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Experiences with marriage counseling?


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EndoftheRope

Thoughts on the benefits of marriage counseling?

 

I see it recommended constantly. Then I see other remarks pretty frequently on other boards that marriage counseling is often worse than doing nothing.

 

We have problems with in-laws, lying, secret e-mail accounts and secret female 'friends,' and H's refusal to take responsibility for any of his own behavior (it's actually the young girl's fault he sent her an e-mail telling her he thinks she's cute; most of the rest, is all my fault.) And more, but I'll stop there.

 

We went to mc years ago and I think we had a good counselor and I think H had good intentions, but it was useless because he didn't follow through on anything. We got back together anyway, and just shoved everything under the rug.

 

The last year has been pretty bad and HE finally demanded mc. We've been three times, and so far all we've really done is re-hash the whole long in-law story. No suggestions, no solutions. I leave each session more convinced than before that I am 100% right on in thinking that, emotionally, his family comes first and the only real problem he sees with their bad behavior towards me is that I actually object to it. I'm just ending up angrier, with no solution in sight.

 

We have not addressed the lying and I assume if we ever get around to it, he'll just deny he does it and pull his same old story that I mishear and misunderstand everything he says. Is counseling at all effective in dealing with liars?

 

I want to quit going and just see a counselor myself to talk about how to detach and emotionally distance myself from his behavior, and start making decisions about the future of this marriage. But it seems if I quit going, I'm then the one guilty of not trying, and I know I will be blamed not only by H but by our children and probably by my family for being the quitter. And I guess I have this faint hope that if I'm patient we'll actually get somewhere. And yet... not really.

 

Am I not being patient enough with only three sessions?

 

I'd be interested in answers to my specific concerns, but also thoughts on mc in general, or anyone's experiences with it.

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catgirl1927

If you've tried counselling together, then counselling on your own is a good place to start building up your strength to move on. It sounds like he only went to counselling to shut you up.

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1. You're probably not being patient enough.

 

2. How much good counseling does depends on the counselor and the people being counseled.

 

3. MC was very helpful for us. There had also been a bunch of lying - he'd had a long-term EA. I'd been deceitful as well. Getting things out in the open was important. We both re-discovered how much the other meant. We went for almost two years.

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My posts don't seem to be working right now - but if this works:

 

yes marriage counseling is very beneficial. My H and I went for 2 years and resolved a ton of problems -- but mostly because we both wanted to. We had both been very angry at the other and were acting out in a number of hurtful ways. It came to a head when he had an EA.

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also, from what I understand, a good counselor helps the couple communicate more effectively, all at the couple's pace. Don't give up on MC, but if you're not satisfied with what's going on, switch counselors. I think individual counselling is a great idea, because you're going to receive a lot of good tools to help you though this rough patch.

 

keep the faith, ER ... sometimes you've got to wade through some deep doo-doo before you start reaching the shallow part, then land.

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MC...where do I start?

 

My H and I have been to MC with 2 different counselors and so far.....not helping much.

 

The first counselor was our pastor (who is also a counselor) and he had great advice and suggestions and when we practiced what he preached (so to speak), things worked better.

 

Our second, most recent, counselor is an actual MC therapist. She is nice and listens to us and offers ways of dealing with our issues.

 

Like your issues, our's keep coming back to the same things, that HE won't do anything about. Sure, he'll be ok like the first week or so after counseling, but go right back to his bad behaviors. He is bipolar and doesn't take meds (cuz we can't afford them) and won't do anything that he can to help his situation (like eat right, get decent sleep, make sure to wear his nicotine patch so he doesn't have a nic fit, etc).

 

It gets to the point where I wonder if going to MC is even worth it, because we're not getting anything out of it when my H doesn't follow through with anything. He's irresponsible, unreliable and although he talks like he really cares about our marriage and making things work for the best to fix his moods and be nice to me on a regular basis, he doesn't change anything.

 

I'm now in the quandry of whether I should separate from him, because most of the time, living with him and his mood swings and unreliability, I am so unhappy. He's lazy and selfish and things of his needs first and rarely has really gone out of his way to be a good husband. He does the bare minimum and meanwhile, I take all the responsibilities on myself, otherwise they won't get done and things will literally fall apart. I do all the cleaning, cooking, laundry, finances/bills, taking care of the kids (for the most part, occasionally he'll change a diaper here or help put them to bed there), but I take care of them daily and take them to day care and pick them up and feed them and bathe them and etc etc etc. I love my kids and I wonder sometimes, if that isn't the only thing keeping me in this marriage.

 

I sit there and wonder as we're talking in MC, if I were to just come out and get angry (because I hate confrontation and it's hard for me to speak my true feelings), that I want a separation, I want to be away from this man. In so many words, I have told my H and the MC that I have wanted to be separated, and I have wanted to leave him. The MC diagnosed me with depression because I am freakin depressed living with a man, who doesn't do anything for me. I tell the MC that he's lazy and selfish and completely unreliable and I know he BS's me all the time, telling me lies or half truths, just to appease me, so I never know when he's telling the truth. And all the MC does is ask him if he does, to which he says no. The MC gives us weekly action items (mostly for my H, than me) and for the first day after our meeting, it's all fine, but after that, right back to same behaviors.

 

What good is getting therapy, when none of the exercises are followed on his part and things he is supposed to work on, are neglected and ignored? How is a marriage supposed to work successfuly and happily, when only one partner is "fine" with how things are, and the other (me) wants nothing more than to be away from their partner?

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carmaenforcer

I don't have experience with "marriage" counseling but I did go to couples counseling with my ex before my W and it did no good. Not to say that there was anything wrong with the councilor that we had or with the concept of counseling. It just didn't work for us because as soon as the counselor started to agree with me and point out my ex's issues, all of a sudden this counselor is wacked, she doesn't know what she's talking about. Yeah, it couldn't be that you were just hoping to get one that was sympathetic to you and saw things your way, right? I'm sure if the situation was reversed my ex would have loved her and ganged up on me. So we only went a couple of time and then my ex didn't want to go anymore. I think it's better if people learn how to communicate with each other, if it takes third party to do it at first that's cool but ultimately couples need to be able to discuss and resolve issue on their own or else they are doomed. IMO...

 

But hey if it's all you got and it works for you, I say go for it.

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I have no experience with mc, but recently my wife and I have been arguing constantly about stupid everyday things and haven't been getting along. During one of our disputes we both suggested the other one needed counseling. I don't think I could ever get myself to go listen to someone tell me how I need to run my life. That might seem selfish or egotistical, but that's how I feel. We mostly argue about daily chores, money, what she wears, sleeping issues, etc. Nothing that's very IMPORTANT in the grand scheme of things. Why is it that all these little things are the ones that tare people apart. We have recognized that we sometimes do have issues communicating and we agree to change and work on it, but just like you said, it's only worth about a week or so and then it goes back to how it's always been. It's definatly not healthy, and having kids is NOT the answer...

 

I am not sure of the solution. I feel like if I change or "give in" they I have lost my cause. It's hard to forget the past and just move on. I suppose that's what marriage is about, though.

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Have you said something about the MC not confronting H's lack of follow-through, or are YOU letting him sit there and blow smoke up everyone's @ss?

 

Take the proof you need that he's not following through with assignments by journalling what he does/does not do with re: to any assignments made by MC. If you don't have any, ask for some and then keep track.

 

And part of what's wrong is lack of confrontation on your part. You've gotten angry and checked out without giving him a chance to even respond. Is that fair? Confront calmly, rationally, and with proof.

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AManWithTroubles

To Uleryn, and perhaps others. There is a book called Stop Blaming, Start Loving. It sounds like you are labeling the poor guy too much. Of course, he may really be bi-polar, but then you go on and attach other labels to him. Instead of putting labels on your spouse, there are ways to change behaviors in people. This book, instead of focusing on labels and finding why people are the way they are, it gives action oriented advice that can help change the relationship. Just give it a try, it's pretty cheap. There are other books related to this, I understand, but this happened to be the one that I picked up. It just gets you past the resentment and blaming games, and on to repairing the relationship. Makes sense, right? Life is too short to sit around finding labels and who's to blame for what. Just fix it.

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EndoftheRope
And part of what's wrong is lack of confrontation on your part. You've gotten angry and checked out without giving him a chance to even respond. Is that fair? Confront calmly, rationally, and with proof.

You got the short version here. ;) I have most definitely confronted him. I have told him calmly, rationally, and with proof. It has gotten me nowhere.

 

Just one example: The night before our anniversary last year, I found on our computer history he'd been on thirtyplussingles.com and eharmony.com. He first told me he clicked on links in his e-mail, not knowing what they were. When I gave him proof those e-mails are IMPOSSIBLE to mistake, the story changed to that he did it for kicks. When I said he'd told me he didn't know what the links were taking him to, he just denied he'd ever said it, and told me I heard wrong. When I got conclusive proof a few weeks later that e-harmony doesn't send out spam at all, he just denied he'd ever been on e-harmony!

 

On the plus side, he didn't sign up at these sites and isn't going to them anymore. But the lying hasn't changed. I can confront him all I want, with a box full of proof and evidence, and he'll just tell me I'm mistaken.

 

Part of my question about counseling is: can counselors deal with this? Or are we just spending more money to have him do the same thing in front of the counselor. And what can a counselor do about it?

 

ManWithTroubles, thank you for the book title. I feel like I've read just about every book there is. I'm willing to set resentment aside if I can for the past, but how am I supposed to carry on in a marriage where I know that he lies and will continue to lie and his words mean absolutely nothing, because whenever it's convenient, he'll just tell me I misheard AGAIN?

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CastingPearls

Ah, counseling, the last resort for doomed relationships. I think people go so they can say "we did everything we could to save our love, but it died anyway." I know that's pretty cynical but it really rings true from personal experience. I'm sure there are exceptions, though, if the problems are petty and communication breakdown is the problem. Sort of like a marital sickness that can be cured with TLC and time. Unfortunately, some relationships are terminal, can't be kept alive and probably shouldn't be. CP

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carmaenforcer

eagle22, relationships are about give and take, knowing when to "give" in and knowing when to "take" control. Often we get locked in a power struggle, the fact that you seem to be arguing over the small stuff is proof that there is a lack of communication more than likely over a bigger issue that was left unresolved and has just become a fight for the arm rest.

I got into this situation with my W before I think now a days most couple run the risk of getting to where you are right now, simply because of the fear of loosing your individuality when becoming one with another.

What worked for us was "COMMUNICATION", calmly bring things up and if she starts to try to fly off the handle, calmly tell her, "I just wanted to talk, I don't want to argue". If she doesn't calm down right away, walk away and pick it up later. Be persistent but not nagging. I also learned to pick my battles, don't bug each other over small stuff. Big issues do come but they are usually spread apart enough that it doesn't make you feel like you have been unhappy most of the time. If you sweat the small things you will not have a long enough break in the unhappiness to let your relationship heal for the next big thing. Little things come up every day and should be dealt with quick and easy or let slide.

Sit down with her and lay out some ground rules for the relationship, don't try to tell her what she needs to do, instead tell her what you are looking for in a relationship and be reasonable as best you can.

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Part of my question about counseling is: can counselors deal with this? Or are we just spending more money to have him do the same thing in front of the counselor. And what can a counselor do about it?

 

Sorry, End, I presumed. Please forgive.

 

You ask an excellent question here that I think you need to take to the MC. It sounds like your truster's busted--for good reason. And without repairing the damage the lying has done, you probably are wasting your time and $$.

 

Why does he lie? This is a question the MC needs to be confronting him with. Has he charmed MC?

 

Have you checked out http://www.marriagebuilders.com? There's some good stuff on there with re: to basic non-negotiable foundational issues that every marriage needs, one of which is honesty. Without it, you're in deep trouble.

 

It's possible to save this marriage, but it's gonna take a lot of work--work you may or may not want to do.

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My H and I went after I had already decided to leave. It took a year of counseling, but we have a stronger relationship now.

 

In the OP case, I don't believe it will help. You say he is going on dating sites and talking to other women. You tell him it hurts you, you fight about it, and he has no intentions of changing this behavior. A man doesn't need a counselor to tell him this behavior is wrong, he knows. He simply doesn't care about your feelings concerning the matter. He says he has stopped... maybe he has. But he is still lying, so how do you really know?? Maybe he has just gotten better at hiding it. How will counseling help this? He will just say the counselor doesn't know what they are talking about and quit, and be among those who says MC doesn't work.

 

A counselor doesn't 'fix' relationships. They take two WILLING participants, that means people who both are willing to let go of pride and ego and really deal with issues, and help them communicate. No relationship is one sided. You may want to blame your H for his actions, but you had a part in them as well, even if your part was to allow him to treat you that way. Likewise, your husband has to be able to hear you and compromise. If he is not, counseling will be a waste of time and money.

 

I have never seen a relationship where the H likes to go to online dating sites 'just for fun' have a happy ending. He has probably already cheated on you, or is close to doing it. If he isn't willing to deal with this seriously, I'd start planning to leave.

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EndoftheRope
My H and I went after I had already decided to leave. It took a year of counseling, but we have a stronger relationship now.

 

In the OP case, I don't believe it will help. You say he is going on dating sites and talking to other women. You tell him it hurts you, you fight about it, and he has no intentions of changing this behavior. ..... He says he has stopped... maybe he has. But he is still lying, so how do you really know?? Maybe he has just gotten better at hiding it.

 

I have never seen a relationship where the H likes to go to online dating sites 'just for fun' have a happy ending. He has probably already cheated on you, or is close to doing it. If he isn't willing to deal with this seriously, I'd start planning to leave.

 

Just to clarify, he went on dating sites a year ago. He never actually made a profile at yahoo's, he blocked them from his e-mail months ago, and never did anything besides go on the first page of the other two sites. His full explanation of going on 'for kicks' was that he and his friends laugh at the type of people who sign up, not that he was meeting women there for fun.

 

In retrospect, he was mad and did something stupid, but didn't take it far and didn't persist in it. My example of the dating sites was, rather, an example of how his stories keep changing on me.

 

It is not entirely a situation of no changes. He's actually made a lot of changes in other areas. I guess that is one of the reasons I'm trying to be patient and see where the counseling goes... and yet wondering how a counselor can deal with the lying, especially.

 

Becoming asked why he lies. He'd tell you to keep the peace. He told me early in our marriage that he just told his parents what they wanted to hear and everyone went away happy. He prided himself on being 'smart' for avoiding fights. I think there's also an element of saving face to some of his lies.

 

No, I don't believe he's charmed the counselor as such. He's not trying. The counselor is quite experienced, so I'm hoping he is quite adept at spotting and dealing with dishonesty.

 

PT, you mentioned two willing participants. DH has thought for years that if he can just force me to join him in shoving problems under the rug, things will go away. HE is the one who finally decided he wants marriage counseling. He says he wants to save this marriage 'for many reasons.' I tend to think he's still in a stage where he thinks he can save the marriage without coming clean about some things, both for saving face and keeping the peace.

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I obviously can't know nearly enough about your marriage to really make a judgement, but I can offer advice. I have had friends whose husbands/bf's said the same thing about dating sites and/or porn. They found out later it had indeed gone much farther. Men often use the 'just for kicks' excuse to divert you from digging deeper. Obviously this may not be true of your H, he may indeed be telling you the truth. But I still see it as a huge red flag.

 

As far as counseling, my H set it up for us too. I had asked him to go with me for a couple years and he would refuse. It wasn't until I walked out that he agreed and set it up, saying he desperately wanted to work on things and keep the marriage together. He later admitted he was hoping that marriage counseling would serve HIS purposes- to make me the bad guy and justify his actions. Again, that may not be true of your marriage.

 

The one thing you keep saying in your posts is that he is a perpetual liar. Yet you believe him when he says the dating sites never went farther than the first page, and that he wants marriage counseling to help the marriage. Yet you contradicted that when you said your first three sessions have been you two butting heads, with him unwilling to compromise. So how is marriage counseling helping YOU? Is he trying to see things from your side? He is making an effort to understand how his lies have hurt you? Or is he hoping the counselor will help him convince you he is right?

 

And again, I don't know your situation, but a good counselor should never allow you two to sit and bicker for three sessions without restriction. You are supposed to be learning to communicate, not rehash old arguments with an audience. If your husband is using these sessions to try and sway you to his way of thinking, I stand by my original post, that until he is willing to see how his actions have damaged you and the relationship, counseling will not help. I do hope I am wrong. Good luck.

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Have you installed a keylogger yet? :confused:

 

Maybe what it's going to take is to remove his option to lie. When he can't lie to you anymore, then I think you'll start to see some progress in MC. And if by some miracle, he's not lying....you will be secured from your doubts.

 

Both of you need to want to be there in order for MC to really help you. And you've both got to be communicating from a postition of honesty. Otherwise, you're wasting your money.

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KnowHowLoveFeels

Hi EOTR,

 

I can relate to what you are going through. My husband will lie to keep peace and save face, too. We've tried MC... and it doesn't help, for the same reasons as yours. Anyway, I have learned to distant myself emotionally from my H, and I take his words with a grain of salt. Healthy? Probably not for our marriage, but it helps with my sanity. I am staying in this marriage for several reasons, and I remind myself of those reasons as needed. I have learned to not depend on my husband for anything important. I have learned to be self-sufficient and independent so that one day, I may just walk out the door. That's the plan.

 

I hope that helps you.

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EndoftheRope
I have had friends whose husbands/bf's said the same thing about dating sites and/or porn. They found out later it had indeed gone much farther. Men often use the 'just for kicks' excuse to divert you from digging deeper.
And also to answer LadyJane's question-- I had a keylogger on for a long time, without his knowledge, during and many months after his brief venture onto the singles sites. And trust me, I'm not so stupid as to believe it was just for kicks. He did it in a moment of anger.

 

As far as counseling, my H set it up for us too. I had asked him to go with me for a couple years and he would refuse. It wasn't until I walked out that he agreed and set it up, saying he desperately wanted to work on things and keep the marriage together. He later admitted he was hoping that marriage counseling would serve HIS purposes- to make me the bad guy and justify his actions. Again, that may not be true of your marriage.
It is or was true of my marriage. He definitely shouted about mc last Feb (?) with that frame of mind, but I think there's progress and a growing willingness to listen, on his part. It sounds like somewhere along the line, your husband had a change of heart? Would you mind telling me if counseling brought that change about or how it happened? (Here or in PT if you'd rather, or if you don't want to go that into it, I understand.)

 

The one thing you keep saying in your posts is that he is a perpetual liar. Yet you believe him when he says the dating sites never went farther than the first page,
I believe him because the keylogger confirmed it.

 

So how is marriage counseling helping YOU?
I think that's what I'm tryng to decide-- based on others' experiences in this situation, is it likely to help me? I think I said before I'm leaning towards not wanting to continue, but realizing that is going to make me the 'quitter' and the bad guy.

 

Is he trying to see things from your side?
A little.

 

He is making an effort to understand how his lies have hurt you?
We haven't dealt with the lies yet.

 

I stand by my original post, that until he is willing to see how his actions have damaged you and the relationship, counseling will not help. I do hope I am wrong. Good luck.
I think you're right, and I hope that he will begin to see that, too.
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EndoftheRope
I have had friends whose husbands/bf's said the same thing about dating sites and/or porn. They found out later it had indeed gone much farther. Men often use the 'just for kicks' excuse to divert you from digging deeper.
And also to answer LadyJane's question-- I had a keylogger on for a long time, without his knowledge, during and many months after his brief venture onto the singles sites. And trust me, I'm not so stupid as to believe it was just for kicks. He did it in a moment of anger. I know it, he knows it, but he thinks if he tells a story often enough....

 

As far as counseling, my H set it up for us too. I had asked him to go with me for a couple years and he would refuse. It wasn't until I walked out that he agreed and set it up, saying he desperately wanted to work on things and keep the marriage together. He later admitted he was hoping that marriage counseling would serve HIS purposes- to make me the bad guy and justify his actions. Again, that may not be true of your marriage.
It is or was true of my marriage. He definitely shouted about mc last Feb (?) with that frame of mind, but I think there's progress and a growing willingness to listen, on his part. It sounds like somewhere along the line, your husband had a change of heart? Would you mind telling me if counseling brought that change about or how it happened? (Here or in PT if you'd rather, or if you don't want to go that into it, I understand.)

 

The one thing you keep saying in your posts is that he is a perpetual liar. Yet you believe him when he says the dating sites never went farther than the first page,
I believe him because the keylogger confirmed it.

 

So how is marriage counseling helping YOU?
I think that's what I'm tryng to decide-- based on others' experiences in this situation, is it likely to help me? I think I said before I'm leaning towards not wanting to continue, but realizing that is going to make me the 'quitter' and the bad guy.

 

Is he trying to see things from your side?
A little.

 

He is making an effort to understand how his lies have hurt you?
We haven't dealt with the lies yet.

 

I stand by my original post, that until he is willing to see how his actions have damaged you and the relationship, counseling will not help. I do hope I am wrong. Good luck.
I think you're right, and I hope that he will begin to see that, too.
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EndoftheRope
Hi EOTR,

 

I can relate to what you are going through. My husband will lie to keep peace and save face, too. We've tried MC... and it doesn't help, for the same reasons as yours. Anyway, I have learned to distant myself emotionally from my H, and I take his words with a grain of salt. Healthy? Probably not for our marriage, but it helps with my sanity. I am staying in this marriage for several reasons, and I remind myself of those reasons as needed. I have learned to not depend on my husband for anything important. I have learned to be self-sufficient and independent so that one day, I may just walk out the door. That's the plan.

 

I hope that helps you.

 

You've summed it up perfectly.

 

I'd love to talk to you more (another thread? pt?) about distancing yourself and what has worked for you.

 

This is all a shame, because he actually has many, many good qualities.

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Hey End, I'll answer your questions as best I can.

 

MC helped me to see that as much as I wanted to blame my H for so many things, I had a part in them too. Even tho my biggest problem was basically allowing him to treat me bad, I still allowed it. That was a hard pill to swallow. It was so much easier blaming him. :)

 

I am very glad you did the keylogger thing and saw it never went any further. Dating sites are rare, but I have had more than one friend whose H signed up for really degrading porn sites and when caught said it was just for kicks... ugh. Since he didn't take if far, I have more hope.

 

Yes there was a point when my H had a change of heart. I think after about a month or so he must have actually listened to me, realized the pain he caused, and that I was DONE. It forced him to acknowledge his part in the situation we were in or lose me. My H's change has been sincere and genuine. But then, he was that way when we met. It took years for him to fall into the issues we had. Was your H always this way? If so, his road will probably be much more difficult than my H's, you know? Really, me leaving was what did it for him. I think that if your H thinks you will stay no matter what, there is no motivation for him to change, and therefore he won't. Sometimes people just really need a swift kick in the pants.

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EndoftheRope

We saw the marriage counselor again today, and I did tell him I wasn't really sure it was helping anything. He did point out that the criticisms have stopped (although I think I made myself really clear on that point, and they had stopped before we started counseling).

 

The counselor did elicit from my husband an agreement to stop speaking negatively about me to his family (that has had absolutely disastrous effects on our marriage so far-- imagine!) So that's good.

 

We discussed H's 'just-a-friend' that he works with. Okay, 'discuss' is a little euphemistic. He pushed my husband a little on that point, and told him (AND ME!) that H needs to tell me about any professional contact he is required to have with her. So I think that's good that he's taking this 'friend' seriously as a problem. (H has dismissed all my concerns as 'ridiculous'.)

 

We discussed the issue of H appearing very eager to keep me away from his work, and the counselor got an agreement that, since my presence is no threat to his job, that I may drop by whenever I feel like it-- that his numerous reasons for keeping me away are really not worth the damage being done by the appearance of having something to hide. (And, btw, I've been to his work twice in two years, so it's not like I have or am going to hound him there. There have just been a few peculiar instances when it would have been natural for us to drop by, or for me to pick him up from work, and he goes out of his way to keep me away.) So I guess that's good.

 

We discussed the lying. H basically brushed off another big one as me mishearing. The counselor didn't push that, but after seeing him 'in action' on other issues, I guess I'm a little more willing to be patient. I think that's going to be a big brick wall, and it may be just as well to deal with other things and get really comfortable with him, first. And in part, I'm just getting better at emotionally withdrawing, too.

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EndoftheRope

Yes there was a point when my H had a change of heart. I think after about a month or so he must have actually listened to me, realized the pain he caused, and that I was DONE. It forced him to acknowledge his part in the situation we were in or lose me. My H's change has been sincere and genuine. But then, he was that way when we met. It took years for him to fall into the issues we had. Was your H always this way? If so, his road will probably be much more difficult than my H's, you know? Really, me leaving was what did it for him. I think that if your H thinks you will stay no matter what, there is no motivation for him to change, and therefore he won't. Sometimes people just really need a swift kick in the pants.

 

What way in particular? The lying? Probably so, to an extent. As I said, he sees it as 'keeping the peace' and has bragged to me about how it was smarter to lie to his parents and have everybody go away happy.

 

But as far as some of the other negatives, no, he wasn't always like that. He was kind and admiring and loving and thoughtful in a great many ways. In fact, in recent months, he is becoming that person again.

 

I think he is starting to see some of the pain he's caused. I honestly think that in some ways he sees himself as so small and insignificant that it's probably a shock to him in a sense that he has that much power to hurt-- you know what I mean? I think I mentioned before that I think the digs and criticisms are really more about his insecurities. I think he's felt overshadowed by me, and has failed to appreciate the importance and value of his good qualities. So he just tore me down bit by bit.

 

And I think he still doesn't appreciate the severity of the damage that lying does. As I said, after today, I have more hope that that is coming in time.

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