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Houston, We Don't Have Contact!


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For some reason or another my other thread has been closed. I don'tknow if it was due to time restrictions, length or something else. So I'm going to continue it with my last posting from the "Houston, We Have Contact" thread and see if I can keep it going. So here is the last post from that thread:

 

@hearttopieces

 

Thanks for the reply. I'm glad you took the time to read through the thread as I think there's just a ton of really great advice throughout, not just for me but for anyone willing to take the time to sit down and get through it. As for more men being like me, well, thank you for the compliment. I'm glad they aren't, this way I stand out a bit ;)

 

Ya know, perspective is a very intriguing thing. It really is. I think the poster Graceful said it best in one of her more recent entries. We all have a unique camera lens that we look through. We all see the world through our own specific and unique eye. In literature they call this a "meaning creation device". How you see something is not how another sees it. The goal in literature is to see it how the author sees it but he/she also realizes that the reader will add their own perspective to it based on the reader's own life experiences. All very interesting things to think about especially on a forum like this. No matter what you think or how you see something, someone else is going to see something differently. It's always a good thing to remember especially when it comes to your significant other (or ex significant other as the case may be).

 

To address your points...

 

She definitely did have me wrapped around her finger. I hope it was in a good way. I would have done anything for her (anything within my power anyway). Me not being able to move in with her as scheduled was one of the hardest decisions I've ever had to make in my life but I felt I had no choice. I felt I had to stay close to home for my mom's sake and as hard as that decision was I do not regret it. I knew the risk involved. Did I think it would end 'us'? To be honest, no. I knew it would not be easy but I thought we could get past it. I was wrong. I misjudged our strength as a couple, I suppose.

 

In regards to her not asking about my mom... I'm gonna giver her a pass on that. Sure, it seems like a no-brainer. She probably should have but I know she was nervous to see me. She even told me so. I think she was 'involved' in what was going on at the table. Plus, she had asked about her a week or so before when we spoke on the telephone. So I'll give her a pass. I mean, considering what a huge deal it is to me and my life you THINK she would have explored it a bit. I dunno. It's a pass with an asterisk, I suppose.

 

She is an initiator. She is prideful. She is confident. But she also loves me very much. I think it was more our compatibility that was in question when all was said and done. I approached that dinner with an open mind and heart. I mostly went with my instincts but made sure to remain calm. If I got the inkling that she was leaning towards reconciliation I think I wouldn't be posting this right now. If I felt that there was more 'hope' from the meeting then I think I would have felt it. It didn't feel it. I didn't feel like she wanted me to kiss her. She may have. I don't know. All I know is what I felt and what I felt was uncertainty.

 

One thing that was said at dinner in regards to her contacting me was basically "Life is too short". She wanted to know how I was. She wanted to see me. The reasons are her own. Only she knows what they were for sure. I think if she wanted to get into contact with me again that she would do so for that same reason. Life is too short not to. And she is someone who does not wait on what she wants. Part of my confusion was that she DID reach out. She texted, she called, she emailed. But I needed the reasons to be clearer as to why she did so. And I didn't want to give it meaning that wasn't there. I need her to show me why I was at dinner with her that night and she never really did. So, here I sit.

 

I did find the "branch talk" as a big deal. She invited me to dinner. It was her forum. I went along with it, we had a good time, we talked and laughed and everything in between. When she had her shot to tell me something significant about 'us' she blew it. She's not one to pull any punches. If she was thinking about trying to rekindle something I think she would have at least hinted at it. She would have made it known one way or another. She did not do this. This is all I have to go on so this is exactly what I am going on. It's too late in the game for guessing. We've been through too much. Me asking her what she was thinking was an open ended question that she could have done anything with. She chose to use it to tell me about her being a branch or a leaf or whatever the hell she said. Hey, that washer choice. That was what she decided to voice. That's what I have to accept out of respect for her and her decision. And I only told her "We don't have to talk about this now" out of sheer respect for the situation. We were at dinner, in a public place. This was not the setting for that particular conversation as I saw that she was beginning to get upset. I was even holding her hands at the dinner table. She knew I was there for her. She knows I love her. There's no question about that. If she felt the need to continue that conversation at another time, well, it either would have happened, will happen or won't happen. I can't wait for it. I think she knows it CAN happen, though.

 

I would agree with you that people sometimes mirror their company. It's a legitimate point. But when I said "So, what have you been thinking", I opened the door. The facade was removed. I rolled out the red carpet for her. I let down my guard for a second and so did she. What she said, though, was not inviting, as I've mentioned. So I don't think she felt intimidated or stunted because I was relaxed or aloof. I lowered my guard for her. For HER. She just didn't respond like I thought she might. Maybe she responded with exactly what she was feeling. That's fine. She's allowed. I wouldn't want her to say anything untrue anyway. I love her too much for her to lie to me and tell me something I want to hear.

 

As far as her thinking I do not ever want to see her again... I dunno. Our dinner went well as far as dinners go. There was a lot of affection, physically (hugging, holding hands, etc) and emotionally. There were no bad feelings there. I think she if she wanted to get into contact with me she would feel okay in doing so. After all, last time she contacted me look what happened - we ended up texting, talking and then having dinner together. If that's not positive reinforcement for her to contact me then I don't know what is. She may have mixed feelings about the way the night ended. Maybe she did want me to kiss her. But wanting a kiss isn't enough to rekindle something. She has to want a lot more than that. And honestly, i don't think she's there yet. She may never be there. I have no clue. I may never get there either. I know I love her but as far as us reconciling... well, it would take a lot of work.

 

So there you have it. Perspective. It means everything. I appreciate yours. You certainly gave me a lot to think about. In the end, though, I have to go with what I think since I'm closest to the situation. Not everything I said is easy for me to say, you do realize. I'm just trying to be as honest as possible. I don't wan to fool myself into thinking anything that's not there. I'd love your take on my perspective, though. If you disagree please share that with me. If I wasn't interested in everyone's opinions then I wouldn't be posting all of this. The things you said in your post actually helped a lot in that it gave me another way to look at things and weigh them against my own conclusions. Thank you very much. It may not have necessarily "changed" them but I'm positive that they did waver, move, etc. So thank you.

 

You're all really helping me in ways you don't even realize. I hope you know that.

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silvermane187

You are one strong man for not breaking NC. I know a week or two after that dinner I would have gone crazy asking myself what her deal was. You, sir, are an inspiration.

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Thanks, buddy. It's not like I haven't thought about contacting her. I just don't see the point is all.

 

"Hey, thanks for a nice dinner". or

"Had fun!" or

"It was really nice seeing you"

 

These all do nothing for me. They get me nowhere. There's too much history to just send that kind of a text or email. And if I were to call it would just feel awkward. I think she realizes that the lines of communication are open if she wants to talk about something worthwhile. If not, it's NC for me. I don't think she has truly had the time or the space to miss me, regret her decision, feel like I'm gone/unavailable, etc. I think it's essential for her to feel this way for reconciliation to even be a thought. If she doesn't get 'there' then even if we did get back together we'd just end up in the same situation, and neither of us want that. I'm actually happier with NC than with frustrating contact that doesn't get me anywhere, sends mixed signals, indecision, heartache, and everything else that you can imagine.

 

I don't think I am strong as much as I am resolved to be happy. I'm trying to do the things that will make me happy. Contacting her, as much as it can be tempting, would not get me there. It would just make me miserable. I'll only entertain contact for the right reasons and 99% of the reasons for contact seem wrong (at this point anyway).

 

But thanks for the confidence, silvermane. I really appreciate it. It helps me to keep my resolve.

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At 27 pages and nearly 400 posts, I think the mod felt it had probably run its course. Your final post in the thread seemed to indicate some form of...'closure'.... maybe better termed as 'the end of a chapter'.....? ;)

I have to say, other than threads actually begun and approved by Admin, it was probably one of the longest I've ever seen on here.

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silvermane187

Texts like you listed come accross as mind games to me, I would have been blunt and to the point as a way to try and get the circular thoughts driving me crazy out of my head. If I were in your shoes after that dinner I would have sent something along the lines of "so what was the point of that?" and taken it from there, asking all the hard questions. But you're right, any contact initiated on your part would probably only set you back. I wish I had that same resolve during the first few months of my b/u, I would have saved myself a lot of pain. Lesson learned.

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At 27 pages and nearly 400 posts, I think the mod felt it had probably run its course. Your final post in the thread seemed to indicate some form of...'closure'.... maybe better termed as 'the end of a chapter'.....? ;).

 

Oh come on! I was just getting warmed up! :laugh:

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Texts like you listed come accross as mind games to me, I would have been blunt and to the point as a way to try and get the circular thoughts driving me crazy out of my head. If I were in your shoes after that dinner I would have sent something along the lines of "so what was the point of that?" and taken it from there, asking all the hard questions. But you're right, any contact initiated on your part would probably only set you back. I wish I had that same resolve during the first few months of my b/u, I would have saved myself a lot of pain. Lesson learned.

 

Mind games, really? Hm. If I were to send her a text or email like that it would have been genuine, I think. The only part of it that wouldn't be 100% genuine is that I'd obviously be fishing for a reply. A reply that would most probably leave me feeling dissatisfied, which is one of the many reasons I decided to send nothing at all. Like I said initially, she had every opportunity to tell me why we were sitting there at dinner. Since she didn't then there really WASN'T a specific reason why we were dining with one another. And that was enough for me. Sometimes what you don't say is as important as what you do say. And since she broke if off with me I feel that it really is her responsibility to bring up a conversation about 'us'. Since she did not bring it up then all I'm doing is accepting her wishes. All of those 'hard questions', they've been addressed already. Unless something new is brought to the table then there really isn't much to discuss.

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Highly recommended book for you, 1784: "Attached" by Amir Levine and Rachel Heller. I wish everyone on Loveshack would read it (I swear, I am not its author or publicist).

 

The description of secure, effective communication versus insecure game-playing and power-struggling is very helpful and useful. I won't do it justice by just summarizing, and the excerpts online aren't the good parts...but you can order it at the NYPL. Having read all your threads, I really hope you will read the whole book.

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I see you've been pushing that book on a few threads, Leda. I'll see what all your fuss is about and check it out on Amazon. You may want to go back to my previous thread to see my response to your post should you feel like taking the time to address it. If not, as always, thanks for the input.

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silvermane187
Since she didn't then there really WASN'T a specific reason why we were dining with one another. And that was enough for me.Sometimes what you don't say is as important as what you do say. And since she broke if off with me I feel that it really is her responsibility to bring up a conversation about 'us'. Since she did not bring it up then all I'm doing is accepting her wishes. All of those 'hard questions', they've been addressed already. Unless something new is brought to the table then there really isn't much to discuss.

 

Hm...I'll throw some more random thoughts at you. Let me know if these are helpful or not and I will gladly keep my dumb 22 year old mouth shut. :)

 

A part of me (the emotional side that thought this way the first few months after my b/u) wants to say "If you want something you have to go and get it". That you shouldn't worry yourself with WHO brings up the 'us' conversation as long as the discussion happens. I let this side of me take over and it did more harm than good.

 

The other part of me, the logical side, completely agrees with what you and says the old "If you love something let it go, etc" line. I'm beating a dead horse here, but she made her bed. The logical side of my brain would explode trying to accept that there was no reason for the dinner. I'm amazed at your ability to accept that there was no reason for the dinner. You are a better man than I.

 

I hope I'm not throwing any wrenches in your gear box, or simply being annoying with my lack of b/u experience.:o

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@silvermane,

 

I totally understand the emotional wrestling match that goes on after a breakup. I think most people go through it, particularly dumpees but some dumpers do as well. When I was younger I would have been a lot more likely to GO FOR IT and TELL HER HOW YOU FEEL, over and over again. I guess I'm a little older and a little wiser than I was when I was your age. That's no slight on you at all. You may very well be a mature 22 yrs of age. Jesus, I remember being in college and going after this gal the COMPLETELY wrong way. But you live and you learn. I did a lot of maturing in my twenties.

 

ANYWAY... I definitely did struggle with the whole "Why did she want to go to dinner" thing. I did. It's hard not to. Who wouldn't ask themselves that question? I sat with it for a while. I realized that why I wasn't there was actually more important than why I was there. Does that make any sense? And I think that's all I really needed. I thought I could have been there for a shot at reconciling. I wasn't. That, along with some time to digest/accept it, was enough for me.

 

That's where I am right now. It doesn't mean she might not want to discuss it in the future. It doesn't mean she will. The future is unwritten and I am an open kind of a guy. So we'll see what happens. I just know that I'm not forcing anything. Everything I used to wish she would realize or say or feel... she has to come to all on her own. Me asking or prodding or begging or influencing or what have you, it won't do either of us any good. I am leaving this alone. It does not need my influence any longer. I've let go of it. I realize that there's nothing left to say. She knows how I feel.

 

Elvis has left the building!

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confused1989

I tried to keep up with your old thread (caught most of it I think) and I just want to say that how you're dealing with things is inspiring. I'm having a hard time finding the closure that I need (well, want) in my relationship. I thought I had it, but I'm realizing now that it wasn't enough closure for me. And I feel a bit silly because I've been struggling with it for a month or two now, and you were able to move on from the "why did she want to go to dinner" thing so quickly (well, compared to me).

 

I definitely learn a lot from reading your posts and how you handle your situations. Thanks for that!

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1784, I still hope you read that book I recommended!

 

I feel like being discreet on the internet, but my situation changed radically since I read that book last week. (YAY!!!!!!!) (!!!!!!) (!!)

 

I know your situation is very, very different from mine, but I feel the book could help you in the future, and might've been very helpful through this process if you had continued to want to reconcile with your ex.

 

It was reading your reconciliation threads and then the book that helped me so much.

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iceweasel6
1784, I still hope you read that book I recommended!

 

I feel like being discreet on the internet, but my situation changed radically since I read that book last week. (YAY!!!!!!!) (!!!!!!) (!!)

 

I know your situation is very, very different from mine, but I feel the book could help you in the future, and might've been very helpful through this process if you had continued to want to reconcile with your ex.

 

It was reading your reconciliation threads and then the book that helped me so much.

 

I'm interested. Which book is that? (I love self help books).

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It's called "Attached," by Amir Levine and Rachel Heller.

 

Note: my favorite parts weren't in the online excerpts, so get the book at the library or buy it.

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iceweasel6
It's called "Attached," by Amir Levine and Rachel Heller.

 

Note: my favorite parts weren't in the online excerpts, so get the book at the library or buy it.

 

HAHAHAHA.....RU SERIOUS??!!!?? I love that book.

I got it last week. I tried to finish it this weekend but I was too busy. I couldn't put it down. I'm about 60% of the way through.

 

Read post #20 and #31.

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showthread.php?t=275403&page=2

 

If I would have known this before, I probably would not have been broken up with my ex. It's such a good book. But i have to admit, I have been working on personal growth for a couple of months, but with this book, it just solidified everything.

 

Great book. You will have to share how your situation changed.

I'm interested to know.

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Haha!! I'm sure you see why I think everyone on here should read it?

 

I don't want to post too much about my personal situation online...it feels so fragile and new, and I AM still anxious, but, I just found it so easy and liberating to follow the instructions and stop communicating in my Anxious way. Love that book!!!

 

It's a great antidote to all the "make sure he/she doesn't think you're desperate" posts around here. Once I read that about being emotionally brave, wearing your heart on your sleeve, and not waiting for the other person to take initiative, I felt all better.

 

There are a lot of insecure control games advocated around here. I wrote this on other threads:

I personally think No Contact is a great tool for:

--Anyone who, for whatever reason, WANTS to move on and not be with their ex again

--Anyone whose ex was or is physically, verbally, or emotionally abusive in any way, so they HAVE to move on, the way you HAVE to quit drinking if you drink a fifth of bourbon alone every night

--Anyone whose ex is wishy-washy and sends a lot of mixed messages

 

I think it is not necessarily always the best strategy for people who want their exes back, AND:

--their exes are generally straightfoward, honest people and secure communicators...and have left due to ambivalence about the relationship

--the categories "dumper" and "dumpee" aren't as clear-cut and black and white as many posters frame them on LoveShack...and your "dumper"(?) might not know how you feel

 

It should not be used as a game or a manipulation strategy, in my opinion. Manipulation may work to re-attract a toxic person in the short term, or even long term. But heart-on-sleeve emotional bravery and honesty, and clear, secure communication will:

--screen out people who really don't want you, or are toxic or wishy-washy

--feel WAY better

--allow you to connect with someone intimately who is a good match for your real, natural style and likes you the way you are.

 

People in real life get shy, scared, and confused and aren't always great emotional communicators, and some of those same people can still make great partners. They just might handle regretting leaving you by testing the waters and fishing a little, instead of going to your door and begging. That's not always "breadcrumbs," the way it's often framed here--most people look for security and reassurance. If you ignore your "dumper's" contact, in many cases it can keep the desire for reconciliation from even coming out.

 

I personally get desperate sometimes! My mistake, which I've fixed since joining this forum, was trying to hide how I felt and act cool and go all NC (it wasn't to manipulate him back so much as I was too prideful to show him I was desperate and hurting)...The right guys for me care about my beauty, my weird sense of humor, our shared chemistry and love, how it feels to kiss or hold me, our shared adventures, and my big heart. They don't care so much whether---oooh--I manage to hide that I'm upset when I lose someone I love. THAT was actually insecure thinking. I'm never going back there again. NC is great for healing when you know it's over or wish it would be over! Not always the right call if it's salvagable.

I'm so glad I found that book when I did.

 

Some people don't realize they're being controlling. The book was so accurate about my specific behaviors that I was able to immediately change them.

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iceweasel6

Leda,

 

You couldn't be more right. I have secure traits, but I also have avoidant issues and some insecurities. I went NC to work on me, and recenter myself. When I have made true change I will contact her, with honesty, clear and secure communication.

 

It is a great book!!! It literally has helped me grow and make "A-ha" moments more frequent than anything in the past year. I wish that I would have stumbled upon it earlier.

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