is no prize based on the way he treats those he claims to love.

It's all looks pretty straight forward to me from reading your threads. Your MM has only been married for about 18 months. He had a baby with his wife already when he married her and then they had another baby just this past summer. Your MM told you that before you came along his wife was the love of his life. But marriage and pregnancy and multiple children bring stress. It's not sexy and romantic. It's all work and responsibility. So the MM loves his wife and children but then you came into the picture and started giving him little mini vacations from his responsibiliies.

With a toddler and a baby his wife is too busy to give him the time and attention he thinks he's entitled to. So he has romance with you and he likes that but deep down he knows that an affair is different than a real relationship with responsibilities and obligations. His romantic feelings are probably stronger with you than with his wife but his wife is his family and family ties run deep. Romance, lust and sex are all really fun feelings but they are also volatile and unstable. Marriages can have lust and romance too but not all the time and certainly not when one spouse is stepping outside of the marriage and giving those things to an outsider.

Your MM is not confused. He does have feelings of romance and lust for you and to him that is a type of love that he enjoys. It's different than family love. Romantic and sexual love is more about getting and family love is more about giving. ideally a marriage should include both but romance and lust usually ebbs and flows in a marriage. It often gets ignored for awhile when babies and small children come into the picture. A person of integrity would not step outside of their marriage when this happens but cheaters are selfish. Your MM knows his affair with you is selfish and will never turn into anything more but he wants it anyways because he is selfish and self entitled.
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Old 22nd December 2017, 1:32 PM   #15
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I think the difference being is that I do not think a Dday has occurred.
He has not had to face real consequences or choice.

He has continued on unabashed.
I guess, with the intention of keeping all the balls in the air.
Even now he is not actually closing things off for good, he is still proclaming love and that will always engender hope.
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