Jump to content

Beginning of the end


Recommended Posts

So today it was the last straw, I asked my husband to move out so we seperate for a while. I don’t know if this will become permanent but I’m looking at all option definitely preparing myself for a long divorce.

 

We’ve had money issues from the beginning. I bought a house for us with my own money and we pay the mortgage together. But for the entire time we’ve being together he has been terrible with his spending, in the past year his expenses have consistently exceeded his income and this resulted in us dwindling our savings from 25k (mostly mine) down to zero. I promised myself that I’d keep trying to make this marriage work until we were flat broke then I can’t do it anymore. Not when we are faced with possibly not being able to afford our mortgage.

 

We have a young child (2 yr old) and that’s what made it the decision to seperate so much more difficult. He is a great father in terms of caring for our son.

 

There has been financial infidelity from him, he has hid huge debts from me. Lots of other. Large sums of money gone with no explanation, or he came up with explanations that just made no sense to me.

 

I still love him and he loves me but I can’t be with someone that is making us broke and driving out family into the ground financially.

 

We just celebrated our 2 year wedding anniversary ( dated another 2 years before that) and we barely made it. On our anniversary he promised me change and said he will never leave me as he loves me too much. But he has promised me many many things over the years and nothing has being realised. I’m forced to face the reality that he is all talk and no action. I kept hoping for 2 years that things would get better like he promised but it never did. We got poorer n poorer.

 

I have tried to leave him a couple of times but it was too painful and I came back within a day. And I think because of that it’s given him the impression that I will always come back. It is very hard to leave him I’ll admit, his being my everything since we met and I can’t imagine life without him, I can but it is just misery.

 

I hope that by asking him to move out and sticking with it for a while, that he will finally realise what he is potentially losing - his wife and his son and his family unit. And maybe it will finally prompt him to make the change He needs.

 

He has no self control with money and can’t exercise any type of discipline. So I can’t set him a budget and expect him to stick to it, ever, not once. He spends thousands of dollars just on himself every month. I pay all the bills for the house hold.

 

So I guess I’m just looking for support and any type of advice. I don’t know if this relationship is even worth saving. But at the same time I love him and want us to work and want us to keep our family unit together.

 

Nothing I’ve experienced in my life has ever compared to this pain of potentially losing my lil family. I just don’t even know how to cope with it

Link to post
Share on other sites
Blind-Sided

I'm very sorry to hear all of this, and unfortunately, I have nowhere to even start on the issue. Love should be enough, but someone who is being secretive, and hiding a serious issue puts the rest of the family in harms way. All I can do is hope someone else has more experience with this who can help.

 

 

God bless.

Link to post
Share on other sites

My xH was financially irresponsible. I had to be the adult in the relationship and manage our finances, including having conversations every few months about his spending habits. He would do ok for a while but always returned to the irresponsible behavior. It was a constant stress in our marriage.

 

We divorced ultimately (not simply because of finances) and he immediately plunged himself back into credit debt and a bad credit rating. He enjoyed being financially secure while we were married, but that experience wasn't enough to make him be responsible when he was on his own again and had no one to manage things for him.

 

So my (possibly biased) opinion is that people rarely change their bad habits and irresponsible behavior. So the decision you have to make is are you willing to deal with the status quo (financial instability and insecurity) for the rest of your life.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, I hope that house is in YOUR name. And I hope you kept receipts.

 

Yes, you'll be better off without him. The good news is you can INSIST he take joint custody of the child so that you can work and have a social life. If you don't do that, you will regret it. Guys often try to leverage a better divorce deal by threatening to take the child some way and mothers get so emotional they fall for it and give in. You can circumvent all that by insisting up front he take joint custody -- because he's great with the kids, so that's perfect! You can work and have three evenings after work to yourself to do whatever you want. Don't settle for less. Plus if he has joint custody, he will be responsible for buying stuff when they're with him. And it won't be your problem when he goes bankrupt.

Link to post
Share on other sites
mark clemson

Yeah, it's too bad. Some people have mental "blind spots" like that and it's hard to know sometimes going in, especially if they won't own up to it.

 

Wonder what the thousands that disappeared went to? :( I guess it won't matter too much soon.

Link to post
Share on other sites
He has no self control with money and can’t exercise any type of discipline. So I can’t set him a budget and expect him to stick to it, ever, not once. He spends thousands of dollars just on himself every month. I pay all the bills for the house hold.

 

Really not a financial issue, though I get that's where the symptoms lie. The roots are in self-esteem, impulse control and other neurotic and self-destructive behaviors.

 

Has he ever spoken to a counselor or therapist about this?

 

Mr. Lucky

Link to post
Share on other sites
Really not a financial issue, though I get that's where the symptoms lie. The roots are in self-esteem, impulse control and other neurotic and self-destructive behaviors.

 

Has he ever spoken to a counselor or therapist about this?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

 

yes, before you ditch your marriage, what about your husband going for some therapy?

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
Really not a financial issue, though I get that's where the symptoms lie. The roots are in self-esteem, impulse control and other neurotic and self-destructive behaviors.

 

Has he ever spoken to a counselor or therapist about this?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

You always give good advice Mr. Lucky

And I think you’ve hit the nail on the head again. At the core of it it’s not a financial issue, he definitely has trouble with impulse control, with being able to plan for the future and doing what he says he will, eg” sure this 2k will last me a month, then 10 days later babe I need more money it’s all gone”

 

I’m curious what you mean by self esteem issues ? He def has some confidence issues as in he thinks I’m too good for him and is very insecure about me having male friends. But I don’t see how self esteem issues manifests into financial irresponsibly?

Link to post
Share on other sites

You have been together for 4 and married for 2 and in that time he has betrayed your trust and spent all your savings...

As it is such a short term relationship, I do not see him getting therapy as being worth it for you.

You could spend years if not decades sorting out his "issues", perhaps even to no avail and in the meantime you become a mental wreck and your child suffers.

Leave him to sort out his problems alone.

Go find a better man to spend your life with, whilst you are still young and relatively unscathed..

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author

Thanks everyone for your replies, I’m abit disappointed that no one thinks this marriage is worth saving. But i understand where you are all coming from, I think I would give the same advice if it wasn’t me.

It’s just hard coz there is so much on the line, right now I have a family a house that’s all one can hope for in life, I should be happy with it. But instead to go n break up that family is just heart breaking for me.

I just wish he would change or that things would change because we have been through a period of out of the ordinary expenses, including debts, renovations and holidays that’s also hitting our back pocket. And hope that once we return to “ ordinary” it will all work out.

 

Regarding therapy - he has seen one provided by work a couple of times, coz when we fought a couple times he has cracked at work and his manager noticed. But it’s not doing us any favours as he has been telling his one sided story to the therapist and he told me her recommendation was to leave me ( I don’t know if that’s true or he is just saying that)

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
You have been together for 4 and married for 2 and in that time he has betrayed your trust and spent all your savings...

As it is such a short term relationship, I do not see him getting therapy as being worth it for you.

You could spend years if not decades sorting out his "issues", perhaps even to no avail and in the meantime you become a mental wreck and your child suffers.

Leave him to sort out his problems alone.

Go find a better man to spend your life with, whilst you are still young and relatively unscathed..

 

Thanks for looking out for me, but I don’t consider 4 years a short term relationship, nor an insignificant one given we have married and had a child together.

I’m not that young ( early 30s) and how is the totally destruction of my family unit and death of a marriage relatively unscathed?

Link to post
Share on other sites
... how is the totally destruction of my family unit and death of a marriage relatively unscathed?

 

It is nothing compared to what could transpire in the future with a man whose spending is out of control, who had you not had 25K in savings and a house, could have rendered you bankrupt and homeless already after spending literally thousands per month on himself...

He is a pathological liar and highly secretive and you are still writing fairy stories in your head regarding this perfect family...

You are in fact shackling yourself and your son, to a huge rock hurtling down into an abyss...

Link to post
Share on other sites

I understand what you mean about your marriage and family being a big deal—it’s the biggest deal. I saw your comment on my post— I have been with my husband for 7 years married for six and two kids. People say all the time I’m lucky this is all happening now while I’m “young” (37) and it’s hard to see it that way.

 

But when you think about how some people here were deceived for 25 years or more, had nothing left when they left, are nearing retirement and facing divorce at the same time....your situation seems so much “easier.” It’s your whole life though and you’re the oldest you’ve ever been so you don’t see it that way.

 

Here’s what I think — it doesn’t sound like there is a lot of good here to build on. If you stay together, financially you will end up in the hole unless something changes. Are you gonna wait to lose your house? I’m fortunate that we have assets to divide still but seeing how much my husband was spending on himself in secret I realize that if we had made less money or this had somehow gone on longer I would be in a bad financial situation. It’s like a runaway train with their dishonesty when it’s been so consistent for so long.

 

I value marriage and family more than anything and this has been completely horrible to go through. I think people here are just acknowledging that the likelihood of change in your situation that will make you feel secure again is low and that you still have a lot of your life ahead to have a financial and even relationship situation that is way better for you. That said, a marriage isn’t something to be discarded lightly. But I wouldn’t have initiated leaving and almost 6 months later I’m so glad I didn’t waste any more time in a marriage that was destroying me in ways I didn’t even see yet. How the kids will do remains to be seen and I’m not totally out yet but I’m hoping that things will continue to improve with time.

 

The anxiety that goes with being lied to is horrible though. And the betrayal. It hurts. Sorry you’re here but hopeful some of this helps?

Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks everyone for your replies, I’m abit disappointed that no one thinks this marriage is worth saving.

 

I like to think most marriages are worth saving, depending on the circumstances. What if you:

 

#1 - demanded marriage counseling or at least therapy for him to determine why he has these financial issues and how to stop these behaviors, and

 

#2 - gave him the ultimatum of taking complete control of the finances, meaning that his income is direct deposited into a joint account that you control, he gets a weekly allowance for gas and necessities, and agrees to attend one or more online financial classes to teach him responsible financial habits (there are plenty of free or low-cost online classes.) This could be a temporary solution until he learns to be more responsible (hopefully.)

 

I cannot imagine he wants to see his marriage fail because of his poor financial habits when there is a way for him to improve and save his marriage and family. I think you can capitalize on that.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I had a longterm relationship with a guy who had similar spending habits and it was a nightmare. We were bringing in good money between the two of us and yet I was constantly juggling bills and payments and we just barely scraped by every month. The more he spent the more frugal I became which made it so unfair to me. He got everything his heart desired while I got nothing because if I spent money too we would have been homeless. This guy was personality disordered and simply would not cooperate with any sort of budget and in the end I left him for numerous reasons but finances was one of the main reasons.

 

If you don't leave your husband and if he want's to save this marriage then he needs to turn over all of the finances to you. His paychecks go directly into an account that only you have access to. You make the budget and pay the bills. You and he agree on the amount of money he needs in his pocket to make it between paydays and you dole it out to him. If there is something extra he wants he has to speak to you first and if you agree that it can fit into the budget then he can have it. It sounds like you would be treating as a child but I actually know several couples where one person handles all of the money and spending because the other person just cannot handle money responsibly. When my uncle got married in his early twenties he let his wife control the money because he knew she would be better at it than him and now 30yrs later they live in a beautiful house, have nice things, have a retirement plan, raised three kids who never had to go without, all because he let his wife manage the money. So don't compromise on this, if he wants to keep his family together then he should willingly turn over his pay to you to manage. Not because he's a child but because he's mature enough and unselfish enough to know that it's for the good of his family.

 

Also I would really want to know where he has been spending that money. Usually when someone is spending thousands of dollars and they have nothing to show for it, it points to some kind of addiction or really bad habit. Could be drugs or gambling or even playing games online and spending on those stupid in app purchases. I have a friend who has a boyfriend who will sometimes spend over a thousand dollars a month on in app purchases. If your husband has an addiction or obsession with something that will have to be addressed as well.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks everyone for your replies, I’m abit disappointed that no one thinks this marriage is worth saving. But i understand where you are all coming from, I think I would give the same advice if it wasn’t me.

 

There are often two schools of thoughts here.

 

"Realists" tend to look at the practical side, so they say it doesn't matter why your husband does these things to damage your marriage, it's enough that the issues simply exist. They're often quick to suggest divorce.

 

"Believers" look at marriage as a commitment that requires both partners do their utmost to make things work, sometimes in the face of substantial adversity caused by a damaged, self-absorbed or negligent spouse. On my better days, I tend to be in this camp.

 

The good news is you can pick and choose things from both sides. No right or wrong, only what works for you.

 

I’m curious what you mean by self esteem issues ? He def has some confidence issues as in he thinks I’m too good for him and is very insecure about me having male friends. But I don’t see how self esteem issues manifests into financial irresponsibly?

 

Low self-esteem and the inner lack of validation and belief creates a hole that people attempt to fill with all sorts of things. Substance abuse, infidelity and financial recklessness are fairly common results, with the failures involved simply reinforcing what the person already believes - a lack of worth.

 

Unless your husband can break this cycle, hard to see how things could get better...

 

Mr. Lucky

Link to post
Share on other sites

There’s just such a big difference between being bad with money (impulse buys, not sticking to a budget, not paying bills on time) and keeping secrets about money. I just have to think with all that money unaccounted for there is something else he’s keeping from you— an affair, addiction, habit, etc.

 

I am a believer in marriage as a commitment and I have gone to great lengths to save mine but if there isn’t honesty from both parties, and the dishonesty is going so far as to cost you and your child your financial security that’s huge. Maybe he can fix this but at this point he’s going to have to put in a ton of effort and it doesn’t seem like he wants to.

 

Another thing—I did the same as you where I have gone without for years because of this money confusion. We lived in a mansion basically, drive expensive cars, have substantial retirement savings. And I didn’t buy things like shoes and undergarments for myself to save money because there was always this uncertainty from the lies. It’s one of the things I’m so excited to be able to leave behind after this relationship.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
There’s just such a big difference between being bad with money (impulse buys, not sticking to a budget, not paying bills on time) and keeping secrets about money. I just have to think with all that money unaccounted for there is something else he’s keeping from you— an affair, addiction, habit, etc.

 

I am a believer in marriage as a commitment and I have gone to great lengths to save mine but if there isn’t honesty from both parties, and the dishonesty is going so far as to cost you and your child your financial security that’s huge. Maybe he can fix this but at this point he’s going to have to put in a ton of effort and it doesn’t seem like he wants to.

 

Another thing—I did the same as you where I have gone without for years because of this money confusion. We lived in a mansion basically, drive expensive cars, have substantial retirement savings. And I didn’t buy things like shoes and undergarments for myself to save money because there was always this uncertainty from the lies. It’s one of the things I’m so excited to be able to leave behind after this relationship.

 

I know it’s the possible dishonesty that I’m worried about most too. In the beginning when he was spending heaps we tried heaps of things including asking him to list out all his expenses everyday. We did that for about a week. I feel he was more honest back then and willing to try diff ways. But now he says the only way we can work is if we seperate accounts entirely coz I’m so controlling. Which is fine by me except the fact he has not shown me once that he can manage his own money. His mom managed all his money before we met, he was 32 yo. That shoulda been a huge red flag for me.

Anyway easier this year he told me he had being hiding a 25k debt from me and paying it off bit by bit in secret that’s where the money went. He seemed genuine and said the secret weighed on him so much but he didn’t want to worry me about it. We paid that debt off in lump sum last month.

 

But this month again he spent 2k in 10 days and tells me it’s nothing out of the ordinary that he spent it on and I just can’t believe it. Unless he comes clean about this I don’t think there’s anyway we can reconcile. He has an addictive personality and I suspect he could be using drugs recreationally.

 

Anyway I’m starting to feel like this is really over and there is no hope. He hasn’t made any attempt to reconcile with me yet either.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Anyway easier this year he told me he had being hiding a 25k debt from me

 

We paid that debt off in lump sum last month.

 

His debt and you paid it off, hopefully you now see how enabling that is. Addiction needs co-dependency to thrive, a lesson we all learn the hard way.

 

I guess the good news, if any exists, is you now have a clear idea of the changes needed were your marriage ever to get back on track...

 

Mr. Lucky

Link to post
Share on other sites
testmeasure

I have an alternative idea.

 

I hear you when you say he is a great father.

 

There might be a way to force the issue. It's called a postnup. It's like a prenup but agreed to after being married. It allows you to separate finances going forward without getting divorced. It's much, much cheaper than a divorce.

 

If he won't agree to a postnup to separate finances, that shows his true nature. And, you need to divorce. In my opinion, you being deceived and drained of resources isn't really in the best long term interest of the child.

 

Of course, how well this would work, how enforceable it would be depends not just on what state, but on what county you live in. So advice of a local attorney is critical.

 

I'm not an attorney or professional on this topic. But, I had a prenup, then a postnup, then a divorce.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
His debt and you paid it off, hopefully you now see how enabling that is. Addiction needs co-dependency to thrive, a lesson we all learn the hard way.

 

I guess the good news, if any exists, is you now have a clear idea of the changes needed were your marriage ever to get back on track...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Yeh I can see that definitely as enabling behaviour and I prob shouldn’t have done it. But the reason I did was because he said the deb collectors were constantly threatening default which will go on his credit file, his credit is bad enough as it is. And we planned to buy another house and he was worried he was gonna be the reason we get rejected for a loan.

 

 

It made sense at the time, funny how one min you had all these shared hopes and dreams together then next it’s all down the drain.

 

I know the changes needed, I just don’t know how to get him to commit to those changes.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author

This is my own fault - I told him we should seperate for a while , and he took that at its word. But in my head I was done not knowing how to go on, so I told my parents we are getting a divorce, now they are totally onboard with this and urging me everyday to get it going. My dad is already constructing a divorce plan so we can get full custody on my son.

 

Mean while me and my husband didn’t talk for two days, I thought he had given up and was done. And today I msg him and he says we need a few weeks apart but he is under the impression we are using this time to reflect and work on our issues and not at the point of divorce yet.

 

What a mess I have made out of this.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
I have an alternative idea.

 

I hear you when you say he is a great father.

 

There might be a way to force the issue. It's called a postnup. It's like a prenup but agreed to after being married. It allows you to separate finances going forward without getting divorced. It's much, much cheaper than a divorce.

 

If he won't agree to a postnup to separate finances, that shows his true nature. And, you need to divorce. In my opinion, you being deceived and drained of resources isn't really in the best long term interest of the child.

 

Of course, how well this would work, how enforceable it would be depends not just on what state, but on what county you live in. So advice of a local attorney is critical.

 

I'm not an attorney or professional on this topic. But, I had a prenup, then a postnup, then a divorce.

 

My parents wanted him a sign a prenup but he refused. He got so offended that they are thinking of th end of the marriage before we even married. I doubt he will sign a post nup. We don’t have that much money anyway it’s prob not worth it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
I had a longterm relationship with a guy who had similar spending habits and it was a nightmare. We were bringing in good money between the two of us and yet I was constantly juggling bills and payments and we just barely scraped by every month. The more he spent the more frugal I became which made it so unfair to me. He got everything his heart desired while I got nothing because if I spent money too we would have been homeless. This guy was personality disordered and simply would not cooperate with any sort of budget and in the end I left him for numerous reasons but finances was one of the main reasons.

 

If you don't leave your husband and if he want's to save this marriage then he needs to turn over all of the finances to you. His paychecks go directly into an account that only you have access to. You make the budget and pay the bills. You and he agree on the amount of money he needs in his pocket to make it between paydays and you dole it out to him. If there is something extra he wants he has to speak to you first and if you agree that it can fit into the budget then he can have it. It sounds like you would be treating as a child but I actually know several couples where one person handles all of the money and spending because the other person just cannot handle money responsibly. When my uncle got married in his early twenties he let his wife control the money because he knew she would be better at it than him and now 30yrs later they live in a beautiful house, have nice things, have a retirement plan, raised three kids who never had to go without, all because he let his wife manage the money. So don't compromise on this, if he wants to keep his family together then he should willingly turn over his pay to you to manage. Not because he's a child but because he's mature enough and unselfish enough to know that it's for the good of his family.

 

Also I would really want to know where he has been spending that money. Usually when someone is spending thousands of dollars and they have nothing to show for it, it points to some kind of addiction or really bad habit. Could be drugs or gambling or even playing games online and spending on those stupid in app purchases. I have a friend who has a boyfriend who will sometimes spend over a thousand dollars a month on in app purchases. If your husband has an addiction or obsession with something that will have to be addressed as well.

 

Your ex bf sounds exactly like my husband down to a Tee. Especially the inability to adhere to any sort of budget. It’s mind boggling for people like us that can manage money easily, it’s not rocket science. I think either they missing a screw in the head or they were brought up in a completely diff way that never taught them anything about managing finances. I know my husbands mom was the worst enabler and gave him money whenever he needed, not just money, gave him anything period that he needed. I’m still not happy with her to this day, she basically did him a services and ruined his life.

 

But unfortunately my husband I don’t think will agree to giving all money to me to manage. Quite the opposite he wants our finances completely seperate coz his sick of me commenting what’s this expense for, what’s that for? Why u spend so much?

 

I can’t believe someone would spend thousand on apps. But my husband Ispends a lot on buying video games, recreational drug use which he claims to have stopped and some gambling, oh and a lot of smoking :( almost nothing on clothes and food, that’s where I spend my money.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Author
I like to think most marriages are worth saving, depending on the circumstances. What if you:

 

#1 - demanded marriage counseling or at least therapy for him to determine why he has these financial issues and how to stop these behaviors, and

 

#2 - gave him the ultimatum of taking complete control of the finances, meaning that his income is direct deposited into a joint account that you control, he gets a weekly allowance for gas and necessities, and agrees to attend one or more online financial classes to teach him responsible financial habits (there are plenty of free or low-cost online classes.) This could be a temporary solution until he learns to be more responsible (hopefully.)

 

I cannot imagine he wants to see his marriage fail because of his poor financial habits when there is a way for him to improve and save his marriage and family. I think you can capitalize on that.

 

I agree with those 2 points, will try to set up marriage counselling.

Point 2 if I can take complete control of finances then it would be best, but I don’t know if he will agree. He always feels restricted enough.

Link to post
Share on other sites
×
×
  • Create New...