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How do you condemn one and sleep with the other?


Mr. Lucky

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I'm often struck by the need of many BS that have reconciled with their WS to continue to vilify the OW/M. Regardless of the affair circumstances, their WS somehow was the "victim" and the AP the "predator". If the AP was a woman, they're portrayed as unstable, loose, less attractive, etc. If a man, they morph into manipulative, sexual harassing, shallow, etc. If there's contact after D-Day, your spouse "slipped up" but the AP is a "stalker".

 

All this is probably human nature at work. But common sense says that of the two participants, one was certainly more beholden to you and in a position to cause you the most hurt and pain. So how do you you forgive one (if possible) and not other? If you reconcile and move on, how do you sleep with one but continue to condemn the other :confused: ???

 

Mr. Lucky

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I guess I can't answer this. I don't feel the OW was a bogeyman.

 

But she has done nothing to show remorse or regret towards me- and my spouse has. She has also not shown remorse towards the other betrayed spouse in the other EMR she was involved in concurrently during the affair with my spouse.

 

And she continues to attempt to poke when she can. I am hoping that after the last attempt she has finally stopped. fingers crossed.

 

But have I demonized her? No. Did she knowingly mak a series of bad choices that have harmed multiple families? Yes.

 

Acknowledging that isn't an unreasonable reaction.

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secretlady76

As the OW I was seen as the person totally to blame, regardless of the fact that we were both married with kids and were 50/50 to blame. The BS blamed the whole thing on me and even told everyone else I was stalking him (despite the fact that it was the other way round).

 

I wonder if any of this was down to MM downplaying his part in it to save his own back. He must have fed her such a load of lies, because she was so convinced it was all my fault that she assulted me in the end. Now he's beating himself up about that because he drove her to it.

 

It's much easier for the BS to blame the OW/OM than admitting that some of the responsibility lies at home.

 

Just shows the true colours of the AP.....cowardly.

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As the OW I was seen as the person totally to blame, regardless of the fact that we were both married with kids and were 50/50 to blame. The BS blamed the whole thing on me and even told everyone else I was stalking him (despite the fact that it was the other way round).

 

I wonder if any of this was down to MM downplaying his part in it to save his own back. He must have fed her such a load of lies, because she was so convinced it was all my fault that she assulted me in the end. Now he's beating himself up about that because he drove her to it.

 

It's much easier for the BS to blame the OW/OM than admitting that some of the responsibility lies at home.

 

Just shows the true colours of the AP.....cowardly.

 

Be careful with generalizations.

 

Blaming the OW more than my spouse would have done nothing to reconcile my marriage.

 

And it sounds like the MM in your situation continued to lie and contributed to his wife thinking as she did.

 

I mean this gently- but maybe take a step back and look at that dynamic. You're blaming her for believing his lies.

 

Isn't that what you were just complaining about? Blaming the wrong person?

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I'm often struck by the need of many BS that have reconciled with their WS to continue to vilify the OW/M. Regardless of the affair circumstances, their WS somehow was the "victim" and the AP the "predator". If the AP was a woman, they're portrayed as unstable, loose, less attractive, etc. If a man, they morph into manipulative, sexual harassing, shallow, etc. If there's contact after D-Day, your spouse "slipped up" but the AP is a "stalker".

 

All this is probably human nature at work. But common sense says that of the two participants, one was certainly more beholden to you and in a position to cause you the most hurt and pain. So how do you you forgive one (if possible) and not other? If you reconcile and move on, how do you sleep with one but continue to condemn the other :confused: ???

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Just thank you for posting this. I've been wanting to do so and trying to find the words, well said. I wonder this often and hope to see more open minded BS responses to gain a little insight.

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Why do so many OW think that the BS only blames them? I agree that there are some that put more emphasis on the OW, but has it not been said on this forum over and over that the one who gets most of the blame is the WS? My xWS got MOST of the blame and yes, the OW did get some of the blame as well, but she did help him hurt me, so the way I see it, she is not innocent. BUT, like I said, the xWS get's most of the blame (if not all, by many).

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Why do so many OW think that the BS only blames them? I agree that there are some that put more emphasis on the OW, but has it not been said on this forum over and over that the one who gets most of the blame is the WS? My xWS got MOST of the blame and yes, the OW did get some of the blame as well, but she did help him hurt me, so the way I see it, she is not innocent. BUT, like I said, the xWS get's most of the blame (if not all, by many).

 

This is where I am at. who is telling them this?

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secretlady76
This is where I am at. who is telling them this?

 

Who is telling them this? The BS for one, who is believing what their WS is telling them; the result of which is that they contact the OW/OM and give them wrath/100% blame them. Further down the line I suspect the BS starts to blame the WS once the dust settles and the truth comes out etc.

I am simply telling you my experience and experience of others I know. Not to say that it is the general rule of thumb.

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underwater2010

I did condemn both equally. Both were married with kids and both took a chance at losing life as they knew it. But only one took the time to apologize and redeem themselves. No apology, no forgiveness.

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Who is telling them this? The BS for one, who is believing what their WS is telling them; the result of which is that they contact the OW/OM and give them wrath/100% blame them. Further down the line I suspect the BS starts to blame the WS once the dust settles and the truth comes out etc.

I am simply telling you my experience and experience of others I know. Not to say that it is the general rule of thumb.

 

Who is telling you that the OW is blamed first?

 

Most of the betrayed spouses I know? Were so hurt and angry- and at the beginning- feeling knocked off their feet- that other than the exposure of the truth- they wanted nothing to do with the OW/OM.

 

So I am sorry for being unclear- but who is telling you that the betrayeds are more angry at the OW/OM than the WS? The WS?

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Who is telling them this? The BS for one, who is believing what their WS is telling them; the result of which is that they contact the OW/OM and give them wrath/100% blame them. Further down the line I suspect the BS starts to blame the WS once the dust settles and the truth comes out etc.

I am simply telling you my experience and experience of others I know. Not to say that it is the general rule of thumb.

 

Giving them wrath is not placing 100% of the blame on them. Being angry at an OW/M is not placing 100% of the blame on them. Asking them to take responsibility is not placing 100% of the blame on them. Confronting, is not either. I contacted the OW in my situation, but I did not say or elude to her that I thought she was 100% responsible for the affair.

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AnotherRound

When my exH had an affair, I was angry with him - only slightly disappointed with the OW. I remember thinking, "if only OW wouldn't participate in affairs, then the WHs wouldn't have anyone to have an affair with!". I was young, and it was an unrealistic view of the world, lol - but I can honestly say, I felt sorry for the OW in my case. Not because she was the OW, but because I knew that my exH was desperate to get out of our marriage, but was unable to directly converse with me about this - or even admit it. His OW was his exit - and she was used for that part - she was even younger than I was and had very few relationships and not much worldly wisdom.

 

I contacted her once, let her know that I knew (she denied it), and that was it. I never bothered with her again. When I think of her now, I don't feel anything. I wasn't angry with her - I was just sad for her. And really sad that my exH didn't feel that he could come to me with his concerns and issues - as I also wanted a divorce, but when I tried to discuss it with him, he simply left the house and avoided the discussion at all costs.

 

I understand why some people hyperfocus on the AP - it makes sense in some ways with the level of hurt they are experiencing - and perhaps, if my exH and I had been blissful, or I had thought we were and was then blindsided, I might have felt the same way. But, in my case, I was just as unhappy as he was and wasn't surprised in the least that our marriage was bad enough that he had an affair. I wasn't blind to the problems we were having, nor was I experiencing any kind of delusion that we were happy (not that BSs are delusional or blind, I'm just saying, I wasn't surprised, I knew very well that we were in a bad marriage).

 

Also, my exMMs exW tends to now hyperfocus on the OW who came after I ended with exMM - bc she flipped and brought a lot of attention to herself during their whole situation. Of course, my experience may not apply here bc even though there were some half-hearted attempts to reconcile in both cases, the reality was that both marriages were dead long ago, and everyone really needed to move on to be healthy and happy. So, there really wasn't any vilifying of the AP and continued sleeping with the WS.

 

It's an interesting question though - I'm hopeful to read some insightful responses.

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Because he is the one spending every day making it up to me and our kids. He is the one who has to look us in the eye everyday knowing that we all know what he did. He has to live with how he hurt his family.

Somewhat disingenuous because the OW/M didn't have a relationship with you to repair in the first place. Also, most BS (rightfully) insist on NC post D-Day.

WE as the BS have to pay the steepest price of all, but on here we are maligned as the bad guy. How dare we not just act like a lady and take it?

 

How dare we have any anger for either of the people involved.

Assuming your question is aimed at me as the OP, I'd gently suggest you missed my point. You have every right to be angry at everyone involved, I know I was.

 

But if you're going to forgive and reconcile with a spouse that promised fidelity before God and family, how do you actively hate the AP during that same process? If a crime was committed, your WS robbed the bank - the AP was only the getaway car driver. The courts usually treat them more leniently...

 

Mr. Lucky

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I did condemn both equally. Both were married with kids and both took a chance at losing life as they knew it. But only one took the time to apologize and redeem themselves. No apology, no forgiveness.

Isn't it obvious that one had a much greater vested interest and motivation post D-Day? To expect the same from both AP's (towards you) doesn't come close to making sense...

 

Mr. Lucky

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I think it's rare to find a BS that says "I blame the AP 100%". However we often see APs on here saying something like "the BS blamed me 100%".

 

So the issue of where the BS lays the blame is very much one of perception. Instead of relying on where the AP thinks the BS lays the blame, why not go with what BSs themselves say?

 

As for condemning the OW in my case, that's easy for me to do as I have no ongoing relationship with her and no interest in forgiving her. At best, she's irrelevant in my life now and I hope she remains so.

 

I'm still with my H (more than 4 years post d-day) and I sleep with him and am gradually regaining trust and respect for him. I sleep with him because we love each other and are married and that's what married people in love do. If you mean "sex" then that has become a priority for me as I don't want to neglect that side of marriage.

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Isn't it obvious that one had a much greater vested interest and motivation post D-Day? To expect the same from both AP's (towards you) doesn't come close to making sense...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Huh?

 

When you knowingly harm another person, it's okay to apologize.

 

Even if you are not married to them.

 

It's human decency. To apologize for harm, and to do no more.

 

In your mind, what should the BS do? Not be angry at both parties? To roll over and not have a reaction?

 

Most betrayed spouses I have encountered are crushed. And hurt. And angry at both perpetrators. The vast majority I have encountered are far angrier at their spouses than the other person.

 

So what answer are you looking for?

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AnotherRound

I think that this thread brings up another question too - that of "consequences" within a marriage after an A if the marriage continues. When I read that a BS is "consequencing" their spouse, I literally cringe - it sounds so... unhealthy. Natural consequences are one thing - but actively punishing a spouse is unhealthy and I just don't see how those relationships are ever going to be healthy again (if they ever were?).

 

So, this condemnation doesn't just apply to the Others I don't think. I think that people who believe in condemning someone, spread it around - they don't just focus it on the AP. However, I think that they also feel highly justified in punishing their WS and so that makes it okay to continue on with them - if the WS takes it. (I can hardly write that without becoming ill, seriously).

 

I don't claim that every BS is this way, obviously -but I have seen it, and have read about it here at times. Where a BS is handing out punishment with an almost glee that the WS is sticking around for it - and a belief that this is some kind of proof that the WS is choosing them. I think it's abusive, unhealthy - and won't work long term in any situation (unless you have a WS who has absolutely no boundaries or self respect).

 

So maybe it's not about condemning the AP and continuing on with the WS - maybe it's about condemning them both and exacting revenge on the WS that feels justified (in some cases, obvs not all!).

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ComingInHot

Mr.lucky, " So how do you you forgive one (if possible) and not other? If you reconcile and move on, how do you sleep with one but continue to condemn the other ???"

 

I don't. I forgave them both.

 

However, it took more effort to control myself in not directing my pain and anger onto the exOW because, like her, we didn't have feelings for each other. It's much easier to take anger out on some person who intruded on your M (regardless of invitation by cheating spouse) rather than on someone you love.*

 

I knew it would do me no good though, so I let her go.

 

Wish she would have done the same to me... :confused:

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Most betrayed spouses I have encountered are crushed. And hurt. And angry at both perpetrators. The vast majority I have encountered are far angrier at their spouses than the other person.

And yet, at least in those marriages that continue, that spouse is forgiven.

 

I'm not looking for an "answer", just contrasting my perspective with others. Nor am I looking to invalidate anyone's feelings - if there's ever an occasion where you have the right to feel however you feel, from numbness to white-hot anger, disclosure is that time. My exW and I didn't reconcile for a lot of reasons so I never dealt with this going forward. At least initially, I had zero interest in or deep seated animosity toward him as he wasn't the one I felt had betrayed me. Others feel differently and your responses help me understand why...

 

Mr. Lucky

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Mr.lucky, " So how do you you forgive one (if possible) and not other? If you reconcile and move on, how do you sleep with one but continue to condemn the other ???"

 

I don't. I forgave them both.

 

However, it took more effort to control myself in not directing my pain and anger onto the exOW because, like her, we didn't have feelings for each other. It's much easier to take anger out on some person who intruded on your M (regardless of invitation by cheating spouse) rather than on someone you love.*

 

I knew it would do me no good though, so I let her go.

 

Wish she would have done the same to me... :confused:

Understood. What was the eventual fate of your marriage?

 

Mr. Lucky

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By the same token then I did not ever have a relationship with her so I don't owe her any forgiveness, I don't owe her any understanding.

Again, I'm struck by the contradiction involved. She wasn't the one that made a lifetime commitment of fidelity to you and then, whilst lying to your face, broke that vow in every way possible. At least that's what I felt my exW did to me. To me, the other participant was a stranger. I couldn't have cared less about him. And yet a significant percentage of posters here, a couple of years or more out, have reconciled but still have a hard time not describing the AP in pretty disparaging terms.

 

Maybe it's a successful coping mechanism. The OM/W (or at least what they represent) becomes a place to put some or all of the hurt, anger and pain a BS feels. And that transfer is part of your WS becoming less of a monster and more of a person. Combined with remorse/transparency/re-commitment, it seems to work for some. Just, to me, a curious process...

 

Mr. Lucky

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if one is going to look at it that way, then could it not be argues that the wayward spouse is easier to forgive because they may feel that the conditions in the marriage are why they cheated, and the betrayed spouse helped to contribute to those conditions?

I'd guess only if the BS feels that cheating is an acceptable - and ultimately forgivable - response to the prevailing marital conditions....

 

Mr. Lucky

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Certainly agree. Everyone's perspective and priorities are different. It's what makes LS interesting...

 

Mr. Lucky

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I've rarely seen a BS on LS completely or even mostly blame the OW/OM for an affair. Maybe I've missed something, but I don't think so. It makes me wonder what caused the OP to be posted.

 

Anyways, I agree with the poster that said something to the effect that it may seem like BS,s blame the OW/OM more because the OW/OM does not get a glimse of what goes on behind closed doors. I imagine that most WS find it more than unpleasant on D-day.

 

As for the BS who puts most of the blame on the OW- you have to remember that many MM (and maybe many MW) are excellant liars. They are also very skilled at manipulating people in an emotional way.

 

I'm sure there are some BS who blame the OW/OM completely, but from what I've seen, those are rare.

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