dumped on vacation

[paralyzed]

I fear my year old relationship has been trashed over simple bad judgement on a cruise. Our party of 30 people on the cruise included an unattached single woman that I had had sex with 3 years prior on 2 occasions. I knew well in advance that she would be there yet I didn't tell my girlfriend about her. I have to say in advance that I never had any emotional attachment to this woman at all. She is a close friend of my friends wife and my only contact with her over the last 2.5 years has been when she would occasionally phone her friend on the yacht. This woman lives in Aspen, I live in S. Cal. I truly didn't consider it an issue. How wrong I was.

 

The first 3 days were magical for me. On the 3rd night, after making love, we were sitting nude on the balcony of our cabin in the moonlight and I remember thinking to myself "this is it, I'm with the women I want to be with forever". Two nites later she was acting strangely at dinner, the other women's 40th birthday party naturally, and she abruptly excused herself from the table. After a while I was concerned and I looked for her around the ship, didn't find her and I returned to the cabin.

 

She showed up 2 hours later and said to me "I told you when we first met that when I don't have that mushy feeling about someone, its all over with. But I want you to know that I will never say anything bad about you in though" I was stunned, she was breaking up with me on a romantic vacation? The gist of it was that she had figured out that I had slept with the other women, not told her ahead of time, and felt that everyone knew but her, which was NOT the case. The rest of the cruise was obviously ruined, I apologized profusely, tried to explain etc. but to no avail. She was very bitter toward me.

 

After we arrived home she would not answer or return my calls for over a week. After we finally met for a drink I again apologized, tried to explain and asked her "why would I take you on a trip halfway across the world to try to make a fool of you?". Its so not me, I don't play games with peoples heads, its just not in my character to even think about deliberately making a fool of someone.

 

We got back together in a sense but this issue never left our relationship. Our communication dwindled over the next two months, probably as much due to me as her. The intimacy in our relationship was gone and a great deal of the trust. Early in our relationship she had told me that she has had ALOT of relationships and she broke up with all of them when her feelings changed. I believed her. Over the last two months I have felt like we were two boxers circling the ring feeling each other out. We broke up last week, I did it but she forced it and I have been trying to understand it since. We exchanged emails about the things we were disatisfied with and when she talked about this incident the anger was still dripping off the words. She had alot of other issues that at least in my mind stemmed from the lack of communication over the last two months.

 

I truly love her and want to be with her forever. My biggest problem is I have to feel loved to communicate, I'm having a terrible time opening up when I feel like the axe is going to fall at any minute. I know I shut her out as she did me. I'm Trying to interpret in her email if she wants to try but I don't want to come on too strong. How can I convince her that I truly didn't mean to hurt her?

[jester]

How can I convince her that I truly didn't mean to hurt her?

 

You've told her that repeatedly for months, now. To no avail. Sometimes a person must be motivated to be convinced. I don't get the sense that your estranged gf has the requisite motivation.

 

The fact that you have a long distance relationship doesn't help matters. If you lived closer, perhaps you would have had more personal, intimate experiences together that would have reduced her almost obsessive focus on this issue. Now, you sit in Southern Cal. and she sits in Aspen, each absorbed by the cruise debacle.

 

I'm concerned that she just won't let it go. Whenever a lover overreacts to some event one wonders whether that person is neurotic or using the event as a pretext to kill the relationship. Either way, it doesn't look good.

 

You may want to put this relationship to sleep, and find women closer to home.

[yes]

I humbly think you should be glad to be free of this lady. I think it's crazy of her to make such a HUGE deal of it. She may have expressed disappointment, put up a fight, but actually break up over it? That's nuts.

 

I mean if anybody was supposed to feel yucky, it'd be that woman who has slept with you even though you had no relationship, seeing you with a serious gf.

 

So if I were you, I'd try to move on. Hell knows what else she will blow way out of proportion even if you do get back together.

 

that's my take,

-yes

[paralyzed]

Thanks for the responses. Sorry to be unclear, the other women is the one in Aspen. My GF lives less than a mile from me. I just want a fresh start without this hanging over my head. She had other issues, mainly that I wasn't communicating. Everything just felt so right before this, yet if we can't have some closure over this I can't even open up. I would feel differently had I lied or cheated.

[jester]

I would feel differently had I lied or cheated.

 

Which you didn't do. You are in a bind: to communicate, you must feel loved. If you feel unloved, you don't communicate.

 

Your gf breaks up with you for failing to communicate when she in fact caused this communications breakdown by her hostile, angry withdrawal of affection. She can't have it both ways: she can't unlove you and expect heartfelt communication. It's not going to happen.

 

The fact that you're all but neighbors, and have not gotten over this, is scary. I know you love her, my friend. Trust me here, she's way too much work. I suspect she has some very serious intimacy issues. In fact, you told us that she has had a large number of relationships, I bet that she ended quite a few of those relationships for the flimsiest of reasons.

 

I suspect there's a pattern, here.

 

You want closure? I recommend you get out, now. Let your exit be your closure.

[amerikajin]

There's no way she abruptly breaks up with you on a love cruise because of communication issues in your relationship. She's just terribly insecure, and she feels upstaged by the other woman. For some reason a lot of women seem to be always obsessed with a man's past sex life, and while I can understand it to a point (I wouldn't put blind faith in the average male, either), it's annoying as hell, and some women just go plain batty.

 

From what I can tell, you did nothing wrong, so don't apologize for anything, except to say that you're sorry that she had to be confronted with this. But you had no idea that this other girl was going to be there, and exactly how were you supposed to broach the subject anyway???

 

Unfortunately, there's nothing you can do. You should give her some time and space to sort herself out. I would probably tell her that it's best to give each other time apart, and I wouldn't call or write her. Tell her that she has to be the one to sort it out and that you'll be around if you want to talk about it and work it out. At the same time, let her know that you also can't be expected to wait around forever, either. I'd say if she doesn't get back to you within two weeks (four weeks max), then it's time to truck on, brother.

[paralyzed]

I did know the other woman was going to be on the trip. I'm know in retrospect I was guilty of very bad judgement in not saying something ahead of time. The other woman was just such a non-issue to me that it never occured to me that it would be a problem or even come up for that matter. I'm uncertain how to proceed now, we've exchanged emails. I tried to explain my feelings, hurts and disappointments and also some of the positives I felt we had. Her response was filled with alot of anger, kind've denying any responsibility for any of my feelings. The main thrust was that she didn't feel like I felt she was important enough to her. I've been writing alot of letters that I have not sent about my feelings but it seems like they range from either "I'm sorry, this is all my fault, how can I fix this" to "your the problem, you are destroying a good thing because you can't truly find forgiveness in your heart" Should I just send the whole mess, take the high road or take the low road?

[amerikajin]

>>>I did know the other woman was going to be on the trip. I'm know in retrospect I was guilty of very bad judgement in not saying something ahead of time.<<<

 

It depends on the situation, really. If you two have talked about past partners then perhaps it would have been a good idea to let her know that one of your ex flings would have been on the trip. Even so, I don't think you've committed an atrocity here. I don't think you're obligated to tell your girl every thing you've ever done in your life, particularly if you know she might have a difficult time accepting the truth. My attitude is that you always tell the truth, but you don't always have to volunteer it.

 

Now women will tell you that "You should have told me the truth. I wouldn't be so angry right now if you would have just told me the truth!" B-U-L-L-S-H-I-T. She's going to be angry whether you volunteer it or if she drags it out of you. She's just using the fact that you didn't volunteer it as a way of justifying her own irrational behavior and using it as leverage against you in the future - if there is one, of course.

 

>>> The other woman was just such a non-issue to me that it never occured to me that it would be a problem or even come up for that matter.<<<

 

Of course she was, and deep down inside, she knows that. She's not upset because she thinks you've got some romantic interest in her; she's pissed because she feels like she's been upstaged by the other girl. She feels like the other chick somehow scored points that she didn't, and to make matters worse, everyone else knew about it but her. So now she's putting her wild imagination to bad use and her head is filled with images of your ex getting drilled by a guy she cares about (i.e. you). She might even think people are laughing at her. In short, she's pissed because she feels like she's "lost face," and her ego has been greatly wounded. So guess who pays for that one??? You, buddy.

 

>>>I'm uncertain how to proceed now, we've exchanged emails.<<<

 

Go back and read what I said one more time. I think you need to start cutting off all contact with her. You've tried. You don't want to keep trying. What you want is to give her time to calm down and hopefully come to her senses to see that this was a big overreaction on her part, but if you keep pushing her, she's going to get even more angry with you. She's using this opportunity to try to strike back in her own way. What she SHOULD be doing is taking a good look at herself. Again, you did nothing wrong, and if she does eventually approach you about starting over, I wouldn't apologize except to say that you're sorry it upset her. If you start letting her beat you down now, she'll always beat you down, and the relationship will get worse. By standing your ground, she might respect you more. If she doesn't, well then she can sail on.

 

But for now, please, cut off the contact. Let her initiate the contact. Give her some time to decide some things for herself. The tough part is, she might really want to move on, but there's NOTHING you can do about that now.

[SoleMate]

had told me that she has had ALOT of relationships and she broke up with all of them when her feelings changed.

 

I don't believe you did anything wrong, or even at all questionable. Did she seriously expect you to brief her on your sexual history with everyone you might meet in any situation? Especially since she herself has an eventful past. Is it realistic to expect the two of you to shun every past sex partner of either of you? No. Of course not. The chickensh*t cruise non-event was just an excuse. This breakup was all about HER. She told you that her pattern is to break things off "when feelings change". That's a recipe for basically never having a long term relationship. Particularly when she doesn't have the skills to repair a break.

 

I truly love her and want to be with her forever.

I don't think ANYONE can be with her forever, because human emotions will always have their ups and downs. I'm very sorry, because I sense your pain. She's just made it her policy not to let a relationship last - ever. That's her problem, not yours. Unlike other posters, I don't believe that she is deliberately manipulative, just operating on some very mistaken principles. But I wouldn't want the job of convincing her of the error of her ways.

 

And amerikajin, let's not generalize this particular incident to all women, please.

[paralyzed]

Thanks for the responses, its humbling to see how people can give of themselves to help a faceless name on a computer. I do understand about barriers we put up to protect ourselves, I have put up enough of them in the past myself. Am I just grabbing at straws to think that there is anything I can say to here or do for her that might help her see that she is focusing on the tree not the forest. I agree that the easiest thing for me is to just let go and I CAN do that but I wish I could at least introduce the thought in her mind that she is judging the results not the cause of our failing?

[jester]

I agree that the easiest thing for me is to just let go and I CAN do that but I wish I could at least introduce the thought in her mind that she is judging the results not the cause of our failing?

 

paralyzed, you want closure but you're not going to get it. To be frank, this particular ending is not about you and your sexual history, it's all about her. You're just an extra, buddy, in her little movie. Ans as SoleMate and I have suggested, you're not the first, and you won't be the last.

 

If it makes you feel better, send her all your letters. Look upon the mailing as an unloading of her and your relationship.

 

After that, move on my friend. You deserve better.

[amerikajin]

>>>And amerikajin, let's not generalize this particular incident to all women, please.<<<

 

It's hard for me to explain in words why I take the blunt approach to dating relationships. In ordinary relationships, I don't generalize much at all. I know I'm making generalizations and that some women are different. I do that because I think one of the biggest mistakes people make in dating - whether you are a man or a woman - is giving the other person the benefit of the doubt that they might be the exception to the rule. My theory is (and feel free to disagree with it as you have) is that, when it comes to dating, women have to generalize about men, and men have to generalize about women - up to a point, of course.

 

They're just my own thoughts, however right or wrong they are. Somewhere in my mind, there's a method to my madness.

[SoleMate]

Thanks for the responses, its humbling to see how people can give of themselves to help a faceless name on a computer.

A lot of us are doing it for our own therapeutic purposes. Scratch almost any LS poster's chest and you'll find a beating heart covered with scar tissue...

[jester]

Scratch almost any LS poster's chest and you'll find a beating heart covered with scar tissue...

 

What heart?

[paralyzed]

Thanks for helping me see this a little more clearly, I was listening too much and believing that this whole thing was my fault. I know I not perfect but she was making me question almost everything about myself. I sent one final email, now I'm done, gonna take it easy for awhile then pick up my life again. I hate to put labels on things but a friend of mine used the words "High Maintenence", never really knew what that was first-hand. Thank-You

 

 

Dear *****,

 

Please take this letter for what it is, my thoughts, not a personal attack or attemp at provoking any kind of response. alot of the problems with our relationship were not about us, they were about you. As painful as it is to hear you are the one with serious commitment issues. You basically trashed what could have been a solid relationship over an insignificant thing. You constantly talked about being treated like a princess and being worshipped, can you honestly say you treated me like that these last two months? A strong relationship needs balance, not one person doing all the giving and I don't mean sexually. After that crap on the boat you withdrew your love yet expected it from me. One of the things that bothered me the most about that whole thing was that the punishment didn't fit the crime. You quit yet expected me to be the perfect everything to you. I could feel it. You talk about unconditional love yet yours was suddenly full of conditions if it was even there. I can see by the anger in your letter that you never did find forgiveness. I once told you how important equality was to me and that you were my equal. In a relationship it means both give and get different things in somewhat equal amounts. When you would not forgive me and withdrew your love back then I can only assume you knew we were in the end doomed already.

 

If you look back on your choices in partners and see a long list of drug addicts, chronically unemployed, too young or otherwise totally incompatible partners and a long list of possibly good partners you do have to question yourself. The first group is easy, you know there is no long term future so you know while you are in it that it WILL end. The other group is tougher isn't it? I guess if going through a whole lifetime of that is what someone wants then it's ok. In all fairness you did warn me, I guess I just started to feel like I was going to be the one to take the prize.

 

In this point in my life thats not what I want for myself anymore. I've spent the last 6 years of my life chasing a ghost until I met you. During those 6 years I dated some some good women but my particular ghost kept coming back into my life and my heart and when she did they were gone. Who could blame them? One thing I've learned from being with you is that I'm ready for the whole package. Forever is a long time but I need to be able to look past tomorrow and know that my partner is going to be there. I don't feel like you and I can ever be that anymore. It's probably better that we quit and move on.

 

 

Love & Best of Luck,

 

****

[jester]

A beautiful and brilliant final farewell, paralyzed. I loved it.

 

By the way, you should change your screen name because you're far from "paralyzed."

 

Best of luck in all your future relationships.

[DivaGirl]

Paralyzed,

 

I'd first like to say that you are *extremely* articulate, intelligent, and sensitive. Anyone woman *should* be happy to have a man like you.

 

I'm sorry for the pain you've experienced. In my relationships, and there have been several, I have been in both your and your ex's positions. I used to be extremely insecure, and although I've made a lot of progress, somehow being with someone manages to nearly destroy any faith I have in myself, and I tend to see the world as all being together, against me, and laughing at me. That sounds like your ex. I, however, realize this about myself, and constantly try to get further and further away from that, because I don't like how I act in the throes of insecurity, and I hate that, sometime afterward, I can always see how foolishly I reacted. It's usually too late to mend the wrongs I committed by then, though.

 

I hope that your ex takes your letter to heart, and not as a personal attack. If she does, perhaps she'll be inspired to change her ways and not see it as the world against her. Perhaps she'll even realize how lucky she was to have you, and you two may have a chance again. In the meantime, however, continue with the goals you outlined in your letter to her. You have a solid head on your shoulders, and should be commended.

[amerikajin]

I think the letter at this stage in the game is inconsequential either way, but as a general rule, I avoid exit letters. Always try to take the high road if you can, and that means avoiding anything that may make you appear to be bitter or petty. Maybe living in So Cal it's not such a big deal, but if the circles are small, this kind of thing could be used against you in a court of female opinion in your network of friends and acquaintances.

 

Note that I'm NOT at all saying you're NOT entitled to your feelings. You absolutely are entitled to them. I'm just saying be careful about how you manifest those feelings.

 

Avoid any kind of negative commentary during your exit interview, especially in the accusatory.

 

Always take the high road.

[paralyzed]

Thanks everyone for the input and advice. I see after reading my letter after a few days have gone by that it may have been a bit harsh but all I was getting from her was resentment anyway. I'm still thinking about it alot, questioning both our communication skills but in the end I'll just stay the course and consider it a lesson in life.

 

thanks