Grieving?

[tft]

Hi

 

Its beena while since I posted regards my situation with ExM (now SM). He now been out the marital home for 14months, since my last post (where I was unsure whether to keep it going due to his emotional instability whilst he was grieving the loss of his M) I ended our R for a month, he had time to decide what he wanted, and came back to me much healther. We have since had a lovely holiday, he's moved into a place where he has his half of the furniture and I've met his family. All moves in the right direction (actions vs words)

 

However, since he moved from his rented flat to his new place, he's started grieving again. Last time this happened (last summer my old posts have the details) I went into his email and was horrified to read that he had, basically, been going back and forth between the two of us. What I read really knocked me for 6-I had no idea he was so emaotionally torn. It devestated me as he'd kept it quiet (and carried on seeing me whilst professing to his W that he missed her, loved her etc) I know to some extent these feeling are "normal" (however the way he went about it was iffy to say the least). That was 8 months ago now. I'm just finding it really hard knowing he's a little sad again not to think back to last time and get really worried its happening again? I've talked to him about it and he has been very understanding, saying that its okay to feel sad but its not a problem for US, he's right where he wants to be.

 

I know he's still grieving but its so hard to be around it and know about it after the way he behaved behind my back 8 months ago. I have no reason (other than history) to suspect anything is going on, he's much more open about things now.

 

I guess I just wanted to know if you have any suggestions on how to deal with this? On how to allow him to grive but be supportive too? If anyone has gone through the same thing how did you cope??Sorry if I come across as rambling.

 

Thanks as ever

 

tft xxx

[Athena]

Does he know you read his emails and understand exactly what he was writing to his w about loving her and missing her while he continued his A with you?

[tft]

Oh absolutely he does. One of the reasons I broke it off in November.

 

I know I'm probably over reacting (very hormonal at the moment) but knowing he's feeling down about it just reminds me of how I felt in November when it all came to light, it was awful. Can he be sad that his old relationship is over and be happy in his new one at the same time? Argh.

[fooled once]

I will never understand any adult giving their email password to their OW, their SO or their spouse.

 

What happened to a person being allowed to have privacy?

 

And he knows you snoop and is okay with it? Did you tell him you snooped recently?

[tft]

The one, and only, time I've snooped was 8 months ago. I new something was up by the way he was acting. I asked repeatedly if something was up to which he denied. But I knew. Seeing his email confirmed it. This time he's told me he's feeling down. I guess I'm just looking for advice on how to keep a level head through it.

[Ms. Red]

And he knows you snoop and is okay with it? Did you tell him you snooped recently?

 

How the hell is that snooping when he gave her access?

[Mino]

who cares if she was snooping.... I can understand, I was going through the same. My sm has not been out as long as yours. I expected that after he got his own place, things would be "normal.. But he started getting depressed about his child. it was really bad at the begining. He withdrew emotionally. We had many talks were I said "just go home" He said he didnt want to, that he wanted to be with me, not w. But he was hurting for missing the child so much. Its hard to sit with someone who you know is in pain. I kinda go with the flow. He has good days and then not so good days. The good days are out numbering the bad these days. But when I feel he is hurting there is really nothing I can do but let him deal with it on his own. Its a process that they had to work through. I understand you completely, I do...That is why our ic told me to leave him when he got his own place. He suggested 6 months to a year. I thought it was impossible to do this, but there are days now where I understand why he recomended this. Good luck, keep yourself busy, I am sure he will get through this , it just takes time.. Are there children involved?

[tft]

Thank you mino. You are right about high and low days, this low was the first for over 6 months! It's just so hard to see him sad. No, there are no children which hasmade it easier than it could've been. How long has it been since your sm left? Did you give him an extended period on his own?

[fooled once]

Yep, snooping.

 

Does he know you have been reading his emails NOW? He may have given her his password at one time; but that doesn't mean he meant for her to go in and snoop. Maybe he trusted her to NOT snoop. I bet if he knew she was reading his emails NOW, he would change the password.

 

Everyone grieves in their own time frame. You can't put a schedule on it.

 

Sounds like he really is regretting ending his marrriage.

 

ETA: I just re-read your original post. So you haven't snooped lately?

 

Maybe he is really just having a hard time realizing the end of his marriage? Maybe he really ISN'T ready for a new Relationship.

 

You stated he took 1 month to "heal himself" and come back to you healthier. That really isn't long enough. Some people mourn the demise of their marriage for years.

 

Are you POSITIVE he isn't seeing/talking to his wife?

[tft]

No fooled, I have not snooped recently. And, for clarity, I ended our relationship 9 months in, which was 2 months or so after I saw the emails. He had a month to explore how he felt which he decided was enough time and came back to me. I told him to go back to her. She had, in fact, been trying to get him back for some time before.

 

I'm pretty sure he doesn't regret us being here. When he says he's sad, it more material based fir example his house, which is under offer he spent a lot of time doing up. He also feels bad about having a failed marriage. He does speak to her on the phone, about offers on said house.

 

I've never tried to put a timeline in his grief, I'm looking for ways and suggestions to keep my head straight during his down days.

 

Thank you for taking time to post.

[Mino]

tft, I would suggested just leaving him alone when he is down. When my guy is in his "mood" I pick up my purse and leave.... I go and do my own thing, whether its sitting at home on the internet, shopping, seeing friends. He is fine the next day. These episodes come and go, and I see that with time, they get less and less. These are his issues, not yours. remove yourself ast once if you see it coming...

[NoIDidn't]

Can he be sad that his old relationship is over and be happy in his new one at the same time? Argh.

 

Yes. Considering how he got to be in his new relationship.

 

This is why its recommended not to jump right into one relationship from another. Because you don't take the time to really close out the old relationship. And you, the new relationship, are made insecure because he still has feelings about the person from the old relationship.

 

Maybe you need to take a break from being in a relationship with a separated man? Not break it off entirely, but give you both space and time to deal with what is. Trying to be in his face to ascertain his feelings every day isn't going to help any.

[Mino]

Yes. Considering how he got to be in his new relationship.

 

This is why its recommended not to jump right into one relationship from another. Because you don't take the time to really close out the old relationship. And you, the new relationship, are made insecure because he still has feelings about the person from the old relationship.

 

Maybe you need to take a break from being in a relationship with a separated man? Not break it off entirely, but give you both space and time to deal with what is. Trying to be in his face to ascertain his feelings every day isn't going to help any.

That is really difficult to do. Since an A started long before mm seperation. I mean how is that supposed to work? You with someone for years, and then he finally moves on his own, are you just supposed to say "see ya in 6 months to a year'? How do you walk away after all that they have been through? It makes sense, to give the space they need, but reality is you do have a relationship with this person and turning ones back while they are in distress, just does not sound right....catch 22 , I guess

[NoIDidn't]

That is really difficult to do. Since an A started long before mm seperation. I mean how is that supposed to work? You with someone for years, and then he finally moves on his own, are you just supposed to say "see ya in 6 months to a year'? How do you walk away after all that they have been through? It makes sense, to give the space they need, but reality is you do have a relationship with this person and turning ones back while they are in distress, just does not sound right....catch 22 , I guess

 

Nope, not what I am suggesting.

 

I didn't read your response, but an extended version of that would work just fine. I never said "6 months to a year". Sometimes you just need a day to a week, here and there to give him space and practically permission to grieve his marriage. You can fight it, or you can accept it. But its going to happen no matter what.

 

I wouldn't call it turning ones back, either. It has to be done. He has to think some thoughts that you might not be emotionally able to hear. He may grieve real love for the ex. Some people can't bear to think that he actually loved her even though he actively cheated on her. It has to be done. Doesn't mean he'll go running back. You gotta trust him to be doing the hard emotional work of grieving what was, if you want him to ever look forward with a clear mind of what can be.

 

You dealt with time apart during the affair, I don't see how dealing with it now would be such a threat to the relationship if one is to grow afterwards.

[fooled once]

I agree --- he hasn't really had time to mourn the old life (house, wife, etc) so he really can't be emotionally healthy/ready for a new relationship.

 

Until you have personal happiness, you can't make anyone else happy.

 

That old saying of "until you love yourself, you can't love anyone else" is really a true statement, IMHO.

 

You can't begin to move forward until you truly put the past behind you.

[Mino]

Nope, not what I am suggesting.

 

I didn't read your response, but an extended version of that would work just fine. I never said "6 months to a year". Sometimes you just need a day to a week, here and there to give him space and practically permission to grieve his marriage. You can fight it, or you can accept it. But its going to happen no matter what.

 

I wouldn't call it turning ones back, either. It has to be done. He has to think some thoughts that you might not be emotionally able to hear. He may grieve real love for the ex. Some people can't bear to think that he actually loved her even though he actively cheated on her. It has to be done. Doesn't mean he'll go running back. You gotta trust him to be doing the hard emotional work of grieving what was, if you want him to ever look forward with a clear mind of what can be.

 

You dealt with time apart during the affair, I don't see how dealing with it now would be such a threat to the relationship if one is to grow afterwards.

Thank you for your insight, NoIdidnt, That was very helpful for me. The reason I mentioned 6-12 months is because that is the time frame the ic . Which is what sounds logical. He said to let our r go, and then after that time period we can build a new R on a healthy foundation. Ok, makes sense, right? BUt that was impossible to do on both ends. Hindsight..... that is what I should have insisted!!! Cause I am seeing the ugly side of his ups and downs. Now I just remove myself from the scene. But its far from perfect. I guess what we are running into now, is I keep asking "so whats Next"? Trying to get some pucture of "future" I guess thats the wrong thing to do, cause it causes agruments and his depression to come out. So On my end, I feel like we are in limbo once again. I know he cannot do anything until he has reached his year of S, but its the waiting , waiting waiting, what drives me crazy...And in return drive him crazy... any help with that. ( sorry for thread jumping) but I figured op is in the same boat:eek:

[NoIDidn't]

Thank you for your insight, NoIdidnt, That was very helpful for me. The reason I mentioned 6-12 months is because that is the time frame the ic . Which is what sounds logical. He said to let our r go, and then after that time period we can build a new R on a healthy foundation. Ok, makes sense, right? BUt that was impossible to do on both ends. Hindsight..... that is what I should have insisted!!! Cause I am seeing the ugly side of his ups and downs. Now I just remove myself from the scene. But its far from perfect. I guess what we are running into now, is I keep asking "so whats Next"? Trying to get some pucture of "future" I guess thats the wrong thing to do, cause it causes agruments and his depression to come out. So On my end, I feel like we are in limbo once again. I know he cannot do anything until he has reached his year of S, but its the waiting , waiting waiting, what drives me crazy...And in return drive him crazy... any help with that. ( sorry for thread jumping) but I figured op is in the same boat:eek:

 

 

Are you ready to end this relationship at this moment? And can you handle not talking to him for weeks on end while he goes through this?

 

I ask because giving time apart will potentially lead him to the conclusion that your relationship (the one you have with him, not you personally) is hurting him. The IC is right that he needs six months to a year alone at the end of a significant relationship, but he already messed that up by stepping out of his marriage and seeing you for however long.

 

So what to do?

 

Set a date. Agree together that you will be apart for a week and allow him to do whatever. And you do whatever you need to keep yourself from calling him or responding when he calls. You both have to go dark on each other. Start with small time periods. He needs this and if you want a future with him, you need to allow him this. Work up to a month or two depending on how he is.

 

This relationship was started on the wrong foundation. The only thing the two of you can do now is start fixing that foundation. Sometimes you have to strip everything you built off and get the cracks out. One of the biggest cracks is trust. You have to trust him and it doesn't seem that you do or can. I understand that. But if he is really out of his marriage, he will appreciate your lack of insecurity in allowing him to truly grieve his marriage. To grieve the love he had for his W at one time. To grieve the family relationships he is going to miss with her family. To grieve the dreams that he had for that relationship. And, to even grieve the fact that his prolonged cheating during that relationship ultimately led him to this place. He will have to accept himself and his part in this. That's why he is depressed. The grief can be profound at the end of a marriage. Its not for the squeamish. Especially the squeamish that will interpret his every sorrow as meaning he wants his W and his marriage back.

 

Don't be a mother to him. It won't help him to always have you there wiping his nose for him. I know you dream of a life with him, but in the state that he is in right now - there is no life to be had with him.

 

He needs space. BUt until you are ready to accept that this relationship might not survive this, you won't be able to give him his space with the knowledge that you will survive this and you didn't waste any years with him. Maybe that's why you are pressuring him? Maybe that is why things get so ugly when you try to talk about the future? You may need to stop thinking of only your investment during his marriage in waiting for him and hoping for him to leave, if that's what you are doing. Because if you are, this is what he is responding to. He may only be hearing "But I (mino) gave you this and that for three long years, you owe me!!!' and doesn't want to hear that.

 

Is a week of no contact with him something you can survive?

[Mino]

Are you ready to end this relationship at this moment? And can you handle not talking to him for weeks on end while he goes through this?

 

I ask because giving time apart will potentially lead him to the conclusion that your relationship (the one you have with him, not you personally) is hurting him. The IC is right that he needs six months to a year alone at the end of a significant relationship, but he already messed that up by stepping out of his marriage and seeing you for however long.

 

So what to do?

 

Set a date. Agree together that you will be apart for a week and allow him to do whatever. And you do whatever you need to keep yourself from calling him or responding when he calls. You both have to go dark on each other. Start with small time periods. He needs this and if you want a future with him, you need to allow him this. Work up to a month or two depending on how he is.

 

This relationship was started on the wrong foundation. The only thing the two of you can do now is start fixing that foundation. Sometimes you have to strip everything you built off and get the cracks out. One of the biggest cracks is trust. You have to trust him and it doesn't seem that you do or can. I understand that. But if he is really out of his marriage, he will appreciate your lack of insecurity in allowing him to truly grieve his marriage. To grieve the love he had for his W at one time. To grieve the family relationships he is going to miss with her family. To grieve the dreams that he had for that relationship. And, to even grieve the fact that his prolonged cheating during that relationship ultimately led him to this place. He will have to accept himself and his part in this. That's why he is depressed. The grief can be profound at the end of a marriage. Its not for the squeamish. Especially the squeamish that will interpret his every sorrow as meaning he wants his W and his marriage back.

 

Don't be a mother to him. It won't help him to always have you there wiping his nose for him. I know you dream of a life with him, but in the state that he is in right now - there is no life to be had with him.

 

He needs space. BUt until you are ready to accept that this relationship might not survive this, you won't be able to give him his space with the knowledge that you will survive this and you didn't waste any years with him. Maybe that's why you are pressuring him? Maybe that is why things get so ugly when you try to talk about the future? You may need to stop thinking of only your investment during his marriage in waiting for him and hoping for him to leave, if that's what you are doing. Because if you are, this is what he is responding to. He may only be hearing "But I (mino) gave you this and that for three long years, you owe me!!!' and doesn't want to hear that.

 

Is a week of no contact with him something you can survive?

You know what, NoI Didnt, I think you have just given me the best advice ever, and I really really mean that from the bottom of my heart. I have never ever looked at doing it this way, starting with a week of nc.. and then progressing from there. I think you got something new here. The ice cold nc, has NEVER worked... but this is worth a try... I need a solution to end this status que, Of coarse I love him, but I see its just stuck again. I will put alot of thought into this, prepare him with your suggestion..I dont want him to think I am throwing in the towel, but continuing like this day after day, is not heathly for either of us and I do feel its damaging our relaionship. Thanks again, YOUR GREAT !! mino

[NoIDidn't]

You know what, NoI Didnt, I think you have just given me the best advice ever, and I really really mean that from the bottom of my heart. I have never ever looked at doing it this way, starting with a week of nc.. and then progressing from there. I think you got something new here. The ice cold nc, has NEVER worked... but this is worth a try... I need a solution to end this status que, Of coarse I love him, but I see its just stuck again. I will put alot of thought into this, prepare him with your suggestion..I dont want him to think I am throwing in the towel, but continuing like this day after day, is not heathly for either of us and I do feel its damaging our relaionship. Thanks again, YOUR GREAT !! mino

 

I hope it helps. You are welcome.

[MizzBlue72]

I agree with the previous poster.

 

I was in an affair, and am now divorced. I did not leave because of the OM; I left because I was not happy and many other reasons.

 

Even since I wanted the divorce I still mourn the loss of my marriage - in so many ways.

 

You have to give him time. He needs time to work this out - so if he does choose to be with you, it will be for his reasons and not because he feels guilty.

 

I have to tell you - grieving for the loss of the marriage - it is really hard. I feel like someone died, seriously. I am no where near being ready, and I have been divorced for some time.