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Abusive? or did it just not work out.


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Old 26th June 2014, 3:54 AM   #1
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Abusive? or did it just not work out.

Just a quick one that I would love feedback on.


I’m one year out since BU, about four months NC.


I still think of her daily and although the worst has passed regularly get the anger and the depression.


One thing that is weighing on my mind is whether or not she was abusive towards me. I’ve read the info about signs/narcissists/ BPD etc. but I’m still not sure. Let’s just deal with her actions and then mine. During the course of a three year relationship this is a list of her worst behaviours. Bear in mind that alcohol was usually involved


Following an argument, threw my clothes out the window of our first floor apartment.


Slapped me hard across the face on two separate occasions.


Ripped up a book I had got as a present and threw all over the garden


Packed her bags and stormed out two or three times only to return a few days later after I had accepted that it was my fault and that she should come back


Got drunk and told friends of mine I was beating her up (I wasn’t)


Broke stuff in the apartment, sprayed shaving cream on my suits


Broke up with me and then proceeded to blame me for it (even months later) what is up with that? As in I gave you so many chances, you’re arrogant, I deserve better.


Stormed out of bars and restaurants on foot of minor disagreement or for no apparent reasons at all sometimes.


Now me:


Worst offence was sending a single flirtatious text to a former colleague. She checked my phone.


Did get very angry with her on several occasions and did some shouting. Never made personal remarks to her but did was out of control verbally. I will add that it was almost always the result of her criticising me in some way and ( I know now) unacknowledged hurt about the way she had treated me on some occasions listed above.


For months I blamed myself (and hated myself) because I loved her and did not want to lose her. Even if in the end I was out of solutions as to how to fix it (it was always up to me to fix it you see)


Trouble is, in most cases she was charming and nice and considerate. She had a great brain and was good to others. She didn’t do a lot of the stuff the abuser is supposed to do.

So what gives? Thoughts welcome.
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Old 26th June 2014, 6:27 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by siochana View Post
Just a quick one that I would love feedback on.


Iím one year out since BU, about four months NC.


I still think of her daily and although the worst has passed regularly get the anger and the depression.


One thing that is weighing on my mind is whether or not she was abusive towards me. Iíve read the info about signs/narcissists/ BPD etc. but Iím still not sure. Letís just deal with her actions and then mine. During the course of a three year relationship this is a list of her worst behaviours. Bear in mind that alcohol was usually involved


Following an argument, threw my clothes out the window of our first floor apartment.


Slapped me hard across the face on two separate occasions.


Ripped up a book I had got as a present and threw all over the garden


Packed her bags and stormed out two or three times only to return a few days later after I had accepted that it was my fault and that she should come back


Got drunk and told friends of mine I was beating her up (I wasnít)


Broke stuff in the apartment, sprayed shaving cream on my suits


Broke up with me and then proceeded to blame me for it (even months later) what is up with that? As in I gave you so many chances, youíre arrogant, I deserve better.


Stormed out of bars and restaurants on foot of minor disagreement or for no apparent reasons at all sometimes.


Now me:


Worst offence was sending a single flirtatious text to a former colleague. She checked my phone.


Did get very angry with her on several occasions and did some shouting. Never made personal remarks to her but did was out of control verbally. I will add that it was almost always the result of her criticising me in some way and ( I know now) unacknowledged hurt about the way she had treated me on some occasions listed above.


For months I blamed myself (and hated myself) because I loved her and did not want to lose her. Even if in the end I was out of solutions as to how to fix it (it was always up to me to fix it you see)


Trouble is, in most cases she was charming and nice and considerate. She had a great brain and was good to others. She didnít do a lot of the stuff the abuser is supposed to do.

So what gives? Thoughts welcome.


The bolded part might offer a big clue.

Abusers don't necessarily follow instruction manuals. Whatever they're supposed to do.......
but after a year of thinking it over, I'd say some of the things on your list should make it rather obvious.
Pretty solid incompatibility.
Storming out of restaurants over nothing at all?
It wasn't nothing at all.

I wouldn't necessarily slap a disorder du jour on her, though.
Whatever her thing was, something about you seriously pissed her off.

A year apart and 4 months NC is on the right track.
I wouldn't waste a lot of time analyzing...............
unless this shows up in your next relationship.
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Old 26th June 2014, 8:11 AM   #3
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The bolded part might offer a big clue.

Abusers don't necessarily follow instruction manuals. Whatever they're supposed to do.......
but after a year of thinking it over, I'd say some of the things on your list should make it rather obvious.
Pretty solid incompatibility.
Storming out of restaurants over nothing at all?
It wasn't nothing at all.

I wouldn't necessarily slap a disorder du jour on her, though.
Whatever her thing was, something about you seriously pissed her off.

A year apart and 4 months NC is on the right track.
I wouldn't waste a lot of time analyzing...............
unless this shows up in your next relationship.
Thanks LP,

I think you are definitely right. As much as it pains me to admit it ( because she was the first woman I was considering marrying and Im 35) we obviously werent compatible.

However what do you mean by " It wasnt nothing at all" in relation to the restaraunt storm outs?

Also, What do the things on my list make obvious? That she is nuts or that I made her nuts? I suppose what really ****s me up is thinking that I catalysed or caused the behaviour.

On the other hand, I never had this level of madness with other girlfriends but she was the first one I lived with and we both live far away from family so it put a real strain on things.

I would like to forgive her and myself but Im not there yet which is a real pain. A year later I want to be done with it and just think of her with her new boyfriend not thinking about me at all and me stuck and well, I suppose that makes me mad and sad!

Thanks.
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Old 26th June 2014, 5:57 PM   #4
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She doesn't sound BPD or NPD in the least. She sounds like a nasty drunk.
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Old 26th June 2014, 6:28 PM   #5
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I don't know if it was abusive. It certainly wasn't healthy for you & she clearly is in need of anger management.
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Old 26th June 2014, 11:09 PM   #6
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She doesn't sound BPD or NPD in the least. She sounds like a nasty drunk.

Yes, but she was pretty unrepentant about stuff she did while drunk ( actually not even drunk it might have just been a glass or two) when she sobered up.


Imagine: she wanted me to go to anger management classes, and I agreed to, and she was the one doing the bat**** crazy stuff. She had me convinced that I was the problem.


What I was guilty of was blowing my top from time to time. I do not absolve myself completely of this but I will say if a man is constantly being criticised for his performance as a partner a snapping point is reached. Also, I forgave her straight away pretty much for her worst behaviour and that was a big mistake.


Even three months after we broke up ( she left) I was too blame for everything.


I think there is a special kind of abuse if you are with someone who puts all the blame on the shortcomings in a relationship on the other person. When you are in love, you are vulnerable, you can get lost.


I accepted her worldview that I was the problem for far too long. in fact, it was only months after the break up that I realised that no man should ever have his clothes flung out a window or be struck in the face by a woman. there is literally no excuse.


Lesson learned. I think the point is we should all recognise abusive behaviours for what they are and walk away.
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Old 26th June 2014, 11:12 PM   #7
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Most times if you feel as though you've been abused then it's likely you have.
We all have our own boundaries and it sounds like she broke yours.

At this stage I don't really think it matters though. You need to move on from the relationship because it didn't work, trying to figure this out will only bring back more memories you don't need anymore.
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Old 26th June 2014, 11:26 PM   #8
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Most times if you feel as though you've been abused then it's likely you have.
We all have our own boundaries and it sounds like she broke yours.

At this stage I don't really think it matters though. You need to move on from the relationship because it didn't work, trying to figure this out will only bring back more memories you don't need anymore.
I've spent many years working with and advocating for abused women and children. Abuse comes in all forms and it's not unusual for substance abuse to exasperate things.

Consider yourself very fortunate to be free of her. Not many can.

I would also echo Lani when she tells you that it's time to move on and stop trying to analyze an obviously very toxic relationship that happened over a year go.

I'm curious why you feel you needed to bring this up again after all this time?
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Old 27th June 2014, 12:03 AM   #9
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I've spent many years working with and advocating for abused women and children. Abuse comes in all forms and it's not unusual for substance abuse to exasperate things.

Consider yourself very fortunate to be free of her. Not many can.

I would also echo Lani when she tells you that it's time to move on and stop trying to analyze an obviously very toxic relationship that happened over a year go.

I'm curious why you feel you needed to bring this up again after all this time?

Hi Michelle,


I will attempt to give you as honest an answer as I can.


It doesn't feel like "all this time" to me. Its been a year and I think about her and what happened daily. I would prefer if it were not so but it is and I'm working on trying to stop through CBT methods.


The baseline point is that I really loved this woman, like no other before and was intent on marrying her ( even if I had doubts arising from arguments and incidents like the ones described)


It has taken me a year to process things. Its the first time too that someone I really loved left me. I was crushed at her loss and my dreams were crushed.


I suppose the difficulty arises (and perhaps this defies logic) in believing that I should be glad to be free of her. I still, being honest, part of me at least, blame myself for not doing more to do the things that were necessary to save the relationship. I am also disgusted with myself, my sense of manhood offended, by the way I was so forgiving of behaviours that were totally beyond the pale. I am also disgusted that I lost my temper with her and shouted at her. To my credit, I never personally abused her I was, I know now, communicating feelings of hurt and fear arising from her behaviour and the situation in general, that at the time I did not understand. I didn't have the prescence of mind to say: stop, you are hurting me and its not fair on me. Instead, every time she cried, I blamed myself and thought about what I must have done to cause it.


In other words, I spent a long time during the relationship and afterwards blaming myself for our failings as a couple. It took a massive toll on me. I didn't tell anyone about the worse excesses of her behaviour until long after we broke up. I realised then, that I had been traumatised by these events but at the time, like a good stoic man, refused to acknowledge to myself that I had been hurt and was hurting. I didn't understand what was happening to me which precipitated the anger when it arose.


I foolishly sent her love letters to get her back. I begged. For a few months on and off. When, after about 6 months and therapy I realised that I shouldn't have been humiliated by having her storm out of a restaurant I brought her to on Valentine's day for example, I sent her some emails criticising her for the abuse. I also told her mother, who had texted me a few times, about the fact that she had told friends of mine I was beating her up. My friends only told me about that after the break up. It might have been ill advised but it was my way of saying that I realise now what you did was very wrong and you should too. You shouldn't treat a decent man like that.


She is with a new guy now and I often wonder if she does the same to him. Does she treat him like that? Will he ever have to pick his clothes out of a flower bed at 1 in the morning.


The thing is ( the thought I have most trouble with) is that she only behaved that way because it was me and that the guy she is with now never pushes her buttons like that.


Do you think this is credible?


Thanks.


And yes, slowly but surely, day by day, I am healing. But I analyse stuff for a living so doing so in respect of my personal life is, unfortunately, a personality trait.
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Old 27th June 2014, 12:34 AM   #10
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Hi Michelle,


I will attempt to give you as honest an answer as I can.


It doesn't feel like "all this time" to me. Its been a year and I think about her and what happened daily. I would prefer if it were not so but it is and I'm working on trying to stop through CBT methods.


The baseline point is that I really loved this woman, like no other before and was intent on marrying her ( even if I had doubts arising from arguments and incidents like the ones described)


It has taken me a year to process things. Its the first time too that someone I really loved left me. I was crushed at her loss and my dreams were crushed.


I suppose the difficulty arises (and perhaps this defies logic) in believing that I should be glad to be free of her. I still, being honest, part of me at least, blame myself for not doing more to do the things that were necessary to save the relationship. I am also disgusted with myself, my sense of manhood offended, by the way I was so forgiving of behaviours that were totally beyond the pale. I am also disgusted that I lost my temper with her and shouted at her. To my credit, I never personally abused her I was, I know now, communicating feelings of hurt and fear arising from her behaviour and the situation in general, that at the time I did not understand. I didn't have the prescence of mind to say: stop, you are hurting me and its not fair on me. Instead, every time she cried, I blamed myself and thought about what I must have done to cause it.


In other words, I spent a long time during the relationship and afterwards blaming myself for our failings as a couple. It took a massive toll on me. I didn't tell anyone about the worse excesses of her behaviour until long after we broke up. I realised then, that I had been traumatised by these events but at the time, like a good stoic man, refused to acknowledge to myself that I had been hurt and was hurting. I didn't understand what was happening to me which precipitated the anger when it arose.


I foolishly sent her love letters to get her back. I begged. For a few months on and off. When, after about 6 months and therapy I realised that I shouldn't have been humiliated by having her storm out of a restaurant I brought her to on Valentine's day for example, I sent her some emails criticising her for the abuse. I also told her mother, who had texted me a few times, about the fact that she had told friends of mine I was beating her up. My friends only told me about that after the break up. It might have been ill advised but it was my way of saying that I realise now what you did was very wrong and you should too. You shouldn't treat a decent man like that.


She is with a new guy now and I often wonder if she does the same to him. Does she treat him like that? Will he ever have to pick his clothes out of a flower bed at 1 in the morning.


The thing is ( the thought I have most trouble with) is that she only behaved that way because it was me and that the guy she is with now never pushes her buttons like that.


Do you think this is credible?


Thanks.


And yes, slowly but surely, day by day, I am healing. But I analyse stuff for a living so doing so in respect of my personal life is, unfortunately, a personality trait.
Sweetie, this is CLASSIC victim mentality. I know the tables are turned where it's the woman abusing the man but it doesn't change the fact that she was over the top abusive.

I've seen this scenario literally thousands of times where the victim, despite how horribly their partners treated them, remained steadfastly in love and loyal and forever made excuses or justified their partner's every inappropriate behavior. It is also VERY common for victims to blame themselves for their partners behavior. You're not that special in this department I'm afraid.

All of this is extremely toxic and very damaged thinking fueled by an equally toxic and damaged abuser.

You have to come to a point where you sincerely understand that whatever was or is going on with your ex is HER problem and NOT yours. How she treated you or how she behaved in your presence has NOTHING to do with you and everything to do with her own demons she's clearly struggling to slay.

It's fine to have empathy and compassion for her because you still care about her as a human being but to sit around and continually torture yourself into thinking that you somehow brought out the worst in her is COMPLETELY UNTRUE!!! Please believe when I say that.

I know it's easy for me to scribble down a bunch of words mirroring back to you what's happening and hoping something I say will stick or motivate you into believing that the reality you THINK is real isn't real at all. It's not easy and I understand this.

You mentioned that you had some therapy which helped you come to some realizations but I'm curious what else your therapist has been advising you? Do they think she was abusive or that you were a victim of domestic/relationship abuse? Are you still going to therapy?
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Old 27th June 2014, 12:44 AM   #11
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Yes, she was highly abusive, and has issues with alcohol. Be glad she's gone, because it would never have gotten any better. People don't change.
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Old 27th June 2014, 1:18 AM   #12
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Sounds like my last ex, but she is an alcoholic and has diagnosed BPD with narcissistic traits. What you went through is nothing compared to what I went through. Be glad you are done with her.
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Old 27th June 2014, 1:55 AM   #13
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Sweetie, this is CLASSIC victim mentality. I know the tables are turned where it's the woman abusing the man but it doesn't change the fact that she was over the top abusive.

I've seen this scenario literally thousands of times where the victim, despite how horribly their partners treated them, remained steadfastly in love and loyal and forever made excuses or justified their partner's every inappropriate behavior. It is also VERY common for victims to blame themselves for their partners behavior. You're not that special in this department I'm afraid.

All of this is extremely toxic and very damaged thinking fueled by an equally toxic and damaged abuser.

You have to come to a point where you sincerely understand that whatever was or is going on with your ex is HER problem and NOT yours. How she treated you or how she behaved in your presence has NOTHING to do with you and everything to do with her own demons she's clearly struggling to slay.

It's fine to have empathy and compassion for her because you still care about her as a human being but to sit around and continually torture yourself into thinking that you somehow brought out the worst in her is COMPLETELY UNTRUE!!! Please believe when I say that.

I know it's easy for me to scribble down a bunch of words mirroring back to you what's happening and hoping something I say will stick or motivate you into believing that the reality you THINK is real isn't real at all. It's not easy and I understand this.

You mentioned that you had some therapy which helped you come to some realizations but I'm curious what else your therapist has been advising you? Do they think she was abusive or that you were a victim of domestic/relationship abuse? Are you still going to therapy?

Hi Michelle,


Thank you for taking he time to write that post. Your analysis comforts me.


The therapist I saw was a very kind woman who would frequently allow us to run as much as 10 or 15 minutes over time to continue our discussion.


I think she was more interested in helping me move through the grieving process than classifying me as a victim of abuse. Keep the focus on me kind of thing. She also said a few times that in a relationship its always two people contributing to all that is good and ill about it.


She did say that I didn't have enough self respect in the relationship and that I allowed core personal boundaries to be breached and that not allowing that to happen again should be my key lesson going forward.


I would be interested to know, in your opinion, if you think she will behave like that again. Part of me thinks yes, part of me thinks no: its only together that she reacted, she was the potassium and I was the water kind of thing.


thanks again.


And thanks to other posters who have contributed.
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Old 27th June 2014, 9:14 AM   #14
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She just sounds like a spoiled princess. Girls are sometimes raised to believe they can act like that because the man is supposed to be man enough to STOP her. You didn't. The more you accepted, the more outrageous she became.

Now let's talk about why you accepted it, and why you then chose to resort to yelling. Have you read No More Mr Nice Guy? Get it.
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Old 27th June 2014, 12:02 PM   #15
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I think this is probably a form of the abuse. She did slap you and that is abuse. You should write all this down and when you feel you are starting to forget the bad and miss her, pull it out and read it. I do this for my ex and it helps me.
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