Toxicity beyond my means

[Mooncloud]

I'm ashamed to say that this person is my best friend. I'm at a loss to explain otherwise exactly how toxic she is so I've spooled off this list in the hope it will finally give me the push to cut her out, after she has refused to help herself or accept help from others in the 14 years since I've known her.

 

• 
  Stubborn, takes no responsibility for her actions and reflects blame onto others
  

 

• 
  Aggressive - not averse to physical assault (smacking, punching, throwing objects), verbal abuse, unnecessarily loud and vulgar language in public, challenging attitude (always looking for a fight from anyone, even strangers)
  

 

• 
  Chronically lazy, only motivated by own selfish needs
  

 

• 
  Drug and alcohol abuse
  

 

• 
  Frequently carries a knife out in public
  

 

• 
  Rarely answers phone calls, takes days between replies to any messages
  

 

• 
  Frequently turns up late or doesn't turn up at all to plans, refuses to check her phone or apologise
  

 

• 
  Refuses to support herself, at 30 years old has lived in her parent's house her entire life except for one 6-month period when she convinced her brother to let her move in to a flat with him until she got bored and stopped paying rent, forcing them both to leave. Despite being low-income her parents support her every need
  

 

• 
  Admits her family love her and cared for her growing up, yet treats them badly, argues, verbally abuses, and manipulates them
  

 

• 
  Behaves like a spoiled brat (has tantrums, refuses to speak to parents in the same house, passive aggressive)
  

 

• 
  Zero money management, taken out an unknown number of loans and credit cards, and has been in debt collection with at least one company, refused to acknowledge it, borrows student loan money off her younger siblings
  

 

• 
  Is supposed to pay housekeeping to family but never does, spends her money on designer clothes, make up, toys and games
  

 

• 
  Bedroom completely invisible under piles of clothes, bags and toys, simply throws rubbish and dirty dishes onto the floor, steps on everything to move around, leaves mess when visiting other people's homes and doesn't apologise
  

 

• 
  Risky sexual behaviour - flirts overtly with strangers, takes drinks from them, willing to go with them in exchange for money, drugs or drinks, no care for consequences and simply relies on others to help her out of bad situations at any given moment, has had several pregnancy scares
  

 

• 
  Self-harms
  

 

• 
  Has made suicide attempts at home, overdosing on pills where she will be found by family and taken to hospital
  

 

• 
  Frequently forgets to take antidepressants or puts herself in situations where she loses or leaves it behind
  

 

• 
  Frequently missed therapy appointments before giving up on it altogether, claims it was useless
  

 

• 
  Is a teaching assistant but rarely bothered showing up for work, boss enabled this due to her mental health issues
  

 

• 
  Had a relationship with a student over 10 years her junior, became extremely volatile, threatened suicide again when he wanted to leave
  

 

• 
  Created a fake Facebook profile to stalk a girl her student ex was too friendly with, invited a house party to her address and denied any involvement when police investigated
  

 

• 
  Invited student ex's best friend, also a student, to her house to have sex with him, to spite him
  

 

• 
  Was arrested on suspicion of sex with a minor after student ex reported her, was suspended from work pending investigation but refuses to admit any wrongdoing
  

 

• 
  Smashed her previous phone in a rage, was given a second hand one from her brother which was seized by the police and hasn't cared for a replacement, making it even more impossible to communicate or plan anything with her
  

 

• 
  Has spent the last 5 months in her bedroom playing computer games to the point of addiction, refuses to be proactive in improving her situation
  

 

• 
  and most recently, passed out in a club toilet after a few cocktails and had to be dragged to an ambulance by bouncers, spent the night hallucinating in A&E, admitted to taking a drink from a stranger but refuses to acknowledge what happened
  

[Els]

Hi, aren't you the one whose friend took major advantage of her for wedding planning or something, too?

 

 

I think you may benefit from being a bit pickier about friends, and also making sure that you set strong boundaries for yourself. For instance, if someone just doesn't turn up for something that was mutually planned, and doesn't even bother apologizing, distance yourself from them.

[anika99]

I'm not qualified to diagnose anyone but I strongly suspect that your friend has borderline personality disorder (BPD). She is mentally ill and there is nothing you can do to help her. People with this disorder who are not actively seeking help are tragic. Nothing helps as they are a bottomless pit of demands and needs. No matter how much you give or how much you do it's never good enough. When you try to discuss issues or set boundaries you are met with rage and blame or it turns into a pity party where you end up feeling guilting for trying to have a reasonable conversation.

 

Set yourself free. You can not make a difference in her life but she will surely impact yours in a negative way. Sometimes there is nothing else to do but walk away.

[Mooncloud]

Hi, aren't you the one whose friend took major advantage of her for wedding planning or something, too?

 

 

I think you may benefit from being a bit pickier about friends, and also making sure that you set strong boundaries for yourself. For instance, if someone just doesn't turn up for something that was mutually planned, and doesn't even bother apologizing, distance yourself from them.

 

Hello, yep that's me. I have distanced myself from those friends and not spoken with them for the last several months as all my interactions with them in the year following their wedding were too stressful, I expected they'd try and get hold of me about their annual new year's party which they did but I'm remaining very non committal about it for the time being.

 

I've been using this new focus as a step up to removing toxic people from my life and pulling away to make a new start somewhere else, this is just the next (and biggest) one for me.

[Mooncloud]

I'm not qualified to diagnose anyone but I strongly suspect that your friend has borderline personality disorder (BPD). She is mentally ill and there is nothing you can do to help her. People with this disorder who are not actively seeking help are tragic. Nothing helps as they are a bottomless pit of demands and needs. No matter how much you give or how much you do it's never good enough. When you try to discuss issues or set boundaries you are met with rage and blame or it turns into a pity party where you end up feeling guilting for trying to have a reasonable conversation.

 

Set yourself free. You can not make a difference in her life but she will surely impact yours in a negative way. Sometimes there is nothing else to do but walk away.

 

This is exactly what me and several members of her family have said about her. I know cutting off this relationship will allow me to focus on moving to a new place and starting over so I'm going to let myself focus on the excitement of that instead of getting dragged down by her anymore.

[healing light]

If she is really difficult to get in touch with, why is it hard to drop her? Does she even take the initiative to get in contact with you? Since she doesn't have a phone and disappears for stretches of time it sounds like it would be easier to fade this one out.

 

However, I agree with the other poster that she appears to have some kind of mental illness.

[Mooncloud]

If she is really difficult to get in touch with, why is it hard to drop her? Does she even take the initiative to get in contact with you? Since she doesn't have a phone and disappears for stretches of time it sounds like it would be easier to fade this one out.

 

However, I agree with the other poster that she appears to have some kind of mental illness.

 

No you're absolutely right, it would be really easy to fade out from social media. The difficulty is that our friendship has a very long history and I'm close with her family as well, so even though we've had periods of drifting away we will inevitably pick up again. She's shown that she's more than capable of getting in touch with me if and when she so pleases, but avoids contact when it comes from the other person. So although it'll take a while she'll eventually come looking for contact with me again.

[preraph]

Get away from that toxic mess. She's going to keep you worried all the time and probably mess something up for you sometime, a relationship or where you live or something. I know she'll show up if you just block her, but if I were you, I'd text her and tell her her chaotic life is dragging you down emotionally and that you are moving on. Don't answer the door. She may retaliate. Hang onto your written text or email tellling her you're moving on in case she really goes nuts.

[stillafool]

No you're absolutely right, it would be really easy to fade out from social media. The difficulty is that our friendship has a very long history and I'm close with her family as well, so even though we've had periods of drifting away we will inevitably pick up again. She's shown that she's more than capable of getting in touch with me if and when she so pleases, but avoids contact when it comes from the other person. So although it'll take a while she'll eventually come looking for contact with me again.

 

Then block her from contacting you. If she doesn't keep a number long it should be easy to drop her. So what if you're friends with the rest of her family, you can drop her and still be cordial to them. I know families that I'm not friends with all of them nor do I want to be.

[CC12]

Okay, so you've made a list of her cons here, now you'll need to make a list of her pros. And I don't think you should count things like, "We had a lot of fun together at that concert" or things like that.

 

For me, she would have to have a LOT of really, really outstanding good qualities to make up for all those bad ones. And even if her outstanding qualities made up for her terrible-sounding personality, I think I would have to draw the line at her sexually victimizing minors and trying to ruin their lives on top of that. I couldn't associate with someone like that, mental illness or not. That's pretty much unforgivable, in my opinion.

 

I also remember your thread about your friend getting married. And I agree with Elswyth. You might want to examine your boundaries and how you choose your friends.

 

You seem like a really kind, big-hearted person. That is a fantastic trait to have, but you have to be extra careful about the people you choose to give that to. People will take advantage of that.

Edited January 6, 2019 by CC12

[BaileyB]

These kinds of discussions are always amusing to me, when people complain at length about the selfish and unhealthy behaviors of their friend or their partner...

 

They amuse me because - we all get to chose our friends and our partners. Which means, if you don't like her behavior, you don't have to be friends with her...

 

The other simple truth about the people who post these lists... they have problems setting healthy boundaries in their relationships. Now is the time to practice setting a healthy boundary Mooncloud - end this friendship and go out and find yourself some new friends. Trust me, this friend will find someone else to take advantage of in no time...

[Mooncloud]

So it's been about a month since I posted this thread and I've been pretty much no contact with my friend, I unfollowed her increasingly toxic feed from my Facebook, removed the messaging app from my phone and muted the chats she was involved in. I only regularly speak to a couple of other friends through messenger so although I wasn't distracted by possible notifications from her, I could see if she had sent anything when in the chats window.

 

I noticed she'd messaged me a few times over the last few days and just glancing at the preview of the message, I could tell she's already gone on the offensive, with no other provocation, saying something like 'if you've gone off grid or whatever at least tell me so I know you're not dead'.

 

Do I owe it to her to respond? I've temporarily deactivated my Facebook because I just can't deal with it at the moment but I know this is going to inflame her more and probably prompt messages from her brothers (they have my mobile so can text me on her behalf, having no phone herself). I'm still amicable with them and they're aware that I'm distancing myself but she can and will get around them.

[darkmoon]

for some people, unreturned phone calls clearly mean: go away, goodbye

 

 

just stop bothering with her, even if you see her, just stay polite but detached

[Bama Belle]

Bailey B. is right. Boundaries are so important. I learned this the hard way after my best friend ended our relationship for reasons, among others, that were none of her business. It wasn't until after that I noticed how I'd let her give her opinions on my parenting, involve herself in my romantic relationships. I learned to set boundaries and to see red flags you miss when friendships start in youth. Has this person had a lot of friends come and go? Are her relationships with others healthy? Does she enjoy your mistakes just a little too much? I can't believe this girl didn't have behaviors that let you know what a train wreck you describe her to be. And losing you might be the kick in the head to get her act together. I doubt it, but anything's possible. The goodbye is tricky. So far, she hasn't reacted vindictively. But she might from a formal goodbye. On the other hand, if you don't end the friendship definitively, she sounds like she might turn up on your doorstep drunk in the middle of the night. If you do opt for a formal goodbye, keep it succinct and non accusatory. "We've grown into such different people, I just don't think we have enough in common for a healthy friendship. But I will always love you and wish you the very best." Or something like that. Don't mention anything she's done or leave room for argument or you'll be pulled into a back and forth nightmare. We can only guess. You're the only one who knows her well enough to guess how she will react or what the ramifications might be. But I think you're making a very positive step in ending the friendship, one you will not regret. Good luck!

[whichwayisup]

You can still be friends with her, just detach and distance yourself so what she does in her life doesn't affect you and your own mental health.

 

Be honest, but kind. Let her know that you care about her and that she needs counseling but you can't be there for her as much as she wants/needs.

 

Disappearing and not saying a word isn't right, even more so since you are close with her family and have had the friendship for many years.

[Malin889]

Do you always make lists of all the imperfections of your friends?

[Els]

Do you always make lists of all the imperfections of your friends?

 

 

The OP is seeking support in going NC with ONE "friend". Her list helps provide context.

[Els]

Do you always make lists of all the imperfections of your friends?

 

 

The OP is seeking support in going NC with ONE "friend". Her list helps provide context.

[Mooncloud]

Bailey B. is right. Boundaries are so important. I learned this the hard way after my best friend ended our relationship for reasons, among others, that were none of her business. It wasn't until after that I noticed how I'd let her give her opinions on my parenting, involve herself in my romantic relationships. I learned to set boundaries and to see red flags you miss when friendships start in youth. Has this person had a lot of friends come and go? Are her relationships with others healthy? Does she enjoy your mistakes just a little too much? I can't believe this girl didn't have behaviors that let you know what a train wreck you describe her to be. And losing you might be the kick in the head to get her act together. I doubt it, but anything's possible. The goodbye is tricky. So far, she hasn't reacted vindictively. But she might from a formal goodbye. On the other hand, if you don't end the friendship definitively, she sounds like she might turn up on your doorstep drunk in the middle of the night. If you do opt for a formal goodbye, keep it succinct and non accusatory. "We've grown into such different people, I just don't think we have enough in common for a healthy friendship. But I will always love you and wish you the very best." Or something like that. Don't mention anything she's done or leave room for argument or you'll be pulled into a back and forth nightmare. We can only guess. You're the only one who knows her well enough to guess how she will react or what the ramifications might be. But I think you're making a very positive step in ending the friendship, one you will not regret. Good luck!

 

thank you. She wasn't always this way, but it's been a slow decline in the last 3 or 4 years. Myself and all of her family and friends have shown concern and tried to help to no avail. I feel she's turned into a very unstable and vindictive person but is holding back her potential explosion until she knows for certain that I'm cutting her off, hence why I'm trying to quietly back off instead of making a point of it. There's absolutely no way she'll have a reasonable discussion with me or anyone else about it.

[Bama Belle]

Oh yeah. Whichwayisup is "wayup" better than my advice. Listen to that one.

[preraph]

I'm sure she's well aware people get sick of her crap and disappear on her. Only you know if it's better to say something or not. You could just say, I'm fine. I'm refocusing my energies, or something vague like that. Then if she asks to see you, just be vague and never something specific and say, Sorry, I'm busy. Don't give her info into your personal life where she can anticipate where you're going or who you're seeing or anything. Just distance her. Who knows, maybe if she alienates enough people, she'll get back on her meds....

[Mooncloud]

I'm sure she's well aware people get sick of her crap and disappear on her. Only you know if it's better to say something or not. You could just say, I'm fine. I'm refocusing my energies, or something vague like that. Then if she asks to see you, just be vague and never something specific and say, Sorry, I'm busy. Don't give her info into your personal life where she can anticipate where you're going or who you're seeing or anything. Just distance her. Who knows, maybe if she alienates enough people, she'll get back on her meds....

 

Oh I'm sure she is, but she'd never admit it. Vague responses will be like kindling for her and definitely ignite a tantrum so I can't really win either way. The only solution I could imagine is to write a long letter to her explaining my exact reasons for leaving but avoiding any and all blame towards her because I know she won't allow me the right to feel mad about her behavior. Either that or cold turkey, and I only have the mental energy for one of those things right now.

 

It'd be a miracle if she did get back on her feet but I think she'll sooner spite me than regret losing me as a friend.

Edited February 4, 2019 by Mooncloud
Spelling