Suicide and the afterlife

[truthtripper]

When a person commits suicide, how would God handle them and where would their soul go?

[Phoenician]

depends if u are suicide bomber or not !

hehe

[GorillaTheater]

I'd prefer to believe that God would comfort one of His children who was in so much pain, and would take that pain away forever.

[GorillaTheater]

But I feel the need to ask why you're asking.

[Clarence_Boddicker]

I'd guess that'd depend on what religion (or lack of) the person who killed themselves are & the people asking about it. From why I understand about Catholicism & Christianity, this is what supposedly happens to them.

 

 

[d0nnivain]

While I agree with Gorilla Theater that I think God would be merciful, rather than punish such a troubled soul, I would encourage you to do anything other than find out for sure.

[pureinheart]

When a person commits suicide, how would God handle them and where would their soul go?

 

Based on my studies, if the individual gave his life to Jesus Christ, accepted Him as Lord and Savior, this person is 'saved'. I believe 'once saved always saved' is what the Lord goes by and reached based on many things- one of which is we are sealed with the Holy Spirit until the day of redemption.

 

This person would go to heaven because it's not of ourselves that 'saved' us, it's Him.

[endlessabyss]

I think about this question all the time, because I think about death a suicide a lot.

 

Trying to ride it out tho.

[truthtripper]

But I feel the need to ask why you're asking.

Several of my family members, including my parents and a few other people in my life have mentioned it to me. A few years ago, one of my therapists(who is Greek Orthodox)who had suffered from severe psoriasis, said that she would have suicided if she didn't fear "God's punishment". I've always wandered what that would be.

 

A few years ago, my cousin died an excruciating death. The cancer had spread throughout her entire body. After witnessing the last moments of her life, I don't quite understand what was the purpose of her suffering? Medical marijuana has recently been legalised here, so I guess God gave us this plant, among other pain killing plants, for this purpose.

 

So, if someone is in diabolical pain and has no access to effective medication(synthetic or herbal)and they suicide, it wouldn't be fair for God to "punish" them.

Edited November 5, 2015 by truthtripper

[burnt]

When a person commits suicide, how would God handle them and where would their soul go?

 

Possibility #1: There is NO God;

(for skeptics, agnostics, atheists, etc.); I fall in this category myself.

In this case, your sense of right and wrong is not defined by ONE defined faith or rules dictated by one religion, but rather you define your notion of ethics and morality from everything around you; meaning you don't follow a religion, but you construct one for yourself. In this case, 'what would GOD do to you if you commit suicide' is a meaningless question, as there is no god to begin with.

 

Possibility #2: There IS a God:

God said NO suicide--end of discussion.

Usually when someone commits suicide he has suffered immeasurable pain and suffering that he couldn't endure any farther based on his capacity to tolerate pain; so then he dies, and God punishes him for eternity--even farther?? That sounds cruel to me. So, I'd like to hope that IF there's a God, he'd choose 'sympathy' over 'rules'.

 

If someone wants to commit suicide and chooses to refrain because "God PUNISHES such 'wrong' act", then that means this person is choosing to do the 'right' thing due to 'fear'. That troubles me too; I'd like to know what we CHOOSE to do the right thing because we believe in its worth, not because we are forced to do it, coerced by 'fear of punishment'.

 

[On a separate note, just wondering…why are those soldiers on secret missions given 'death pills' to swallow in case they are caught and national security may be compromised? Shouldn't they be asked to take in the pain if they are tortured and never give in--since whatever torture your enemies put you through is nothing compared to the punishment God will put you through??]

[Clarence_Boddicker]

Possibility #1: There is NO God;

(for skeptics, agnostics, atheists, etc.); I fall in this category myself.

In this case, your sense of right and wrong is not defined by ONE defined faith or rules dictated by one religion, but rather you define your notion of ethics and morality from everything around you; meaning you don't follow a religion, but you construct one for yourself. In this case, 'what would GOD do to you if you commit suicide' is a meaningless question, as there is no god to begin with.

 

Possibility #2: There IS a God:

God said NO suicide--end of discussion.

Usually when someone commits suicide he has suffered immeasurable pain and suffering that he couldn't endure any farther based on his capacity to tolerate pain; so then he dies, and God punishes him for eternity--even farther?? That sounds cruel to me. So, I'd like to hope that IF there's a God, he'd choose 'sympathy' over 'rules'.

 

If someone wants to commit suicide and chooses to refrain because "God PUNISHES such 'wrong' act", then that means this person is choosing to do the 'right' thing due to 'fear'. That troubles me too; I'd like to know what we CHOOSE to do the right thing because we believe in its worth, not because we are forced to do it, coerced by 'fear of punishment'.

 

[On a separate note, just wondering…why are those soldiers on secret missions given 'death pills' to swallow in case they are caught and national security may be compromised? Shouldn't they be asked to take in the pain if they are tortured and never give in--since whatever torture your enemies put you through is nothing compared to the punishment God will put you through??]

 

 

Torture done by skilled interrogations is almost always 100% effective, if they have enough time. You should read some biographical books by combat vets that have been subject to torture, before asking ridiculous questions. Suicide pills are not as necessary today as they were in the past. Comm gear is small & lightweight. The new method is to send in a smart munition at the pickup point if the asset can't be recovered. Some groups like the CIA have a bad record in asset recovery, especially those assets that are not members of the Agency. That's a well known part of the game that black operators play.

[pureinheart]

I think about this question all the time, because I think about death a suicide a lot.

 

Trying to ride it out tho.

 

((((((((hugs)))))))))) please do 'ride it out'! There is a reason for each and every person on this earth, so please seek help if you ever feel discouraged enough to actually follow through...

 

Use this scripture- 'casting down all vain imaginations and every high thing that exalts itself before the knowledge of God, and pulling into captivity every thought unto the Lord Jesus Christ'...

[endlessabyss]

((((((((hugs)))))))))) please do 'ride it out'! There is a reason for each and every person on this earth, so please seek help if you ever feel discouraged enough to actually follow through...

 

Use this scripture- 'casting down all vain imaginations and every high thing that exalts itself before the knowledge of God, and pulling into captivity every thought unto the Lord Jesus Christ'...

 

 

 

Thank you,

 

 

Even though things seem quite hopeless, I still have things that keep me going.

[Tayla]

would it help to know that most ppl think about it when in despair?

 

I watched a show today that reset my mind... Ppl forget the basics... that they are a modern miracle in their senses and existance... Simply sitting back and going Wow!!! I have sight... Or wow! I've been loved in life!!! What gets the despair going is forgetting ourselves as miracles existing...

 

Unless you are in severe pain and have lost each of your senses and the grim repper is near... step back and seee your part in this ever marveling world!

[truthtripper]

would it help to know that most ppl think about it when in despair?

 

I watched a show today that reset my mind... Ppl forget the basics... that they are a modern miracle in their senses and existance... Simply sitting back and going Wow!!! I have sight... Or wow! I've been loved in life!!! What gets the despair going is forgetting ourselves as miracles existing...

 

Unless you are in severe pain and have lost each of your senses and the grim repper is near... step back and seee your part in this ever marveling world!

When something is terribly wrong with your body, be it physical, mental or emotional and your freedom and quality of life is being greatly compromised, it would be unusual not to think of death- and especially when your illness is also a burden for family and friends.

[TaraMaiden2]

A quick, if detailed search through threads and posts reveals that there are too many threads on suicide and ending one's life.

 

From my PoV, even one thread is too many.

It's so sad that with every mechanism available to those who need it, (so much more than in the past) there are still people who feel that suicide is the only resort left available to them.

 

Nobody can say for sure what the afterlife holds - if anything.

Surely though, staying alive, linking arms with others, and walking shoulder to shoulder, in mutual support, is a better alternative?

 

I would urge anyone with the willingness to die, to give it one more day.

 

Every day.

Just keep going for one more day.

And talk.

To anyone.

A priest, a counsellor, a neighbour - anyone.

 

I will relate, with all honesty and truthfulness, something that happened to me, on New Year's Eve:

I was at the checkout counter of the store where I work, as a sales assistant.

A lady approaches, to buy a gift voucher for her hairdresser, who is expecting a baby girl any day now (she later told me).

I greet the customer with my usual "Good morning madam, how are you?"

"Well to be honest, not very well.

I have advanced breast cancer and will need a mastectomy and intense chemo. I'm just about to go to my hairdresser's to have my head shaved, and be fitted with my new wigs. I call them Thelma and Louise. My own hair is also going to be made into a natural wig for those who will need one. I got my diagnosis in October '15. I've been fighting the incredulity and 'why me' tendency ever since.

I have a family, but sometimes, even then, you just have to go it alone."

We talked for a few moments, then with a Happy New Year!" She smiled, full of hope and despair at one and the same time, and left.

 

She is a woman with a premature death sentence hanging over her head, and a willingness to fight, and live.

 

Life is uncertain, but one thing is for sure: It's for grabbing by the lapels and shaking for everything it has to give, rather than abandoning it for an unseen, unknown uncertainty.

 

I wish her well, and anyone else, whose life seems desperate, right now.

 

There is so much to fight for.

[deckard11]

When a person commits suicide, how would God handle them and where would their soul go?

 

Bottom line, you go to hell for committing suicide.

[Lurkeraspect]

Bottom line - no one knows what happens after death.

[TaraMaiden2]

Bottom line, you go to hell for committing suicide.

 

What utter and total tosh. It's that kind of talk that engenders fear, which is precisely what some factions of religious nutters, want.

Ridiculous comment.

[truthtripper]

Surely though, staying alive, linking arms with others, and walking shoulder to shoulder, in mutual support, is a better alternative?

.

The reason why people want to die is because no matter how much they reach out to others, no one wants to 'link arms' with them. The suicidal are lonesome truth-seekers drowning in a sea of mass denial.

[TaraMaiden2]

The reason why people want to die is because no matter how much they reach out to others, no one wants to 'link arms' with them. The suicidal are lonesome truth-seekers drowning in a sea of mass denial.

 

Not always so.

 

I think that's how most people considering suicide, might feel, but it's usually not the case at all.

 

It's a slant on the "my wife doesn't understand me!" thing.

Most people hell-bent on suicide seriously believe nobody could, or does understand them, but it's a question of communicating properly and more importantly, in the right direction.

 

It has been said many times to members posting here, regarding psychological issues in their partners: "You are NOT his/her therapist. You cannot heal them, and it's not your job, and furthermore, you should NOT be expected to."

 

It's the same with this: The right people aren't being called on.

And someone suffering from depression, despondency and despair, simply cannot see the way out.

 

They can't believe anyone CAN help them, or that anyone will listen. It's well-known that mental issues are inadequately understood, and that those NOT in any need, find it very hard to understand or deal with those who are.

 

But there is ALWAYS a way out. It's a question of opening the right door, in the right time.

[Taramere]

Yeah...a friend of mine is slowly, or not so slowly, killing herself by starvation. She's had an eating disorder for years, and doctors have finally given up on her as treatment resistant. Believe me, an army of people have attempted to get through to and help my friend...but the sad truth is that she cannot be helped. Or if she can, the source of that help is one that leading experts in the world (on these conditions) have yet to find.

 

People with mental health conditions like anorexia, depression etc can make huge progress and live fulfilling and healthy lives with the right treatment and help. But, they have to want to get better. Unfortunately sometimes a person's condition becomes their "baby"...which is what happened with my friend. It's her identity. She can't conceive of a life and an identity that doesn't revolve around being anorexic.

 

People like that can draw in helpers who are determined to try to "fix" them. The problem there is that when the helpers realise the person can't be fixed they will often become angry and frustrated...and only make the person feel worse. As I did with my friend for a while. It's hard not to, and on balance I seem to have shown more patience than the vast majority of people in her life. Now, I can see she's so close to death that all I can do is be a friend and I'm not going to try to lecture her or get angry with her in what will probably be her last couple of months on this earth. Help her feel less alone...but that won't save her. It won't make her want to get better.

 

She still wants to talk, though. She wants to talk about all the people she's felt let down or abandoned by in her life. Inevitably there have been a lot of them. Some, people who should never have abandoned her (a parent). Others of the type most of us will feel abandoned by at some point in our lives (fickle or shallow friends, lovers etc). Others still were good friends to her, as she'll admit, but there was only so much they could take. Maybe they were sympathetic until a close relative developed something like cancer - desperately wanted to live but couldn't, and so my friend's friend would lose patience with her - having all these doctors and treatment opportunities at her disposal, and availing herself of none of them because she just didn't want to try to get better.

 

With mental health problems, it can be difficult for the onlooker to know where choice ends and compulsion/disease begins. Not just the onlooker. Close friends and family who have educated themselves thoroughly about a condition - even people treating patients with mental health problems - they can all struggle to differentiate between the person's own free choices and the compulsive actions they take resulting from their condition. Some people deny that they're sick. They might get flashes of awareness of it, but then they'll go back to attributing their problems to the behaviour of people who have flitted in and out of their life. Or they'll even insist "this is not a sickness. It's who I am. This is a lifestyle choice that other people ought to respect."

 

There's a limit to the amount of times a person wants to, or should, become that individual on whom a mentally ill or severely depressed person depends (and simply by linking up with a very troubled person who has been abandoned by everybody else, you may become the person on whom they depend to a degree you really didn't bargain for). For me, I will always want to be available to those who need a friend...but my rule from now on is that they must have a will to get better. That's the one thing you can't give a person....and if they don't have it, becoming their friend is a long, hard and very lonely road. I know that's tough to say, as the essence of depression is that people can't see a chance to get better. But there must be some tiny spark of fire there that says "I want to get through this. If there's a way for me to feel better, I want to try it." If that spark isn't there, then I'm afraid there isn't very much anybody can do to assist.

 

As to what happens in the afterlife...I would bet everything I have on that involving "absolutely nothing other than the physical body decaying or being cremated." Whatever it's ups, downs and general imperfections, as long as you can hold onto life, have all your senses and have some chance of bits and pieces of happiness - it has to be better than that nothingness. To the OP, I hope you somehow find that spark that will make you want to live. For all you know, that little spark could one day lead to something amazing. But it has to come from within you. Nobody else can give you it.

Edited January 3, 2016 by Taramere

[Timshel]

I understand your words Taramere. When my husband and father were dying of brain cancer, the most difficult part was not their physical care. It was being helpless to save them. Standing by and watching someone you love slowly leave and despite all effort, being unable to stop it is crushing. The neurologists and oncologists were steadfast and had developed an objective stoicism to protect themselves. My husband and father did not want to die...but they did.

 

I have had a major depression and have treated people with major depression. All the education and objective knowledge can still be tainted by frustration with, as you said, the absence of a spark/will to live. It is easier to remain benevolent as a practitioner than to be personally involved. I have come to realize that since my husband's passing, I am less flexible.

 

As far as suicide and the afterlife, the movie 'What Dreams May Come' best reflect my beliefs atm. In the movie, the afterlife is presented as perception. Whatever the energy/mental being a person has at the time of death, this energy becomes their afterlife reality. This is a simplification of what I believe but exemplifies it well enough.

 

I hope that anyone considering suicide would allow themselves to be helped. To at least have enough hope to let others help them. Things can get better....sometimes a leap of faith is enough to start.

[losangelena]

Bottom line - no one knows what happens after death.

 

I agree with this. It's fine to believe one thing or another, but no one truly knows what happens after we die, let alone what happens to those who die of their own hand (I tend to think that they don't get special treatment either way).

[bluefeather]

Cool, I was thinking this would have turned into a heated religious debate by now. I don't think anyone can answer that question. They can only answer with what they think or believe.