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10 year relationship gone, intense pain


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Hello all, my ex-fiance left me at the end of March after she was out nearly 24 hours and went to a concert with her friends from work. We would have been together 10 years in November. We have 3 children together, two girls 3 and 7, and a nearly 10-year-old son that isn't biologically mine (he never knew it). The children were upset and tried contacting her as well but she ignored all of us. By the time she got home my mother was at my house talking to me about it and kind of let her have it, as she started doing this type of behavior with people from work but said it would stop. I started moving some of my stuff out the house and walking it to my mom's house that's 4 houses down. She didn't care and actually called the police on my mom because she wouldn't leave. This had the children crying because they thought they were going to take their Grandma to jail. It was then that I realized she truly didn't want to be with me anymore.

 

The first week or two wasn't so bad because I thought she would come around, as she did so the 2-3 other times she left me in the past. However, this hasn't been the case still. She works 3rd shift at the post office and when we were together she would pick the kids up from school, and fall back asleep when I got home and wanted to sleep until later. A lot of times I'd fall asleep with her for a little. She was always bitchy and moody, however, I dealt with that the entire relationship, but it had gotten worse. She had said that she's been depressed for a while now but never picked her medication up from the doctor. A few weeks after the break up I started noticing her car was never home in the morning so I checked the phone logs and realized that she had been talking to this 41-year-old man named Chris from her past (she's only 28). She use to babysit for this man when she was around 15 or so and he was nearly 30 at the time, and he took advantage of her and had a sexual relationship with him. Once I found out, I confronted her about it and she said it's just someone she talks to because she's single and likes to. However, I knew this was why she didn't come home to sleep anymore.

 

I looked this man up and discovered that he is a violent sex offender (child abuse) and was served 17 years, but did only 10. In addition, he was recently arrested for the possession of meth and a syringe and had a track record of stealing. He has no job, no car, no home, etc. The meth is interesting as she admitted to our mutual friend that she had just tried meth for the first time after Easter. After telling her this, she denied having sex with him and going to his house. However, she thought I was capable of seeing her messages so she eventually stopped caring overnight and justified the sexual abuse. She literally introduced this man to our children overnight and took them out to do family things and stayed at a motel, where the kids seen them sleep together in the same bed. She then would take the kids to the garage he was staying in and he quickly became involved in my children's lives daily. She has been taking the kids and him out to do stuff daily, however, she never had the desire to do this with me that much. She quickly moved him in and now the kids are around him daily. They see them doing sexual stuff all the time and it's tearing me up inside.

 

A few weeks ago I discovered that she took this man inside our children's school to pick them up. I quickly contacted the school and notified them about his sex offender status and they contacted her and said he isn't allowed on school property. Once she found this out, she quickly told our son that he isn't biologically mine as a form of revenge. She said that she would take him to meet his biological dad (who never cared much) and his brother that he had never met. In fact, she tried this before on the previous break up but he and his family weren't interested. This killed me inside as he did not need to know this because of the piece of **** that she is with.

 

I contacted CPS and told them everything and she is rather excited to take the drug test now and said that Chris isn't going anywhere. She has had time to prepare for the test and therefore ready. I'm not quite sure if she continued doing meth after the one time of trying in around Easter. However CPS interviewed the kids yesterday and myself and essentially said that he isn't allowed around the children, however, they really can't do much about it. They could only scare her into not exposing the children around him. They encouraged me to contact a public defender as they legally could.

 

The time she left me before this 7 years ago, we had just discovered that she was pregnant with our first daughter. She left me and then said she was getting an abortion. Eventually, she contacted my mother and pretty much begged to come back. The times that she had left me in the past was different in the sense that she was less independent. Her mother was alive back then and she didn't have a good job. Her mother was battling lung cancer and eventually came to stay at my mother's house with us. She died and years went on and we both went through different jobs and periods of unemployment. She didn't have the resources to get a place and therefore I think that contributed to her not leaving me back then. I applied us both at the post office despite her telling me not to, and she said they wouldn't hire her because she's a high school drop out. I was there briefly and then they hired her on. My mother couldn't handle the kids and she wanted to stay at the post office. I went through a period of unemployment after that as I've also been battling with major anxiety. She financially supported us for quite some time until I got back on with my previous employer. She was fine with me not working then as I could manage all the house related stuff and getting the kids from school. Everything was going good I thought until everything I mentioned above happened. She had got promoted to supervisor, lost a bunch of weight and I think this got to her head over time.

 

I've been wanting to post this for a while now, however, the story is so complex and I've been so depressed. In fact, I'm typing this when I should be sleeping as I have work, but I'm waking up in the middle of the night often. Despite this pain, she has put me through she is on my mind literally 24/7 in a constant loop. I can't figure any of this out and told her right after we broke up I would compromise on anything and asked if we could go to counseling. She, of course, said no, she does not want to talk. She essentially wanted her freedom back she said and "fell out of love". She said that she felt like herself more than ever and does not regret leaving. She said that she had fallen out of love 2 years ago but tried to make it work. She also admitted that she had been lying for 2 years and she had been smoking weed daily. This was one of the sources of arguments with us as I didn't like when she got high. Despite sending her messages/pictures about getting back together, she quickly got with this creep. I'm a mess emotionally from not only the breakup but the cruel stuff she has done with the children. I'm attempting to get into counseling, however, they won't have any open slots for a while. Both of us wasn't perfect, however, I'm dwelling on the stuff I could have changed such as letting her smoke as much as she wanted and other things. However I was never abusive, never hit her, and wanted the best for her and our family. I was always faithful and very honest, however, this got me nowhere. I don't know what to do with myself anymore. I'm not suicidal, however, I often times think about it. It hurts that she quickly moved on with this man and is very content replacing me with him. I told her that I would have literally compromised on anything to make it work. How do I deal with these emotions and moving on? What is the odds that her rebound will last? Why is she choosing him over me?

 

She's essentially repeating her upbringing as her mother didn't have a stable relationship long, her dad was physically abusive and then left, she was raped as a child (she never told her mother), and they were homeless often. Her mother was able to hold a job down despite doing crack. So perhaps this could play a role in her not valuing keeping our family together?

 

Any advice would be appreciated as I'm a mess... We had our Florida vacation coming up in June to look forward to, however, I had to cancel this the other day and lost out on money. I also have a new apartment, but, I'm still sleeping at my mothers 4 houses down from my ex as I'm lonely. Thank you!

Edited by statix
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Holy mother of god I thought I had it bad. Yo at this point she's a lost cause. Even if she came back begging I wouldn't take her back. Get your kids, I urge you to do everything possible to get your kids out of this situation. Sounds silly but do a little YouTubing and search MGTOW. In your situation it might be helpful and give you some insight. I wouldn't say this woman chose a meth addict over you, she's deeply troubled and will probably have to hit rock bottom before she realizes her mistakes. Don't let her drag you down with the kids.

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The Outlaw

At this point in time, there's nothing you, nor anyone can do for her. She's going to have to see for herself before she decides if she wants to get any better, and she's going to have to want it and her alone. Maintain limited contact with her but keep it only at that.

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Why would you stay in something like this.

 

It's just repeat behavior and will continue

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mark clemson

All of the below is just my personal opinion:

 

Sorry that this is such an awful trainwreck. Agree that you should do what is in your power to keep your kids away from this situation.

 

They see them doing sexual stuff all the time and it's tearing me up inside.

 

Was this brought up with CPS? Possibly it could be considered a form of child abuse. If you can somehow document the presence of meth or meth paraphernalia in their presence that may help as well.

 

Despite this pain, she has put me through she is on my mind literally 24/7 in a constant loop.

 

This sounds like limerence. You can research it on Wikipedia and see if you agree. It takes a long time to fade and is emotionally painful but DOES eventually fade. You are definitely in love with the WRONG woman.

 

Once you get some counseling, do what you can to pull your life back together, including getting the kids to a better place, and eventually stop letting your heart rule you with this person. Believe she will NEVER be anything but a horrible trainwreck without serious help that she has no interest in getting. I'm sure part of you just wants the "old" her back but that's unlikely to happen. Even if she does it's MUCH better for you to be detached from her - how can you trust that she won't revert to this again? And remember, if she gets hooked on meth it's likely to be 10 times worse.

 

Get all the support you can as you deal with this. :(

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I recently got ahold of the mother of the victim from the 90s that he sexually abused and she did confirm it was him. She told me the details such as him being around 18-19 at the time and went down orally on her 5-year-old daughter and masturbated on her. They found semen on her leg and a towel that he stuffed in their couch.

 

Despite trying to tell my ex this, she is believing what he told her that he was accused of molesting a 12-year-old and that the mother accused multiple guys of this. I reassured her that he is lying and that this isn't what he got 17 years for and lifetime sex abuse status for.

 

As I said, she is saying he isn't going anywhere, and that she won't leave our kids alone around him and that he isn't allowed to do drugs around the kids.

 

I'm so overwhelmed and still in shock, despite the breakup being 2 months ago. I can't understand why she wants this guy so much and values him more than me. I was a decent boyfriend to her and we have 10 years of memories that she just speaks down on now. He has court May 3rd, and I really hope they arrest him again.

 

It's just surreal that the person you knew for 10 years is capable of this and pretty much wants to go through life without me. We were best friends I thought and had a lot in common besides the weed stuff.

 

I saw her the other day and she has bruises all over her legs, and hickeys all over her neck. She's wanting to do everything with our kids with this man and he's even going to our children's doctors appointments.

 

I'll be reaching out to an attorney tomorrow! How the hell do I switch my mentality from missing what we had, being physically attracted to her, to hating her and truly not wanting her anymore?

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You got to completely move on. It's fine to love her still but what she did isn't acceptable. She's putting your kids around such a person. Your life will be miserable and full of pain and having her back won't fix it. Fix yourself, focus on bettering yourself, limited contact will help. Focus on your children and let that woman go.

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lonelyplanetmoon

OP I feel your pain and can totally relate about your emotions controlling you during this period.

 

Your mind knows she is not doing right by you and the kids but yet you still hang onto that love that once was.

 

I went to counselling and read a bunch of self help books during my break up a couple of years ago. The most important thing I learned was that I was causing my emotions to be strong for the love we HAD. The past was ruling my world. To get out of the funk, you have to forget the past and focus on the present - today. Her actions today do not contain love toward you. Think about all her actions toward you in the most recent present, then your feelings of love will fade.

 

That and time...

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destroyedlife

i understand i really do. but being a third party and reading this, i understand her too. it seems like you living close to your mom is an issue. dont take offense to what im saying, but it seems like she wasnt happy because she was binded by a life of judgement and rules. having your mom live neer you is a huge mistake. letting your mom get involved is even bigger, even if you are right in the situation, dont ever get your mom involved, because shes only going to take your side and that makes you seem like a mamas boy. you complaining that she gets high n smokes weed. why does it bother you so much. because you dont do it? so she cant? were you clingy? it sounds like it , like all you wanted to do was to sleep in bed with her and didnt give her much space. i skimmed threw your story so i may be missing something.

 

but the reason why i am being blunt is because i used to be like you. i used to be so mentally organized that i made my ex act more like a tool for my success and security. so i wanted her home at certain times. i expected to know where she was , who she was with, blah blah, in reality me tracking her down made me seem like inspector gadget , no woman wants a man like that.

 

you finding out who this guy is regardless and searching him on the interenet and all that, what does that make you look like? it makes you look like a parent tracking down their child so they can get mad and punish them with grandma to back him up.

 

now im not saying everything you spouse did is right or wrong. but what you need to do is step back. and look in the mirror.

 

how were you. were you controlling, were you cheap, were over caring, insecure, clingy, always wanting to know, always reading texts over her shoulder, always demanding to know where she is , who shes with, what shes doing. and if she messes up get mommy involved to help validate your feelings? think about it man, im not trying to be an jerk. but ive been there, and i can tell that alot of this was you.

 

if you are looking for validation on the web you will probably get it. but validation does not solve problems. take my advice. and change

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destroyedlife _ I can see your point but did you read the part where she tried Meth? This woman is out for destruction and she's gonna take down anyone including herself. Your advice is good but you put someone who's doing meth and all rules go out the window. Love advice is the last thing this dude needs. He's gonna have to muster up all that he can to salvage his kids. Meth isnt like taking a hit of weed and a more serious drug and seeing someone die slowly from addiction is more heart breaking than cheating. Edited by Despr8
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destroyedlife - I wanted to be honest and include my mom in there as she was at my house at the time because she was gone for 24 hours. I do admit that I would tell my mom a lot of stuff and my mom would be in the middle of a lot of fights in the past, but that's because they had a fairly close daughter-mother type relationship and we spent the majority of our relationship under her roof. We didn't have the resources to be on our own. Upon moving out, I detached quite a bit from my mom and only went over there when dropping the kids off. The closeness was very convenient as she always watches our children. If her mom was still alive, I'm sure there would of been plenty of things she told her as well.

 

I wasn't trying to be controlling in the relationship, I never went through her phone, I just simply had standards and expectations that I found important for a relationship. I'm not sure why her smoking weed would bother me so much, I just wanted her to compromise and not do it all the time. And no - I wanted to go out and do stuff with her and the kids all the time.

 

And yes - I searched this guy up because we have children together and knew she was going to bring him around our kids, and I'm glad I did.

 

Overall, I told her that I would make ANY compromises if it meant saving our relationship even if it meant letting go of the weed thing and letting her do it daily. In addition to not telling my mom anything anymore. I see your point, however, and that's why I admit I'm not perfect and honest about the situation and feel guilty for my side of the issues. But I was too good to her deserve all of this cruel stuff she had done.

Edited by statix
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Despr8 - yes, I'm with you on it not being something you try once. Since being with this guy her judgment is getting worse. She has missed our son's award ceremony, allowing him to drink full-sized monster (he has ADHD), allowing him to have a large pocket knife (he's very destructive), and missing time/leaving work early, hickeys all over her neck, etc. She never would have done this when we were together.

 

The fact is, I'm not sure if she stopped after the one time she tried it around Easter. If not - this perhaps explains what is going on with her. She was pretty excited to take the drug test at first, however now she isn't responding to phone calls from CPS.

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Despr8 - yes, I'm with you on it not being something you try once. Since being with this guy her judgment is getting worse. She has missed our son's award ceremony, allowing him to drink full-sized monster (he has ADHD), allowing him to have a large pocket knife (he's very destructive), and missing time/leaving work early, hickeys all over her neck, etc. She never would have done this when we were together.

 

The fact is, I'm not sure if she stopped after the one time she tried it around Easter. If not - this perhaps explains what is going on with her. She was pretty excited to take the drug test at first, however now she isn't responding to phone calls from CPS.

 

 

Here's what might happen. Shes gonna lose her job. Do more drugs, get completely hooked. Get backed up on bills. Probably guilt trip you into giving her money. This is the important part..... You give an ultimatum. No drugs, seek help, get rid of the squatting junkie. She'll refuse odds are unfortunately. You CUT HER OFF! Get the kids and let her continue her path down. Once she looses everything she'll be homeless, maybe prostituting and be far gone completely. Junkies run in pairs always and the guy wont be of much help. He'll probably leave once shes of no use to him. The love is gone bro, move on completely. If you wanna help her, Only offer her to go to a Center. No Money, No shelter.

 

 

This is all big maybes but Meth is ridiculously addicting and it'll be her new love. Best of luck to you and stay strong. Get your kids and find yourself a good woman. Time to start over.

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Thanks for the response Despr8. CPS interviewed her today and said that she needs to provide proof that he has no limitations and did his classes. Once she provides the papers Friday, CPS said they can't do anything.

 

Although she refused the drug test today, I'm not completely sure she continued to use meth after that one time use. What's the odds? Things she has been doing and very cruel actions suggest she is.

 

As I said, I'm a mess and trying to wrap my head around that she left and within a few weeks started having sex with this piece of **** from her past. Whatever he's doing, she's very adamant and motivated to keep him around. I just can't understand it.

 

You don't think with time she will look back and regret it and come crawling back? I was decent to her and was willing to compromise. Maybe the love wasn't completely gone but she wanted a rebound but the drugs also messed with her? Thing is, she seems to see no value in me anymore and is favoring the druggie child molester. I know I shouldn't want her back, but I at least want to have the ability to have her back if I wanted.

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That guy is a major dirtbag tweaker and she is definitely doing meth with him. Birds of a feather. No woman starts dating an unemployed sex-offender meth head who is living in a garage if she's not doing it, too.

 

I would forget about ever getting back with her and focus on gaining full control of your children through the courts. I'm sorry, but I really can't wrap my head around you ever wanting to get back together with this woman. She is vile trash given how she has absolutely no motherly instinct to protect her children, subjecting them to her depraved whims.

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Thanks for the response Despr8. CPS interviewed her today and said that she needs to provide proof that he has no limitations and did his classes. Once she provides the papers Friday, CPS said they can't do anything.

 

Although she refused the drug test today, I'm not completely sure she continued to use meth after that one time use. What's the odds? Things she has been doing and very cruel actions suggest she is.

 

As I said, I'm a mess and trying to wrap my head around that she left and within a few weeks started having sex with this piece of **** from her past. Whatever he's doing, she's very adamant and motivated to keep him around. I just can't understand it.

 

You don't think with time she will look back and regret it and come crawling back? I was decent to her and was willing to compromise. Maybe the love wasn't completely gone but she wanted a rebound but the drugs also messed with her? Thing is, she seems to see no value in me anymore and is favoring the druggie child molester. I know I shouldn't want her back, but I at least want to have the ability to have her back if I wanted.

 

 

You hear yourself? F her! Bye Felicia! She will manipulate the hell out of you with that attitude. Who cares if she'll regret it? She broke everything and even endangered your children. I'm all for finding solutions and rekindling love but this is not the fairy tale most people would want. We were together for 10 years and she left to F a junkie/pedo and became a meth addict, but I saved her after she stopped prostituting herself and doing drugs. Believe me this is just the beginning of pure hell. You have no idea what you're gonna be put through. Here's a taste, your kids will be messed up, you'll be feeding her addiction because you love her, Lies! Lies! tons of Lies. You'll be broke. Shoot, she might take other junkies to rob your moms house to feed her addiction. Sorry to sound like a ass but I know what addicts do and it crushes families. There is no I tasted Meth and that's it! That addiction is instant and it wont be long before ol boy shows her how to shoot up. She is gone, get it through your brain that the woman you loved will never be back. Get yourself situated, get your kids and work to be better yourself. Go to the gym, talk to a therapist and a addiction counselor, find what makes you happy. Do it for yourself and the sake of your kids. I'm done bro!

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Well check it out, thanks!

 

She said today she's taking a paid week off work and they are taking the kids camping, wtf?!

 

I don't understand why she's trying to do all these activities with the kids with this creep. But when we were together it was hard to get her to do stuff. Not sure if it's out of spite or what.

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Over the weekend my 7-year-old daughter had a girl scout event, and my ex brought the creep with her. Once I got there, I saw him lifting my daughter up and playing with her like she was his. My ex, of course, was all over him and the girl scouts moms told me about them being in their own little world. The man had a large ass knife attached to his belt too. They eventually left not long after I got there, thankfully!

 

Currently, they are camping with my 3 children and on their 2nd night out. As I said, I can't understand why she's trying to be so active now that she is with this new man as I always wanted to do stuff with the kids too.

 

The living situation is also going to get worse for the kids as her brother has moved into the house with his pregnant girlfriend (he also has a pregnant ex).. She's bringing along her 3 kids. The house only has 3 bedrooms and therefore my daughters will probably have to give up their room.

 

This whole thing is a damn mess and still appreciate any feedback!

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Unless there's a reason for CS to step in you can only control yourself and your end. Focus on that.

 

Cut off all unnecessary contact with the X. Kids, business text only.

 

Keep any pickups/drop offs to a 3 minute exercise with no engagement.

 

It's works if you apply it.

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destroyedlife
Over the weekend my 7-year-old daughter had a girl scout event, and my ex brought the creep with her. Once I got there, I saw him lifting my daughter up and playing with her like she was his. My ex, of course, was all over him and the girl scouts moms told me about them being in their own little world. The man had a large ass knife attached to his belt too. They eventually left not long after I got there, thankfully!

 

Currently, they are camping with my 3 children and on their 2nd night out. As I said, I can't understand why she's trying to be so active now that she is with this new man as I always wanted to do stuff with the kids too.

 

The living situation is also going to get worse for the kids as her brother has moved into the house with his pregnant girlfriend (he also has a pregnant ex).. She's bringing along her 3 kids. The house only has 3 bedrooms and therefore my daughters will probably have to give up their room.

 

This whole thing is a damn mess and still appreciate any feedback!

 

This all is too close to home for me. Minus what I said in my previous comment. I have seen this pattern far too often with women of certain personality types . I believe the narcissist sociopath or psychopath or borderline and possibly bipolar one of these catagories these type of women and possibly men as well fall into seem to act like this. Almost like they become hypnotized by the new member of the opposite sex or the false reality that they have built for them selves.

 

I have read hundreds of posts and experienced myself this same situation. Their position of power is a chess game based on your emotions.reactions and what offends you.

 

Ask yourself is this normal behavior? Hells no. What person walks out on there family. Instantly replaces their spouse and plays "house" like a child? With a new partner?. The more you convince them what there doing is wrong . The more they'll do it. To the point where she will get married and pregnant.

 

So the answer. Spite is a big part. But the biggest is independent choices. Right now she wants to do everything opposite of you. Even if it gives her a dead end down the road. You can't control who she's with and to be honest who she brings your kids around. But she can't control that for you either. Make sure you have 50/50 custody. And be a good dad. Your kids will see who's better . It may take time but trust me they will see.

 

And your ex will see as well. It seems that women have hormones related to sex that they cannot control. And they are subconsciously pursuing someone who they think is the better option. But they are blinded by sex. Once the honeymoon stage wears off. She will be alone or knocking on your door again.

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mark clemson

If the brother is even remotely a decent guy (or even if he's not for the kids' sake) consider telling him about the BF/sending him the link to his history etc. If he stays he could possibly be your eyes inside the house (for your kids sake) but he would more likely get out of there.

 

Consider being prepared to record any evidence of abuse or drug use (such as if your kids describe it) e.g. using a video camera.

 

Such a sad and messed up situation. :(

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If the brother is even remotely a decent guy (or even if he's not for the kids' sake) consider telling him about the BF/sending him the link to his history etc. If he stays he could possibly be your eyes inside the house (for your kids sake) but he would more likely get out of there.

 

Consider being prepared to record any evidence of abuse or drug use (such as if your kids describe it) e.g. using a video camera.

 

Such a sad and messed up situation. :(

 

Thanks for your reply Mark, unfortunately, there is a possibility that the brother is the one that got them in touch again after or before, our split up. The brother does not give a **** about us staying together and knows the guy from their past. I had issues with the brother because he's been very inconsiderate of things in the past and is a negative influence on my ex. He's not a very faithful person himself and has cheated on people and has two girls knocked up currently. I couldn't depend on him for ****, as I also don't trust him. He has no problem with his sister with the pedo creeper just because they are buddies. It's sad because I feel that's more of a motivator for her to stick with him because some of her family knows him from long ago (when he took advantage of her at 16).

 

No idea what to do really, it's the pain that I'm trying to control and this sense of betrayal and shock that lives with me 24/7.

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This all is too close to home for me. Minus what I said in my previous comment. I have seen this pattern far too often with women of certain personality types . I believe the narcissist sociopath or psychopath or borderline and possibly bipolar one of these catagories these type of women and possibly men as well fall into seem to act like this. Almost like they become hypnotized by the new member of the opposite sex or the false reality that they have built for them selves.

 

I have read hundreds of posts and experienced myself this same situation. Their position of power is a chess game based on your emotions.reactions and what offends you.

 

Ask yourself is this normal behavior? Hells no. What person walks out on there family. Instantly replaces their spouse and plays "house" like a child? With a new partner?. The more you convince them what there doing is wrong . The more they'll do it. To the point where she will get married and pregnant.

 

So the answer. Spite is a big part. But the biggest is independent choices. Right now she wants to do everything opposite of you. Even if it gives her a dead end down the road. You can't control who she's with and to be honest who she brings your kids around. But she can't control that for you either. Make sure you have 50/50 custody. And be a good dad. Your kids will see who's better . It may take time but trust me they will see.

 

And your ex will see as well. It seems that women have hormones related to sex that they cannot control. And they are subconsciously pursuing someone who they think is the better option. But they are blinded by sex. Once the honeymoon stage wears off. She will be alone or knocking on your door again.

 

I'm not sure if she's a narcist or not, however, something isn't right. Everything you said is spot on, but the pain is unbearable. I can't believe she threw my ass to the curb and got with this piece of **** from her past. And then doing what she's doing with our children with him. She's already telling our kids to call his stepmom "Grandma"!

 

I really truly hope what you're saying about the honeymoon stage wearing off and being blinded. How long do you think this is going to take? I've read some unofficial numbers about 90% of rebounds fail within 4 months or so. But I'm also worried there is some sort of connection merely because he took advantage of her when she was 16 and that somehow triumphs our 10-year relationship.

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