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The new, consolidated, Paying for Dates thread


Dating Dating, courting, or going steady? Things not working out the way you had hoped? Stand up on your soap box and let us know what's going on!

View Poll Results: Who should pay for dates?
Men always should pay 57 22.44%
Women always should pay 5 1.97%
Men and women should take turns paying 173 68.11%
I have no opinion/other/see comments 19 7.48%
Voters: 254. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 25th April 2015, 4:50 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by enigma32 View Post
Most women expect men to pay for dates because they can. Dating is a competition. As a man, if you aren't willing to pay for the a date, whatever woman you are interested in can probably find a guy who will pay. Why should she date you? Unless you are much better looking than she is, she will most likely pick someone else.
Women don't pick guys because they can/will pay. Well, some do, but the vast majority aren't picking men that way.

We pick they guy we like. The guy we hope likes us, too. The guy that we are attracted to.

Paying says, "I like you." Paying says, "You're special enough to treat." It's not a guarantee of his interest or genuineness, but it's an early sign, whereas not paying can also be interpreted as a sign of the opposite.

It's really not about getting free food.
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Old 25th April 2015, 4:58 PM   #47
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my most recent ex is the only one I've been with who paid. 100% insisted and wouldn't accept any contribution from me.

My exes before that we either bought our own way, or just didn't go on dates that involved spending money.

Having been used to paying for myself, my ex was a very new experience, and since I naturally can sometimes be averse to people spending money on me, it took a while for me to stop being so worked up and feeling terrible about it. If I tried to grab the check he'd wrestle it out of my hands. I eventually accepted that it was something he enjoyed doing. And then towards the end, came the fights and the insinuations about his paying for me and I thought "oh. okay. yep. gonna hold it over my head that you paid, even when I tried to. Thanks."

So that leaves me a bit leery. Everything I own, I bought, save for a necklace from my parents and my flute which was from my grandmother. Otherwise, I fully pay for myself in all aspects of life.
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Old 25th April 2015, 5:01 PM   #48
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I automatically assume I'm paying.

Not out of obligation, but because i believe men should pay, at least early on.

I'm a fan keeping things simple. And the simple truth is paying gives off a masculine vibe to the woman, and it makes her feel feminine.

Plus, it's just the stud thing to do. And it never, ever hurts your chances.
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Old 25th April 2015, 5:03 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by MrNate 2.0 View Post
I automatically assume I'm paying.

Not out of obligation, but because i believe men should pay, at least early on.

I'm a fan keeping things simple. And the simple truth is paying gives off a masculine vibe to the woman, and it makes her feel feminine.

Plus, it's just the stud thing to do. And it never, ever hurts your chances.
It makes her feel feminine when she is interested.
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Old 25th April 2015, 5:52 PM   #50
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It makes her feel feminine when she is interested.
Seeing she agreed to go out with you, it's usually safe to say there's at least some there.
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Old 25th April 2015, 6:03 PM   #51
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Seeing she agreed to go out with you, it's usually safe to say there's at least some there.
Not necessarily. I've been out with quite a few women who decided on the first date that they had no sexual interest in me, but enjoyed my company otherwise. They were happy to keep things going without any progress forward.
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Old 25th April 2015, 6:07 PM   #52
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It makes her feel feminine when she is interested.
If I concluded by the end of the date that I'm not interested, I would insist on paying my share.
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Old 25th April 2015, 6:15 PM   #53
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I read Gaeta's post and she did not attach biology to social convention. Where did you get that from? What are you saying? That our subconscious thoughts are not biological? That makes no sense at all. Gaeta's post was what she thought men think on a subconscious level when they pay for a woman on a date.
So, are you saying? That you believe that romantic love isn't biological and is an invention of the Medieval Code of Chivalry social norms that started in 13th Century France? That can't be true. Have you watched French movies? Haha!
Our real instincts are very vague. For example, you get thirsty but that impulse doesn't tell you whether to drink water, coke, or whiskey. That choice is controlled by habit and social convention. Our dating needs work this way as well. Paying for dates is such a social convention... but that instinctual thirst could easily be quenched in other ways.

The emotions behind "love" and "lust" have been around forever. However, most typically you would be married off to whoever brought your family the most benefit. Nearly all hunter gatherer societies perform this way. The whole idea of two people meeting and falling in love and then getting married was preposterous pre-1300's. In fact if you look at Romeo and Juliet written some 300 years later, you find the society teaching this kind of love to be dangerous and stupid.

The idea that people choose their own spouse is relatively new, and honestly isn't working out well... despite the alternative being morally repugnant.
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Old 25th April 2015, 6:16 PM   #54
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If I concluded by the end of the date that I'm not interested, I would insist on paying my share.
I think that's what the girl did 3 weeks ago and like a fool I said,,,"No I got it"

LOL
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Old 25th April 2015, 6:19 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by LifeandPerseverance View Post
There may actually be something to this. I just figured it was the thoughtfulness aspect?


I don't know. I feel like whoever invites the other on the date should pay. Regardless of gender. The pursuer should pay.
Your second paragraph -- that works for friends but not dating.

And agree with gaius, on a subconscious level, when a man pays, it IS a turn on. Don't know why, but it is.

And when a woman is turned on, the man feels good = win win.

Not to mention, when a woman feels turned on, she will want to turn her man on! By striving to be the most responsive, exciting, spontaneous partner he's ever had! Another win-win!

Of course there are other variables involved in turning each other on; a man paying in the early stages is just one.
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Old 25th April 2015, 6:59 PM   #56
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Men who quibble about bills on dates, may always quibble about other money aspects, and as many marriages founder due to arguments about money, then that is not a great start.
I think men who quibble may be that way, but I think men who see women as equals and who believe that paying at least part of the time is reasonable are no more likely to. In fact, I'd say men who insist on paying are likely to be far more controlling (of finances, and everything).
And let's flip it around - I would think a woman who never offers to pay is likely to be that way in a relationship - always taking what she can get and offering little in return.


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Originally Posted by enigma32 View Post
Most women expect men to pay for dates because they can….
I like getting free meals too.
This is exactly the dynamic I am trying to avoid which paying for 1st, 2nd 3rd dates seems to attract.

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Originally Posted by SawtoothMars View Post
I think a lot of these guys feel the situation is like an employer that forces people to pay money to have an interview.
.
It feels like that to me to.

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Originally Posted by SawtoothMars View Post
Paying for dates is such a social convention... but that instinctual thirst could easily be quenched in other ways.
I agree. We have a lot of biological urges underlining us. We don't listen to them all. Thankfully (most of) society has managed to curb the urges we have to just take a female and have sex, to attack someone who wrongs us.
Just because it's hard wired into us doesn't mean is right or appropriate in modern society.

And it's not about being cheap or 'being a wuss'. It's about adjusting our beliefs to be in line with the real world we live in.

It's interesting how many people say they think a man paying is sexy or powerful. It's well known in PUA community that buying girls drinks at a bar is a surefire way to lower your value in their eyes. Sure they may like it, but most won't respect you for it. Perhaps it's different with an organised date, but I'm not convinced.

Anyway, thanks everyone for your replies. Definitely an interesting thread.
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Old 25th April 2015, 7:17 PM   #57
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It's interesting how many people say they think a man paying is sexy or powerful. It's well known in PUA community that buying girls drinks at a bar is a surefire way to lower your value in their eyes. Sure they may like it, but most won't respect you for it. Perhaps it's different with an organised date, but I'm not convinced.
Yes, it's extremely different when courting a woman who's already agreed to a date vs. trying to pick up a woman in a bar.

It's a dance, and he can lead if he's inclined. Many are inclined.

1. He asks her out (shows interest)
2. She agrees (returns interest)
3. He offers to pay (shows interest)
4. She accepts (returns interest)

It advances from there, or not, but it's a step in the dance. And steadily, they each show more and more interest. As I said on the last thread on this topic, if a man didn't offer to pay for the first date, I'd simply pay for myself. But I'd be disappointed because I'd feel that it was a sign that he's not that into me.
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Old 25th April 2015, 7:29 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by El Pallasso View Post
You have to understand that most women only want "equality" in the parts that convenience them.
Who pays for dates is a social etiquette thing it's not really a question of "equality" like being able to vote and equal pay for equal work type things!! Everybody can choose do do as they like as far as paying for dates!!
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Old 25th April 2015, 7:30 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by xxoo View Post

1. He asks her out (shows interest)
2. She agrees (returns interest)
3. He offers to pay (shows interest)
4. She accepts (returns interest)

It advances from there, or not, but it's a step in the dance. And steadily, they each show more and more interest. As I said on the last thread on this topic, if a man didn't offer to pay for the first date, I'd simply pay for myself. But I'd be disappointed because I'd feel that it was a sign that he's not that into me.
Exactly!! Step 4 is VERY telling. I would pretty much be offended if my date took a hard line on going dutch, at least on the first date . . . but, I'm in my late 40s (borderline baby boomer/Gen X). It always surprises me to see paying for dates as such a hot-button issue on LS. Could it be a generational thing? As we've gone from Gen X --> Gen Y --> Millenial, you combine the proliferation of online dating with a tighter economy and a more pessimistic outlook on the economy's future.
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Old 25th April 2015, 7:30 PM   #60
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Yes, it's extremely different when courting a woman who's already agreed to a date vs. trying to pick up a woman in a bar.

It's a dance, and he can lead if he's inclined. Many are inclined.

1. He asks her out (shows interest)
2. She agrees (returns interest)
3. He offers to pay (shows interest)
4. She accepts (returns interest)

It advances from there, or not, but it's a step in the dance. And steadily, they each show more and more interest. As I said on the last thread on this topic, if a man didn't offer to pay for the first date, I'd simply pay for myself. But I'd be disappointed because I'd feel that it was a sign that he's not that into me.
I agree with this with the exception of the last step. Just because a woman accepts payment, her interest is not guaranteed.
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