When somebody says "lower your standards" or "stay in your league"

[AD1980]

Whenver sombody has problems attracting the opposite sex you usually hear this which may be good advice but it kinda leaves a bad taste in my mouth as far as the dating scene marriage love etc

 

In the sense that people are on levels and only settle for what they can get with how they look or whatever

 

Are most people picked because the perosn inittiating realized he or she just cant do any betetr and not becasue they tohught that person was good looking when they first sae them?

 

I hate the word settle but we all settle in some way for whatever we can get or attract and it may not be what we are that moved by but we cant do any better

 

I know its depressing to break down the whole thing like this but isnt it kind of reality we settle for what we can get with where we are on the social food chain?

 

And if we were allot higher up wed probably be with somebody different?

[Eeyore79]

Attractiveness isn't just about looks. It's also about what someone's personality is like, whether you have things in common and find them fun and interesting, whether you have similar values and life goals, how they behave, etc.

 

Everyone wants to date someone they find attractive, but that doesn't mean someone has to be gorgeous looking for others to find them attractive. Someone may be out of your league in terms of looks, but if you make up for that with your other positive attributes then you could easily find yourself in the same league overall and end up dating them.

[GivenUp0083]

I think as we get older are tastes or desires in the opposite sex start to change. Our priorities may differ as we age and having super hot bodied woman as a girfriend becomes less important to some people and maybe other qualities like compatability, kindness, responsibility, maturity all become much more important than looks.

 

In a monetary empire like the United States you're going to have classes because not everyone is on the same level in varying areas of social life, but for the most part if you feel strong enough for someone those classes become less noticeable.

 

I think certain standards of personality are important to hold, yet people need to realize that not everyone is perfect and we all have baggage. Too many times in my online dating experiences have I met women or heard of women who rule a guy out because "he did this one thing that one time and it was a little weird". Okay, well people get nervous dating and not everyone knows your personal rules to dating, and maybe he had a messed up GF in the past that liked it when he did that. Who knows why, but having standards is important but being open minded and understanding is just as relevant.

 

I also think that with the era of technology this world has entered, dating will only become harder and harder. We are becoming less "physically social" and more "online social" to the point where we don't meet anyone outside of the internet as people used to. We do everything through technology now, we look for jobs and things to buy on the internet, why go to a store? We don't call to say hello anymore, we text. In my career in sales no one answers their phone, they just say to email them. It's getting worse and worse, society is closing the door on avenues to meet new people, and because the internet has connect every human being on the planet to mass communication, there's no reason for someone to "settle" because they can find a new person the very next day through an email or a website.

 

That's my "the world is going to ****" rant of the day. Peace I'm outta here

[GoodOnPaper]

Whenver sombody has problems attracting the opposite sex you usually hear this which may be good advice but it kinda leaves a bad taste in my mouth as far as the dating scene marriage love etc

 

Me too. I knew I would never attract the most or the best looking women in the world, but I really did hope that I could attract someone that I would feel very drawn to physically and fall head-over-heels for, but that never happened. Is it possible to find within your "league" the kind of intense attraction, sex, and intimacy that those in the top 5% or so probably experience on a regular basis? I don't know, but if not . . .

 

I know its depressing to break down the whole thing like this but isnt it kind of reality we settle for what we can get with where we are on the social food chain?

 

. . . then it certainly is depressing.

[Andy_K]

Better to raise the level of what you have to offer than drop your standards.

 

Join a gym, cool your temper, get a better job, educate yourself, take up hobbies, whatever improves your life and improves your dating prospects.

[Cee]

I don't think of it as settling, but as broadening my preferences to include men who are actually interested in me.

 

Thanks to multiple LS threads, I realize that my picker is broken. I pick men who want nothing to do with me and ignore the ones who like me. It's high time I start considering the fact my taste in men is seriously effed up.

[4givrnt4gtr]

Honestly I think when we like someone who is "out of our league" is because the qualities this person has is what we want to have ourselves. That or we hope that by being with someone "better" than us we might somehow shine with their light (this latter part is so not healthy).

 

In any case if its the former, I agree with the poster that says that instead of "settling" you should become the person you would like to be with...literally...whatever it is, education, personality etc. Now, in regards to looks, I accept not everyone has been blessed with a Brad Pit/Angelina Jolie looks but that doesn't mean you can't accentuate your positive qualities, take care of yourself and whats more important, accept and love who you are (i know, cliche but oh so true...nothing more attractive than a goofy looking yet confident man in my book).

 

Think about it....so many gorgeous women, with average looking men....still, they love them and date them. At first glance, you think...what the heck...but then you meet the guy, and you see how he was able to balance his average looks, with a great personality and confidence to kill.

[OceanGirl]

Unfortunately, this saying is very true.

 

It mostly means lower your standards looks wise but also includes your status (for men), confidence, intelligence etc.

 

I know that when I date a guy that is a much worse looking than me, has worse job than me etc etc, he is so eager to please me and to hang on to me that I can get away with murder. His tolerance level is much higher because he simply has fewer options. Sadly, I can't be happy with a guy like that so it doesn't work out.

 

When I am dating a super hot, successful guy, it's a whole different ballgame. If I am feeling somewhat down and am not as talkative or fun on one of the early dates, he will next me. After all, he has about 999 cuing to date him so he can afford to.

 

It's a simple concept of supply or demand.

[EasyHeart]

You should never date anyone you don't want to date. Why waste your time? Unfortunately, many people never develop the self-confidence to NOT date.

 

The only people who should "settle" are people who have a ridiculous, overly-comprehensive list of criteria for anyone to consider dating them. Women seem to do this more often than men, but I'm sure it goes both ways.

 

For instance, I know a woman who will not consider dating anyone unless he is: 6'2" or taller, blonde, no hair on his chest, makes at least $250,000/year, never married/no kids, lives within 15 minutes of her, has a >4000 sq. ft. house, has a boat and/or private plane, belonged to certain fraternities in college, likes downhill skiing (and preferably owns a condo in a ski resort), and either owns or is willing to buy horses. As you might guess, this severely limits her dating options. And frankly, she's decent-looking and fairly nice, but not the kind of woman you're going to pick out of a crowd. Someone like this is never going to find someone unless she "settles", because her expectations are completely unrealistic.

[Eeyore79]

If someone is of equivalent attractiveness to yourself, you don't feel like you're settling. A gorgeous woman might look at an average guy and think "Eww" because he's below her standards, whereas an average woman might look at the same guy and think he's attractive, and an ugly woman might look at the same guy and think he's so hot that he's out of her league.

 

No matter what you're like, there's someone who will find you attractive... but that person is probably going to be of roughly equivalent attractiveness to yourself, so if you're not hot, your partner probably won't be either.

[GoodOnPaper]

No matter what you're like, there's someone who will find you attractive... but that person is probably going to be of roughly equivalent attractiveness to yourself, so if you're not hot, your partner probably won't be either.

 

So are such couplings doomed to a life of mediocre connection, intimacy, sex, etc. if we're not in that upper echelon of physical attractiveness?

[somedude81]

The problem that the posters aren't realizing, is that most likely AD1980 is already going after women with similar levels of attractiveness and class as himself.

 

But when women in "your league" keep turning you down, and people tell you to settle. The only thing it means, is to lower your standards and go for women you aren't attracted to at all.

 

To me, that's a ridiculous thought. If a man isn't ugly or overweight, he shouldn't have to settle for women that are.

 

Cee actually brought something up, it seems women are the ones who need to settle, not the men. All women want the dashing rogue. But he doesn't care about the woman. A quick tumble then he's off to the next conquest. Are women truly happy just being another mark in the bedpost?

[brainygirl]

So are such couplings doomed to a life of mediocre connection, intimacy, sex, etc. if we're not in that upper echelon of physical attractiveness?

 

So plain people can't have good sex? Its a fallacious argument.

 

There are many aspects of love and intimacy, by focusing too much on one aspect, such as appearance or money, you limit the chances of finding the very love and intimacy you look for.

 

And its just silly to assume that just because you look at a person and think them mediocre that their mate thinks the same thing, of course you should find someone you think is wonderful, but there is more to wonderful than a pretty face and a hot body.

[brainygirl]

The problem that the posters aren't realizing, is that most likely AD1980 is already going after women with similar levels of attractiveness and class as himself.

 

But when women in "your league" keep turning you down, and people tell you to settle. The only thing it means, is to lower your standards and go for women you aren't attracted to at all.

 

To me, that's a ridiculous thought. If a man isn't ugly or overweight, he shouldn't have to settle for women that are.

 

Cee actually brought something up, it seems women are the ones who need to settle, not the men. All women want the dashing rogue. But he doesn't care about the woman. A quick tumble then he's off to the next conquest. Are women truly happy just being another mark in the bedpost?

 

But, again, there's more to matches than looks. Fine, he's in decent shape and has a nice look. What's his personality like? Does he go around frowning constantly with a bad attitude? Does he make "joke" that make women feel uncomfortable? Is his personal hygiene lacking?

 

And again, maybe these women you are calling fat and ugly don't think of themselves that way and certainly don't appreciate being told "so sorry, you are too fat and ugly for me to take a few minutes to get to know you".

 

And why should women, some of whom may be plain, but who've got great personalities, good careers and certain life goals and aspirations settle for men who have no jobs, no ambitions, and are irresponsible?

[Kamille]

So are such couplings doomed to a life of mediocre connection, intimacy, sex, etc. if we're not in that upper echelon of physical attractiveness?

What ???Seriously? You think physical appearance is a reliable indicator of outstanding connections, intimacy and quality sex?

 

 

 

I never paid attentions to leagues, fortunately, and as a result, consider that I mostly have been with men who were definitely physically out of my league. Friends still swoon when I mention ex ex. I'm cute and I have a great personality. It goes a long way.

 

Also, different people are attracted to different physical and personal traits.

 

I sometimes wonder if people who are so focused on leagues aren't talking for themselves, ie, they value the physical appearance f their dates way too much, to the detriment of establishing real connections with people.

[LoveLace]

I have been told by friends to lower my standards, but have also been told to raise them...depending on which guy I was hanging around with at the time. It's hard to find a happy medium. Because I have for sure been way too picky and also not picky enough. So in a sense we do "settle" a little bit in the end. Because we realize there is no perfect person and we have to be capable of accepting a person's flaws.

[somedude81]

But, again, there's more to matches than looks. Fine, he's in decent shape and has a nice look. What's his personality like? Does he go around frowning constantly with a bad attitude? Does he make "joke" that make women feel uncomfortable? Is his personal hygiene lacking?

Most likely, "No", to all of those. I know they certainly don't apply to me.

And again, maybe these women you are calling fat and ugly don't think of themselves that way and certainly don't appreciate being told "so sorry, you are too fat and ugly for me to take a few minutes to get to know you".

Woman are no better. If a man doesn't meet her minimum requirements, she won't "take a few minutes to get to know you" either.

 

Also, a woman has to be several stages below average for me to consider her fat and or ugly. Young women who meet that qualification, are 20% or less of the total population of women.

 

And why should women, some of whom may be plain, but who've got great personalities, good careers and certain life goals and aspirations settle for men who have no jobs, no ambitions, and are irresponsible?

I don't know why they do, but they do. Most likely because he's very attractive and knows how to push her buttons.

 

I really wish women would go for the guys "who've got great personalities, good careers and certain life goals and aspirations"even though he's not a model or a bad boy.

[somedude81]

I never paid attentions to leagues, fortunately, and as a result, consider that I mostly have been with men who were definitely physically out of my league.

This is the heart of the matter. The concept of leagues, doesn't apply to women.

 

Just by being average, a woman can easily get men who should be out of her league.

 

When both the common woman and the princess want and can get the prince, who would gladly sleep with both of them, what is the common man to do?

[brainygirl]

Most likely, "No", to all of those. I know they certainly don't apply to me.

 

Woman are no better. If a man doesn't meet her minimum requirements, she won't "take a few minutes to get to know you" either.

 

Also, a woman has to be several stages below average for me to consider her fat and or ugly. Young women who meet that qualification, are 20% or less of the total population of women.

 

 

I don't know why they do, but they do. Most likely because he's very attractive and knows how to push her buttons.

 

I really wish women would go for the guys "who've got great personalities, good careers and certain life goals and aspirations"even though he's not a model or a bad boy.

 

I really don't know what to tell you. I know I'm a woman who would like to meet a guy who's nice, fun, and get to know him. I know that I have trouble doing so.

 

I know that I have seen guys who claim to want to meet a nice women with a good head on her shoulders fall over others guys to give attention to the one girl in the group who is plainly a mess.

 

I know that I have ruled out otherwise "acceptable" men for such things as having lied to me about what they did for a living, and for thinking its funny to use threats of harm in a humerus way ("oh just wait until I punish you for that" or "we'll have to change that won't we") I'm sure he thinks its funny and cute, I think its insulting.

 

I also know that there are lots of people around who say "I just want to meet someone nice, not spectacular, just nice" and yet can't.

[carhill]

When somebody says "lower your standards" or "stay in your league"

 

I assume their ego is writing checks their intellect can't cash and move on.

 

People, even those giving 'advice', reveal a lot about themselves through their words. It's all good information.

 

Here's mine: Examine your personal criteria and then look in the mirror and apply that criteria to yourself. Do you like what you see? Go with that.

 

I used to have an emotional response to those ladies who might catalog me into 'leagues' or 'standards' but now realize the great information they were sharing with me about themselves. Resentment has turned to appreciation and, more importantly, the dearth of their presence. I hope they found what they're looking for and the mirror smiled upon them

[Woggle]

It's more a matter of readjusting standards than lowering them. When you see women throwing themselves at men who are already married it is clearly not a case of them having high standards. Some of the guys i see getting a lot of attention from women are the worst kind of people. They would do better if they stopped prioritizing other aspects which in no way contribute to a happy relationship in the long run.

[Kamille]

This is the heart of the matter. The concept of leagues, doesn't apply to women.

 

Just by being average, a woman can easily get men who should be out of her league.

 

When both the common woman and the princess want and can get the prince, who would gladly sleep with both of them, what is the common man to do?

 

I think you missed the point of my post, which wasn't to say that men were poor victims of the dating game, but that "leagues" is an inoperative concept when you have self-confidence and just go with your gut. I dated my exes because I didn't stop to wonder "wait, is he in my league?". Instead, I was attracted to them and figured I had nothing to lose by getting to know them. And I've always been a "personality first" kind of person. I've dumped hot guys because our personalities didn't click. Similarly, I've dated and fallen in love with guys who friends considered to be "under my league" because we had a great time together.

 

Place personality first, yours and hers, and forget about leagues. Also, stop victimizing yourself. Not charming.

[somedude81]

Kamille, you completed missed the point of my post.

 

Leagues are very much real. But they only apply to men. Actually they do apply to women too but only in extreme examples. Meaning, a woman who's a 5 could get man who was a 10. But a man who is a 5 would be lucky to get a woman who's a 6.

 

Men and women are playing the same game, but the rules are different for each gender.

 

I'm not trying to victimize myself. I only peruse women who's personality click with mine and are about as attractive as I am. I'm not going for stuck up or hot girls. But when I get rejected by the women I should be able to obtain, that's when I have to start thinking about what is really going on.

Edited November 6, 2010 by somedude81

[jean-luc sisko]

Leagues exist, they're simply not absolutes. Nothing in life is truly absolute.

 

A hot woman could date an ugly man. a rich man could date a poor woman.

[GivenUp0083]

If someone is of equivalent attractiveness to yourself, you don't feel like you're settling. A gorgeous woman might look at an average guy and think "Eww" because he's below her standards, whereas an average woman might look at the same guy and think he's attractive, and an ugly woman might look at the same guy and think he's so hot that he's out of her league.

 

No matter what you're like, there's someone who will find you attractive... but that person is probably going to be of roughly equivalent attractiveness to yourself, so if you're not hot, your partner probably won't be either.

 

This is exactly my problem and why I think I need to move out of the big city. The biggest problem is I feel most women OVER VALUE themselves in terms of looks, at least in their early to mid 20's. They do this because in a big city there's a lot of options, they can afford to hold out because you meet so many new people daily that they think it's a matter of time before brad pitt sweeps them off their feet.

 

I consider myself an average looking dude, maybe a little bit better than average, girls who I don't consider hot (primarily because of their weight) tell me all the time that I'm a "hottie" but girls I consider to be average in looks don't give me a second look more times than not.

 

However I'm one to listen to my elders and I know something most of these women don't realize...my odds get better with age. The older I get, the more my value increases as long as I have a stable decent paying job and I'm not overweight. I dress pretty well and I'm a lot of fun to hang out with on top of it, so I have a lot of bonuses as well. Maybe those average girls don't look my way today, but in 5 years they'll wish I'd ask them out.

 

Edit: I hold high standards of personality, because if you don't connect or can't get along with someone then what's the point in the long term? Looks I pretty much just want a girl that is somewhat cute and can dress herself nicely, and doesn't weigh more than I do (which isn't hard, I weigh about 185). If that's too much to ask then I'm in big trouble ;-)

Edited November 7, 2010 by GivenUp0083