Tolerance... When to cut the cord

[and.then.some]

If I try to explain all of my personal situation, it will be pretty long.

 

The basic issue is with ...rather insensitive, and apparently self-absorbed friends. These aren't people I feel comfortable tossing to the wind with ease, because I've known them for ages. I never noticed how self-absorbed they seem to be before now, because I never actually needed much from them before. Now, I've created a lot of distance between myself and them.

 

In short, I'm a pretty caring person, I guess you could say. I empathize a lot with the people supposedly closest to me, especially. Their problems become my problems. Not necessarily because I end up doing all of the labor for them, but because I'm very emotionally involved in their general happiness. If they're happy, I'm really happy for them. If they're down, I'm sad for them too. If they have a problem, I'm gonna try to help them out of it. (Not that it's gonna wreck my whole day in most cases, but I think you know what I mean. lol)

 

I'm not the person who needs the pat on the head, or constant reassurance. So, I never noticed any lack of praise or comforting words from these people in all of these years. However, when things got pretty rough for me, after the smoke cleared, I realized that I could have really used someone to just tell me "you can do it" or "it will be okay". Not one of them tried to put any effort into ... simply making me feel better! Or into trying to offer some sort of comfort.

 

They listened... and then they told me about their new problems, so I could comfort, encourage, and console... or praise, congratulate, and laugh with them. As the situation was on going, they had plenty of time to at some point try to offer some words of encouragement. Although it wasn't as though I was ready to jump or anything, it was pretty clear that I was going through a rough patch and why.

 

Am I expecting too much from people? Or is "don't worry" really that rare in human interactions?

 

The friendships were fine before, I guess because I'm not really the person who looks for other people to give me any sort of praise or whathaveyou. (And no, I'm not the kind of person to simply tell people what they want to hear, or offer praise and complements for no reason.) I guess I had never been really down or really stressed out before. Maybe I just handle things, in general, better on my own than they do, but I still think "close" friends should actually... care.

 

My mother declares jealousy is the reason. But, she's my mother, and I would like to hear some unbiased opinions.

Edited April 21, 2010 by and.then.some

[hardcandy]

In short, I'm a pretty caring person, I guess you could say. I empathize a lot with the people supposedly closest to me, especially. Their problems become my problems. Not necessarily because I end up doing all of the labor for them, but because I'm very emotionally involved in their general happiness. If they're happy, I'm really happy for them. If they're down, I'm sad for them too. If they have a problem, I'm gonna try to help them out of it. (Not that it's gonna wreck my whole day in most cases, but I think you know what I mean. lol)

 

In my opinion, you come across as a bit co-dependant. At the very least over (hyper) sensitive to your friends emotions and/or troubles. I think taking a couple steps back and not becoming so emotionally involved would be a good thing for you.

 

 

Am I expecting too much from people? Or is "don't worry" really that rare in human interactions?

 

In this day and age, yes. I think most people are more self absorbed with their lives, their troubles and their happiness, than that of others..

Edited April 21, 2010 by hardcandy

[and.then.some]

In my opinion, you come across as a bit co-dependant. At the very least over (hyper) sensitive to your friends emotions and/or troubles. I think taking a couple steps back and not becoming so emotionally involved would be a good thing for you.

 

LOL! Thanks for the reply! I think my post may have come across the wrong way. I can assure you that I'm not co-dependent, but I'm apparently more sensitive to their involvements than they are to mine. As I've said above, I have taken a few giant leaps back from the these people, and... they have taken notice. If there's any co-dependency going on, it's probably on their parts. However, as I also said, I'm not one who typically needs any sort of encouragement etc. Yet, when I did finally need a little emotional support from the people closest to me, who I've known for ages, it just wasn't there at all.

 

The problem seems to be that the dynamics of these relationships had a lot to do with my shoulders and ears always being there, and me always willing to lend a helping hand within reason. When I just listened without giving anymore than one particular friend would normally give, she was actually offended. The problem is that they expect me to have answers and kind words, but never really have any to give themselves.

 

As well, when I say I'm very emotionally involved, I don't mean that I'm in a tizzy or anything, experiencing all of their emotional ups and downs with them. But yes, it saddens me to hear that a very close friend has a problem. And, as a close friend, if there's anything to I'm able to do to help out, I'm usually more than willing to do so. If a friend is doing well, I'm happy for him/her. No, it doesn't affect me as if I've just won the lottery or something.

 

 

In this day and age, yes. I think most people are more self absorbed with their lives, their troubles and their happiness, than that of others..

Of course people are more involved in their own lives than they would be in someone else's. My life does not revolve around them and their problems, though sometimes one of them acts as though it should. (One of these friends manages to get me involved in half of her affairs, asking me to help her with various things. When I could, I did. But I have since backed away, and now she's a bit offended by this.)

 

"Don't worry" is nothing more than compassion. It's not really being more worried about someone else's affairs than your own.

 

If I tell you that my dog was just run over by a car, and you say "Oh really, that's too bad. Brian stood me up last night, and he's such a jerk." I think that's kind of cold. To say, with concern "OMG! That's horrible! Is he okay?"... that's not being overly concerned or overly involved at all. But I do thank you for your insight.

Edited April 21, 2010 by and.then.some

[TaraMaiden]

I can assure you that I'm not co-dependent, but I'm apparently more sensitive to their involvements than they are to mine. As I've said above, I have taken a few giant leaps back from the these people, and... they have taken notice.

yes, and this is therefore sending them mixed messages... She used to care, why does she now NOT care?

 

If there's any co-dependency going on, it's probably on their parts.

Nope. We all love to be needed. No good deed goes unpunished, and as such, bending over backwards for someone has the ulterior motive of wishing to be liked, seen as a generally all-round good-egg and someone reliable. We do things for others, just as much to make us feel good about us, as we do to make them feel good about it.

Withdrawing that support has now generated resentment, because you're no longer reliable.

 

However, as I also said, I'm not one who typically needs any sort of encouragement etc. Yet, when I did finally need a little emotional support from the people closest to me, who I've known for ages, it just wasn't there at all.

Did you discuss this with them? did you point out that some support would have been welcome, given the amount you have been supportive to them?

 

The problem seems to be that the dynamics of these relationships had a lot to do with my shoulders and ears always being there, and me always willing to lend a helping hand within reason. When I just listened without giving anymore than one particular friend would normally give, she was actually offended. The problem is that they expect me to have answers and kind words, but never really have any to give themselves.

Well, who taught them that you always seem to have answers and kind words? Where did they learn that?

And can you see how withdrawal could make them reverse that opinion?

 

As well, when I say I'm very emotionally involved, I don't mean that I'm in a tizzy or anything, experiencing all of their emotional ups and downs with them. But yes, it saddens me to hear that a very close friend has a problem. And, as a close friend, if there's anything to I'm able to do to help out, I'm usually more than willing to do so. If a friend is doing well, I'm happy for him/her.

All the more reason for them to show resentment and confusion... Wouldn't you say?

being Emotionally involved - even if you're not in a tizzy or anything - is still something to be cautious about because working from a seat of emotion, as opposed to compassion, can lead to hasty decisions, many of which might be incorrect. Emotions are not a good foundation to work from.

 

Of course people are more involved in their own lives than they would be in someone else's. My life does not revolve around them and their problems, though sometimes one of them acts as though it should. (One of these friends manages to get me involved in half of her affairs, asking me to help her with various things. When I could, I did. But I have since backed away, and now she's a bit offended by this.)

This is different. She would be classified as an Emotional leech, or Vampire. Strong helpful people are vulnerable to abuse like this, from people like these....

 

"Don't worry" is nothing more than compassion. It's not really being more worried about someone else's affairs than your own.

"Don't worry" has to be one of the most idiotic things to say to somebody who is worried frantic. I think it was something the second-in-command said to the captain of the Titanic, when they hit the iceberg.....

 

If I tell you that my dog was just run over by a car, and you say "Oh really, that's too bad. Brian stood me up last night, and he's such a jerk." I think that's kind of cold. To say, with concern "OMG! That's horrible! Is he okay?"... that's not being overly concerned or overly involved....

 

There's a difference between Tolerance, and Acceptance, and there's a difference between Idiot Compassion, and Wise Compassion.

 

Tolerance - putting up with something, even though there are judgemental limits. Like religious tolerance. Hindus are welcome to live in the UK providing they do not burn their dead on six-foot-high wooden pyres, next to a river and chuck the remains into the water.

Acceptance is understanding that certain people have certain mores, values and opinions, and even though we might not agree with them, we vow to not argue or contest these, but see them as part of that person - 'warts and all' - and still reach out with a helping hand, regardless.

 

Idiot Compassion Supports somebody, but removes their own strength to work through the problem themselves. we do the donkey-work for them, then wonder why they're still falling flat on their face.....

 

Wise Compassion enables a person, with our support, to stand on their own two feet and find a skilful solution to their own problems.

[quankanne]

The problem seems to be that the dynamics of these relationships had a lot to do with my shoulders and ears always being there, and me always willing to lend a helping hand within reason. When I just listened without giving anymore than one particular friend would normally give, she was actually offended. The problem is that they expect me to have answers and kind words, but never really have any to give themselves.

 

I think you've already got your answer, kiddo – some people are like emotional vampires, sucking your energy and emotions from you until you're spent, then they move on to the next person if it seems like you've got nothing left to give. This particular girl isn't a "friend," just someone looking to leech your emotional energy.

 

a real friend understands that listening (whether it's you listening or the other person doing the listening) is theraputic (and needed), and that you offer some kind of encouragement, or advice, if that's what is being solicited. I'm sorry you didn't find that IRL, but know that we're here to listen, advise, coax and fill ya with piss & vinegar if need be

[and.then.some]

For the sake of clarity... I'm asking because I've considered practically ending these friendships. It's hard for me because I've been friends (practically family) with these people for a very long time. Simply backing away hasn't been easy, because they still try.

 

One friend gets mad at me on a semi-regular basis now because I don't make as much time to deal with her and her shenanigans. As well, I have become slightly more indifferent towards her. She has had tantrums over this. I have tried to explain things from my perspective, which only puts her on the defensive and makes her mad. After a number of days the cycle just repeats itself.

 

Do I throw away a life long friend over this?

 

Another friend hasn't been nearly as emotional about it, but won't give up. I'll still get the call at 2am about something that is no real business of mine. When I don't offer much opinion or insight, she'll try to drag something out of me. When I just ignore the phone now, she'll just call and text more. In trying to salvage the relationship, I talked to her about the matter as well. Though less dramatic, she became defensive and mad. (Believe me, I handled the situation with kid gloves in both cases.) Then, she, like the other, expected everything to go back to normal.

 

Another life-long friend...

 

They don't back away, because I've always been there. And it is believed that, rain or shine, I will always be there. I had decided to just limit my involvement with them, change the way I relate to them, and just tolerate them in small doses. Me being "like a sister", not answering the phone for a week or so doesn't even register as a brush off to them. It doesn't send the "back away" signal that it might to someone else.

[quankanne]

Do I throw away a life long friend over this?

 

but are they *really* friends? There are people you know since forever, but aren't friend-quality by virtue of what they don't offer to the relationship. A real friend doesn't waste your time with piddly, whiny-azz phonecalls at 2 a.m., but understands that if she DOES need to get hold of you at an odd hour because of something serious going on, she can call.

 

she knows those things that trouble you, and will follow up just to make sure you're doing okay, even when you've assured her that you've got it under wraps. She doesn't have a cow just because you haven't talked or emailed her in several months, but just takes up where you last left off, as if the whole time-distance thing apart is nothing.

 

a real friend doesn't insist on imposing on you every little damn thing that's bugging her just because she can – she spends time being in that friendship with you, whether it's doing things together or just catching up on chit chat.

 

a real friend understands the difference between caring and being a pain in the butt.

 

and it sounds like none of those chicks you're talking about understand what an honest friendship is about.

[and.then.some]

The problem seems to be that the dynamics of these relationships had a lot to do with my shoulders and ears always being there, and me always willing to lend a helping hand within reason. When I just listened without giving anymore than one particular friend would normally give, she was actually offended. The problem is that they expect me to have answers and kind words, but never really have any to give themselves.

 

I think you've already got your answer, kiddo – some people are like emotional vampires, sucking your energy and emotions from you until you're spent, then they move on to the next person if it seems like you've got nothing left to give. This particular girl isn't a "friend," just someone looking to leech your emotional energy.

 

a real friend understands that listening (whether it's you listening or the other person doing the listening) is theraputic (and needed), and that you offer some kind of encouragement, or advice, if that's what is being solicited. I'm sorry you didn't find that IRL, but know that we're here to listen, advise, coax and fill ya with piss & vinegar if need be

 

LOL! Thanks! I feel like I've sort of been the mother hen or something. And, like mother hen can't have any problems. It's not like they're totally selfish monsters or anything of that nature. One may listen, the other half listens, but both seemed to miss the mark when it came to a pretty major event in my life. Before that point, I never really noticed or cared. But it really did hurt that the people who subjected me to their late night BS calls couldn't even empathize a little. lol

 

It was always there. It never required anything in return. And I guess it was just taken for granted. Now, I'm kind of torn about how to handle the situation...

[TaraMaiden]

In that case, what you have been doing is practising "Idiot Compassion".

I'm not calling you an idiot, I'm saying that your application of assistance has dis-abled these people from seeing their own problems are for them to own, and to man-up and deal with them.

 

This is clearly beginning to fray your nerves...

You refer to one's friend's problems as 'shenanigans'.

you mention your other friend is persistent and intrusive.

They have become dependent on you for their decision-making and support. In short, you have enabled them to rely on you to solve all their problems for them.

why should they deal with all that crap, when you've done it all up to now?

(and I bet that they ask you for advice and support, then go off and do the opposite....)

do you think about them even when they are far removed, silent and absent?

 

Do their problems occupy your mind, to the extent that you forget to think about your 'stuff' because their 'stuff' is all-invasive?

 

Do you harbour or feel resentment at this?

 

If you answer yes to any of these, or anything here has resonated, then - yes.

They're vampires.

 

And there is an antidote. Or a psychological 'stake through the heart'....

[and.then.some]

Do I throw away a life long friend over this?

 

but are they *really* friends? There are people you know since forever, but aren't friend-quality by virtue of what they don't offer to the relationship. A real friend doesn't waste your time with piddly, whiny-azz phonecalls at 2 a.m., but understands that if she DOES need to get hold of you at an odd hour because of something serious going on, she can call.

 

she knows those things that trouble you, and will follow up just to make sure you're doing okay, even when you've assured her that you've got it under wraps. She doesn't have a cow just because you haven't talked or emailed her in several months, but just takes up where you last left off, as if the whole time-distance thing apart is nothing.

 

a real friend doesn't insist on imposing on you every little damn thing that's bugging her just because she can – she spends time being in that friendship with you, whether it's doing things together or just catching up on chit chat.

 

a real friend understands the difference between caring and being a pain in the butt.

 

and it sounds like none of those chicks you're talking about understand what an honest friendship is about.

 

That's the way I started to feel once I realized that these guys weren't really trying to in some way be there for me. At the time I didn't expect much of anything. It wasn't till I came through on the other side of a hot mess that I realized they weren't the least bit compassionate or supportive.

 

Also, I feel that... if they told me something I said or did hurt them in some way, even if I didn't feel I did anything wrong, I would feel sorry for hurting them still. It just wasn't the same way with them.

 

I just needed to know if I'm expect too much from them, or if I paired up with the wrong best buddies for life. LOL. Thanks for replying!

[and.then.some]

Nope. We all love to be needed. No good deed goes unpunished, and as such, bending over backwards for someone has the ulterior motive of wishing to be liked, seen as a generally all-round good-egg and someone reliable. We do things for others, just as much to make us feel good about us, as we do to make them feel good about it.

Withdrawing that support has now generated resentment, because you're no longer reliable.

 

I don't always bend over backwards, but I do it occasionally. It's not something I think about before hand. If I had the time and I was asked, and I didn't object for some reason, I would do it. If it has anything to do with being liked, it wasn't something I thought about before hand. But yes, making people happy (or feel better) makes me happy. And it does feel like I did something good. I've always been that way. It was probably something branded into my brain by my parents and the church. lol

 

I'm not a goody-twoshoes or anything, but I think I like to fix things.

 

Did you discuss this with them? did you point out that some support would have been welcome, given the amount you have been supportive to them?

 

In the nicest ways possible, with sugar on top. The both became defensive and offended.

 

 

being Emotionally involved - even if you're not in a tizzy or anything - is still something to be cautious about because working from a seat of emotion, as opposed to compassion, can lead to hasty decisions, many of which might be incorrect. Emotions are not a good foundation to work from.

 

The emotional involvement at this point has more to do with what I should do. But the emotional involvement I spoke of when it comes to there problems would be better stated as a strong general concern for their well-being.

 

 

"Don't worry" has to be one of the most idiotic things to say to somebody who is worried frantic. I think it was something the second-in-command said to the captain of the Titanic, when they hit the iceberg.....

 

Oh, you know what I mean. LOL

 

There's a difference between Tolerance, and Acceptance, and there's a difference between Idiot Compassion, and Wise Compassion.

 

Tolerance - putting up with something, even though there are judgemental limits. Like religious tolerance. Hindus are welcome to live in the UK providing they do not burn their dead on six-foot-high wooden pyres, next to a river and chuck the remains into the water.

Acceptance is understanding that certain people have certain mores, values and opinions, and even though we might not agree with them, we vow to not argue or contest these, but see them as part of that person - 'warts and all' - and still reach out with a helping hand, regardless.

 

Then I guess that would be my other question. Do I choose tolerance or acceptance or neither.

[and.then.some]

In that case, what you have been doing is practising "Idiot Compassion".

I'm not calling you an idiot, I'm saying that your application of assistance has dis-abled these people from seeing their own problems are for them to own, and to man-up and deal with them.

 

This is clearly beginning to fray your nerves...

You refer to one's friend's problems as 'shenanigans'.

you mention your other friend is persistent and intrusive.

They have become dependent on you for their decision-making and support. In short, you have enabled them to rely on you to solve all their problems for them.

why should they deal with all that crap, when you've done it all up to now?

(and I bet that they ask you for advice and support, then go off and do the opposite....)

do you think about them even when they are far removed, silent and absent?

 

Do their problems occupy your mind, to the extent that you forget to think about your 'stuff' because their 'stuff' is all-invasive?

 

Do you harbour or feel resentment at this?

 

If you answer yes to any of these, or anything here has resonated, then - yes.

They're vampires.

 

And there is an antidote. Or a psychological 'stake through the heart'....

 

One of my friends will get me wrapped up in her affairs, but I wouldn't call her stuff all invasive. I won't be at the movies or grocery shopping thinking about some problem she's having.

 

I don't think there is a psychological stake that'll work in this case. LOL

[quankanne]

:laugh: then tell them Mama Hen is fixing to lay a doozy of an egg! And very clearly, but kindly, let them know that you feel that they've let you down by not being the kind of friend that you've tried to be to them when you were experiencing X situation.

 

that's not being selfish, it's not being hateful, it's informing them that the playing field has shifted because you realize that you're giving of yourself way too much for little in return.

 

frankly, I don't think it's asking too much of someone to show that kind of sensitivity to what's going on with you ... especially when it's a close friend/relative!!!

[carhill]

Here's a suggestion which has worked for me during my divorce and dealing with my mother's terminal illness...

 

I identified those friends whom did not show proactive interest and care and distanced myself from them, choosing to focus on a core group of people who do demonstrate clear and healthy friendship. If asked by the others I simply respond 'I'm going through a tough time right now and need people around me who really care about me. I'm focusing on that.' Nothing further. They can process the meaning in my absence, or not. I really don't care. I used to care. Therapy and divorce have taught me healthier boundaries. It matters not what the length of friendship. Everyone is an equal.

 

Cut the cord. It's a big world and there are lots of wonderful, loving, caring people in it. Trust me, these 'friends' won't miss you one bit.

[TaraMaiden]

(. . .)

Then I guess that would be my other question. Do I choose tolerance or acceptance or neither.

Acceptance. But at a safe distance.

 

One of my friends will get me wrapped up in her affairs, but I wouldn't call her stuff all invasive

If she's getting you all wrapped up in her affairs, that's invasive.

She's making herself a priority in your life.

As has been said - I too question the term "Friends" here.....

 

I don't think there is a psychological stake that'll work in this case. LOL

Oooooooh trust me.

Yes, there is.

I've used it myself on three separate occasions.

it involves doing almost what you mentioned in your second post....

 

If I tell you that my dog was just run over by a car, and you say "Oh really, that's too bad. Brian stood me up last night, and he's such a jerk." I think that's kind of cold.

 

However,Look at this scenario instead:

WhingyFriend: "Oh woe is me, I have so many problems! *This* is happening, *that* is happening, and as for *the other* I just don't have a clue what to do!"

and.then.some:"Oh my, yes, that is terrible.... Hey, do you want to see my new shoes? I got them in a sale!"

 

This is Wise Compassion.

letting them see these problems are of concern to you, but not your concern.

 

They're giving you something Negative, about them....What you do, is listen compassionately - but then flip it round to give them something Positive, about you.

I know this sounds callous.

I recognise that.

But ultimately, what you are doing is telling them that wile the problems lie in their laps, so do their own solutions.

 

I've done this three different times now, and all with the same effect.

These flaky so-called 'friends' disappeared - of their own accord and free will - right off my radar.

It goes against the grain.

But it really, really works.

And it gives you the fresh start and clean slate you need, to address your own attitudes, to protect yourself from ever becoming their victim again.

[blueyedgrl85]

You sound like such a kind and generous friend that they are lucky to have you in their life! That being said..... You are giving more than you are getting. You put a lot of time and effort into these friendships and in most cases, it seems like the effort is not matched. It is important that all friendships are balanced. This means that you should only give what the other person is giving. One-sided friendships are unfair and unhealthy. Friendships require balance.

 

The solution is to limit the time and effort you place into your friendships. Since you sound so empathetic, apply it in other areas like volunteering at an animal shelter, youth home, senior center, etc. There are plenty of other people out there who could benefit from your help and others like you who are caring and willing to listen/help out. Your friends are so dependent on you that they will just continue to take all of your energy out of you until there is none left- which leaves you feeling drained and empty. Move on and find more mutual friendships and activities out there where others will appreciate you and will also help you when you have a problem.

 

 

 

All the best!

[and.then.some]

I'd like to thank everyone for all of the kind, supportive, and insightful replies. I have created distance, and I do feel a little guilty about creating even more distance.

 

I have friend who had the same problem that I have. His solution was to stop really giving any advice, and that's what I've tried to put into practice. The truth is that I have to retrain myself.

 

I really was wondering if I might just be expecting too much or something, and I thank you all for the unbiased opinions. I'm the person who reasons "she can't see the other person's problem because she is so wrapped up in her own problems" and "I understand". The sad truth is that understanding where a person is coming from on some basic level doesn't always make it easy to deal with.

 

I do need to branch out a little more and find more like-minded people to make up for what is lacking in these other friendships. I've already let one know that you can't get out what you don't put in. But I think she's thinking "this too shall pass".

 

Thanks again, everyone!

[Peaceful Guy]

fuhque them! ive been in relationships like this before.. there's tons of people out there that would support you as a friend and listen to your problems.. you may never know how they got so self absorbed, or what they're thinking.. but you can without a doubt get out there and meet new people to be close with. get back into activities that you like, and really go for it! look for other caring empathetic people.. they'll be looking for you too.. try not to waste any time being resentful of your old friends, you'll be having a blast again in no time!

 

so, maybe you've already been doing that? well, there is a mourning period when things change.. let it take its course. its okay to be sad for a time, but jump at the first opportunity to let it go and be happy again.. hope to see you out there!

[and.then.some]

so, maybe you've already been doing that? well, there is a mourning period when things change.. let it take its course. its okay to be sad for a time, but jump at the first opportunity to let it go and be happy again.. hope to see you out there!

 

Yeah, mourning period. Disillusionment, in fact. That's all. I'm not mopping around or anything, but thanks. I guess the complication is/was being able to say F'em 100%. It's harder to forgive and get over reoccurring offenses without majorly changing something about the situation or your perception.

[BlueHarvest]

Friendships are like emotional banks. They are constantly being withdrawn from, but need deposits every now and then or they dry up.

 

It's a bad cliche, but I think it gets the point across.

 

I've had a few friends like you mentioned. I keep them at arm's distance. They aren't just any ole friends either. They are friends I've known since high school. I just keep boundaries up. I invite them to do something, if they say "sure I'll hang out" or whatever but then don't show up I don't call them. I let them initiate the next contact against me. And I don't worry about them initiating contact either.

 

I'm not saying your strong...but maybe the cord that needs to be cut is yours. To me it sounds like you *need* these friendships. Make sure friendships are there in your life but not a requirement.

 

It will get tough at times, I know first-hand. But if it wasn't for life's rough times, we wouldn't appreciate the good times. Know what I mean?

[Peaceful Guy]

Yeah, mourning period. Disillusionment, in fact. That's all. I'm not mopping around or anything, but thanks. I guess the complication is/was being able to say F'em 100%. It's harder to forgive and get over reoccurring offenses without majorly changing something about the situation or your perception.

 

i know.. you don't have to say f'em %100, you probably won't.. that's my job! i mean, im just saying.. from a distance.. i want you to move forward without hesitation or regrets or worries or whatever because from the way i see it you didn't do anything wrong and the sooner you're happy the better.. setting boundaries.. (in my case not going over to emotionally distant friend's houses to watch them play video games ()).. will change the situation. you're perception.. could be a hard one to shake. also, you sound very caring and compassionate.. i think that if that's the case then forgiveness so that you can move on as quickly as possible is the best thing to do. really though, kind people have the most fun! get out there!

[Peaceful Guy]

i know.. you don't have to say f'em %100, you probably won't.. that's my job! i mean, im just saying.. from a distance.. i want you to move forward without hesitation or regrets or worries or whatever because from the way i see it you didn't do anything wrong and the sooner you're happy the better.. setting boundaries.. (in my case not going over to emotionally distant friend's houses to watch them play video games ()).. will change the situation. you're perception.. could be a hard one to shake. also, you sound very caring and compassionate.. i think that if that's the case then forgiveness so that you can move on as quickly as possible is the best thing to do. really though, kind people have the most fun! get out there!

 

a big part of where im coming from with this is that when i look back on how difficult it was for me to "move on".. i realize now that as much as i was hurt and trying to "solve" the situation there are some things that just really aren't your fault.. it seems like maybe youre doing something wrong.. maybe they've got a point.. maybe you're hurt because you're this or that.. but really, and i think this is key, if you're being cool and kind and caring to people then you're really in the clear to "move on" and find new friends and adventures.

[and.then.some]

Friendships are like emotional banks. They are constantly being withdrawn from, but need deposits every now and then or they dry up.

 

It's a bad cliche, but I think it gets the point across.

 

I've had a few friends like you mentioned. I keep them at arm's distance. They aren't just any ole friends either. They are friends I've known since high school. I just keep boundaries up. I invite them to do something, if they say "sure I'll hang out" or whatever but then don't show up I don't call them. I let them initiate the next contact against me. And I don't worry about them initiating contact either.

 

I'm not saying your strong...but maybe the cord that needs to be cut is yours. To me it sounds like you *need* these friendships. Make sure friendships are there in your life but not a requirement.

 

It will get tough at times, I know first-hand. But if it wasn't for life's rough times, we wouldn't appreciate the good times. Know what I mean?

 

This isn't really the same as what you've described, but thanks for the reply. It's not really an issue of ... life just happening, but the dynamics of the friendships we have with one another.

[BlueHarvest]

This isn't really the same as what you've described, but thanks for the reply. It's not really an issue of ... life just happening, but the dynamics of the friendships we have with one another.

 

Did your first post not describe a friendship in which you were there for your friends, but when things were "rough" they weren't there for you?

 

Like I said, continue to be a friend. Don't just be there for the bad, try to do positive things during happy times for the both of you. That's you being assertive in a friendship. If they flake on you during the good AND the bad...then I wouldn't really classify them as true friends, in which case why are you still worried about the friendship and putting yourself out there?

 

Like I said...it sounds like YOU are the one who is having trouble cutting the cord, I was trying to word things a bit nicer but apparently I have to be blunt about it.

 

The common factor is YOU keep letting them use you. Choose your friends, don't let your friends choose you.

 

My entire statement from before applied exactly to your situation. I know because I've been in your shoes before. Denial of your situation doesn't change the situation.

 

You asked for advice. Don't get defensive when someone gives it to you straight.

[and.then.some]

a big part of where im coming from with this is that when i look back on how difficult it was for me to "move on".. i realize now that as much as i was hurt and trying to "solve" the situation there are some things that just really aren't your fault.. it seems like maybe youre doing something wrong.. maybe they've got a point.. maybe you're hurt because you're this or that.. but really, and i think this is key, if you're being cool and kind and caring to people then you're really in the clear to "move on" and find new friends and adventures.

 

For me, these friendships are starting to turn more into something like the relationship I have with my dad. My brother no longer speaks to our father, and hasn't for years. I know other people who have had similar problems with their fathers and simply disowned them. My mother and father raised me well when it comes to loyalty to family. So, while I might skip some family functions on account of my dad, or wouldn't talk to him for some weeks following certain incidents, he's still my dad. There were times when I literally hated him, wanted him out of my life, and declared to others that I wouldn't even go to his funeral. Really.... THAT bad. LOL But it never lasted for more than a couple of months. There were moments when I thought it might be best to just push him all the way out of my life, and that's how I've felt about these girls at times as well. That was my dilemma here... totally jumping ship or finding a way to be more accepting.

 

I don't like drama, and I don't like people who piss me off lol. When I've had these types of problems with other people, it was never an issue. With or without an explanation (depending on the relationship) I would simply drop contact.

 

These girls are like family, though they're not guilty of anything so major as my father. We've known one another since we were knee high, and just coming out of diapers. There were people I met in high school or grade school or college who I ended close friendships with because I found them to be selfish or untrustworthy friends. I had no guilt in those situations because there wasn't this same... sisterly bond.

 

People who are in that family box... I guess I feel a more responsible for them. As well, in a way, I expect more from them, depending.

 

At the time, it was frustrating trying to understand, or figure a way to get them to understand, but I've simply given up hope on that one. If it's meant for them to understand something, I guess they'll get it with time and experience.