Jump to content

Think my H is a narcissist


veronese

Recommended Posts

I've read up on narcissism and think my H is probably one!

 

I really wish he wasn't because it's not a particularly nice personality disorder, but unfortunately it describes my H perfectly.

 

I'm shell-shocked, what the hell do I do now? It was depressing reading and although very informative, has left me feeling pretty numb.

 

I would love to hear from anyone who has any experience, advice, or encouragement for me.

 

I hope I'm wrong but I have a horrible feeling for once I may be right. It explains so many things about his whole character/behaviour etc. but it hasn't cheered me up any!

 

Thanks everyone

 

Veronese x

Link to post
Share on other sites
madamdragonfly

This defines my husband in many ways as well, so I know where you are coming from honey....but you know what? Knowledge, though painful, IS power. You have to remember that.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Can I ask a serious question? Look the list over and see how many of those traits apply to you? Do any of those characteristics apply to you?

 

I think it's a matter of DEGREE. I've looked at the characteristics that make up an N and thought my husband has certain traits too but then I thought I did too! Upon reflection, I realized that MANY of us have these characteristics!

 

But what separates a TRUE N from just a normal, average person? (if there's such a thing!) Are those traits balanced out with other traits that are not considered narcisistic (sp?) And are the narcistic traits really pronounced? Are they displayed all the time or just some of the time?

 

I'm no psychiatrist but those are the questions I'd ask myself before deciding whether your husbands are REALLY N's.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I have often wondered if my husband was one too, and passive agressive as well. However, after reading about those disorders, I saw where I have a few of those traits myself. I think we all have triats of things to an extent. Some maybe worse than others, however since I'm no doctor/psychologist I can not dianose myself, nor my husband. I can only assume(which is not good) that he is and that I have some traits too. The best way to find out for sure and learn how to deal/handle it, would be to get a diagnosis.

 

 

 

 

Jade

Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I think we all have these traits !!:)

 

Yes...to a greater or lesser degree I think we DO. Also, I wanted to say this. I really think it depends on what DAY you choose to look at that list. If you're having a bad day with your husband and he's being particularly irritating or controlling or whatever it is, then you're more than likely to attribute more of those traits and place more emphasis on them.

 

Whereas on a good day you might say "Yeah, he's a little like this and a little like that sometimes."

Link to post
Share on other sites
Yes...to a greater or lesser degree I think we DO. Also, I wanted to say this. I really think it depends on what DAY you choose to look at that list. If you're having a bad day with your husband and he's being particularly irritating or controlling or whatever it is, then you're more than likely to attribute more of those traits and place more emphasis on them.

 

Whereas on a good day you might say "Yeah, he's a little like this and a little like that sometimes."

 

 

Definitely!!! :)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Only a qualified professional can diagnose personality disorders, mental illnesses, etc. Being so close, untrained, and inexperienced with patients displaying symptoms, you don't have the kind of perspective or knowledge necessary for an objective assessment, much less a diagnosis. Some counselor or psychologist visits are your best bet for something definative. They'll pick up on any abnormal behavior.

Link to post
Share on other sites

A therapist could probably tell you whether or not he has it from your description of his actions.

 

My mother was one and suffered from BPD.

 

We do all have these traits to a certain extent. But, also on another level, the loved ones of people with these disorders suffer from many of these issues because we're around those people. It's called a "flea". I learned that in therapy after I found out my mom was BPD.

 

For instance, I have a hard time apologizing to anyone, under any circumstances because I always had to apologize for everything when I was growing up, and most of it wasn't my fault.

 

We might rage, because that is how our partner always deals with anger, etc.

 

I can only tell you that if he is truly that way, that you'll have a uphill battle staying married to him, because everything is all about him.

 

When I got married, all about her, when I had my son, all about her, when my best friend died, all about how it affected her- when I was sick with my second child- all about her. When my stepfather got told he had diabetes, all about her- you get the picture.

 

They very rarely seek therapy because they think it's everyone else's problem.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
Can I ask a serious question? Look the list over and see how many of those traits apply to you? Do any of those characteristics apply to you?

 

I think it's a matter of DEGREE. I've looked at the characteristics that make up an N and thought my husband has certain traits too but then I thought I did too! Upon reflection, I realized that MANY of us have these characteristics!

 

But what separates a TRUE N from just a normal, average person? (if there's such a thing!) Are those traits balanced out with other traits that are not considered narcissistic (sp?) And are the narcistic traits really pronounced? Are they displayed all the time or just some of the time?

 

I'm no psychiatrist but those are the questions I'd ask myself before deciding whether your husbands are REALLY N's.

 

 

Thanks for all your interesting replies. I know what everyone means about it being impossible for me to diagnose a mental disorder and that only a medical professional could do so. I mean, all I know about narcissm I've learned in about 4 days, so an expert I most certainly am not! (btw, how do you go about getting a professional assessment done? I kind of doubt my H will be eager to trot down to the nearest psychiatric hospital!)

 

It's just that everything I read on the subject pointed to it, much to my dismay, even when I much preferred the other possibility of him having only some of the traits. When I came across anything positively UNLIKE my H I felt encouraged by it and hoped there would be enough discrepancies to rule out my fears. Unfortunately there weren't very many of them!

 

In answer to your question though Touche, looking at the list of traits I can truthfully say only one or two could be applied to me. I'm by no means without a whole heap of idiosyncrasies and issues of my own though, it's just that mine don't fit the narcissist description

 

I agree that many people possess these traits in varying degrees and the characteristics aren't that unusual. I think we all know someone who could be described as such.

 

But when I went in to it in more detail it was then that I seriously began to wonder if it was possible. I can't go into the individual examples but almost everything was true of my H, both past and present, in his behaviour, attitude and history. The list of characteristic traits is the tip of the ice berg and as you said, could be true of lots of people, I'm sure they aren't all narcissists though. I know there must be so much more information on this disorder and maybe if I learn more I'll change my mind about my suspicion. I do hope so.

 

What separates a TRUE N from a normal, average person? (and I do wonder if one exists too!). Well one thing is their staggering lack of empathy for others. My H's lack of empathy has always horrified me, always. I accepted he was incapable of this emotion attributing it to the absence of any towards him as a child and much as I loathed this aspect of his character, I understood how it had happened. Seriously Touche, this lack of empathy is HUGE. I may be wrong but when someone appears to be essentially a kind, good person, this absence of empathy is slightly bizarre.

 

Another difference between N's and Mr and Mrs Average is their never ending thirst for attention, flattery, admiration. Now I know it's not unusual to come across individuals with big egos, but N's are a little more subtle about it but no less needy. For 17 years my H was adored by me, my family, friends, colleagues, strangers, EVERYONE! He was complimented regularly, admired universally, desired by women and men alike, and was generally considered to be Mr Just About as Bloody Perfect as You're Ever Going to See Actually! He's physically gorgeous too.

 

Yes, it did piss me off but what could I do? He couldn't help being so fricking wonderful could he? We both knew how less than perfect he really was even if no-one else did. Then along comes the bombshell that even that indecent level of nauseating approval didn't suffice - he had 3 females tucked up his sleeve just to top himself up! They can't get enough of it!

 

Lots of things don't add up when you're married to a narcissist, and I don't mean catching them out lying. It's their personalities, their emotions (or severe lack of them), their behaviour. You can live with a N for years without really knowing much about what they are thinking (cos often they're not).

 

Their unexpected and brutal cruelty (verbally) arrives from nowhere and disappears back where it came for another few years. They say or do something so out of character (in your opinion) it knocks you for six, then it's gone and they're back and you are left baffled and hurt. It happened to me maybe 4 or 5 times in 17 years, a strange, upsetting day when my H behaved like a stranger towards me, a nasty one at that.

 

I'm rambling too long, sorry. I don't know if he really is a N or not, but what I've learned about narcissm has made sense of a lot of puzzling questions I've always had which were never answered.

 

As madamdragonfly said, having more knowledge can only help me

 

veron x

Link to post
Share on other sites

veronese

he had three affairs. how did he react to you discovering them?

do you predict a continuation of the cheating?

if he is a narcissist, what difference does that make to you/things?

does it mean that you fear behaviour will not change because, he has a character disorder that makes him do this?

i was once involved in a terrifying physically abusive relationship (a long time ago now). i read up on things like psychopathic behaviour and traits all the time. the more i read the more terrified i became. looking back on it, i dont know. i do know that my own fear created a theory which my fear set out to prove. it is very difficult to diagnose people when you are a professional, harder when you are not and harder still when you are emotionally involved in the situation.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi NEW!!! So good to see you here!

 

Anyway, Veronese, first I want to say, you're very funny. You made me laugh out loud a few times:laugh: I can just see you saying to H :

 

"Uh, honey, if you're not doing anything right now, can you come with me to the nearest psychiatrist for an evaluation? See, given your heavy narcistic tendencies, I want to have you evaluated to see if you're a Narcisist?"

 

"OK, sure dear, let me just grab my coat and we'll be on our way!":lmao:

 

Ok, I'm not meaning to laugh at your situation but we all have to have a little laugh every now and again, right? Anyway, you seem like a woman with a great sense of humor.

 

Back to the discussion. I was going to say what New kind of said already. How will it really help you know whether he is one or not? Would you treat him differently or act more understanding? How will that knowledge help YOU? So I agree with New for bringing that up. It's an important question to ask yourself.

 

Maybe he's a borderline N or a full blown N or not one at all...how will that change things to know that? Would it give you a reason to leave him? Or maybe an excuse to stay with him? I don't know...just throwing out things for you to maybe ponder a bit.

 

A little side not here and I'm not sure if this applies to you or not. But my ex-husband had a lot of issues. But I always kind of felt that things were MY fault in some way. It was only after I finally left him that I realized (after I happened to read the symptoms/signs) that he was a manic depressive. He admitted to me after we were divorced that he suffered from depression. I never even knew this while we were married because I really didn't know anything about depression. He never admitted to being having bipolar disorder and I didn't ask him. He only admitted to depression but he fit the profile of a person with manic depression to a "T".

 

Somehow it made me feel SO much better to know that yes, I may have contributed a bit to the failure of our marriage, BUT it wasn't ALL me and there really WAS something wrong with him. From then on I never really blamed myself as much for the divorce.

 

I'm not really sure why I'm telling you this and whether there are any similar conclusions to be drawn from this but I thought I'd throw that out there for what's it worth.

 

So tell us (if you care to) how having this knowledge about him might help your situation?

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author

I really appreciate both of your inputs.

 

newbby, he was almost as shocked to be found out as I was to have discovered his affairs. They weren't PAs, but were long term, flirtatious EAs. He didn't imagine me ever finding out and typical of N's, thought them not to be a threat to our marriage as they weren't sexual and he didn't plan on leaving me.

 

According to the stuff I've read about infidelity, my H is in the top category to reoffend. He experienced no guilt throughout, thought he was almost entitled to it, never acted suspiciously through our 17 years together and would still be seeing them now if he hadn’t been rumbled - maybe he still is?!! I'm not exactly confident of him breaking what has been a long term habit but God only knows, miracles CAN happen - hope one's happening round here! He'll have my boot up his beautiful bum if he does stray again, he's not that bloody gorgeous, no siree Bob!

 

If he is an N newbby, I think our chances are even slimmer than I thought til now. If he needed additional ego boosting during the years when I thought the sun shone out of him, he'll be gagging for some now he's starved of my adoration.

 

But you know what you said about proving your own theory sometimes? I wondered about that myself! Next thing you know I'll stumble over an article about transvestites and convince myself he might be one of those too! I must be careful not to over-dramatise what is already a bummer of a situation!

 

Touche, thanks for the compliment. I'm glad my sense of humour hasn't been totally suffocated by my extraordinary gloomy attitude these days! Losing my sparkle has annoyed me. I used to be so bloody cheerful and light hearted generally. Not anymore, I'm like a bloody rottweiler that bites any hand that comes too near! I agree with you that the best tonic is to be able to see the funny side of things but it aint always possible. It's getting easier by the day though!

 

But as for answering how this will help me in my situation? Well depressing though it is to suspect he is an N, at least I can understand and accept the truth and recognise his limitations. We've had a few discussions recently, me and the old git, and they've reinforced how inadequate he can be. I suppose the information has stopped me hanging on to false illusions and hope. I tested him out on the topic of feelings yesterday, like does he bloody have any?! and the poor bugger couldn't even identify any emotional response in himself concerning a recent disagreement we'd had. At least I know not to flog what is obviously a dead horse anymore!

 

I may not have the traits of an N but I'm ram jam packed full of whatever characteristics a fool in denial possesses! After all, he's always been a cold, emotionless man who in reality, said very little but listened patiently to my ramblings. I think I created my own version of him in my head based on a load of assumptions. I always heard you have to watch the quiet ones and boy were they right!

 

I'm not sure how this knowledge will help me but help me it will, bollocks to how it affects him! I know I've got to look after me cos up til now we've both been looking after him. It may accelerate a separation or divorce, I don't know just yet. My gut reaction though is that it will end up that way. It's certainly not going to make me excuse bad behaviour.

 

He was a stroppy git yesterday actually and I told him how unjustified and unreasonable he was being. It pissed him off even more but I was surprised at how unbothered I was (for all the Brits here "Do I look bovvered??").

 

Knowing more about N may help me to understand better why he is the way he is, which may positively affect our marriage, but truthfully I think the wife I was before DDay was the kind of wife he likes best. I can't be that wife again.

 

I was just like you about feeling to blame for any problems we had. If he was a crotchety grump I used to wrack my brains trying to a) work out what I'd done wrong and b) try to make everything right (i.e. make his stroppy mood go away). Looking back I can't believe how subservient I behaved with him. If he's irritable now I may ask him why but if I've done nothing to deserve his bad humour I leave him to wallow in it alone. Sometimes I've pointed out how sulky he is and expressed mild concern, but have then wandered off quite indifferently and unconcerned about it. Sure does bug the hell out of him when I don't fret.

 

Thing is though Touche, N's need lots of attention and devotion so the less I give him (and it's a lot lot less!), the more likely he is to seek it elsewhere. Knowing that though is not going to make me go back to the way we were before. I'll give him attention if he bloody well deserves it, and in the meantime I could do with a bit myself thanks very much Mr. Grumpy!

 

Anyway, another long one, sorry! I don't know much about yours and newbby's stories though; I liked hearing both of your personal experiences.

 

Thanks for taking the time. Hope you have nice weekends

 

Veron x

Link to post
Share on other sites

veronese,

it all sounds very tough and i think you are coping well.

i understand what you are saying about how knowing that he is a n may help you to cope. knowledge is power etc. however, is coping or knowing how to deal with him going to bring any fundamental changes to the two of you individually, as people? or does it just help your marriage tick along?

is he open to the possibility that he may need some help/ have some problems?

it would be completely impossible to fix any marriage, without fixing the people as individuals, with no view to fixing the marriage, just because people need individual nourishment, which can never come from the other party.

i dont believe anybody is completely beyond help, but, many seem to be beyond realising that they need it. of course you cannot force somebody to seek help for themselves, and even if you did, unless they recognise it, they may not gain anything from it. in fact few people realise that they are in trouble until they actually hit rock bottom. difficult as it is, leaving him may be the only way for him to realise that he needs to sort himself out.

how does it help your marriage? i dont know.

or you could just make sure the marriage is dealable for you, but, it sounds that you feel you cannot trust him at all, so what kind of marriage is that?

what is he like as a father etc? do you feel you can live in a marriage and enjoy the other benefits of being married, without the trust factor? do you feel that he loves you, or do you feel he is not capable of really loving anybody?

Link to post
Share on other sites
helena abadi
Only a qualified professional can diagnose personality disorders, mental illnesses, etc. Being so close, untrained, and inexperienced with patients displaying symptoms, you don't have the kind of perspective or knowledge necessary for an objective assessment, much less a diagnosis. Some counselor or psychologist visits are your best bet for something definative. They'll pick up on any abnormal behavior.

 

We know our partners well, and I think we can make a initial assessment, however some professional help is absolutely necessary.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Veronese, you said you sound like me in that you blame yourself and try to fix things...or you DID. Now, you walk away, act indifferent when he sulks, etc. That's exactly how I became before I left him for good. I hate to say it, but indifference is the first step out the door.

 

He sounds like he's emotionally bankrupt. Nothing there. It's really hard to fix things with someone like this. Do you want to fix things? Does he? To me it sounds like you're one step out the door. Start doing things for YOU and continue to ignore his sulking. If you change the dynamic it might, just MIGHT bring him around...if it doesn't then you're preparing yourself for a new life.

 

Glad you haven't let this completely change who you are. KEEP your sense of humor. Don't let him take away who you are.

 

Time will tell what the right decision is but in your heart of hearts, I think you already know.

Link to post
Share on other sites
helena abadi

Beautiful people may have more narcissistic tendencies. When it comes to attention, they have little trouble attracting it, they don't have to try hard attracting new partners. People adore physical beauty, and those blessed with it are forgiven a multitude of sins. Not surprising they may have little empathy. But no empathy? Have you asked him if he will see a psychiatrist? Sounds as tho you have nothing much to lose now.

 

The fact he felt no guilt is not surprising. People with no empathy cannot identify with another person's pain. Yes, he's highly likely to reoffend, especially if he feels no guilt.

 

It also sounds as tho he is so withdrawn from your relationship he's not even dim light at the end of the tunnel.

 

And if you do leave him, he may be surprised, but not feel much either - except the pain of your boot up his bum.....

 

Take care of YOURSELF.

Link to post
Share on other sites

hi veronese

 

i sympathise with you, because my situation was the same. i was married to a guy who frustrated me no end with his lack of real empathy and his constant insatiable need for attention. like you, i finally read about narcissism and the shoe fit. it doesn't really matter whether a clinical diagnosis was made or not. he was functionally narcissistic and in our marriage that put me in the position of sucking up the lack of feeling and supporting his inflated ego, both thankless and endless jobs.

 

the benefit i had from coming to this realization was that it allowed me to stop beating the dead horse of our relationship. i had literally driven myself to a nervous breakdown because of how dysfunctional our marital relationship had seemed to me and because i could not effect it. but knowing he was an N allowed me to conserve my energy for myself, which eventually gave me enough to walk away.

 

It was for the best. it is very unlikely that an N will ever change. I know about what is going on with my ex now and that lack of real inner change is still true.

 

i hope your situation turns out well.

Link to post
Share on other sites

there has been some speculation as to my husband being a N. He was a serial cheater throughout our marriage. Many women and sometimes a few at the same time.:sick: He said he "shoved" the guilt away and figured what I didn't know wouldn't hurt me.

 

He will admit that he did it for the ego stroking, admiration and adulation. However, for him its a self esteem issue and not N. I still think shoving guilt away is the same as not having any. Doesn't it defy the purpose of what guilt is in the first place?

 

If your H is a N, he won't change, he can't change. It's not possible for these people to change EVER. Having AN affair because a marriage is bad or for whatever reason... is different from feeling entitled to having many affairs. That my friend is a whole other ballgame and one you shouldn't being playing in.

 

You said your husband blames you for things? He makes you feel bad and come running to him even though he is the one to cause the problem in the first place? Hmmm... this is not a good sign either.

 

Sounds like you are just now discovering who you have been married to all this time.... I believe you will make the right decision when that time comes.

 

(hugs)

Link to post
Share on other sites
×
×
  • Create New...