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Friend Zone = Sad Panda Zone :(


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Hello Everyone. I could really use some advice. I've only been in long-term relationships before, and as such I feel completely out of my element in the dating world. This is somewhat long, so I rather appreciate it if you read all of this(even though, spoiler, it's essentially a simple "Friend Zone" question).

 

I'm 27, and I just moved to the UK to pursue a graduate degree in music. I recently met an amazing girl…An intelligent, creative, beautiful, artistic, and eccentric women from Barcelona that completely swept me away. We immediately connected in a very deep way. For our first date we were only supposed to see an art exhibit together for about an hour. This turned into an exciting 3 day long affair including drinking, music, philosophizing, cuddling, scrabble(I won!), making out, and foreplay.

 

However a very curious thing has happened. Over the course of the month that we've known each other, somehow things have progressed in a complete retrograde of normal dating procedure. The first night we met we ended up making out and fooling around, but no sex. Since then with each day things have taken a step back. On subsequent dates things progressed from fooling around/foreplay, to just kissing and cuddling, then just cuddling and sleeping together. I try to be very respectful of a woman's boundaries and she seemed to be backing things off for some strange reason, even though we still had intense hang out sessions for days on end. She started avoiding/pulling away when I would go in to kiss her. However she would still let me be physical with her in other ways, and I still slept in bed holding her. She would even let me kiss her on the neck and head. She also starts being more flaky about hanging out with me, cancelling a date, showing up an hour late for another, etc.

 

This last time we were laying in bed together at 5am after another long hang-out session and I was feeling very close to her. We were cuddling, holding hands, stroking each other's hair etc. We had a moment, looking into each other's eyes, and I decided to try kiss her one more time. She pulled back again, and I felt complete shattered and embarrassed. She could tell I was upset and asked if it was ok that she didn't want to have sex. I told her that it wasn't that I wanted sex, it's that I wanted her. I asked what she wanted from us, if she was looking for a relationship or not. She told me that she wasn't ready for a relationship because she recently(didn't specify time) got out of a toxic relationship. We have a conversation where she says she's sick of superficial relationships that are just about sex and instead wants to connect deeply in a platonic way. I say I want the same thing, but that sex can deepen a relationship if it's with the right person, and that I would be willing to wait to have sex if that would make her more comfortable. She said she would think about it, but couldn't promise anything. She says she understands if I can't handle this and can't be her friend, but that she cares about me and would miss me.

 

So this is where I'm at. I'm completely smitten with this women. I've attempted to go on a date with someone else, but it felt cheap and hollow. I keep thinking about her. She wants to hang out again soon, but I'm feeling extremely emotionally confused about this whole thing. Should I let her go, knowing full well that I can't make her love me? Should I try to be friends with her, knowing completely that it will crush my soul every time we hang out? Or should attempt to break out of the friend zone, and try to earn her love and respect?

 

And furthermore, for intellectual curiosity, do you think she is being upfront when she is saying that she really isn't ready for a relationship, or is this the "Easy let down"?

 

All advice, thoughts, and criticisms are welcome. Thank you very much.

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I have nothing valuable to add, in fact I didnt even read your post. I just wanted to complement you on the south park reference. I enjoyed that that.

Carry on.

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Hello Everyone. I could really use some advice. I've only been in long-term relationships before, and as such I feel completely out of my element in the dating world. This is somewhat long, so I rather appreciate it if you read all of this(even though, spoiler, it's essentially a simple "Friend Zone" question).

 

I'm 27, and I just moved to the UK to pursue a graduate degree in music. I recently met an amazing girl…An intelligent, creative, beautiful, artistic, and eccentric women from Barcelona that completely swept me away. We immediately connected in a very deep way. For our first date we were only supposed to see an art exhibit together for about an hour. This turned into an exciting 3 day long affair including drinking, music, philosophizing, cuddling, scrabble(I won!), making out, and foreplay.

 

On subsequent dates things progressed from fooling around/foreplay, to just kissing and cuddling, then just cuddling and sleeping together.

 

She started avoiding/pulling away when I would go in to kiss her. However she would still let me be physical with her in other ways, and I still slept in bed holding her. She would even let me kiss her on the neck and head. She also starts being more flaky about hanging out with me, cancelling a date, showing up an hour late for another, etc.

 

We were cuddling, holding hands, stroking each other's hair etc. We had a moment, looking into each other's eyes, and I decided to try kiss her one more time. She pulled back again, and I felt complete shattered and embarrassed.

 

She could tell I was upset

 

I told her that it wasn't that I wanted sex, it's that I wanted her.

 

I'm feeling extremely emotionally confused

 

All advice, thoughts, and criticisms are welcome. Thank you very much.

 

So here's my advice, thoughts, and criticism:

 

Women are much sharper when it comes to dating than men. They are far ahead of us in the game. If you are dating a woman your age, you can generally look at her as being at least several years ahead of you when it comes to dating depending on their actual age. The only advantage men have in all of this having better control of our emotions. This is why a woman who displays little emotion or can handle their emotions better than a man, the man is in big trouble. The man has no advantage and he will get mopped in those dating scenarios.

 

This is also true for a guy who loses his control of his emotions or is too emotional from the start. Their is no way you will be able to successfully handle the common woman out on the dating scene.

 

So you have to always keep your "pair" intact and avoid the woman who displays little emotions or at the very least, keep the control above hers. It's your only advantage.

 

So emotions, cuddling, showing that you are upset, stroking hair, and everything else in bold print above stands a better chance in a long term relationship with someone who is in love with you, otherwise, just keep it cool or you will get mopped.

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I got two rules about women that I learned to follow that have made my life easier when it comes to the attention whores.

 

Don't sleep with them unless you are sleeping with them.

And don't cuddle unless it's AFTER sex.

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mr.dream merchant

You boys out there gotta man up. When a girl tries to friendzone me when I want her vagina, lips, and ass? I tell her to go kick rocks (not literally but I do tell her it's not happening). Friendship with a woman you want to **** is a one way street to her, her, her, her, her, insanity, her, her, her, but never YOU. **** that bull****. Man up and forget about her, there's like what, 3 times as many women on this planet as men? I'm sure several hundred thousand of them are willing to put your cock in their box.

 

And don't listen to all that "be super sweet to her" bull****. A woman knows if you're ****able from the moment she lays eyes on you. Where most guys **** up at is the actual conversation. Me? I keep my opinions to myself, and that usually gets me the most play. I just sit there and agree, laugh, blahzey blahzey with them. That's what every woman wants anyways, a guy that they *think* cares but we really don't, and for some reason, over thousands of years - they think otherwise. All men care about is the pussy, and when we get to dig it out.

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Cracker Jack

The best thing to do is to try and distance yourself from her at this point. Waiting for her sounds nice, but it'll simply create more stress in the process.

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Tell her not to call you again until she figures her sh*t out. You want a relationship, she isn't isn't sure what she wants, but she is still getting the emotional comfort that you are offering her, yet you aren't getting anything in return. And I don't just mean sex.

 

You are being used as an emotional tampon.

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skydiveaddict
I have nothing valuable to add, in fact I didnt even read your post. I just wanted to complement you on the south park reference. I enjoyed that that.

Carry on.

 

 

Yes I agree. Southpark = funny

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The best thing to do is to try and distance yourself from her at this point. Waiting for her sounds nice, but it'll simply create more stress in the process.

 

Agreed. It sounds like she's trying to put you down in a "nice" way, but doesn't realize her kindness only causes more confusion and hurt in the long run. I used to be guilty of doing this as well, but found out it's better to be up front with a person rather than string them along in hopes that I'll develop reciprocal feelings. That isn't to say she isn't totally against the idea of dating you - these things are never cut and dry - but she definitely isn't gung ho about being with you.

 

So yeah, distance yourself and try to move on. If she tries to pursue you, make sure to make her completely aware of your stand on things before hanging out again.

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Thank you everyone for your feedback. It is in many ways things I already knew but probably just didn't want to accept, and it's good to have objective perspectives.

 

To mr.dream merchant: I agree about having to accept that I'm rejected and move on. However I must say I'm not really looking to simply **** as many women as possible. Personally I would prefer to be myself and be rejected by 99 out of 100 women than simply playing a game to sleep with as many of them as possible. I'm looking for the right girl to accept me for who I am(and to say the least I definitely have my eccentricities).

 

To Sabali: This is good advice. Most of the ways that I know how to interact with women romantically come from my past of long-term(more than two years each) relationships. It seems I need to learn to slow down and focus more on attraction first.

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Don't be so available to her - let her know that you can't be spending that time with her (and in that way), when you want different things - that you need to be saving your energy for your own life, and finding a girl who wants the same things as you do.

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reservoirdog1

You need to stop contacting her. Only communicate with her if it's in response to initiation by her. Let HER do the chasing.

 

Meanwhile, get out and see friends and enjoy life. Date if you feel up to it; if you don't, be sure to flirt a lot. Get photos of yourself goofing off with women, and put them on your Facebook page, even if you're not dating them, so that she can see them.

 

When you DO speak to her (because she contacts you), act upbeat and cheerful, like you've got a full, busy and exciting life. More often than not, if she asks to hang out with you on X date, tell her you can't do it that day and suggest she give you a shout later in the week. Make her WORK in order to spend time with you. Make yourself WAY less available.

 

The object of the above is to make her see you as interesting, in demand, NOT hung up on her, and NOT a guy who'll drop everything just to spend time with her and accept the crumbs you're receiving from her. In short, the object of the above is to BUILD HER LEVEL OF ATTRACTION TO YOU. Remember, people want what they can't have, or what doesn't come easily to them, way more than they want something that's easily attainable.

 

Attraction isn't a choice -- it happens against one's will. Sounds like she previously had an attraction to you, and it receded. If you want her, you need to rebuild that. You need to make her want you, too.

 

It's possible that the above won't work. But at least if it doesn't you'll know it, and you won't have sacrificed your dignity and self-respect in the process.

Edited by reservoirdog1
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