User, Loser or Normal?

[OldEurope]

After a falling out a year ago, I recently got back in touch with a long-time friend from the States, someone with whom I have always had great fun, humor, friendship and intellectual companionship.

 

A year had gone by after a pretty bitter fight (on how she was handling her personal life) and I eventually contacted her, inviting her here for some upcoming European events. She told me that she was very happy to hear from me and that she missed me and had wanted to contact me as well (I had changed my email, she did not reach me as a result). We got back on the phone and on e-mail and it was just like old times. The spirit of the friendship was back on track.

 

But then. Then, at the end of our second, hour-plus conversation, she starts telling me about all of these new business connections of hers, and sends links of these businesses' websites to me. This was sort of rushed in at the end of our conversation. In the past, I had been somewhat instrumental in helping her find this contact or that. I did not mind then the "using" aspect of the friendship--after all most friendships have that from time to time--though I never really called upon her for anything ever (not really my cup of tea to do so); she offered once the phone numbers of her own contacts in Europe when I moved abroad but these I have never needed, having married here. I have done for her much more, and at the time, with pleasure.

 

So I received these business website links and she went on to discuss what new ventures she was pursuing (with her, there is always something "new" aloft) I said I would see what I could do about connecting her to this area and that one, which she had asked me about. Later I did some research and I came up with what she subsequently told me were some very helpful contact names and information (in the financial arena).

 

I thought this would be enough. No. This was followed by a request to set up an interview at this one firm, "if that would be possible". Then she sent along more details about various projects coming up and "could we discuss it later", blah blah.

 

All this for me was a real turn off. I thought it very poor timing, coming on the heels of a reconciliation, while some ashes from our bad fight were still a bit aglow in certain areas. It made me wonder if her interest in reconnecting was simply business related, as in the past I have been something of a helpful source and wanted to make sure the friendship was going to be just that--mutual, kind, genuine friendship.

 

I wrote to tell her these things on my mind, and I was firm, though not nasty. I told her that I did not want to get into business deals or to get into "helping", particularly within the first five minutes of re-establishing our friendship.

 

I wrote that at the beginning of the week by email. I have not heard since (usually she writes right away).

 

Was I wrong to react like this? Have I read too much into it? Or do I have a friend here who was simply "on the make" for business reasons?

 

Any input would be appreciated.

 

OE

Edited June 18, 2010 by OldEurope

[Meaplus3]

Hmmmmm.. it sounds to me like she is using you to. Especially since you came to her aid in the past with business. Just my gut feeling here. I could be wrong.

 

Mea:)

[Malenfant]

I dont think you were wrong in how you reacted.

 

Her general intentions are questionable.. did she really want to be friends this time?

 

She might be the sort of person who does want to be friends but sees the advantages for herself and has to act on them.

Fair enough giving contact information, but asking you to set up interviews isn't really on TBH.

 

If I was her, and I hadnt intended for you to feel like I was using you, I would have written back straight away and apologised.

Either she's not sorry, or she's embarassed, or she's angry with you.

Either way a true friend would be able to swallow any of the above to ensure their friend knows that they are sorry.

 

You were right to be firm, you suspected she was trying to take advantage and you weren't going to stand for that.

 

Now she knows you wont set her up, it will be interesting to see if she contacts you again.

If she does, and she doesnt ask for help, and seems to understand the situation with you both but still wants to be friends then so be it.

But if she tries it again you will know the truth.

[OldEurope]

Dear Malenfant, and Meaplus,

 

Many thanks for your words; it is greatly appreciated.

 

Malenfant---you make a very good point about her not writing back at once to clear up any "misunderstanding".

 

That is what is most irksome in this irksome situation. Even though we had been talking long-distance on weekends and I said to myself a day ago..."Hmm, perhaps she is just having a busy week and could not really respond to me"...it just doesn't sit well that she couldn't write a quick, kind reply to assuage my suspicions right away.

 

*sigh*

 

Thank you, ladies...

 

OE

[marlena]

I don't know if she is a user but what I do know is that if she is, she is not a very good one. You just don't ask for favours when in the initial stages of reconciliation with a friend. Like you said, the timing was ghastly.

 

Personally, however, I don't think you should have written to her expressing your disappointment. She may have taken your letter as being accusatory. Just refusing would have sufficed, I think. Now, you gave her every reason to be angry and embarassed.

 

At any rate, I'd let it rest. Friendships like relationships are hard to mend once broken.

[Adunaphel]

I think it is still possible, though not very likely, that you get a well thought, apologetic reply from her.

I can imagine a few reasons why a person who genuinely cares about your friendship might take some time to write back.

- she might feel bad, or even upset, because of your words... and she might want to cool down a little before replying.

- it might take her a few days to realize that if you sent such an email it is because you are giving your friendship a chance.

- she might feel very embarassed.

- she might want to choose accurately the words for explaining and apologizing.

 

I do hope she writes back and does not disappoint you.

[green_tea]

Someone mentioned that if she was a true friend, she would have written back straight away to you to apologise for coming across as using you - but really a true friend wouldn't accuse a friend of using them in the first place.

[fooled once]

After a falling out a year ago, I recently got back in touch with a long-time friend from the States, someone with whom I have always had great fun, humor, friendship and intellectual companionship.

 

A year had gone by after a pretty bitter fight (on how she was handling her personal life) and I eventually contacted her, inviting her here for some upcoming European events. She told me that she was very happy to hear from me and that she missed me and had wanted to contact me as well (I had changed my email, she did not reach me as a result). We got back on the phone and on e-mail and it was just like old times. The spirit of the friendship was back on track.

 

But then. Then, at the end of our second, hour-plus conversation, she starts telling me about all of these new business connections of hers, and sends links of these businesses' websites to me. This was sort of rushed in at the end of our conversation. In the past, I had been somewhat instrumental in helping her find this contact or that. I did not mind then the "using" aspect of the friendship--after all most friendships have that from time to time--though I never really called upon her for anything ever (not really my cup of tea to do so); she offered once the phone numbers of her own contacts in Europe when I moved abroad but these I have never needed, having married here. I have done for her much more, and at the time, with pleasure.

 

So I received these business website links and she went on to discuss what new ventures she was pursuing (with her, there is always something "new" aloft) I said I would see what I could do about connecting her to this area and that one, which she had asked me about. Later I did some research and I came up with what she subsequently told me were some very helpful contact names and information (in the financial arena).

 

I thought this would be enough. No. This was followed by a request to set up an interview at this one firm, "if that would be possible". Then she sent along more details about various projects coming up and "could we discuss it later", blah blah.

 

All this for me was a real turn off. I thought it very poor timing, coming on the heels of a reconciliation, while some ashes from our bad fight were still a bit aglow in certain areas. It made me wonder if her interest in reconnecting was simply business related, as in the past I have been something of a helpful source and wanted to make sure the friendship was going to be just that--mutual, kind, genuine friendship.

 

I wrote to tell her these things on my mind, and I was firm, though not nasty. I told her that I did not want to get into business deals or to get into "helping", particularly within the first five minutes of re-establishing our friendship.

 

I wrote that at the beginning of the week by email. I have not heard since (usually she writes right away).

 

Was I wrong to react like this? Have I read too much into it? Or do I have a friend here who was simply "on the make" for business reasons?

 

Any input would be appreciated.

 

OE

 

I think your gut was dead on. on the make for business reasons is my guess.

 

[OldEurope]

I don't know if she is a user but what I do know is that if she is, she is not a very good one. You just don't ask for favours when in the initial stages of reconciliation with a friend. Like you said, the timing was ghastly.

 

Personally, however, I don't think you should have written to her expressing your disappointment. She may have taken your letter as being accusatory. Just refusing would have sufficed, I think. Now, you gave her every reason to be angry and embarassed.

 

At any rate, I'd let it rest. Friendships like relationships are hard to mend once broken.

 

Yasoo, bella! Nice to see you here over on "neutral" territory!

 

1. My thoughts exactly. I wouldn't "think" to introduce a request for favors so soon into the repair of a friendship. I am miffed, because things were going nicely in terms of the flow of talking and reminiscence....and then this bad gut feeling...

 

2. Hmmm, an interesting point. Yes, it was accusatory. I wanted to be clear because, as I said, in the past I had truly gone out of my way to help her. Also, I did do some research for her this last go-around, and I did not like the "Gee thanks, now can you do this?" feeling...

 

Mamma mia...

[OldEurope]

I think it is still possible, though not very likely, that you get a well thought, apologetic reply from her.

I can imagine a few reasons why a person who genuinely cares about your friendship might take some time to write back.

- she might feel bad, or even upset, because of your words... and she might want to cool down a little before replying.

- it might take her a few days to realize that if you sent such an email it is because you are giving your friendship a chance.

- she might feel very embarassed.

- she might want to choose accurately the words for explaining and apologizing.

 

I do hope she writes back and does not disappoint you.

 

These are very good points, and thank you.

 

I've thought some of what you say here, trying to summon a "positive" view...

 

I am going to give it this weekend to hear from her; if not, then I am afraid that my current feeling is the correct one....

 

OE

[OldEurope]

Someone mentioned that if she was a true friend, she would have written back straight away to you to apologise for coming across as using you - but really a true friend wouldn't accuse a friend of using them in the first place.

 

Normally I would agree with you. It is just that in the past I have "helped" without asking anything in return (or expecting to) and her request came on the heels of a reconciliation after almost one year of not speaking to each other--so bad was our falling out. I was always a true, blue friend to her...OE

[marlena]

Yasoo, bella! Nice to see you here over on "neutral" territory!

 

1. My thoughts exactly. I wouldn't "think" to introduce a request for favors so soon into the repair of a friendship. I am miffed, because things were going nicely in terms of the flow of talking and reminiscence....and then this bad gut feeling...

 

2. Hmmm, an interesting point. Yes, it was accusatory. I wanted to be clear because, as I said, in the past I had truly gone out of my way to help her. Also, I did do some research for her this last go-around, and I did not like the "Gee thanks, now can you do this?" feeling...

 

Mamma mia...

 

OK! Now, you've got me singing Mama Mia all day and thinking about my upcoming vacation on an island in the Ionian Sea facing you!!

 

Anyway, OE, I know how you are feeling. It's always hard when you have to question the whole premise of a friendship. Anyway, she is who she is. You can't change her. Either you accept her because she has redeeming qualities or you just let her go. Either way, do what you think is best for you, for your peace of mind.

 

Mama mia .... how can I resist ya?

[OldEurope]

OK! Now, you've got me singing Mama Mia all day and thinking about my upcoming vacation on an island in the Ionian Sea facing you!!

 

Anyway, OE, I know how you are feeling. It's always hard when you have to question the whole premise of a friendship. Anyway, she is who she is. You can't change her. Either you accept her because she has redeeming qualities or you just let her go. Either way, do what you think is best for you, for your peace of mind.

 

Mama mia .... how can I resist ya?

 

Great movie!

 

Pierce Brosnan.....

 

That Greece is the Greece we are all rooting for, and much more....

 

Anyway, I agree with you that she "is as she is" , but the timing, as you mention, just makes my skin crawl a bit. This weekend is the test. If I hear from her in some way and there is good will, fine. If not, methinks it will not work...

 

By the way, damn your vacation! I am jealous, sitting here looking out onto rain, gray skies, and 18 C. weather cursing your Corfu or whatever gorgeous place you are off too. O mio dio, I need a vacation too!

 

OE

[marlena]

Great movie!

 

Pierce Brosnan.....

 

That Greece is the Greece we are all rooting for, and much more....

 

Anyway, I agree with you that she "is as she is" , but the timing, as you mention, just makes my skin crawl a bit. This weekend is the test. If I hear from her in some way and there is good will, fine. If not, methinks it will not work...

 

By the way, damn your vacation! I am jealous, sitting here looking out onto rain, gray skies, and 18 C. weather cursing your Corfu or whatever gorgeous place you are off too. O mio dio, I need a vacation too!

 

OE

 

You know better than anyone. Like I said, you have to decide whether she is, flaws and all, worth keeping.

 

Just to make you feel better, we had a wicked electrical thunderstorm last night. Very beautiful, actually. I sat, completely enthralled, watching the skies explode.

 

You are just a hop, skip and jump away from the Ionian islands. Why not consider a holiday spot there? They are gorgeous. Even more so than Skiathos where, I think, Mama Mia was filmed. Think about it.

 

By the way, not Corfu, but close enough! Here.

 

http://fiveprime.org/hivemind/Tags/beach,kefalonia

[Ariadne]

I would say normal.

 

I did do some research for her this last go-around, and I did not like the "Gee thanks, now can you do this?"

 

When people get into the business mode is all business..

 

Kind of like when people are desperate for a job and call some person that they don't know much, and acquaintance, and ask them to hook them up for work in their company etc.

 

That doesn't have much to do with friendship but business. And when she asked you to set that interview it was her taking care of her stuff.

 

You seem to be very uptight about this and are fearful to be taken advantage, but it is simply solved by saying you don't feel comfortable setting that interview, or just set the interview for her.

 

That way you'll do her a favor and it will help with the new get together. That would have been a good way to start instead of that letter.

 

I'd say write to her again and tell her hope you are not mad or some such.

 

Good luck!

[OldEurope]

Ariadne,

 

I agree with you "in general" but keep in mind we had not spoken in a year and we had a pretty bad falling out last summer. Also, I had gone much out of my way in the past to really help her, and it was genuine.

 

I just thought this was too much too soon, and it made me question her whole cheery "Hey! Great to hear from you!" attitude which was then swiftly put into business mode after two conversations.

 

Confusing. But the "gut instinct" said what it said.

 

As for uptight: perhaps....I had reason to be wary of her, from the past.

 

It is too bad because there were aspects of the friendship that I liked alot. But I just do not want to "Help". Not now...

[OldEurope]

You know better than anyone. Like I said, you have to decide whether she is, flaws and all, worth keeping.

 

Just to make you feel better, we had a wicked electrical thunderstorm last night. Very beautiful, actually. I sat, completely enthralled, watching the skies explode.

 

You are just a hop, skip and jump away from the Ionian islands. Why not consider a holiday spot there? They are gorgeous. Even more so than Skiathos where, I think, Mama Mia was filmed. Think about it.

 

By the way, not Corfu, but close enough! Here.

 

http://fiveprime.org/hivemind/Tags/beach,kefalonia

 

 

Those photos are simply divine. Please tell me that the water is crystal clean...yes?

 

Hope to plan very soon hopping, skipping, jumping....

 

The thunderstorm sounds like it was terribly romantic!

 

OE

[White Dove]

I can't believe she had the guts to ask you for a favour after just minutes of reconciliation! Don't feel bad, OldEurope. She's pretty selfish, I'd say.

[marlena]

Those photos are simply divine. Please tell me that the water is crystal clean...yes?

 

Hope to plan very soon hopping, skipping, jumping....

 

The thunderstorm sounds like it was terribly romantic!

 

OE

 

Of course, it is crystal clear. That's one thing they can't take away from us. Our sun and beaches. Or can they?

 

Yes, it was very romantic. I love intense weather! :love:

[OldEurope]

I just received an email from her.

 

She wrote that she had a terrible head cold and "could not respond right away". Then she says "no", that she is not motivated by business concerns, but is "suprised" that I had "such an impression". Then she added that she hoped to talk soon.

 

Now, any thoughts on how I might respond to this? Now that I look like the bad guy for reading too much into things, must I "apologize" for what I thought was a reasonable suspicion?

 

What would the "pleasant and appropriate" words in reponse might be? I thought of these:

 

a) "As we had just resumed contact again, I wanted to start off on the right basis..."

b) "Well, you've been a bit of a user before so, hell, what did you expect?"

c) "Never mind, I'm happy to help where I can..."

 

Many thanks for any ideas...

OE

[OldEurope]

I can't believe she had the guts to ask you for a favour after just minutes of reconciliation! Don't feel bad, OldEurope. She's pretty selfish, I'd say.

 

 

Thank you for your response, White Dove. That certainly was my impression too!

[marlena]

I just received an email from her.

 

She wrote that she had a terrible head cold and "could not respond right away". Then she says "no", that she is not motivated by business concerns, but is "suprised" that I had "such an impression". Then she added that she hoped to talk soon.

 

Now, any thoughts on how I might respond to this? Now that I look like the bad guy for reading too much into things, must I "apologize" for what I thought was a reasonable suspicion?

 

What would the "pleasant and appropriate" words in reponse might be? I thought of these:

 

a) "As we had just resumed contact again, I wanted to start off on the right basis..."

b) "Well, you've been a bit of a user before so, hell, what did you expect?"

c) "Never mind, I'm happy to help where I can..."

 

Many thanks for any ideas...

OE

 

 

Well, OE, first you have to decide whether or not you want to continue having her in your life as a friend.

 

If the answer is positive, then, I would let this slide this one time. After all, you did let her know how you feel in your previous communication so what would be the point of just reiterating the same thing? Part of friendship is forgiveness and acceptance of shortcomings.

 

If the answer is no, then, tell her that you are not interested in rekindling your friendship after all. It really is up to you.

 

I had something similar happen to me. It took a year to get over it. We are still friends because I chose to focus on all the good qualities this woman had.. how supportive she had been over the years.

 

Perhaps you should think about this for a few days before answering.

[OldEurope]

Of course, it is crystal clear. That's one thing they can't take away from us. Our sun and beaches. Or can they?

 

Yes, it was very romantic. I love intense weather! :love:

 

 

Does Greek Mythology have a God or Goddess anywhere who sets his or her or their holy wrath on idiot politicians and renegade bankers? The House of Agamemmnon set loose on the House of Goldman...or something like that?

 

The day that anyone takes the sun and beaches away from the Greeks is the day the stars go out in heaven, the four horsemen of the Apocalypse gallop across the skies, and the Whore of Babylon does her last belly dance. In other words: when Greece's beaches go, we all go.....

[OldEurope]

Well, OE, first you have to decide whether or not you want to continue having her in your life as a friend.

 

If the answer is positive, then, I would let this slide this one time. After all, you did let her know how you feel in your previous communication so what would be the point of just reiterating the same thing? Part of friendship is forgiveness and acceptance of shortcomings.

 

If the answer is no, then, tell her that you are not interested in rekindling your friendship after all. It really is up to you.

 

I had something similar happen to me. It took a year to get over it. We are still friends because I chose to focus on all the good qualities this woman had.. how supportive she had been over the years.

 

Perhaps you should think about this for a few days before answering.

 

 

Excellent ideas....

 

And good advice that I "mull" things a bit. Didn't like this (or the implication that I am at fault and she "innocent")...but I think...All right, big picture...

 

I most likely will "let this one go" and get myself into a great, positive attitude which is my normal style.

 

Interesting comment about your friend. So you've been "there" too....

 

OE

[White Dove]

I'm speaking from experience, OldEurope. I had a friend, we were best friends and for years, I helped her a lot and being a friend, I didn't mind at all until a few other close friends told me that she taking advantage of me. Something happened and we had a fall out. It was about 2 years later that we bumped into each other and were friendly. She found me on FB a few days later and sent me a PM saying she'd like to reconcile. I thought that it couldn't hurt me as I have moved along.

 

Just one day after I approved her friend request, she wrote to me saying that she needed my help with a few things (sounds familiar yeah?) and that she saw my info that I had a lot of connections. That in itself was a red flag FOR me. I knew where she was going. I wanted to prove myself wrong and I helped her out anyway (stupid me!). She had a bit of difficulties in between which I helped her fixed them and when she got everything that she wanted, she just left.

 

I called her up to go for coffee and she always had excuses. A few months later, I noticed she was not listed on my friend list and when I searched her, I couldn't find her. Turned out she got what she wanted and blocked me after that.

 

It hurt me a lot. Even more so the second time. That's why I feel that your friend will never change and that recent email she sent you, was perhaps her way of trying to make it look as if your judgment of her was wrong.

 

Then again, I could be wrong. Some people do change and it is up to you to give her another chance or not.