Compromise or surrendering?

[Grumpybutfun]

I didn't want to thread jack another thread so I made this one to address what compromise means to people and when does that become surrender and being a doormat?

In my personal experiences compromise has always been about the two of us disagreeing about something and coming to a joint decision we both can agree with and be happy by discussing it in a calm manner.

For instance, my wife was very afraid when I started MMAs fighting twenty year olds because at forty, I don't heal like I used to. She was dead against it but I really wasn't being challenged otherwise and was getting bored. We sat down and compromised by me promising that if I felt like anything was broken or an internal puncture, anything to the eyes or head occurred, I would seek medical attention regardless of time or place. I could live with that though sometimes it is a pain.

However, when does it become surrendering who you are and what you are like to give in to demands? When does it become less about compromise and more about making your way the only way or trying to change them? When do we say, this is who they are and I can or cannot accept it and just act on that instead of trying to change them?

My wife has always had a very dysfunctional family and yet she still wants to be a part of some of their lives....I know this isn't something I can change and if I try I am trying to change who she is, therefore I just have to be there for her when the inevitable toxicity and fallout occurs. I compromise my beliefs that she should only be around healthy and non toxic people and I get to fight twenty year olds....it works for both of us and we neither one feel resentment or like we aren't being true to our internal or authentic nature.

Any comments or thoughts? Stories of a failure to compromise or when you surrendered because you felt you had no choice? Thoughts on how compromising isn't something you would do because you believe you can coexist without change?

Grumps

[crederer]

Well grumpy I gotta say I've seen your posts around and you seem pretty based. I'm gunna give it to you straight

 

The MMA stuff. If it's not competitive but a workout routine, you should be okay. They look after people pretty well there.

 

You going for a purse prize against a kid half your age, you're more than likely gunna end up on the losing end (whether it be the fight itself or a few years down the line with some serious health issues as a result). So I gotta say it really depends on those two things. If she's worried about you sparring bring her along and show her what it's like, I've done that in the past and she probably has horrifying images from the worst knock outs of all time on UFC's highlight reel running through her head or something that is simply not an accurate depiction of what you're doing.

 

As far as her family stuff goes. You can say whatever you want to her about it behind closed doors but at the end of the day that's her family and you have to respect that. You're not a psychologist (presumably, if I remember you're a military man) and just because you think her ignoring them is what's best for her doesn't necessarily mean that's true.

 

Comprimize isn't about "well I let you do MMA therefore I can do this, even though you don't like it". Comprimize is about an individual topic. These two things have nothing to do with each other and therefore comprimize has nothing to do with it (or at least I feel they are mutually exclusive).

 

That's my thoughts on it, cheers mate.

Edited April 29, 2014 by crederer

[todreaminblue]

to me compromise isnt surrender where one person gets what they want and the other is defeated...its a calm thoughtful and logical discussion on what is best for both that both are happy with the outcome.Its a discussion where solutions and alternatives are given that both can come to an agreement takes two to compromise not just one......change is alway is inevitable but you shouldn't have to change your values or ideals to come to a change that suits both ..a true compromise at the discussion end the outcome is a happy one for both..

 

 

i have compromised my own values and ideals what i need and want for my life and future in certain relationships and in my experience all ended badly I am not in those relationships anymore...........deb

[Candy_Pants]

My H enjoys high risk hobbies. Skateboarding and riding a motorcycle. He CAN'T ride a skateboard "safely", he's a ****ing daredevil, that's the thrill. So we've agreed that it's not smart for him to skate. However I can't "take" away the motorcycle riding. He knows he has to be very very safe or else I'll kick his butt.

 

I haven't been married long, but we're learning a little bit of surrender goes a long long way. But it has to be mutual, and done respectfully, and with trust in the other person.

 

Obviously compromise is the "ideal", but some things I simply.won't budge on (such as my birth plan). So I informed him and either he surrendered, or I would do whatever I wanted anyway .

[Grumpybutfun]

Well grumpy I gotta say I've seen your posts around and you seem pretty based. I'm gunna give it to you straight

 

The MMA stuff. If it's not competitive but a workout routine, you should be okay. They look after people pretty well there.

 

You going for a purse prize against a kid half your age, you're more than likely gunna end up on the losing end (whether it be the fight itself or a few years down the line with some serious health issues as a result). So I gotta say it really depends on those two things. If she's worried about you sparring bring her along and show her what it's like, I've done that in the past and she probably has horrifying images from the worst knock outs of all time on UFC's highlight reel running through her head or something that is simply not an accurate depiction of what you're doing.

 

As far as her family stuff goes. You can say whatever you want to her about it behind closed doors but at the end of the day that's her family and you have to respect that. You're not a psychologist (presumably, if I remember you're a military man) and just because you think her ignoring them is what's best for her doesn't necessarily mean that's true.

 

Comprimize isn't about "well I let you do MMA therefore I can do this, even though you don't like it". Comprimize is about an individual topic. These two things have nothing to do with each other and therefore comprimize has nothing to do with it (or at least I feel they are mutually exclusive).

 

That's my thoughts on it, cheers mate.

 

 

 

Hi crederer, I was just using those things as instances...no problems with our compromises. These two compromises are far between....mine was last year and her family stuff happened twenty one years ago so I try not to do the whole tit for tat because I do know what you mean. Definitely not what couples should do....

 

Yep, it is training and is competitive and I hope she doesn't read what you wrote.... I do pretty well, haven't lost yet to the kids, the problem was my inability to quit when I got hurt due to my over competitive nature and so she was probably right about me getting medical.

 

So do you think compromise is surrendering yourself or two people making joint decisions that affect their marriage?

 

Thanks for your feedback and cheers to you,

Grumps

[crederer]

Hi crederer, I was just using those things as instances...no problems with our compromises. These two compromises are far between....mine was last year and her family stuff happened twenty one years ago so I try not to do the whole tit for tat because I do know what you mean. Definitely not what couples should do....

 

Yep, it is training and is competitive and I hope she doesn't read what you wrote.... I do pretty well, haven't lost yet to the kids, the problem was my inability to quit when I got hurt due to my over competitive nature and so she was probably right about me getting medical.

 

So do you think compromise is surrendering yourself or two people making joint decisions that affect their marriage?

 

Thanks for your feedback and cheers to you,

Grumps

 

I think compromise is a combination of things. It's never about surrendering to your spouse. The fact you weren't able to quit while hurt (pride thing, I get it) is probably troubling to her, and to be perfectly honest, rightfully so. I still don't have an accurate picture of what's going on. She's just worried for you and your safety. But as I say, the two are exclusive.

 

Is it affecting your lives outside of the ring? Are you there all hours of your free time? Or is it that she's worried about seeing you get punched in the face?

[Fugu]

When you decide to get married, you're making a decision to compromise who you are as an individual. You are 100 percent yourself when you are by yourself, but when you decide to pair up with someone, you inevitably give up a part of yourself in order to accommodate the wants and needs of the person you're with.

 

Let me be straight: that doesn't mean giving up everything about you that's important - not in the least. If a couple is to work, it has to respect the individual self as well as the couple. But there's a give and take. The hard part -- really f*cking hard as I'm finding out -- is in knowing where those boundaries are. Everyone has an individual ego, and we don't part with that easily, but you have to make room for someone else's wants and needs. That's just the way it is. That's how I see it anyway.

[bwright42tx]

I think compromise is a combination of things. It's never about surrendering to your spouse. The fact you weren't able to quit while hurt (pride thing, I get it) is probably troubling to her, and to be perfectly honest, rightfully so. I still don't have an accurate picture of what's going on. She's just worried for you and your safety. But as I say, the two are exclusive.

 

Is it affecting your lives outside of the ring? Are you there all hours of your free time? Or is it that she's worried about seeing you get punched in the face?

 

I thin he's not looking for advice, but just opening a general discussion on compromise vs. surrendering, and giving two examples of compromise in his relationship.

 

I think the difference between compromise and surrender can be a subtle one. There have been many times in my relationship where I thought we'd reached a compromise on a particular issue, only to realize, many years later, she had simply surrendered to what I wanted.

 

Compromise doesn't always mean both people are happy, but it means both people can live with the outcome without resentment and feel like they had their point of view heard.

 

Surrender means one person "gave-in" just to end the discussion/shut the other person up.

[atlg8r]

For me, the difference can be explained with these examples:

 

My ex and I had a lot of strife over HIS ex-girlfriend, because early on we broke up over her. (Lots of drama...glad I learned from that eventually!) After that, through the entire relationship, he insisted on remaining her "friend" even though it drove me insane and we fought over it all the time. He always insisted "I'm not going to be with someone who tells me who my friends are." And I surrendered because .... I was an idiot. That was being a doormat.

 

Examples of compromise IMO: My current fiance is a smoker and I am not. I fell in love with him despite this very bad habit, so when I moved in with him (actually even before that) he agreed that unless or until he quit, he would not smoke around me or in the house. So he goes outside, either in the garage with the door open or out on the patio. It's an inconvenience to him, but he does it out of respect for me and my health/comfort. He's also promised he will quit at some point, but I haven't pushed. I feel he has to do that on his own or it won't last anyway.

 

A much smaller example was this weekend hanging a clock at home. I brought it from my old apartment when I moved in with him. I didn't care for where he suggested hanging it, so I offered a couple of alternatives. One of them he liked, too, so that's what we picked. It wasn't my first choice nor his, but we both were happy with it in the end.

[BetheButterfly]

I didn't want to thread jack another thread so I made this one to address what compromise means to people and when does that become surrender and being a doormat?

In my personal experiences compromise has always been about the two of us disagreeing about something and coming to a joint decision we both can agree with and be happy by discussing it in a calm manner.

 

That's a great definition about compromise. Agreed. My husband is very good at talking things through like that, in a calm and fun manner.

 

For instance, my wife was very afraid when I started MMAs fighting twenty year olds because at forty, I don't heal like I used to. She was dead against it but I really wasn't being challenged otherwise and was getting bored. We sat down and compromised by me promising that if I felt like anything was broken or an internal puncture, anything to the eyes or head occurred, I would seek medical attention regardless of time or place. I could live with that though sometimes it is a pain.

 

Thanks for sharing that. My hubby wants to get a motorcycle. Before we got married, I was ok with that (though I'm a bit scared of them; I saw a horrible motorcycle crash once and I still have it in my mind) but after we got married I changed my mind. I refuse to let him get a motorcycle cause I'm afraid he will get hurt. I know he can get hurt in other ways, but also one of my friend's friends got paralyzed in a motorcycle accident and that in turn paralyzed my tolerant attitude towards motorcycles.

 

While we've talked about it and he isn't pursuing getting a motorcycle now, I know that later on, he will broach the topic again. What do you think? Should I push my fears aside and let him live his dream? I just don't want him to get hurt.

 

However, when does it become surrendering who you are and what you are like to give in to demands?

 

That's a good question. Are my fears who I am? I know my husband gives in to my demand of no motorcycles because he understands I don't want him to get hurt, but am I not letting him be who he is?

When does it become less about compromise and more about making your way the only way or trying to change them? When do we say, this is who they are and I can or cannot accept it and just act on that instead of trying to change them?

 

Good points to ponder. I would like to talk to my husband about this.

 

My wife has always had a very dysfunctional family and yet she still wants to be a part of some of their lives....I know this isn't something I can change and if I try I am trying to change who she is, therefore I just have to be there for her when the inevitable toxicity and fallout occurs. I compromise my beliefs that she should only be around healthy and non toxic people and I get to fight twenty year olds....it works for both of us and we neither one feel resentment or like we aren't being true to our internal or authentic nature.

Any comments or thoughts? Stories of a failure to compromise or when you surrendered because you felt you had no choice? Thoughts on how compromising isn't something you would do because you believe you can coexist without change?

Grumps

 

What do you think about my fear of husband getting a motorcycle? Do you think I'm not letting him be himself and instead letting my fears drive me and negatively impact him? What if my fear of what could happen is protecting my husband from getting in a motorcycle accident?

 

As a Christian, I know Jesus said not to worry and not to be afraid, but I think it's good to strive to be safe. However, am I being a chicken and passing the being safe line and negatively impacting my spouse? My husband is not afraid. Should I withdraw my objections to him getting a motorcycle, since fear is my main objection?

[DKT3]

A good compromise is one when both walk away feeling like they didn't get what they wanted but can live with the decision. One getting what they want means the other didn't.

 

I recall with our daughter was a toddler I wanted to put in a salt water pool, wife didn't. Compromise was an above ground pool with a removable ladder. I felt it sucked because that meant no diving broad, she felt it sucked because we had a pool. Anything else and it would have been winning, compromise isn't about winning.

[Grumpybutfun]

 

That's a great definition about compromise. Agreed. My husband is very good at talking things through like that, in a calm and fun manner.

 

 

 

Thanks for sharing that. My hubby wants to get a motorcycle. Before we got married, I was ok with that (though I'm a bit scared of them; I saw a horrible motorcycle crash once and I still have it in my mind) but after we got married I changed my mind. I refuse to let him get a motorcycle cause I'm afraid he will get hurt. I know he can get hurt in other ways, but also one of my friend's friends got paralyzed in a motorcycle accident and that in turn paralyzed my tolerant attitude towards motorcycles.

 

While we've talked about it and he isn't pursuing getting a motorcycle now, I know that later on, he will broach the topic again. What do you think? Should I push my fears aside and let him live his dream? I just don't want him to get hurt.

 

 

 

That's a good question. Are my fears who I am? I know my husband gives in to my demand of no motorcycles because he understands I don't want him to get hurt, but am I not letting him be who he is?

 

 

Good points to ponder. I would like to talk to my husband about this.

 

 

 

What do you think about my fear of husband getting a motorcycle? Do you think I'm not letting him be himself and instead letting my fears drive me and negatively impact him? What if my fear of what could happen is protecting my husband from getting in a motorcycle accident?

 

As a Christian, I know Jesus said not to worry and not to be afraid, but I think it's good to strive to be safe. However, am I being a chicken and passing the being safe line and negatively impacting my spouse? My husband is not afraid. Should I withdraw my objections to him getting a motorcycle, since fear is my main objection?

 

This is what I meant about compromise vs. surrendering....exactly. Do you two compromise and come to some agreement you both can live with or does he just surrender what he wants for your fears?

Honestly, I think there are compromises such as him taking safety courses, buying the best safety equipment, and wearing a helmet at all times, only driving in clear weather....things that would make you feel like he is safer due to precaution. However, I understand your fears as it just takes one accident, one skid...but isn't that true with everything? He either surrenders what he wants or you two compromise by trying to come up with a solution with compromise. I know when I rode, my wife felt much better after I took a safety course, only drove on less busy roads and got the best safety equipment available while promising I would never go without a helmet. I lived in SC at the time and you didn't have to wear a helmet in Charleston. I wore one because it made her happy, and it is just smart to wear one. I think telling a grown man what he can and can't do is a very fine line towards being his mom. And that is not what a man wants his wife to be to him.

IMHO, you can have a conversation about what you would need to feel okay about this. You will never feel good about it, but there are ways to help him protect without telling him he can't do something. As men, we know we aren't infallible, but we don't want to give up things we enjoy because of safety concerns. I know it is crazy, but we are manly men.

Grumps

[Grumpybutfun]

I think compromise is a combination of things. It's never about surrendering to your spouse. The fact you weren't able to quit while hurt (pride thing, I get it) is probably troubling to her, and to be perfectly honest, rightfully so. I still don't have an accurate picture of what's going on. She's just worried for you and your safety. But as I say, the two are exclusive.

 

Is it affecting your lives outside of the ring? Are you there all hours of your free time? Or is it that she's worried about seeing you get punched in the face?

 

I was just using this as examples and these issues are all squared away and fine. I was mainly wanting to discuss this in general. My wife and I are very good at compromise and communication. It is hardly even a blip in our day...more like....idea, counter, concern, counter, negotiation, fact gathering, negotiation, and compromise reached, on with our day.

 

I was asking in general about compromise and surrendering....if you feel like compromise is surrendering or if you feel like you can't compromise due to having issues communicating?

Best,

Grumps

[sumdude]

GB sounds like you and your wife are a great match. Would you say you have similar personalities?

 

Compromise vs. giving in..or giving up.

 

Seems like a fine line sometimes. I think in the end if one person ends up feeling resentful then that's when it stops being a compromise. The other party may never know because the one feeling resentful may not have known at the time that they weren't compromising, they were surrendering. But they made the 'deal' and have to live with it. Not that surrender is always a bad thing, Lennon Wrote "Love is surrender" in the song Mind Games which is often the truth.

Edited May 8, 2014 by sumdude

[BetheButterfly]

 

This is what I meant about compromise vs. surrendering....exactly. Do you two compromise and come to some agreement you both can live with or does he just surrender what he wants for your fears?

Honestly, I think there are compromises such as him taking safety courses, buying the best safety equipment, and wearing a helmet at all times, only driving in clear weather....things that would make you feel like he is safer due to precaution. However, I understand your fears as it just takes one accident, one skid...but isn't that true with everything? He either surrenders what he wants or you two compromise by trying to come up with a solution with compromise. I know when I rode, my wife felt much better after I took a safety course, only drove on less busy roads and got the best safety equipment available while promising I would never go without a helmet. I lived in SC at the time and you didn't have to wear a helmet in Charleston. I wore one because it made her happy, and it is just smart to wear one. I think telling a grown man what he can and can't do is a very fine line towards being his mom. And that is not what a man wants his wife to be to him.

IMHO, you can have a conversation about what you would need to feel okay about this. You will never feel good about it, but there are ways to help him protect without telling him he can't do something. As men, we know we aren't infallible, but we don't want to give up things we enjoy because of safety concerns. I know it is crazy, but we are manly men.

Grumps

 

Update! Guess what? I told my husband that I support his desire of getting a motorcycle today, and I'm actually excited about riding behind him!!! While it is dangerous and I have a friend who got paralyzed by a motorcycle accident, I am learning that I do not need to be afraid, just careful, and trust God that if an accident happens, He will give the strength we need. Thanks for the encouragement to respect my man's love of motorcycles and the advice about how to ride responsibly. Greatly appreciated

[2sunny]

To me...

 

Compromise is meeting someone halfway in the middle.

 

Surrender - to cease fighting = no longer a battle.

 

I don't ever equate surrender with being a doormat. That would indicate that I compromised my integrity/boundary. No can do.

 

 

Surrender -to me - means becoming neutral about an issue.

 

For me, good balance is key...

[Mr. Lucky]

To me it's as simple as this:

 

Surrender serves the needs of the individual.

 

Compromise serves the needs of the relationship.

 

Keeping those very different entities in a healthy balance over the course of years, family, careers, etc. is the biggest challenge in a LTR...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Art_Critic]

Surrendering doesn't have to be a negative.. in the AA the steps are all about surrendering but surrendering for the better, for growth to take place.

 

I do think if you surrender you do lose part of your identity but in the transformation of it all your new work in progress identity is who you are..

 

Compromise in marriage to me is all about 2 people living as one who have different opinions about issues that need to be addressed and you come together to keep both of you happy.. but surrendering isn't part of that..

 

So.. both are good... being a doormat isn't about growth..or surrendering or compromising.. being a doormat is about losing your self respect to the point where someone else's happiness comes before yours.