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So it's not bad, but does that make it good?


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MrsConflicted

I'll try keep this brief. Together 5 years, married 3. We're young, in hindsight may have rushed a little, but I do honestly love him and I do believe he loves me.

 

He's not abusive, not physically anyway, and emotionally while there are a couple of red flags I honestly think it's not intentional and he doesn't realise or mean to be, and probably doesn't constitute full on emotional abuse.

 

I think a lot of my issues with him boil down to selfishness, arrogance/he views me as lesser, insensitivity and a lack of consideration and respect. None of which I think have very much to do with anything about me or things I've done as much as it's just how he is. His last relationship ended for some of these reasons, and in hindsight there were signs from the very start.

 

I've recently met a couple who seem to have what I would like in a relationship and marriage, and whilst I can't know everything that goes on behind closed doors, me and the wife speak a lot, as do my psych and I, and it's really made me realise with some clarity what it is I feel I am missing and why I might feel so empty in my own marriage sometimes.

 

There are things I didn't even really understand were not really okay or wanted in a marriage until speaking to her and my psych, I thought it was just normal and I was overreacting etc.

 

Example of this being how he speaks down to me and treats me like a child, but puts it in a way (and I honestly believe he thinks) that comes across like he just cares for my safety, health, our house, or our finances or just would rather me spend time with him.

 

I've spoken to him about this and he's said he will improve and I can see he has, but I wonder if it's enough and if maybe it's just an incompatibility issue because I still don't feel like I'm happy.

 

I'm not really sure what to do. I love him and I want to be with him but I need to be happy and the thought of waking up in 40 years with nothing having changed just feels...empty.

 

Any advice?

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DH & I married later in life. Shortly thereafter I realized I didn't know how to be married. Not the basic stuff like no cheating but how to function as a team. DH & I went to a marital retreat / communications workshop to bridge that gap. It showed us where the flaws & weak spots were & gave us some tools to address them. I read a lot of pop psychology self-help books on how to fix your marriage. Most were drivel but I usually got at least one nugget of helpful info from them.

 

For us it boiled down to respect (& how the other one felt respected) and appreciation -- saying please & thank you even for the little things like making dinner or clearing the table.

 

Try some sort of marriage counseling before you throw in the towel.

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MrsConflicted

I agree, MC is definitely on our to do list, it's hard to find someone in our suburb or near enough that won't really interfere with work.

 

We are both at new jobs so we don't want to be taking too much time off if we can help it, there just aren't many Councillors around and especially not ones that work after hours.

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Honestly, based on the degree to which you seem to have internalized your dissatisfaction, you don't seem much better at communication than he is. And I'd guess you both are pretty sure you're right, the other person is wrong.

 

As suggested, counseling a must. I'd move it up the priority list...

 

Mr. Lucky

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MrsConflicted
Honestly, based on the degree to which you seem to have internalized your dissatisfaction, you don't seem much better at communication than he is. And I'd guess you both are pretty sure you're right, the other person is wrong.

 

As suggested, counseling a must. I'd move it up the priority list...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Earlier on maybe I didn't communicate the best but the last couple of years I've been very clear and open, I've just accepted apologies and promises of improvement and tried not to put too much pressure on him. Now I have just hit a breaking point I guess.

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understand50

MrsConflicted,

 

Marriage is a on going process if it is to Survive. Both must work on the marriage, and also each must work on their-self. Does not come easy, or fast, but if you stick with it, it is well worth it.

 

You both need to communication, and see if he can work on the area he is lacking in. If he want to change, and works at it he can. This has to be proactive, on his part, not just talking.

 

The other side of the coin, is to look at yourself. Are you working at being the best wife you can be. Are there things you can change to make things better. Bottom line, you both WILL change over time, hopefully for the better.

 

Here is a site that may help you both:

 

https://www.artofmanliness.com/

 

 

I wish you luck......

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but the last couple of years I've been very clear and open

 

Clear and open communication would have included your boundaries and the consequences to the relationship were they crossed. Said gently, what you did was false advertising. He acts this way because you've allowed him to.

 

Is there a reason you haven't stood up for yourself until now?

 

Mr. Lucky

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Mrs Conflicted,

 

 

I think a lot of my issues with him boil down to selfishness, arrogance/he views me as lesser, insensitivity and a lack of consideration and respect. None of which I think have very much to do with anything about me or things I've done as much as it's just how he is. His last relationship ended for some of these reasons, and in hindsight there were signs from the very start.

 

 

You could be writing about my first marriage :eek:

 

 

Mr Lucky nails it here;

 

 

Clear and open communication would have included your boundaries and the consequences to the relationship were they crossed. Said gently, what you did was false advertising. He acts this way because you've allowed him to.

 

 

Like you, my situation changed and I began to see what I was really dealing with and how other couples related to each other. I wanted our mariage to be like theirs.

 

 

 

Like you, I kept asking for change and nothing did change.

 

 

Like you I became more assertive.

 

 

The result was that he started an affair - I don't know if he was looking for a more compliant replacement or if it was a distraction - but when I found out he got the divorce papers.

 

 

I don't think that marital counselling will help. He is how he is and has already shown his reluctance to change.

 

 

Your choice is how long you want to put up with it? :)

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MrsConflicted

I guess what changed is I started seeing and talking to other couples and we as a couple started hanging out with other people who were also noticing these things, so I stopped feeling like it was in my head and I was overreacting.

 

I would like to give MC a try, just so I can feel like I have honestly tried everything before throwing in the towel if that's what I do.

 

Today he's decided to tell me that he has an issue with the lack of affection I show him or the lack of initiation of affection, and I do understand what he means but the main reason for it is because he turns any affection into an indication were about to have sex. I can't really kiss or hug him without him thinking it's me initiating sex. What's made it worse is I've stopped having sex with him just because he wants to and I want to be a "good wife". So now he's sexually frustrated which is making it worse.

 

I'm going to show him more affection and hopefully he will take on board what I said about not wanting to feel pressured into sex whenever I am affectionate...

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Happy Lemming
What's made it worse is I've stopped having sex with him ...

 

You cut him off and you are wondering why he is acting arrogant and insensitive??

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MidnightBlue1980

 

Today he's decided to tell me that he has an issue with the lack of affection I show him or the lack of initiation of affection, and I do understand what he means but the main reason for it is because he turns any affection into an indication were about to have sex. I can't really kiss or hug him without him thinking it's me initiating sex. What's made it worse is I've stopped having sex with him just because he wants to and I want to be a "good wife". So now he's sexually frustrated which is making it worse.

 

I'm going to show him more affection and hopefully he will take on board what I said about not wanting to feel pressured into sex whenever I am affectionate...

 

Sorry for the men reading what I am about to say.

 

Mrs Conflicted, you need to understand that men are not like women. If their needs are unmet, they basically think everything you do or say is an invitation to have sex and they can be somewhat crude about it, groping your butt, chest, etc. If you satisfy their sexual needs, they are better to be around. Otherwise they are extremely irritable and you will not get what you want from them. If you do it though, they are very nice to you. So even if you are not in the mood, never underestimate the power of a bj. Like Nike said, Just Do It.

 

One day when you are older, you will hear from friends about men who won't touch them anymore. Eventually they get tired of being rejected. Trust me, from what I hear, this is a very bad thing. When you are older, you may wish he was groping you and he will be on the couch, staring at his phone.

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MrsConflicted

Sorry let me clarify, we still have sex, it is just not as frequently as I'm not doing it when I don't feel like it not just doing it for his benefit.

 

Also he acted like this even before I slowed down sexually.

 

I've also had some childhood abuse and other things throughout my life that makes sex a bit of a sensitive issue for me, so for me to not do it just for someone else's benefit is something I've taken a long time to be able to do, like literally the last 3-4 months.

 

I know it'll make him less frustrated and nicer, hence why up til now I did it when he wanted to, but now I'm kinda like why do we need to have sex just when he wants to if I don't? And why can't he be a respectful and nice husband without it so often? What if I had a physical disability? Is that the only reason for a woman to not want to have sex?

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And why can't he be a respectful and nice husband without it so often? What if I had a physical disability? Is that the only reason for a woman to not want to have sex?

 

Somewhere between his entitlement and your petulance lies the answer. There are three entities in a marriage - you, him and the relationship. Right now, number #3 is on life support. You both have some decisions to make...

 

Mr. Lucky

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MrsConflicted

Sorry how am I being petulant?

 

Because I want to be able to not feel pressured into sex by my own husband? Or because I want to feel respected as an equal and not a subordinate or child?

 

Maybe I should have made clearer boundaries and enforced them, but there are a lot of things that he does or says that most people who have witnessed it had agreed that he doesn't always even show me the respect you'd give any other human let alone the person you're supposed to love.

 

Petulant is not the right word and frankly I don't appreciate it.

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I know a guy who always complains about his wife being controlling and treating him like a child. Then I saw them interacting.....hmm interesting, he acted like a 13 year old teenager in her presence.

 

Sometimes, the way people treat us is a direct reflection of how we act with that person. I'm not saying this is fact, I don't know you. What I'm suggesting is you examine your behavior with and around him.

 

Secondly, if you enjoy sex with him then have it. Don't use it as a behavioral modification tool. Doesn't work, only makes bad worse.

 

Lastly, timing and tone is very important to relay thoughts in a Female's mind to a message that we men understand and actually grasp. Wrong time or tone will often result in compliance, simply to end the conversation.

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MrsConflicted

All good points really.

 

I have tried to work on myself as much as I've asked anything of him, I'd be hypocritical otherwise.

 

I don't feel I act in a way that would seem immature or like a child, and I have already considered this as a reason why and had a couple of friends watch me in interactions or ask there opinions on interactions between us, and these are mutual friends that are quite objective and were his friends first, and I've outwardly asked if maybe I could be setting this behaviour off for him but they've agreed it doesn't seem to be something I do or say just how he acts/reacts.

 

I'm not witholding sex at all, it's more I as a person have realised a lot of the times we do are because he wants to whether or not I actually do as well, especially due to my past negative experiences sexually with abuse etc and I'm trying to be more assertive because I don't want to start resenting him for something he isn't aware of.

 

How would I go about making sure my timing and tone are okay? Because that is a good point. I tend to wait until we are relaxing after dinner, usually not a sunday because we work the next day, and I'm usually quite calm because it's not like I'm angry about it just more upset and want to work on it. I don't tell or scream and I generally don't cry either unless I just get too upset.

 

Is there a better time/way to approach it with him?

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MidnightBlue1980
All good points really.

 

Is there a better time/way to approach it with him?

 

This is just my opinion based on 11 years of marriage. You are obviously quite intelligent and have thought a lot about this. However I can't exactly say what it is you want from reading this thread. And I'm a woman.

 

You will get better results if you are more specific with what you want and need from him and avoid over-sweeping statements like, you want to be respected more. He won't know what to do with that. Men like specifics, action statements. What are a few (like 3) things he could do or not do, say or not say, which would make you happier?

 

For example, when I was the one going to work everyday and he was at home with the kids, I felt unappreciated. He did not know what I wanted. So I said, get up and meet me at the door a few times a week, sit with me while I eat, ask me about my day.

 

Just my 2 cents.

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MrsConflicted

Yeah that's a fair point, for a while I was frustrated coz you're right I'd tell him I don't feel like he respects me and he didn't really know what to do with that.

 

I have since given him actual specifics. He tends to like lists so I made one of what I felt I wanted in a husband, pointed out the things on that list he already had/does, and then the others that I felt needed improvement.

 

It's just easier to summarise on a post like this is all.

 

I guess my issue at the moment is I feel like while he's improved, and I don't want to be unreasonable and feel like he hasn't done enough since we spoke, I still feel like something feels off and empty. Like it's not as bad as it was for sure but I still don't feel it is good, and since I don't feel he really understands why I'm not happy or why I need these changes maybe he won't be able to get there, if that makes sense?

 

Part of me worries I've started switching off a bit and I'm not sure how to switch back? I still love him and want to be with him but I'm not sure (besides maybe he just isn't doing as much as I need) why I feel empty still?

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This is just my opinion based on 11 years of marriage. You are obviously quite intelligent and have thought a lot about this. However I can't exactly say what it is you want from reading this thread. And I'm a woman.

 

You will get better results if you are more specific with what you want and need from him and avoid over-sweeping statements like, you want to be respected more. He won't know what to do with that. Men like specifics, action statements. What are a few (like 3) things he could do or not do, say or not say, which would make you happier?

 

For example, when I was the one going to work everyday and he was at home with the kids, I felt unappreciated. He did not know what I wanted. So I said, get up and meet me at the door a few times a week, sit with me while I eat, ask me about my day.

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

I agree with the above. This whole thread has been rather vague. I'm glad to hear that you give more detailed info to your husband because you sure haven't told us much.

 

Basically all we know is that your husband condescends to you sometimes and he wants more sex. I don't know what you mean when you say he talks down to you. Do you mean he takes an exasperated tone? Do you mean that he yells and calls you names? Does he say insulting cruel things to you? Like you're incompetent or you are stupid. Is he angry or just irritated? So much depends on the nuance of how and what he says.

 

As for the sex thing. I hear ya. It's not nice to be pawed at constantly for sex when you're not even in the mood. Obviously nobody wants to be a blow up doll or be expected to perform on demand. That being said, you have been quite vague about this aspect too.

 

You say you only want to have sex when you feel like it. Well how often do you feel like it? Once a week? Twice a week? More? And how often does he want it? 5 times a week? 10? If he wants it twice a day everyday and you only want it twice a week then you have mismatched sex drives and you will both have to compromise. He will have to accept that you have the right to refuse him and he can't have sex every time he wants it. You will have to have sex even when you don't really feel like it sometimes. When you love your partner making an effort to satisfy them sexually is not demeaning, it's loving. Sure there will be plenty of times that you legitimately are not in the correct frame of mind for sex, like your exhausted, you're coming down with a bug, you're really busy trying to get something done. However if none of those reasons apply and you're often denying him simply because you d on't feel like it then that's not fair to him either. He can't expect you to be at his beck and call for sex 24 hours a day but you can't expect him to be sexually frustrated more often than not because you are not in the mood. If you love him and he is a good lover then with a little effort on your part you can get in the mood.

 

As for your empty feeling. How much of that is really on your husband? I find that people (myself included in the past) tend to immediately blame their partner for every moment of dissatisfaction or unhappiness they experience. Actually very little of our feelings regarding personal happiness, fulfillment and contentment have much to do with anyone else. Young people are famous for blaming their inner turmoil and pain on things outside of themselves so before you go blaming your husband for your empty feelings really dig deep and make sure these feelings are not coming from some other unresolved issues within yourself.

 

As for worrying that you are switching off on your husband, well you can control this to a certain extent. Your husband is never going to be perfect, he is never going to be a prince. He will always have flaws and faults just as you do. If you want to spend your days focusing on his faults and nurturing your feelings of resentment then you most likely will switch off and lose your loving feelings for him. Or you can continue to communicate with him what is and is not acceptable behavior as the need arises but other wise focus on his qualities and and nurturing a loving relationship with him. Personally if someone had a habit of talking down to me or being disrespectful I wouldn't be writing it down or looking for the best time to bring it up. I'd be calling them on the carpet for it right when it happens. As in "you're being disrespectful, so smarten up. I will not continue this conversation with you until you can speak me as your equal"

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I agree with the above. This whole thread has been rather vague. I'm glad to hear that you give more detailed info to your husband because you sure haven't told us much.

 

Basically all we know is that your husband condescends to you sometimes and he wants more sex. I don't know what you mean when you say he talks down to you. Do you mean he takes an exasperated tone? Do you mean that he yells and calls you names? Does he say insulting cruel things to you? Like you're incompetent or you are stupid. Is he angry or just irritated? So much depends on the nuance of how and what he says.

 

As for the sex thing. I hear ya. It's not nice to be pawed at constantly for sex when you're not even in the mood. Obviously nobody wants to be a blow up doll or be expected to perform on demand. That being said, you have been quite vague about this aspect too.

 

You say you only want to have sex when you feel like it. Well how often do you feel like it? Once a week? Twice a week? More? And how often does he want it? 5 times a week? 10? If he wants it twice a day everyday and you only want it twice a week then you have mismatched sex drives and you will both have to compromise. He will have to accept that you have the right to refuse him and he can't have sex every time he wants it. You will have to have sex even when you don't really feel like it sometimes. When you love your partner making an effort to satisfy them sexually is not demeaning, it's loving. Sure there will be plenty of times that you legitimately are not in the correct frame of mind for sex, like your exhausted, you're coming down with a bug, you're really busy trying to get something done. However if none of those reasons apply and you're often denying him simply because you d on't feel like it then that's not fair to him either. He can't expect you to be at his beck and call for sex 24 hours a day but you can't expect him to be sexually frustrated more often than not because you are not in the mood. If you love him and he is a good lover then with a little effort on your part you can get in the mood.

 

As for your empty feeling. How much of that is really on your husband? I find that people (myself included in the past) tend to immediately blame their partner for every moment of dissatisfaction or unhappiness they experience. Actually very little of our feelings regarding personal happiness, fulfillment and contentment have much to do with anyone else. Young people are famous for blaming their inner turmoil and pain on things outside of themselves so before you go blaming your husband for your empty feelings really dig deep and make sure these feelings are not coming from some other unresolved issues within yourself.

 

As for worrying that you are switching off on your husband, well you can control this to a certain extent. Your husband is never going to be perfect, he is never going to be a prince. He will always have flaws and faults just as you do. If you want to spend your days focusing on his faults and nurturing your feelings of resentment then you most likely will switch off and lose your loving feelings for him. Or you can continue to communicate with him what is and is not acceptable behavior as the need arises but other wise focus on his qualities and and nurturing a loving relationship with him. Personally if someone had a habit of talking down to me or being disrespectful I wouldn't be writing it down or looking for the best time to bring it up. I'd be calling them on the carpet for it right when it happens. As in "you're being disrespectful, so smarten up. I will not continue this conversation with you until you can speak me as your equal"

Sometimes for us men, it's not really the number of times a week there is sex, but the effort and energy given. Its the effort and energy that makes us men feel desired and appreciated, along with not always having to ask but to have it offered.

 

OP, like midnight said offer him one or two things you feel can be improved. Do so by saying when you do XYZ it makes me feel ABC, then leave it. If your husband is a decent man with average intelligence he will figure out how to improve it. Debates will cause him to defend himself, that makes solutions more difficult.

 

PS, anika, loved the "it's not demeaning, its loving". As a man, I can admit we can be daft about keeping a woman emotionally motivated and balanced. But women can also totally miss this part of a relationship. We are supposed to happily accept rejection, yet are out of line to expect satisfaction.

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Lotsgoingon

I disagree with the people who keep saying this has to do with you not wanting so much sex.

 

I think that's off target. You don't wanna have sex right now because a part of you is really pissed at him and angry at him ... .and you've tried to suppress it and you can suppress this no more. Forcing yourself to be tender and affectionate with someone is one of the surest ways to lose all attraction to that someone.

 

Also a wonderful way to trigger passive-aggressive behavior on your part.

 

Sounds like you raised your consciousness, as people would say in the old says ... Or put more simply, you assumed a relationship had to be x way and now you're really it can be so much better.

 

Congratulations on that growth and that breakthrough!

 

Since you're in therapy I'm wondering if you can now start practicing more assertiveness in the relationship and calling him out when he talks down to you ... or when you feel he's not respecting you ... Basically no avoiding conflict.

 

I just don't think this is one of those changes you can quietly and subtly inch your way into ... But work with the therapist ... You don't want to beg. You want to insist ... and when he down-talks to you ... walk out, leave ... tell him you don't like the way he talks to you ... Start taking action.

 

The thing is you're gonna have to practice this new assertiveness at some point ... and what's insidious is how much patterns continue if you don't practice breaking out of them.

 

Translation: don't wait to be assertive with some new dream man. Start practicing now. Start asking for what you want now. Stop apologizing for what you want now. If you assertiveness leads to the end of the relationship ... well ... that's better than putting up with treatment you don't like.

 

At some point it'll be clear whether this guy can make an adjustment ... or whether you can make an adjustment. You'll know ... you'll feel the answer ... loudly and clearly.

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MrsConflicted

Hi All,

 

Thank you all for your input. Again I apologize for having been vague it's just i didn't really want to hit you with a wall of text, and don't want to make it too obvious to identify me if anyone I know including him is on here.

 

Some examples of the behaviors I have issues with are:

 

- It was mothers day coming up, I had said i would find it nice if I got something for being a fur-mum. He said he thinks that's stupid and he wont get me anything. I am walking through the shops and see a cute $2 mug that says "fur-mama". I say I am just going to pop in there for a sec to get that mug (with my own money mind you) as we walk past the store. He gets stroppy and ****ty. " $2 plus $2 etc and before you know it you've spent $1000. I don't want to f around at the shops i want to get in and out so i can go home and relax. You don't need it it's a piece of **** why would you even want it". So I don't get my mug. those quotes are 100% exactly what he said.

 

- yelled at me at the park in front of our friends for trying to train the dogs and not stopping the little one jumping off the very small bridge which might hurt her legs. was saying I was irresponsible and not caring enough about them (i love them more than anything). He apologised and said he wouldn't do it again, but said I shouldn't have been trying to train her while she's still young (9 months) and could hurt her legs (the jump really couldn't have done much if any damage at all, it was like 40cm from the ground).

 

- I was doing housework, the dogs were outside playing. He goes outside and yells " what the f is this?! why weren't you watching them look at the massive hole they've dug!!"etc. They were out there for 15 minutes, it was not that big a hole, I had been doing something else in the house, and they had been outside most of the day unsupervised and hadn't done anything like that so I thought I could leave them for 15. The loudness and tone of his voice was what my main issue is with this particular incident. He directed the anger he had about the hole at me, making it my fault for not watching them, making out I was irresponsible for not watching them.

 

-He will get easily irritated, at me or otherwise. I.e they got his order wrong at macD's and once he got home and realised he flipped his lid, was yelling and swearing, ended up going back and getting it sorted. I told him he could have had my burger instead, I would just make something else, no big deal, but he was not having it.

 

-He will get all sad if I decide to hang out with friends who live around the corner, even though he was obviously also invited. If i give in to his sooking, he usually spends the time oin his computer, on his phone or in a different room anyway. He doesn't want to spend time with me as much as he just doesn't want me to go out and he wants me home.

 

- he will rarely do things or go places with me he doesnt enjoy, but will expect me to go with him virtually all the time and makes out like we are spending the day together. e.g he will want me to accompany him to macdonalds at 10pm for a late night snack, even if i dont want to get anything myself and am in bed. he wont come with me to hang out with a group of friends we both know but I am closer to because of whatever excuse he wants to use that day. He will want to go shopping in the city and will say " lets go make a day of it and have lunch etc" but when I have wanted to go somewhere further than 20 minutes for dinner he says no or if I want to go shopping i usually go alone because he'd rather not.

 

It's as if when life isnt going exactly how he expects or wants he can't cope. He has this idea of what he wants and how he expects things to be and if life or anything else gets in the way he is a miserable sod and nothing I do or say to try cheer him up works because "woe is me".

 

lotsgoingon you have a point, I didn't really think of it before but on top of the pressure he puts for sex, feeling like he treats me as below him doesn't exactly make me eager to please him, and I am disappointed and upset so I'm not exactly in the mood anyhow.

 

I've also been in therapy for some sexual abuse from childhood and bringing that back up hasn't helped. Sexually we average about once a week/fortnight? But frankly it's been sore the last few times, most days I am exhausted as I am anaemic and have pretty severe depression and anxiety, and he has said or done something to upset me at least once in the day, so I am not exactly pumped for it. When we do I make sure I am not just a "Starfish".

 

I have actually thought for a long time the emptiness was due to my depression, part of why until recently I wasn't as assertive about my needs not being met actually. I thought I was overreacting, it was just the depression talking, etc. I have done a lot to improve my life in different aspects of it, and I am not blaming him for how I feel as much as I have found as I've been improving other things, him and our relationship are the only thing that really still feel "Grey" or "empty". I don't rely on him to make me happy, I have friends, I have my shows and my own money to spend etc. But my issue is not only does he not really make effort to make me happy, he also tries to stop me having that happiness myself. i.e asking me not to hang with my friends, asking me to sit in the same room as him even if we aren't interacting, saying i spend too much of my own spending money I earnt working full time. He has been improving on this,though, I will say that,and I have told him i have noticed and appreciate it as well.

 

Also i do bring it up as it happens but I also note it down as he has a very selective memory, so if it does come up again I have a direct reference instead of some vague statement about a behaviour. His response even when brought up on the spot is usually to apologise, say he'll do better, but tell me what I should have done different as if his reaction is my fault. i.e sorry I got ****ty and yelled at you at the dog park in front of your friends for trying to train the dogs and not stopping the little one jumping off the very small bridge.I'll do better next time, but you shouldn't have been trying to train her while she's still young (9 months) and could hurt her legs.

 

I think my main problem going forward is the follow through of consequences. I.e I find it hard to tell him I won't put up with something and if it doesn't stop I'll leave because we both kind of know I won't unless he really pushes me too far. I don't want to give him empty threats or manipulate him, if he's going to change i want it to be of his own accord, and I don't want him to change until the threat of losing me is gone and then he slides back into it, even though he doesn't seem to be doing much more than just enough to show he's done something and keep me relatively placated.

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Thanks for shedding so much more light on this OP. Totally get why you are less than thrilled with your marriage.

 

Your husband sounds like a man-child. I can't stand guys who throw temper tantrums whenever something goes wrong or they don't get their way. Worse he doesn't seem to view you as a person or be able to empathize with how you feel.

 

Really can't see how this will get better without professional help. Maybe marital counselling, possibly counselling for him alone. Not sure how you will convince him to agree to that though. Whatever you do, don't put your life on hold or isolate yourself because of him. Buy what you want, see the friends and family you want to see, no matter how pouty he wants to be. Your husband is very childish and immature, and like a child he has to learn that tantrums and pouting won't get him what he wants. Draw up some boundaries for your self and enforce them.

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Since you're in therapy I'm wondering if you can now start practicing more assertiveness in the relationship and calling him out when he talks down to you ... or when you feel he's not respecting you ... Basically no avoiding conflict.

 

I just don't think this is one of those changes you can quietly and subtly inch your way into ... But work with the therapist ... You don't want to beg. You want to insist ... and when he down-talks to you ... walk out, leave ... tell him you don't like the way he talks to you ... Start taking action.

 

The thing is you're gonna have to practice this new assertiveness at some point ... and what's insidious is how much patterns continue if you don't practice breaking out of them.

 

MrsConflicted, given the additional detail you've provided, this is good advice as long as you understand the dynamic. Assertiveness isn't silently enduring this treatment, building resentment for several days and then shutting down in the bedroom.

 

Have you discussed counseling with him? Does he understand the degree to which you're disconnected from the marriage?

 

Mr. Lucky

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Your husband sounds like a child. Was he spoiled a lot when he was younger?

 

It sounds tome like he has started viewing you as "mommy", and he is acting out like a adolescent. I'm not surprised that having sex with him isn't your top priority right now.

 

The idea that if you give him all the sex he wants he will somehow become a better husband isn't going to work. This goes way beyond that. He has a lot of growing up to do.

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