roryb Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 So, I’ve been on 1.5 dates with a girl (we met at my university, whilst she was visiting a friend, spent hours talking and I messaged her the next day, and we met up the next week in my hometown.) The date went really well, we chatted for hours again, loads in common, few awkward silences, she was laughing loads, asking lots of questions and so on. The ‘problem’ was that there was next to no physical touching, except hugs. I made the rookie mistake of going to a bar, and sitting across the table, which made it almost impossible to get close, I didn’t think it would be wise to attempt to sit next to her, when I’m still getting to know her. I’m at university currently, and as a result, most of my recent flings/relationships have stemmed from drunken encounters, so this is unchartered territory in a way. I don’t want to get friend-zoned due to not making a move, which I think may happen if nothing happens on the next date. Also, in the 'online dating era, people seem to lose interest very quickly (I know that she uses them) When we first met, she said a few things, which made me cautious about making a move, such as it’s a big deal for her to kiss someone, she has to really like them’ and when I offered to walk her back (she stayed out much longer than her friend) she made a point of mentioning that I wouldn’t be coming in. She also mentioned a crazy manipulative ex, and a stalker guy who rings her intermittedly (possibly from a dating site). I don’t want her to think that I’m only after ‘one thing’ Just looking for suggestions on good second dates, which lend well to physical escalation, aside from a bar? We’ve both decided to do something ‘different’ – so maybe a spoken word event/gallery exhibition/late night at a museum? I live in the UK, so anything outdoors is probably best kept for better weather! Sorry for the length, any general advice/insights are appreciated! Link to post Share on other sites
d0nnivain Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Go to a bar that has dancing? Play bar games & step behind her to correct her form when throwing darts or shooting pool Take her to the cinema & put your arm around her. Kiss her cheek hello when you see her. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Redfisher Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 To bad the weathers crappy, I find nature hikes to be best. You can grab a hand then a little later pull her in for a kiss by some nice scenery.. Link to post Share on other sites
RedRobin Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 When she is walking in the door, you push open the door with one hand and place your other hand on her lower back to 'escort' her in. It's a pro move, but one I find very sexy by a man I am just getting to know. I am also not into kissing men on the lips right away. How a man hugs me says a lot about how compatible we will be later. How was that hug? Was it basically a shoulder grab and a pat on the back? Or was it an embrace? Link to post Share on other sites
xUnknown Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Go Glow Bowling (the bowling at night with music/blacklights and stuff). That's always my 2nd date go to. hahaha. Music and couple drinks provides a good atmosphere. Plus, it provides a great place to make fun of yourself for sucking and have a good laugh. You can make "bets" on who wins (ie: kiss), show her how to hold the ball correctly. I'm telling ya, its fun and a great way to loosen up any tension there is. Link to post Share on other sites
Redfisher Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Go Glow Bowling (the bowling at night with music/blacklights and stuff). That's always my 2nd date go to. hahaha. Music and couple drinks provides a good atmosphere. Plus, it provides a great place to make fun of yourself for sucking and have a good laugh. You can make "bets" on who wins (ie: kiss), show her how to hold the ball correctly. I'm telling ya, its fun and a great way to loosen up any tension there is. Yes that's awesome, 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author roryb Posted November 18, 2015 Author Share Posted November 18, 2015 Thanks guys, will take the suggestions on board! Link to post Share on other sites
JBLV Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I would be careful, since her past experiences might mean she has a defense barrier. Just try and read the situation, before making a move. Second dates are usually a sign that she's interested. It's better to try and fail than not try at all. Link to post Share on other sites
Author roryb Posted November 19, 2015 Author Share Posted November 19, 2015 I would be careful, since her past experiences might mean she has a defense barrier. Just try and read the situation, before making a move. Second dates are usually a sign that she's interested. It's better to try and fail than not try at all. Yeah, I was wary since she's been hurt in the past by guys. So, not sure how to proceed. Link to post Share on other sites
d0nnivain Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 Everybody has been hurt by somebody. Just be a nice person & all should be well. Link to post Share on other sites
Author roryb Posted November 19, 2015 Author Share Posted November 19, 2015 Everybody has been hurt by somebody. Just be a nice person & all should be well. What do you think of the whole no makeout by second date = friendzone. Seen/heard conflicting stories. Link to post Share on other sites
d0nnivain Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 No kiss by the 2nd date would & did bother me. My husband didn't kiss me until our 3rd date. I was fully prepared to dump him if it hadn't. Make out . . . well that can take a bit longer. Many women don't want to be pressured. You have to see how she reacts but there at least has to be some flirting & contact even if hand-holding, brushing of the arm . . . something to get over the touch barrier. Otherwise it's a no-go, friend-zone thing, IMO. Link to post Share on other sites
Zapbasket Posted November 19, 2015 Share Posted November 19, 2015 When we first met, she said a few things, which made me cautious about making a move, such as it’s a big deal for her to kiss someone, she has to really like them’ and when I offered to walk her back (she stayed out much longer than her friend) she made a point of mentioning that I wouldn’t be coming in. She also mentioned a crazy manipulative ex, and a stalker guy who rings her intermittedly (possibly from a dating site). I don’t want her to think that I’m only after ‘one thing’ I think that's a big clue right there about how to proceed. She's telling you she wants to take some time to get to know you before she does anything physical with you. She's saying her trust has been shaken and she's wanting to be cautious. The way forward is to RESPECT THAT. Instead of just plowing in for a kiss this next date, try saying this: "I want you to know I'm really attracted to you. But last time you were telling me that it's a big deal for you to kiss someone, so I don't want to try to do anything you're not comfortable with." Then, if she's relaxed and you both are having a good time, put your hand on her shoulder at some point. Or tuck a piece of stray hair behind her ear. Her response will give you an indication of where she is in terms of being ready to do anything physical. Read her cues. By engaging with her physically in ways less intimidating than kissing, you're indicating your attraction and creating openings for her to respond in kind when she is ready. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author roryb Posted November 19, 2015 Author Share Posted November 19, 2015 I think that's a big clue right there about how to proceed. She's telling you she wants to take some time to get to know you before she does anything physical with you. She's saying her trust has been shaken and she's wanting to be cautious. The way forward is to RESPECT THAT. Instead of just plowing in for a kiss this next date, try saying this: "I want you to know I'm really attracted to you. But last time you were telling me that it's a big deal for you to kiss someone, so I don't want to try to do anything you're not comfortable with." Then, if she's relaxed and you both are having a good time, put your hand on her shoulder at some point. Or tuck a piece of stray hair behind her ear. Her response will give you an indication of where she is in terms of being ready to do anything physical. Read her cues. By engaging with her physically in ways less intimidating than kissing, you're indicating your attraction and creating openings for her to respond in kind when she is ready. Thank you for that. I think that's the best way to approach the situation, since after what she's said, I don't want her to think that I didn't pay any attention to what she said. Link to post Share on other sites
shet Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 There's a difference between diving in to inhale her face, and snatching a quick peck on the lips. Not many adult women will flinch from a guy they like giving them a little smooch on a second date unless the date is a con and not a date as far as they're concerned... or they're such damaged goods it's not worth your time fighting through their dysfunction. Trust me I've been through both more than once. Usually a vague understanding of body language will let you know if she wants a kiss. Getting close, turning to face you, looking at your mouth and smiling... lingering during conversation... et cetera. You will feel like they expect something. The difference between those who do and don't want it is light and day. At least, until drugs or extreme drunkenness are involved, where established physical cues go out the window, but we'll assume neither of you are getting trashed on a second date. Even if you get it wrong and they flinch away as you lean in, consider; one, WTF did they think was going to happen on a second date, they signed up for it by going; and two, a peck on the lips is hardly anything, if that's too much, how do you think she'll be in the bedroom, or the rest of life really. Of course, once you've successfully managed the small kiss, you can leave it at that or linger and see if she wants more. One woman I dated, as I was about to get in the car after a simple smooch at the door and goodbye, ran back out of the house and sucked my face off. Very often you'll manage a chaste kiss, think from her response that that's it, then after a short delay while those neurons fire up she'll grab your jacket and haul you in for more. I personally find women need that initial move from you, as we hear so much about, but once you make even that small gesture the floodgates can open and they'll just eat you up. Stupid really. Link to post Share on other sites
Zapbasket Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Even if you get it wrong and they flinch away as you lean in, consider; one, WTF did they think was going to happen on a second date, they signed up for it by going; and two, a peck on the lips is hardly anything, if that's too much, how do you think she'll be in the bedroom, or the rest of life really. I don't think this is a good way to look at it at all. First of all, there is no hard and fast rule regarding how many dates should happen before the first kiss. It's all, and only, about the two people involved. If you're truly interested in getting to know a person, then part of the process is learning what THEIR pace is, even if it differs from your own. No one has an obligation to do anything physical after X number of dates. This goes both ways, of course--if one person's desired pace is faster than the other person's, then the slower-paced person should make an effort to acknowledge that. Doing so in no way means, however, that they're obligated to match the other person's pace. No one has to do anything they don't want to do. If it's of primary importance that the OP get a kiss on the second date, then he doesn't have to continue dating anyone who won't give him that. I, personally, feel no need to kiss on the second, third, fourth or even fifth date. I have no set rule for when a kiss happens...but I do know that I'm well practiced at this stage of my life in sexual matters, and all too knowledgeable of the fact that even the most passionate physical attraction does not mean the two people align with each other in other key ways. More than kissing, making out, sex, etc., I want to know that I can enjoy a person's company; that we have plenty of things to talk about well beyond a spate of dates; that he is kind, of good character and someone I could see potentially being a true partner to me in every sense of the word as things unfold between us. EVENTUALLY, yes, that means physically, too. But I'd rather see the signs of the other kinds of compatibility before I dive into the physical aspect. Sometimes, I've learned from experience, my physical attraction to a person clouds my judgment regarding other important things. So I'm a date who would probably turn down a second-date kiss. I'd appreciate if the person I'm dating respected that. If not, then he has the choice to move on to someone else, and he'd be welcome to, if he could not respect my pace. Does my reticence in the initial dating stages mean I don't know how to get it on when the time comes? Of course not. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
JBLV Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 I, personally, feel no need to kiss on the second, third, fourth or even fifth date. I have no set rule for when a kiss happens... You must surely accept that you are in the minority? Most women would not stick around if a man had not made any move by the fourth/fifth date. He'd probably be labelled shy/awkward. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Redfisher Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 I just had a mental picture of a t-shirt that says "I kiss on the first date" I'm a dork...Haha. Link to post Share on other sites
Lois_Griffin Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 Go Glow Bowling (the bowling at night with music/blacklights and stuff). That's always my 2nd date go to. hahaha. Music and couple drinks provides a good atmosphere. Plus, it provides a great place to make fun of yourself for sucking and have a good laugh. You can make "bets" on who wins (ie: kiss), show her how to hold the ball correctly. I'm telling ya, its fun and a great way to loosen up any tension there is. Hell - I want to do that and I'm married! LOL. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Zapbasket Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 You must surely accept that you are in the minority? Most women would not stick around if a man had not made any move by the fourth/fifth date. He'd probably be labelled shy/awkward. I'm 39, not 24. By now I'd hope that a guy I'm compatible with would also have learned that swapping spit isn't worth it if there's as yet no indication of character and depth. I'm at a point in my life where I'm much more impressed by someone who shows that he's actually developed emotionally as he went through his 20s and 30s, than someone who still feels there should be X physical contact by date X. To me, kissing as a way to establish intimacy is much more a sign of shyness (i.e., lack of emotional depth/versatility) than hurrying to kiss. Link to post Share on other sites
SwordofFlame Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 You must surely accept that you are in the minority? Most women would not stick around if a man had not made any move by the fourth/fifth date. He'd probably be labelled shy/awkward. The funny thing is the guy can also label the women shy/awkward too if she doesn't want to kiss by then. Link to post Share on other sites
JBLV Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 The funny thing is the guy can also label the women shy/awkward too if she doesn't want to kiss by then. That is true, but people are more sympathetic to women in those circumstances. People will suggest that maybe she's been hurt in the past, like to take things slow. Alternatively, people will say that if he's not prepared to wait for intimacy, forget him! I'm 39, not 24. By now I'd hope that a guy I'm compatible with would also have learned that swapping spit isn't worth it if there's as yet no indication of character and depth. I'm at a point in my life where I'm much more impressed by someone who shows that he's actually developed emotionally as he went through his 20s and 30s, than someone who still feels there should be X physical contact by date X. To me, kissing as a way to establish intimacy is much more a sign of shyness (i.e., lack of emotional depth/versatility) than hurrying to kiss. OK, well the OP said that he's at university, so I'd assume they are in the range of 18-25, where different rules tend to apply. Link to post Share on other sites
Odinani Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 a man feeling angst because there's no physical action after just 1.5 dates is quite alarming. Many women would see such an attitude as a bit of a red flag. Link to post Share on other sites
SwordofFlame Posted November 20, 2015 Share Posted November 20, 2015 OP I would say don't wait too long to make a move. I won't put a set number of dates on the amount of time, but usually the longer you wait, the greater the chance is that you'll never leave the friend zone. The reason for that may not necessarily have anything to do with kissing, but rather the fact that she might just be disinterested. I'd also date other girls simultaneously too so you don't get too attached to her. Link to post Share on other sites
Author roryb Posted November 20, 2015 Author Share Posted November 20, 2015 a man feeling angst because there's no physical action after just 1.5 dates is quite alarming. Many women would see such an attitude as a bit of a red flag. Not sure I would call it angst. Our encounters have been fairly 'platonic', so I just thought that it may be time to make it clear that I'm romantically interested in her. I have female friends/dated girls, who become disinterested if a guy has not made any move by the second date, so it's difficult to know which approach to take. OK, well the OP said that he's at university, so I'd assume they are in the range of 18-25, where different rules tend to apply. I'm 21 and she's 23, she's working, whilst I'm in my final year of university. Link to post Share on other sites
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