Betrayed&Stayed Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Discussion got heated over acknowledging the elephant in the room. I was in our bedroom reading a book when my wife asked me to watch a show with her. So I did. We try to watch it every week. Anyhow, the show had two scenes close together that involve two different affairs. I was able to handle the first scene, but once the second scene came up I lost interest. I got up and checked something in my office, and then returned to our bedroom to continue reading my book. The show ends and my wife asks me why I left. I asked her if she really has no idea why. She responds with a No. Again I ask her with an emphasis on her being honest with me. Again she responds with a No. At this point I see only two options: (1) She’s lying, or (2) she’s incredibly insensitive. Neither one is good. In short, we spent an hour arguing over this and resolving the conflict. The resolution was that I would like for her to acknowledge the elephant in the room. I wasn’t upset about her affair. I wasn’t upset with the show. I was upset that she ignored the elephant in the room. If she had only came into the bedroom and acknowledged the elephant in the room, then I would’ve been just fine and calm. Resolution: We came up with non-verbal signs that we will give to each other to acknowledge the elephant in the room. For those reconciling, how do you handle the elephant in the room? Link to post Share on other sites
Sub Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 She should be more sensitive, but if she asks you, just tell her. If non-verbal signs work, that's cool. But just be honest, and include that you think she's being insensitive for having to ask, in one shot. The real test comes the next time. If she condescendingly asks if you're ok when something like this happens again, and treats it like a joke, then you have a bigger issue. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
RightThere Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Discussion got heated over acknowledging the elephant in the room. I was in our bedroom reading a book when my wife asked me to watch a show with her. So I did. We try to watch it every week. Anyhow, the show had two scenes close together that involve two different affairs. I was able to handle the first scene, but once the second scene came up I lost interest. I got up and checked something in my office, and then returned to our bedroom to continue reading my book. The show ends and my wife asks me why I left. I asked her if she really has no idea why. She responds with a No. Again I ask her with an emphasis on her being honest with me. Again she responds with a No. At this point I see only two options: (1) She’s lying, or (2) she’s incredibly insensitive. Neither one is good. In short, we spent an hour arguing over this and resolving the conflict. The resolution was that I would like for her to acknowledge the elephant in the room. I wasn’t upset about her affair. I wasn’t upset with the show. I was upset that she ignored the elephant in the room. If she had only came into the bedroom and acknowledged the elephant in the room, then I would’ve been just fine and calm. Resolution: We came up with non-verbal signs that we will give to each other to acknowledge the elephant in the room. For those reconciling, how do you handle the elephant in the room? Off track, but some advice. Don't do that to your wife again. You're playing the same tactic women have used forever in the "You mean you don't know what's wrong?" If the scene bothered you, you should have said it. Not dance around it for an hour. Communication is on of the reasons you were probably in relationship troubles in the first place. Although the non-verbal cues are a good tool. 9 Link to post Share on other sites
drifter777 Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 I understand that my WW never - and I mean never - wants to discuss, remember, or talk about her cheating. And it's not a subconscious thing, it's something that she is very aware of. Even when she knows something has or will trigger me she acts as though it is a complete surprise. But I get it. I accept the enormity of her regret and shame are things she'd rather be left in the past forever. The elephant in the room is nearly transparent to her even when it's bright purple to me. That's just the way it is now, always has been and always will be. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
michelangelo Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Shoulda just said, I don't like watching shows with affairs in them and suggested turning the channel. If she protested, then complain or leave the room. That she is not traumatized by her own affair as you are is something you have to deal with. The fact is, a wandering spouse does not suffer the kind of pain that a betrayed spouse does. It is different for them. Link to post Share on other sites
SarahJames Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 \ I wasn’t upset about her affair. I wasn’t upset with the show. I was upset that she ignored the elephant in the room. If she had only came into the bedroom and acknowledged the elephant in the room, then I would’ve been just fine and calm. These few sentences you expressed here speak VOLUMES. You're deflecting. By saying "I wasn't upset about her affair. I wasn't upset with the show," what you're really saying is "I'm upset. I'm upset with my wife. I'm upset that she cheated. I'm upset that she fails to acknowledge it in these awkward situations. I'm upset because I'm still hurt. I'm not over it. I have not forgiven her. The ignoring isn't working. And I hate that her solution has been ignoring what SHE did to our marriage". Don't play games with her. Tell her exactly how you feel, but also take her feelings into consideration. What she did was wrong, yes. BUT you can't punish her for the rest of her life for the mistakes she made. You either work on truly forgiving her, or you're going to have to let her go. Those are your only two options because by bringing it up, even when a similar scenario plays out in a TV show, what you're doing is making her feel guilty. She will only be able to handle so much. There will come a point where she is no longer able to take the heat. This is by no means to down-play what it has done to you. All I am saying is - don't play the "do you REALLY not know what is bothering me" game. It isn't worth it. Communicate openly and HONESTLY in the most sensitive way you can to minimize anyone's feelings getting hurt. Best of luck. 7 Link to post Share on other sites
drifter777 Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 What she did was wrong, yes. BUT you can't punish her for the rest of her life for the mistakes she made. You either work on truly forgiving her, or you're going to have to let her go. Those are your only two options because by bringing it up, even when a similar scenario plays out in a TV show, what you're doing is making her feel guilty. She will only be able to handle so much. There will come a point where she is no longer able to take the heat. This is by no means to down-play what it has done to you. All I am saying is - don't play the "do you REALLY not know what is bothering me" game. It isn't worth it. Communicate openly and HONESTLY in the most sensitive way you can to minimize anyone's feelings getting hurt. Best of luck. I agree with nearly all of this post except for the part highlighted above. I agree that bringing it up in this passive/aggressive way is not productive but it shouldn't surprise anyone that there are things that trigger a BS. In my experience it works much better when I say to my WW "this triggers all those horrible feelings attached to your cheating so I think we should talk about it later (or now)". When you do what you did you also ignored that elephant. It happened and you are still trying to recover. Be direct and honest. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
JamesM Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Off track, but some advice. Don't do that to your wife again. You're playing the same tactic women have used forever in the "You mean you don't know what's wrong?" If the scene bothered you, you should have said it. Not dance around it for an hour. Communication is on of the reasons you were probably in relationship troubles in the first place. Although the non-verbal cues are a good tool. This. My first thought when I read your post was...you mean you didn't tell her why? Are you assuming that she has the same thought directions as you? That is not logical. Yes, she could have thought about the affair, but it is also likely that she was involved with the story line and did not think of how it may affect you. I have had the same type of convo with my wife except I was the "clueless one." It is very frustrating to be in that position when your mind is off in another direction. She was not insensitive or lying. There is at least another option: she was clueless. Link to post Share on other sites
whatatangledweb Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 I tell my husband that the show or whatever was triggering me and I couldn't watch. Then I would leave the room. He always turned the channel and come get me and say I'm sorry. He now knows and just turns the channel. He knows I will trigger which makes him feel bad also. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Artie Lang Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 the show's subject matter- vis-à-vis, her affair -caused you to trigger. she's either playing dumb, or is really that obtuse. if it's the latter, you have a problem here. she should know the subject matter alone is gonna make you uncomfortable. i think you should communicate this directly. the time for "non-verbal" signs has passed. you need to make your feelings known- LOUD & CLEAR. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
painfullyobvious Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Just be honest with your wife and tell her that sometimes you are triggered by situations, thoughts and other things that make you reflect back on the affair she had. The is no need to have a secret signal or signs or dance around the issue. Just say this is making me recall the affair. Honest direct communication is what will lead to full reconciliation between you two. She needs to know you are hurting as a result of her behavior and she needs to see you are trying to move forward and beyond the results of the affair. Its a good time to communicate together about the triggers. Look at these situations as building blocks for a new foundation... Good luck Link to post Share on other sites
Furious Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Discussion got heated over acknowledging the elephant in the room. I was in our bedroom reading a book when my wife asked me to watch a show with her. So I did. We try to watch it every week. Anyhow, the show had two scenes close together that involve two different affairs. I was able to handle the first scene, but once the second scene came up I lost interest. I got up and checked something in my office, and then returned to our bedroom to continue reading my book. The show ends and my wife asks me why I left. I asked her if she really has no idea why. She responds with a No. Again I ask her with an emphasis on her being honest with me. Again she responds with a No. At this point I see only two options: (1) She’s lying, or (2) she’s incredibly insensitive. Neither one is good. In short, we spent an hour arguing over this and resolving the conflict. The resolution was that I would like for her to acknowledge the elephant in the room. I wasn’t upset about her affair. I wasn’t upset with the show. I was upset that she ignored the elephant in the room. If she had only came into the bedroom and acknowledged the elephant in the room, then I would’ve been just fine and calm. Resolution: We came up with non-verbal signs that we will give to each other to acknowledge the elephant in the room. For those reconciling, how do you handle the elephant in the room? A truly remorseful spouse is proactive about triggers and keeps the elephant in Africa. 6 Link to post Share on other sites
AlwaysGrowing Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Oh, I most definitely think private signals are great. You never know when a trigger might occur, that way you can be discreet. It gives your wife the opportunity to acknowledge it, or she lets you know..that she knows this is difficult..and she is there for you without you having to say anything. You can give the signal or she can. Either way, it is giving the WS the opportunity to acknowledge it before it becomes too much. Also, the more a WS can be proactive. the more likely triggers will lessen. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
jnj express Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 How did you get yourself thru the 1st A, on the TV---much less 2 in a row---that's just dredging up as you say the elephant in the room As to your wife--if she didn't really know what was bothering you----then she has no idea what remorse is all about Link to post Share on other sites
Author Betrayed&Stayed Posted November 27, 2013 Author Share Posted November 27, 2013 Let me get this thread back on track. I could have verbalized why I left the room, but I didn’t for several reasons: 1 – She KNEW why. I knew that she knew. During our conversion she admitted that she knew. But she hoped that it was for another reason. While watching the show I recognized that she SAW the elephant. The idiom “elephant in the room” implies that everyone sees the elephant, and that everyone knows that everyone else sees the elephant. 2 – There is a long history of anytime I verbalize my triggers than I am either “throwing it in her face”, I’m “dwelling on it”, or combination thereof. Neither are true. In this case I just didn’t care to watch the show anymore. At this point 99% of my triggers have little power over me. They are just reminders. 3 – My wife has a long history (back to FOO) of avoiding conversations that can get heated or controversial. She would rather not rock the boat. She has gotten much better over the years. She agreed that she was not being forthcoming in regards to the elephant. She also admitted that she needs to be more sensitive. By having a non-verbal sign, I can let her know without the risk "throwing it in her face". I started this thread for people to share their experiences since I’m sure this is a common occurrence. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
dichotomy Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Funny - this exact thing, just came up and we adressed it in MC. Wife knew and so did I why I lost interest.....we were watching a very interesting TV series but it had a constant story line of an affair going on. We have a couple of key words we use post dDay..... One that I stole from another poster here is "Rabitt Hole". As in this is about to plunge me down the rabbit hole of her "advenures in wonderland" with OM. Anything that comes up that triggers me on affair/OM I can say this key word.... and she understands we/she need to change things up. This could be said even in front of others, since no one knows what the heck this means. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
jnj express Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 Why would your wife even think about putting anything on the TV, that has to do with an A---and believe me today's TV schedules have a lot of it---she knows it is a trigger Does your wife hold you and help you thru your pain---when it arises---she should be doing everything she can to help you thru times of pain-----for ----BUT FOR---what your wife did, you would not be having these triggers---at least that is what a good selfless/remorseful/accountable spouse who had an A, would do, and they would do it for as long as it takes----years and years and years----IF NECESSARY Link to post Share on other sites
bubbaganoosh Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 I wasn’t upset about her affair. I wasn’t upset with the show. I was upset that she ignored the elephant in the room. You never told us how you handled the situation when you found out about her affair. The only thing you said was and I quote, "I wasn't upset about her affair". This leads me to believe that when you found out she was cheating that you did very little or nothing about it and as far as she was concerned, you were done with it. I might be wrong on this because you haven't told us what happened so if that's the case then she's probably not going to see the elephant in the room. Maybe you should have been harder on her infidelity and she would be more sensitive. Link to post Share on other sites
Spectre Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 To be honest, I just went and read the OP's original topic about his situation..and I think he should divorce this woman immediately. Why waste your life with her? Why stay with someone who, even though you are not raging mad anymore gives you, and I quote, a "dull ache"? Link to post Share on other sites
Spark1111 Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 well, I let the elephant simmer as I mull over my feelings, my triggers, and try to decide if it is sensitive, hypersensitive, can I get through it, or am I truly going a bit crazy and over thinking it all? And after all that AGONIZING THINKING, I just come out and shoot the damn elephant! For example, MY H has only recently discovered the musical artist Adele, and plays her constantly as he does with any artist he admires. I admire her too but I listened to her constantly last year and he has only just discovered her work. So in the car, okay. then in the house. Finally it was all that was playing and I burst out of the bedroom recently one day and TOLD HIM I AM STARTING TO TRIGGER.... Her music is all about the one who got away and we need to put on another artist NOW! He was shocked I felt that way or that I perceived that! he apologized, hugged me and had no idea those were my thoughts.....he just really liked her music. None of us are mind readers....speak your feelings and speak in headlines when you trigger. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Betrayed&Stayed Posted November 28, 2013 Author Share Posted November 28, 2013 You never told us how you handled the situation when you found out about her affair. The only thing you said was and I quote, "I wasn't upset about her affair". This leads me to believe that when you found out she was cheating that you did very little or nothing about it and as far as she was concerned, you were done with it. I might be wrong on this because you haven't told us what happened so if that's the case then she's probably not going to see the elephant in the room. Maybe you should have been harder on her infidelity and she would be more sensitive. Her affair was in 1999. She confessed in 2008. We spent 3 yrs in IC and MC (on and off). The worst part of it is behind us now. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 Discussion got heated over acknowledging the elephant in the room. I was in our bedroom reading a book when my wife asked me to watch a show with her. So I did. We try to watch it every week. Anyhow, the show had two scenes close together that involve two different affairs. I was able to handle the first scene, but once the second scene came up I lost interest. I got up and checked something in my office, and then returned to our bedroom to continue reading my book. The show ends and my wife asks me why I left. I asked her if she really has no idea why. She responds with a No. Again I ask her with an emphasis on her being honest with me. Again she responds with a No. At this point I see only two options: (1) She’s lying, or (2) she’s incredibly insensitive. Neither one is good. In short, we spent an hour arguing over this and resolving the conflict. The resolution was that I would like for her to acknowledge the elephant in the room. I wasn’t upset about her affair. I wasn’t upset with the show. I was upset that she ignored the elephant in the room. If she had only came into the bedroom and acknowledged the elephant in the room, then I would’ve been just fine and calm. Resolution: We came up with non-verbal signs that we will give to each other to acknowledge the elephant in the room. For those reconciling, how do you handle the elephant in the room? Wow, even a silly joke about it or saying 'Hmm, that was slightly awkward moment..' would have meant she "got it" and acknowledged it. You are right, neither is good. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 You never told us how you handled the situation when you found out about her affair. The only thing you said was and I quote, "I wasn't upset about her affair". This leads me to believe that when you found out she was cheating that you did very little or nothing about it and as far as she was concerned, you were done with it. I might be wrong on this because you haven't told us what happened so if that's the case then she's probably not going to see the elephant in the room. Maybe you should have been harder on her infidelity and she would be more sensitive. Go look at his back history, her A was a while ago, not recent. Link to post Share on other sites
twosadthings Posted November 29, 2013 Share Posted November 29, 2013 An extended middle finger makes a pretty clear and unambiguous sign. Just sayin', Twosadthings Link to post Share on other sites
Author Betrayed&Stayed Posted November 29, 2013 Author Share Posted November 29, 2013 An extended middle finger makes a pretty clear and unambiguous sign. Just sayin', Twosadthings Yes. It's very effective Link to post Share on other sites
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