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Hi, I posted here before but this time I would like to hear from Betrayed Spouses. How important you think it is, in order to heal, to know all the truth? Would you go as far as reaching out as your spouse/partner's affair partner to know that? Do you feel like the need to know details like exactly how long the affair lasted for is useful? I really want to be able to forgive my WS but because his shame and fear of losing our family ( and quite possibly pride too) he's being very vague about details of his indisctretion/s. This is turning into obsession for me, even if what I want more is being able to forgive him. But I feel that in order to do that I need conplete honesty, even if it hurts. Could be that I have it already, could not be.so difficult to trust someone who lied on you before already. I'm open to your experiences and suggestions.

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40somethingGuy
Hi, I posted here before but this time I would like to hear from Betrayed Spouses. How important you think it is, in order to heal, to know all the truth? Would you go as far as reaching out as your spouse/partner's affair partner to know that? Do you feel like the need to know details like exactly how long the affair lasted for is useful? I really want to be able to forgive my WS but because his shame and fear of losing our family ( and quite possibly pride too) he's being very vague about details of his indisctretion/s. This is turning into obsession for me, even if what I want more is being able to forgive him. But I feel that in order to do that I need conplete honesty, even if it hurts. Could be that I have it already, could not be.so difficult to trust someone who lied on you before already. I'm open to your experiences and suggestions.

 

It was critically important for me bc I realized my spouse was someone I didn't realize she was and I needed to know what I was married to. I also needed to know in order to assess if I could live with going forward with her or not. What I have found is that I know the gist of the details and did R but now I kind of regret not launching her then. However, then my regret would have been not trying to see if things improved. They have improved but she will forever be tainted in my eyes and really unsure if I will ever feel the same about her- likely not. I do think she deserves the consequences of her actions. Basically right now I am using her for her insurance until I get a different job and then out of the blue she will get served. I am a bad person I know but I have a funny way of getting back when you least expect it. :)

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I love how you said " I needed to know WHAT I was married to.

Also, fair enough about the insurance. If you feel like you've been used for emotional or financial stability seems only fair to me you get your needs met too.

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I'm not a BS. I think you need to clarify what you mean ALL the details. All will probably hurt too much.

 

 

I think I'd need to know most of the details: when did it start; how did it start; when did it end; how often they saw each other & why my WS started it in the 1st place. I would not want to know how often they had sex or if the sex was better.

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I am a wayward spouse so apologies in advance if I am not welcome here. But I wanted to share my perspective as I think it could be helpful. In my case, once my husband found out about the affair, I was terrified of losing him and terrified of facing the consequences of my actions. So I tried to minimize and cover up everything possible, even though he was begging me to just tell him everything. I think that is an extremely common reaction and I'm sure it's what your husband is doing too. I'm sure there is a lot about his affair that you don't know - I'm sorry.

 

In my case, I only realized that I could fully be honest when I felt like THERE WAS NOTHING LEFT TO LOSE. He had said he wanted to split up and was going to file for divorce, but was still treating me very graciously. Only then did I realize that I had hit rock bottom and that I couldn't talk my way out of anything anymore. And despite how it may sound, I still loved him deeply and was broken-hearted at having hurt him and I wanted to do what I could to make it better. So I told him everything, and it was a relief for both of us. But it took getting shaken out of my "cover your ass, protect your marriage from consequences at all costs" mentality by knowing all was lost already.

 

I would file for divorce. It takes several months to go through anyway, and you could always withdraw it or put it on hold if he begins to be honest with you. That was the only thing that made me be honest - knowing I had nothing more to lose. Good luck xox

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Betrayed&Stayed
Hi, I posted here before but this time I would like to hear from Betrayed Spouses. How important you think it is, in order to heal, to know all the truth? Would you go as far as reaching out as your spouse/partner's affair partner to know that? Do you feel like the need to know details like exactly how long the affair lasted for is useful? I really want to be able to forgive my WS but because his shame and fear of losing our family ( and quite possibly pride too) he's being very vague about details of his indisctretion/s. This is turning into obsession for me, even if what I want more is being able to forgive him. But I feel that in order to do that I need conplete honesty, even if it hurts. Could be that I have it already, could not be.so difficult to trust someone who lied on you before already. I'm open to your experiences and suggestions.

 

For me it is extremely important to know the details.

 

I wanted all of the details but I digested the details over a long period of time. Initially after her confession, I was just shocked. It took me some time just to accept that she had an affair. Once I was able to process the fact that she did have an affair, then I started asking more detailed questions. Looking back I can't believe it took me several months before I asked for details about the OM, such as his name.

 

I wanted details so I could gauge the level of betrayal and deception on her part.

 

Of course I got the "sex was not good", "we only had sex a few times", "he had small penis", etc comments. There's no way for me to confirm those statements so I assumed that they had the best sex ever, all the time, and he has a huge johnson; worst-case scenario from my perspective. I had to assume that everything she told me was minimized.

 

I needed to know the timeline

How it started, who started it

How it ended, who ended it

How did they define the relationship

What did she think/feel about him (and me)

Did they talk about me/marriage

Sex: where, how many times, etc. I didn't ask for explicit details on the sex aspect

I also asked a LOT of questions about her state of mind, what was she thinking, thought process during the affair

 

I did email the OM and asked if he would confirm some of the things that my WW said about the affair. He never responded to my request. I really wanted to confirm the timeline. Since he didn't respond I was able to confirm the timeline by calling the HR department of where they worked together (at that time). His start and end date matched her story. Plus her change in behavior aligns with the timeline that she gave me.

 

I would think it would difficult to forgive a WS only to learn later on that there was more to it than originally believed.

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40somethingGuy
For me it is extremely important to know the details.

 

I wanted all of the details but I digested the details over a long period of time. Initially after her confession, I was just shocked. It took me some time just to accept that she had an affair. Once I was able to process the fact that she did have an affair, then I started asking more detailed questions. Looking back I can't believe it took me several months before I asked for details about the OM, such as his name.

 

I wanted details so I could gauge the level of betrayal and deception on her part.

 

Of course I got the "sex was not good", "we only had sex a few times", "he had small penis", etc comments. There's no way for me to confirm those statements so I assumed that they had the best sex ever, all the time, and he has a huge johnson; worst-case scenario from my perspective. I had to assume that everything she told me was minimized.

 

I needed to know the timeline

How it started, who started it

How it ended, who ended it

How did they define the relationship

What did she think/feel about him (and me)

Did they talk about me/marriage

Sex: where, how many times, etc. I didn't ask for explicit details on the sex aspect

I also asked a LOT of questions about her state of mind, what was she thinking, thought process during the affair

 

I did email the OM and asked if he would confirm some of the things that my WW said about the affair. He never responded to my request. I really wanted to confirm the timeline. Since he didn't respond I was able to confirm the timeline by calling the HR department of where they worked together (at that time). His start and end date matched her story. Plus her change in behavior aligns with the timeline that she gave me.

 

I would think it would difficult to forgive a WS only to learn later on that there was more to it than originally believed.

 

One thing I made sure the OM understood was that if he didn't also spill details (some of which were known and some unknown to me) that I would be going to his wife. He had a lot of remorse and did talk to me about lots of stuff and I kept the documentation. If the OM isn't going to talk then you have to ruin him. It is war and think no different.

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Starswillshine

I needed to know what I was forgiving. I needed to know everything. I didn't need to know the graphic details, but I needed to know if I asked, that I was given the truth.

 

It is impossible to move on when you still feel the WS is lying. I know they all minimize and try to not say the really harmful and hurtful parts, but I needed him to care about what I wanted more than protecting anything else.

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Originally Posted by Müun

Hi, I posted here before but this time I would like to hear from Betrayed Spouses. How important you think it is, in order to heal, to know all the truth? Would you go as far as reaching out as your spouse/partner's affair partner to know that? Do you feel like the need to know details like exactly how long the affair lasted for is useful? I really want to be able to forgive my WS but because his shame and fear of losing our family ( and quite possibly pride too) he's being very vague about details of his indisctretion/s. This is turning into obsession for me, even if what I want more is being able to forgive him. But I feel that in order to do that I need conplete honesty, even if it hurts. Could be that I have it already, could not be.so difficult to trust someone who lied on you before already. I'm open to your experiences and suggestions.

You know that your spouse betrayed you right? Knowing how long the affair was going on and knowing that she had a PA and an EA with him was enough for me and I took action and divorced her. I did not ask for all the other sexy details as I WANTED TO PROTECT ME!......I did not contact the AP because he did not betray me my wife betrayed me… I am not about to fight every man that will have sex with my wife because I always knew that there was thousands of men that would. I told my wife years ago that I depended on her to remain faithful and not other men. She failed. I knew what I had to forgive and did not need additional nightmare details.

 

 

Now what happened was that my wife was allowed back in the home for various reasons and I told her that words are not enough and that actions for a long time will have to be demonstrated. After her proving with actions for over 4 years I remarried her…I do not want any gory sexy details if there were any or any details at all. I want to protect my emotions and I had to look out for me as it was obvious I could not depend on her for that. I used ACTIONS by her to determine my decisions.

 

 

From what I have read on marriage forums, the sexy details give the BS nightmares for decades!!!

Edited by Mr Blunt
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You know that your spouse betrayed you right? Knowing how long the affair was going on and knowing that she had a PA and an EA with him was enough for me and I took action and divorced her. I did not ask for all the other sexy details as I WANTED TO PROTECT ME!......I did not contact the AP because he did not betray me my wife betrayed me… I am not about to fight every man that will have sex with my wife because I always knew that there was thousands of men that would. I told my wife years ago that I depended on her to remain faithful and not other men. She failed. I knew what I had to forgive and did not need additional nightmare details.

 

 

Now what happened was that my wife was allowed back in the home for various reasons and I told her that words are not enough and that actions for a long time will have to be demonstrated. After her proving with actions for over 4 years I remarried her…I do not want any gory sexy details if there were any or any details at all. I want to protect my emotions and I had to look out for me as it was obvious I could not depend on her for that. I used ACTIONS by her to determine my decisions.

 

 

From what I have read on marriage forums, the sexy details give the BS nightmares for decades!!!

 

Hi, I am not looking to know graphic details, I know even too much about that unfortunately as I found out myself from texts. It wasn't an emotional affair, was only lust. An ex girlfriend who stayed fwb for years got back into our life after he asked me to get married, which was very early in our relationship to be fair. I kind of know when it started I think but I don't know when it ended. He says was only a couple of times (funnily enough I found two texts that explicitly say they were going to meet ) but things ended when we moved in together, less than a month after that. As I found texting going on for months after I don't know if I can believe him. They don't talk about meeting but the content is sexual. Different than the others tho. I could write the other woman to ask but I am not sure if I can forgive in case he's lying again, so I am taking time. And yes, the details, like the content of these texts are killing me. It's been two months now but they are scarred in my memory.

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FloatingThroughLife

I wanted to know everything, and she told me nothing, so I had to gather as much information as I could on my own. What I came to realize is that my wife is not the same person anymore. She's not who I married. If I didn't get all this info on my own, she would have been able to manipulate me into a reconciliation by telling me what I wanted to hear instead if the truth, and that is no way to live.

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Hi, I posted here before but this time I would like to hear from Betrayed Spouses. How important you think it is, in order to heal, to know all the truth? Would you go as far as reaching out as your spouse/partner's affair partner to know that? Do you feel like the need to know details like exactly how long the affair lasted for is useful? I really want to be able to forgive my WS but because his shame and fear of losing our family ( and quite possibly pride too) he's being very vague about details of his indisctretion/s. This is turning into obsession for me, even if what I want more is being able to forgive him. But I feel that in order to do that I need conplete honesty, even if it hurts. Could be that I have it already, could not be.so difficult to trust someone who lied on you before already. I'm open to your experiences and suggestions.

 

Every BS has their own level of need for the details about

their WS's affair.

 

When a BS asks did they have sex and the WS says yes.

He is not lying. HE is not trickle truthing. He fully answered

the BS's question

 

The BS did not ask how many times they had sex or how

good was the sex.

 

Direct answers allows the BS to control what facts about

the affair are learned. The WS when asked did you have sex

and says no we just kissed. Then at a later date admits to

just oral. The truth keeps on trickling in. This is the difference.

This way is not being honest.

 

So muun, I will warn you that once a BS hears a fact it can

never be unheard. So before a BS asks a question they must

say will I regret hearing the answer.

 

I have seen too many relationships stall in the recovery

stage and they spend the rest of their lives in a marriage

that limps along because the BS never got the answers to

their questions.

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viatori patuit

My first marriage ended with an affair.

 

 

For me, the details were unimportant. I did not reconcile though. My take was that once I found out and processed it reconciliation would never happen. There are so many other people out there that can make someone happy, why mess with a broken partnership.

 

I feel your pain and understand not everyone can just walk away. But if you are not willing to then you are probably going to have to deal with this again.

 

Good luck. I hope you find peace.

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Occasionally there are stories of a WS (usually WW) providing ALL details - but its rare.

 

I wanted to know everything - never did. Most WS wont share every detail. Even to this day I occasionally have fantasies of having some crystal ball where I can see or ask to know everything that happened. I say crystal ball because I believe even if I administered a drug to make my wife open up - I believe her "memories" or what she believes happened are tainted and not accurate. There are several years of my wife's life - a person she was - that I will never really know.

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Hi, I posted here before but this time I would like to hear from Betrayed Spouses. How important you think it is, in order to heal, to know all the truth? Would you go as far as reaching out as your spouse/partner's affair partner to know that? Do you feel like the need to know details like exactly how long the affair lasted for is useful? I really want to be able to forgive my WS but because his shame and fear of losing our family ( and quite possibly pride too) he's being very vague about details of his indisctretion/s. This is turning into obsession for me, even if what I want more is being able to forgive him. But I feel that in order to do that I need conplete honesty, even if it hurts. Could be that I have it already, could not be.so difficult to trust someone who lied on you before already. I'm open to your experiences and suggestions.

 

The truth is extremely important but the truth is only a variable that coincides with the frame of mind and self esteem in oneself. If there are children it only adds to the excruciating dilemma of weighing the cost of staying with or divorcing the WS.

 

In such circumstance it will appear there's no clear choice or clear solution. Whether married or divorced it sucks rocks either way.

 

Odds are letting go is the immediate course to intense pain but in the long run it paves the fastest course toward moving on. I believe the uncertain future is as frightening as the known hell in the present.

 

I look at the truth in a pragmatic way, is the first cut sufficient truth, does the 3rd, 4th, or 5th cut truly make a difference.

 

I'd rather invest in an uncertain future than present hell and that is what I did do in my circumstance. It was surreal but I handed my cheater his suitcase and wished him well. No drama, no questions, simply an adios.

 

What only matters is the truth in your heart, the limit of what you will endure and the steadfast strength it takes to not accept the cheap value a cheater places on you.

 

The irony is that many cheaters are turned off and disgusted by their betrayed spouse who is too willing to forgive. In a way it proves to the cheater they are the higher value spouse.

Edited by Furious
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We're starting MC next week, and he's really good with me lately, the husband I'd always wanted him to be. But I have a dilemma: shall I contact his ex mistress to double check if he's telling the truth? This might change everything in case the two stories would not be the same. I'm not sure if I am ready to know but on the other hand, while weeks goes on, I know I don't want to live the rest of my life thinking that he's still lying and might get away with it.

I'm feel so conflicted.

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My first marriage ended with an affair.

 

 

For me, the details were unimportant. I did not reconcile though. My take was that once I found out and processed it reconciliation would never happen. There are so many other people out there that can make someone happy, why mess with a broken partnership.

 

I feel your pain and understand not everyone can just walk away. But if you are not willing to then you are probably going to have to deal with this again.

 

Good luck. I hope you find peace.

 

But having a very small child together and living in a country that is not my country would make things very difficult to arrange. It would mean me leaving and taking the child away from him. Which us horrible, not for him, he deserves this since the moment he decided that his selfish needs were worth more than his family and marriage, but for the child. I grew up without my father, he died when I was really young and I would like my child to avoid this pain.

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: shall I contact his ex mistress to double check if he's telling the truth?

 

His mistress may not tell you the truth and if she is still seeing him she will cover up for him and tell you she hasn't heard from him, or if she isn't in contact, she may tell you she is, to cause trouble for you and him...

 

People in affairs lie. She is NOT your friend, she will probably see herself as your competitor or your enemy. In the event she sees herself as one out of two wronged women, the other being you, the fact you are reconciling with the common "enemy" (your husband) will alienate her from you.

All in all you cannot trust a word she says.

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Southwardbound
But having a very small child together and living in a country that is not my country would make things very difficult to arrange. It would mean me leaving and taking the child away from him. Which us horrible, not for him, he deserves this since the moment he decided that his selfish needs were worth more than his family and marriage, but for the child. I grew up without my father, he died when I was really young and I would like my child to avoid this pain.

 

Try not to let what happened with your Father, influence your own actions. It is far better to raise a child in a happy, single parent household, than a two parent unhappy household. Do you really wish to teach your child that a loveless marriage is an acceptable one?

 

I know it is very hard to make these sort of decisions, especially when your child is young. But you have to think about not only what is best for the child, but also you long-term. I can tell you from experience that children are very resilient and will be fine with a long distance divorce.

 

I believe I mentioned to you earlier what you need to do to set in motion to leave, if that is what you decide to do. Make sure if you do leave, that you have a money safety net in cash (not in the bank) ahead of time, etc...

Good luck.

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If I were you, I would bundle my child up and go home to the UK, to friends and family.

 

You don't want to be alone in a strange country with a bad marriage and a cheating husband.

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Southwardbound
If I were you, I would bundle my child up and go home to the UK, to friends and family.

 

You don't want to be alone in a strange country with a bad marriage and a cheating husband.

 

If you do this make sure you are living in the UK for just over six months BEFORE you start your divorce, this way your when you do the child custody part, your domicile will be considered to be in the UK. The UK has a good basic financial support system for single parents that can help you out with reasonable housing and finances. Travel across EU nations is easy and cheap, plus with internet now, if you H really wants to keep up his relationship with your child he won't have any problems doing so. Before you decide what your going to do long term with your relationship you really need to think it through in depth as these decisions will affect you for another 17 years.

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Personally, I don’t want a partner for all things in life (a spouse) that has no problem lying straight to my face. I think you are right to investigate up one side and down the other. But what the other poster said about contacting the OW is likely good advice. Unless she is prepared to offer proof of things (like ongoing contact), you’re very unlikely to be able to believe anything she says.

 

But in general I think that investigating after an affair is simply wise and the price of admission. The bonus is that if you investigate and find nothing, then you both win. This is how trust is rebuilt. You can trust but you should verify. And when you see consistently verified actions over time, then the trust is gradually restored.

 

On the flip side, if you do find he’s lying, you’re in a better position to make informed decisions. I think it’s best that you both embrace the need for your investigations. If he’s receptive to it, that can also speak volumes.

 

The alternative is to never really know. I really doubt that lasts. It only throws a rug over the mess. Nothing buried gets healed.

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Hi, I posted here before but this time I would like to hear from Betrayed Spouses. How important you think it is, in order to heal, to know all the truth? Would you go as far as reaching out as your spouse/partner's affair partner to know that? Do you feel like the need to know details like exactly how long the affair lasted for is useful? I really want to be able to forgive my WS but because his shame and fear of losing our family ( and quite possibly pride too) he's being very vague about details of his indisctretion/s. This is turning into obsession for me, even if what I want more is being able to forgive him. But I feel that in order to do that I need conplete honesty, even if it hurts. Could be that I have it already, could not be.so difficult to trust someone who lied on you before already. I'm open to your experiences and suggestions.

 

I did (reach out to the AP). I feel like I never would have gotten the truth if I hadn't. Remember, women are likely to lie about the sex, men are likely to lie about everything else. The AP gave me the real sex details and a near complete fabrication of the "how it happened" and "who pursed who". My wife gave me the opposite, sex details that sound like something from a RomCom and the real "how it happened" story. I never confirmed her "how it happened" with the AP, but my W did eventually confirm the sex details that I got from the AP as accurate/true. It came at a price though, trusting the POSOM over your W puts you in a bad spot; it's almost like you and her AP against her. Not exactly good for healing, that's for sure.

 

Also, I will say, I "had something" over the AP, something that was very important to him that I did not disclose, so he had very good reason to respond to me and tell me the truth. Had I not had this, I'm not sure I would have gone down this route because the AP has every reason in the world to lie/minimize and make it all the other person's (in this case, your spouse) fault. I also went way beyond "legal/moral" in my quest for electronic data, I'm not happy with myself for this either, some of it was way over the line. It did give me more and let me wring out the last couple of confessions, but, all of this stuff, it comes at a price to the BS. You become, at least I did, a more crappy version of yourself. I spent months after d-day making threats, being a bully, gathering intelligence using illegal methods, and basically just being a POS. It's not like I didn't have justification, but, I crossed the line and now have to live with it.

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Is that what he's telling me about length of the affair (wasn't really an affair, was more something he had before me and never stopped, I am basically the other woman but the other knew about me and I didn't know about her)

I need to know how much he can go further with lies and keep up a normal appearance. Also, has he had contacts on whatsapp with another woman who lives far away from us I want confirmation that they never actually met.

I am really tempted to write to the first one as she hates him and feels like he used her (she didn't know we were going to get married or having a child).

 

I did (reach out to the AP). I feel like I never would have gotten the truth if I hadn't. Remember, women are likely to lie about the sex, men are likely to lie about everything else. The AP gave me the real sex details and a near complete fabrication of the "how it happened" and "who pursed who". My wife gave me the opposite, sex details that sound like something from a RomCom and the real "how it happened" story. I never confirmed her "how it happened" with the AP, but my W did eventually confirm the sex details that I got from the AP as accurate/true. It came at a price though, trusting the POSOM over your W puts you in a bad spot; it's almost like you and her AP against her. Not exactly good for healing, that's for sure.

 

Also, I will say, I "had something" over the AP, something that was very important to him that I did not disclose, so he had very good reason to respond to me and tell me the truth. Had I not had this, I'm not sure I would have gone down this route because the AP has every reason in the world to lie/minimize and make it all the other person's (in this case, your spouse) fault. I also went way beyond "legal/moral" in my quest for electronic data, I'm not happy with myself for this either, some of it was way over the line. It did give me more and let me wring out the last couple of confessions, but, all of this stuff, it comes at a price to the BS. You become, at least I did, a more crappy version of yourself. I spent months after d-day making threats, being a bully, gathering intelligence using illegal methods, and basically just being a POS. It's not like I didn't have justification, but, I crossed the line and now have to live with it.

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  • 2 weeks later...

It's VERY important to me. Unfortunately, my husband is a compulsive liar and he definitely felt the need to lie and conceal his cheatings from me, while continuing to do them on occasion, or at very least engage in the very behaviors that led to his cheatings (i.e., going to bars and strip clubs). All my life I've had people deceive me by hiding stuff from me, because they "didn't want to hurt my feelings," which is utmost insulting and condescending. My mother did this when I was a child, my best friend/cousin did this, my college friends did this, various cheater exes did this to me, I suspect my mother-in-law did this to some extent because she was worried that any divorce would lead to her not seeing her grandkids again (which is total BULL!), etc. It's mortifying and infuriating. I have NO tolerance for it. But it happens.

 

I think the truth is utmost important. However, sometimes you have to go with your gut and circumstantial evidence, which might go against what you are normally taught to go by, esp if you are a cop, lawyer, teacher, or scientist...since these professions tend to emphasize the need to get documented proof first before making any decisions or handing down consequences or diagnoses. But in cases like this, sometimes you HAVE to go with your gut, in order to save your time, dignity, and sanity. Eventually that's what I did--I assumed he cheated at least once during all of his 48 secret strip club visits, so therefore I treated myself to a fling of my own at the local male revue strip club--and as it turned out, my gut was right the entire time.

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