pink_sugar Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 I thought I'd bring up an interesting topic for thought. Anyone ever notice how employers expect you to give 2 weeks notice when leaving, when they have no obligation to give you notice? I find this interesting, because really we are not required to give them notice when it comes to the at-will employment laws either. I think it is a good thing to do when a company has treated you well, but if certain circumstances prevent you from doing so, employers shouldn't expect it of you. Most employers do not give you notice when they are letting you go. My husband and I are re-locating since I just lost my job and there is no way we can afford to stay in this area on his income alone. So whenever he gets another job, if it's after we move, we will give minimal notice. He also recently found out that his company just lays people off when they give notice, so there probably isn't any point to giving notice at all. Link to post Share on other sites
UpwardForward Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 I thought I'd bring up an interesting topic for thought. Anyone ever notice how employers expect you to give 2 weeks notice when leaving, when they have no obligation to give you notice? I find this interesting, because really we are not required to give them notice when it comes to the at-will employment laws either. I think it is a good thing to do when a company has treated you well, but if certain circumstances prevent you from doing so, employers shouldn't expect it of you. Most employers do not give you notice when they are letting you go. My husband and I are re-locating since I just lost my job and there is no way we can afford to stay in this area on his income alone. So whenever he gets another job, if it's after we move, we will give minimal notice. He also recently found out that his company just lays people off when they give notice, so there probably isn't any point to giving notice at all. If he gives notice, and they lay him off - wouldn't that make it easier for him to get unemployment benefits? Link to post Share on other sites
d0nnivain Posted January 3, 2014 Share Posted January 3, 2014 It's not a requirement but a courtesy. If you expect a good recommendation down the line, be polite. You never know what will happen in the future. Why burn a bridge, just because you can? Most new employers will be happy to delay your start date so you can give the other employer notice. The difference is, when the employer fires you they already have a plan in place about how your work will get done -- new employee, reshuffling etc. When you quit, they are scrambling. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author pink_sugar Posted January 4, 2014 Author Share Posted January 4, 2014 (edited) If he gives notice, and they lay him off - wouldn't that make it easier for him to get unemployment benefits? You could, but it's a lengthy process. This happened to me once before. I gave notice after 2 weeks of no work, I was let go without being told. The employer will first tell unemployment that you willingly quit the job before they admit to letting you go before the end of your notice period. So in order for you to collect benefits, you will have to appeal the decision and tell the EDD that you were let go before the end of your notice period. The appeals process can take several months before you receive any benefits. (If you do win) I know when this happened to me several years ago, I filed in November and didn't receive any benefits until around March. Edited January 4, 2014 by pink_sugar Link to post Share on other sites
UpwardForward Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 (edited) You could, but it's a lengthy process. This happened to me once before. I gave notice after 2 weeks of no work, I was let go without being told. The employer will first tell unemployment that you willingly quit the job before they admit to letting you go before the end of your notice period. So in order for you to collect benefits, you will have to appeal the decision and tell the EDD that you were let go before the end of your notice period. The appeals process can take several months before you receive any benefits. (If you do win) I know when this happened to me several years ago, I filed in November and didn't receive any benefits until around March. It still might be worth it. Especially if 'notice' and simultaneous layoff are in writing? Then appeals process could be shorter? Edited January 4, 2014 by UpwardForward Link to post Share on other sites
Author pink_sugar Posted January 4, 2014 Author Share Posted January 4, 2014 It still might be worth it. Especially if 'notice' and simultaneous layoff are in writing? Then appeals process could be shorter? From what I know, the previous person who they let go after notice wasn't given anything in writing. They basically just said that same day was his last. Regardless, he won't be able to quit until he has something else lined up, so I guess the unemployment process would be defeated. Link to post Share on other sites
UpwardForward Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 From what I know, the previous person who they let go after notice wasn't given anything in writing. They basically just said that same day was his last. Regardless, he won't be able to quit until he has something else lined up, so I guess the unemployment process would be defeated. Yes, hopefully he can wait until other employment. But, if there's a layoff - I think he should demand it in writing, and because of possible delay in benefits. Link to post Share on other sites
Author pink_sugar Posted January 4, 2014 Author Share Posted January 4, 2014 Yes, hopefully he can wait until other employment. But, if there's a layoff - I think he should demand it in writing, and because of possible delay in benefits. Yeah he was laid off from this company before during their slow season, they did give him documentation and everything so he got benefits. But I don't think he will get laid off this time since they are doing better this year and the layoffs usually happen around November and I think only one person was let go. Link to post Share on other sites
nittygritty Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 From what I know, the previous person who they let go after notice wasn't given anything in writing. They basically just said that same day was his last. Regardless, he won't be able to quit until he has something else lined up, so I guess the unemployment process would be defeated. An employer has the right to replace someone or eliminate the position after a person gives notice. Once you give your employer two weeks notice, your employer gets to decide whether or not they need or want you to finish out the full two weeks. When you give your employer notice they know your leaving. They are immediately faced with the decision of what to do. If you know that you are not going to be able to finish out a full two weeks let them know when you give notice. An employer provides you a job and an income in exchange for the work you do for them. If you don't like working for someone else come up with a your own business concept and plan. Invest all of your money or try to get a loan or find some investors to make it happen and work for yourself. Giving an employer two weeks notice is the right the thing to do as a courtesy for having provided you a job and pay. Link to post Share on other sites
UpwardForward Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Perhaps things have changed over the years. But when I was in my 20's I did give notice. My boss did terminate me before my chosen last day. Unbeknownst to him, he did owe me unemployment benefits. - and they were paid. But this was a long time ago. To answer your original question Pink Sugar, I would think if the employee doesn't give proper notice, it can carry with them when others ask the prev employer for recommendation/reference. In other words the employer can be rotten and get by with it, but not so easy for the employee if they expect to use the job as a reference. Link to post Share on other sites
Author pink_sugar Posted January 5, 2014 Author Share Posted January 5, 2014 (edited) I get that if your employer has been good to you, however there are some situations where it isn't feasible. In my husband's case, he will need to leave almost immediately, because we are re-locating and he will need to be able to start the other job right away. This is also due to our financial difficulties. Being unemployed and with his hours being cut, he cannot afford to stay a full two weeks. He doesn't get paid enough to even rent a room while he is in the process of looking for work in the city we're moving to. Also given that business is slow right now and he is not a full time employee, I don't think it's that surprising if he wasn't able to give that much notice. My job left me high and dry by letting me go suddenly before Christmas with no reason. Two weeks is a courtesy and it's not always feasible. I gave two weeks at a prior job out of courtesy and that didn't stop my old boss from making comments about giving me a bad reference. Edited January 5, 2014 by pink_sugar Link to post Share on other sites
UpwardForward Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Hopefully he will be able to find another job in the city soon. Link to post Share on other sites
nittygritty Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 (edited) Perhaps things have changed over the years. But when I was in my 20's I did give notice. My boss did terminate me before my chosen last day. Unbeknownst to him, he did owe me unemployment benefits. - and they were paid. But this was a long time ago. To answer your original question Pink Sugar, I would think if the employee doesn't give proper notice, it can carry with them when others ask the prev employer for recommendation/reference. In other words the employer can be rotten and get by with it, but not so easy for the employee if they expect to use the job as a reference. The laws pertaining to unemployment benefits have changed over the years. However, Pink Sugar still may qualify for unemployment benefits because of the way she was let go. "At will employment" does mean you can randomly, without just cause, just let someone go and that person not qualify for unemployment benefits. An employer saying that they have probationary periods that go beyond 30 days does not mean that the person will not qualify for unemployment benefits. I would think Pink Sugar has a very good chance of qualifying for unemployment benefits because of the way her employer let her go. As long as she had not given them any type of notice. Edited January 5, 2014 by nittygritty typo Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 At will employment cuts out all the 'fear of a lawsuit if I let this person who isn't working out go'. It isn't easy letting people go who aren't working out but it would be even harder if half the people you let go pull your company into court because 'they' feel they should still be employed. It doesn't mean an employer can screw someone out of wages earned or benefits, or even mean they can break laws, it just means they can let you go without warning, with or without a reason. Getting unemployment benefits isn't related to being at will employed. If you find yourself unemployed for your own fault ie: you put your notice in and they let you go at that point (although your pay is still due), or you fail a drug test or your performance isn't up to par... etc etc etc.. then you can expect NO unemployment benefits. In my state if you are let go within the probationary term of 90 days (we are also an at will state) then no unemployment benefits will be given for that employer, that doesn't mean that a person isn't eligible through their old employer if they were on benefits when they took the newer job, Of course you certainly can go fight with the labor board, if the employer doesn't fight back then the certain limited benefits might be granted but not a lot as their wasn't that long of an employment to begin with (90 days). Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 Notice is all about being nice to the people who you used to work WITH and for, it is just a nice professional way to transition from one job to the next as we all know people grow and move and need to change jobs at times. I have had someone recently leave with zero notice, texted their need to leave 12 hours before the start of the week. They were an integral employee but were going through personal issues that wouldn't allow them to remain at work. Did it kill us, sure.. we were busy when they did it and replacing them still has to be done, but consider that bridge burnt and don't use me as a reference. They didn't break any laws but professionally what they did was rude and disrespectful to an employer what has treated them with exceptional respect and gone out of their way for them. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
UpwardForward Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 The laws pertaining to unemployment benefits have changed over the years. However, Pink Sugar still may qualify for unemployment benefits because of the way she was let go. "At will employment" does mean you can randomly, without just cause, just let someone go and that person not qualify for unemployment benefits. An employer saying that they have probationary periods that go beyond 30 days does not mean that the person will not qualify for unemployment benefits. I would think Pink Sugar has a very good chance of qualifying for unemployment benefits because of the way her employer let her go. As long as she had not given them any type of notice. I was responding to possibility of OP's H getting benefits, should he give notice and be laid off before his last day. And assuming he isn't within a probationary period. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author pink_sugar Posted January 5, 2014 Author Share Posted January 5, 2014 (edited) The HR lady instructed me to file for unemployment right away. Gave me a handbook and all. I was let go because they felt it wasn't a good fit during the 90 days. As long as it's not gross misconduct or anything of that sort, you can get UI. My husband had a similar situation a few years back and the unemployment benefits came from the prior employer, not the one that let him go because he wasn't there long enough. According to my award letter, UI will be based on the previous employer. Unfortunately I made considerably less there, so the amount isn't much. Edited January 5, 2014 by pink_sugar Link to post Share on other sites
Author pink_sugar Posted January 5, 2014 Author Share Posted January 5, 2014 I was responding to possibility of OP's H getting benefits, should he give notice and be laid off before his last day. And assuming he isn't within a probationary period. Yeah, there really isn't any question about my ability to get benefits due to the reason I was let go. But anyways back to the original subject, I almost always give 2 weeks. The only case where I did not was one employer who just treated me like crap and it wasn't improving even after going to the union. I couldn't stand it and gave a week's notice. They should be glad I gave any at all with the treatment I received. So I think there are a few exceptions to the rule. Link to post Share on other sites
MuscleCarFan Posted January 5, 2014 Share Posted January 5, 2014 I was responding to possibility of OP's H getting benefits, should he give notice and be laid off before his last day. And assuming he isn't within a probationary period. I will be at my job for almost 11 months now... Link to post Share on other sites
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