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Guy with no relationship at 36 - am I 'damaged goods'?


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If there is such a thing as a "mature" person I suppose I never arrived. I suffered from anxiety / depression etc. throughout my twenties and was fairly isolated despite having studied and worked in an office job for a few years. I spent my twenties trying to solve the problems I got from a bad childhood (domestic violence, some sexual abuse), but I did not succeed.

 

I have very little experience with women. In my early thirties I panicked and tried cold approaching women in bars or in the street. I ended up with a couple of one night stands and a couple of dates, but no relationship came out of this.

 

I found the rejections from women hard to take. Some of them can be very harsh or annoyed if you are not naturally confident. I felt like these women saw me as very unattractive - the way I see myself on my worst days, but being snapped at for introducing yourself to someone is tough. Other women would talk to me, but my lack of confidence or anything interesting to say led them to back off.

 

It is difficult enough for me to try and meet women, but I now feel I am carrying around a stigma and that if women knew I had never had a relationship or had seen therapists for a couple of years they would automatically think of me as a loser and not the type of person they would want in their lives.

 

I stopped trying to meet women in clubs or bars two years ago while I was having therapy, but I don't feel I have changed much in confidence. I can approach women but some of them will see the lack of confidence, or the inability to make interesting conversation, and get annoyed. The lack of any relationship probably just makes me more nervous when approaching women. It is an extra thing I feel I have to hide.

 

I know I can get dates if I approach enough women (a lot), but feel bad about doing it because I don't generally feel happy in myself. It is like I am trying to put on a confident guy act, and occasionally it works, but deep down it is not me. I am feeling down at the moment, but am trying to get some professional photos done so I can improve my self image and try social networking / dating sites. But I don't want to restrict myself to that. I hope to be able to socialise again and meet women.

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Ethan, the very first thing is to be proud of yourself for trying to work through your problems. I personally would never, ever judge someone who has been to therapy. I would go as far as to say that I would rather be with someone who has been proactive in fixing their issues than someone who refuses to and prefers to complain instead. So please be proud of yourself.

 

You have legit reasons for not having had a relationship and if your future partner(s) cannot accept that, then they aren't a good person to be with. Life gets in the way for a lot of people. I have only dated 2 guys in the last 3 years because part of that time I was not looking to date and the other part I was very ill. This doesn't mean no one 'wanted me'.

 

My suggestion to you would be to put yourself out there, and in more ways than cold approaching women, join clubs, groups, meet ups, something that interests you and yes if you like, online dating. Remember as well, and this is straight from a woman's mouth, lots of women don't like to be hit on. It can be flattering yes, but it can also be incredibly annoying, so we can come off cold. Not everyone feels like being chatted up all the time.

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The important thing is that you've been and hopefully are still in therapy. It's natural that since you have begun working on the anxiety issues only fairly recently, you are as insecure as any young man would be who was first starting to date. With experience, you will gain some confidence. I think you first need to just get used to being social in a general sense. Go do things with a small group of friends and just see if you're fine talking to them or if you still feel anxious. From there, it's not much of a step to joining activities that will have men and women, whether it be dance lessons, a softball team, or taking a part-time job in retail that will bring you into contact with meeting people. Or you can join a meetup for just people who like to dine out. Now, sometimes those are awkward for people alone in the best circumstances if there are lots of couples, so do the singles ones, but look for one that isn't just about meeting girls but is a group of people joining together who have a common interest, like for me it was a paranormal group, or could be a bird watchers group, or whatever your specific interests are. And just start by getting used to being friendly to a group of people you don't know well yet. From there, your confidence will build and also you may just trip over someone to date. Good luck.

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I can think of nowhere worse than bars and clubs to meet the opposite sex.

 

Try some of the ideas suggested by the previous posters.

 

Good luck.

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SycamoreCircle

The ability to care about someone, make them feel good, make them feel cherished is not something which requires a resume.

 

You're very aware of issues that you have such as confidence.

 

But it sounds like you've put yourself out there a good bit in social situations where you're introducing yourself to women and asking them out. Good for you! Some men don't have the confidence to do that. Even if you're getting shot down, I still find honor in what you're doing. And I think a lot of women would, too. Online dating has really changed the dating landscape.

 

Can you have fun?

 

If you can have fun, you can be a great partner to a woman. If you can treat a woman with kindness and respect, you can be a great partner to a woman.

 

Confidence is not thinking you're something amazing. Confidence is the ability to not think about yourself. So next time you're with a woman, think about the present, think about her, think about what she would like to do, what would make her have fun and what is important to her. If you keep those things in mind, you will be the most engaging person she's met in a long time.

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OP there are plenty of women with similar stories, I think the only common difference is that women with similar stories often have relationships but then flail when it comes to sexual intimacy. So I think it could possibly help you mentally/emotionally to acknowledge this, that it's not like you're faced with a sea of women who can't possibly understand where you've been coming from. Quite the contrary there are many women who definitely would understand. Many women who had bad childhoods and have been through therapy, themselves. It's just not typically something you can see when you meet a person. Which should also give you some healthy perspective - just like I am positive you have laid eyes on numerous women with similar stories without realizing it, likewise most women will lay eyes on you without being able to tell that you've ever seen a therapist or had any trauma and so on. YOU know that you've experienced these things and YOU are judging yourself. The majority of the women you meet are not reading your mind or judging you. You have to work on the negative thoughts you have about yourself so you can stop projecting those thoughts as coming from others.

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It's really hard approaching women cold and if you had some success with this, you did well. It sounds like you did. Most encounters with the opposite sex don't turn into a relationship (or we would all be horribly confused wouldn't we?). The women you might approach socially or whatever know nothing about your background. They will continue to know nothing unless you tell them. You don't have to tell them, just be vague if that helps you.

 

From the sound of it, you've already had some pretty horrible things happen in your life that you are coping with and maybe feel you have to hide. It seems like it's causing some internal distress and not surprisingly. There is nothing wrong with you and you can't help your former circumstances. Any decent women would be caring and comforting not judging. You just need to find that woman - and you will.

 

If you could go back into therapy or counselling, that might be a help to you, to relieve the pressure of all these worries. This is not to say you shouldn't approach women or anything, just for you because it sounds like you are still struggling.

 

If you can, it's probably best to take the road of building relationships gradually. Start by saying hello, Next time you see the woman you like, say hello again and if she responds well, have a chat. And so on, until she feels you are a familiar face and a friend and you feel you know her better too.

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Hi guys, thanks for the replies. I have read them all. I have already put some of the things into practice over the last four years like attending meetups, or working in retail at a charity shop. I had lots of nice conversations, but never met anyone I hit it off with.

 

I find that my self image just doesn't improve. I have had interesting conversations with people yet when I talk to someone I am attracted to I feel I am flawed and run out of things to say. The same void is there that I always felt despite the work I have done.

 

 

The majority of the women you meet are not reading your mind or judging you. You have to work on the negative thoughts you have about yourself so you can stop projecting those thoughts as coming from others.

 

I do work on myself, but the thoughts are hard to change. I suppose I was brainwashed and continued with negative thoughts well into my teens and twenties. I just find it hard to shake them off.

 

When you say I am projecting, it is difficult to accept that a woman would react with anger or disgust in a bar just because I have introduced myself, and yet be happy to talk to other guys later in the evening. Ultimately something has caused these women to act that way and it cannot be a good thought. No I cannot know what the majority of women think, but most are not too friendly, and the ones that are seem to only make a half-effort in conversation to put the burden on me to say something amazing.

 

 

The women you might approach socially or whatever know nothing about your background. They will continue to know nothing unless you tell them. You don't have to tell them, just be vague if that helps you.

 

This also brings up the issue of do I need to tell them at all? I would feel a lot less bad about myself if I could tell them the one night stands were relationships or something along those lines. Some guy in another thread on loveshack said if you tell women the truth they will think something is wrong I think a few women commented in that thread saying they would have similar question marks.

 

I feel like using a cover story to shake off this insecurity I don't think many women in this city I am in, which is full of successful men, will be very understanding about my past. I believe the vast majority will treat my age / relationship experience as unheard of and therefore undesirable.

 

I don't want people to think I am just venting. I have put in an awful lot of work in the last few years, approached a lot of women, and am still in therapy. I really feel like I need to get out there and meet people.

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You seem to have this idea that you need to disclose everything about yourself the first few minutes of meeting someone. That would indicate a lack of appropriate boundaries and would send most women running. Learn the art of the slow reveal. Nothing you have mentioned is something you would even mention in the first 5 dates with someone. You save harder subjects until people have gotten a bit of a chance to know you.

 

You say women reject you and then later talk to other guys. I agree with you, something you are saying or doing is turning them off or making them uncomfortable. I don't know you at all so I'm going to start with the basic....hygiene. Are you clean and do you smell nice? Is crap stuck in your teeth? Are your hands dirty? This stuff seems obvious but I can't tell you how many of my male patients I've had to sit down and explain basic hygiene to. They literally had no idea.

 

Also, your body language is big. Are you standing too close with your hands in your pockets? Are you fidgiting and obviously nervous? Are you maintaining eye contact too long or not at all? All of these are things that women will immediately pick up on and will make them uncomfortable. What are you saying to them? Some random man just asking me out for no reason pisses me off because I know he'll just sleep with anyone and doesn't care about me, he's just playing a numbers game. But if you talk to me, if we click, if I find you funny and interesting then I won't be offended.

 

It is on you to provide interesting and witty conversation if you approch a woman. The onus is on me if I approach a guy, I need to make him see me as a possible partner in just a few minutes. The only way to do that is to be interesting and funny. If you aren't interesting.......have experiences and read books that make you interesting. Humor is harder, in some respects you either have it or you don't. I love inteleectual debate and I'm attracted to people that can think about things in many different ways, can you do this?

 

In another post I recently suggested a guy take an assertive communication class and hire a stylist. Both are ways to improve the appearance of your confidence without actually becoming more confident. And pretending to have it is as good as having it for all intents and purposes. A well dressed man will attract attention and women will be much more receptive to him from the get go. Someone who can speak well is also likely to afford more attention from the opposite sex. These are actual things you can do to make your life better.

 

I've been told a number of times in crazy medical scenarious that I'm so calm, collected and confident. I always find this hilarious, because in my head I'm thinking "Oh my god....they're gonna die, what do I do!!!!!!" I just LOOK confident, and it does wonders.

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Thanks Ebel. Well I feel bad that my thread was moved from the general forum for some reason. I just want to say I am not what you think I might be. I have zero hygiene issues. I don't fidget either. I dress smart / casual. One of the women I had a one night stand with couldn't believe I had never had a relationship.

 

I see my photos and on a good day can see myself as average, or on a bad day as less than average. I am tall and fairly athletic.

 

I like your story about appearing confident at work. I don't wear the confident mask well. It either slips in conversation, or I think my expression must be on the nervous side. I have done an assertiveness class about one year back and it was good.

 

I guess there is no answer ultimately. I give the stigma a place in my mind. Other people's opinions therefore have power over me.

 

My thought process tells me if I date a woman 5 times and she is then told I have never had a relationship she is then just a very annoyed woman. I feel I have not expressed this well on Loveshack. I sound like I am venting, but this is a huge barrier in my mind since there must be women who view it with suspicion and disdain. The thought of dating a woman who might view you with disdain if she knew about your past is quite a profound fear.

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littleblackheart
Thanks Ebel. Well I feel bad that my thread was moved from the general forum for some reason. I just want to say I am not what you think I might be. I have zero hygiene issues. I don't fidget either. I dress smart / casual. One of the women I had a one night stand with couldn't believe I had never had a relationship.

 

I see my photos and on a good day can see myself as average, or on a bad day as less than average. I am tall and fairly athletic.

 

I like your story about appearing confident at work. I don't wear the confident mask well. It either slips in conversation, or I think my expression must be on the nervous side. I have done an assertiveness class about one year back and it was good.

 

I guess there is no answer ultimately. I give the stigma a place in my mind. Other people's opinions therefore have power over me.

 

My thought process tells me if I date a woman 5 times and she is then told I have never had a relationship she is then just a very annoyed woman. I feel I have not expressed this well on Loveshack. I sound like I am venting, but this is a huge barrier in my mind since there must be women who view it with suspicion and disdain. The thought of dating a woman who might view you with disdain if she knew about your past is quite a profound fear.

 

Does anything happen specifically on date 5? I'm not versed on dates, but I'm not sure there's a set list of conversations you have to have at any given time.

 

 

I guess if a woman really wants to get to know you, and if the attraction is mutual and if everything else is going well, the only thing that might worry her would be that perhaps you haven't been in a relationship yet because you're very choosy, and she may worry you're going to find fault with her.

 

 

If she views this with disdain or suspicion, she's the one with a prejudice and you will have had a lucky escape.

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You aren't damaged goods, that's certain to anyone who thinks logically but unfortunately women and dating are the farthest thing from logical and it will be an uphill battle.

That's the biggest problem.

Women want whatever other women want and for a guy who's never been wanted before it's a big hurdle to get over which increases in height as the years go by.

 

'The past is the past' unfortunately only selectively applies to a woman's sexual history according to this board.

When it comes to a man's relationship history it's game on and fire away with the judgement and scenario making.

 

Cold approaching is a sh*t fight for most men and not recommended.

 

A lot will come down to luck. Hopefully you will cross paths with an atypical woman without the laundry list of requirements that most have.

 

I'm not yet your age and not in your situation and have experienced the massive superficiality displayed by today's woman as a bloke growing up for myself.

 

Family gatherings have always yielded better results for me.

The only women you'll find in clubs are those to use as a piece of a*s.

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This is the whole reason I feel like lying. If I am being compared and a negative judgement made I find this to be illogical. Particularly because a guy who has been in a relationship and treated a woman terribly / violently automatically gets judged as better than me because he has been in a relationship. How can that make sense?

 

One experience I had on a date was where a woman was into me. We went on a second date, but her judgement of me eventually came down to the lack of social networking online, and that she believed I wasn't sociable enough. She had asked me about past relationships on the date as well. She was trying to build a picture, but came up with the worst case scenario in her head.

 

I guess Loveshack is about people reassuring each other. I have experience with female therapists in their late 20s / early 30s and am convinced they have a negative view of men who have not dated. It is difficult to know whether this extends to other women in society, but it seems to come down to their egos and the negative image they build up of single men through media stories.

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It seems your bigger hurdle is the fear of facing this issue, than the issue itself. I am not going to down play it though. It will be an issue for quite a lot of women. You will see posts on here from women that say for the right women it wont matter. lol Yes that's true but is the right woman a 1 in 20 or only less attractive women. Who knows, and you will need to start flirting with women more to get through those numbers to find that one, and steel yourself for the inevitable knockbacks. I get the impression with most of the guys with this issue its seems to be more of a mental stumbling block to dating than actually clocking up a bunch of women reacting badly when they find out. You have to try do your best to have a not give a shyte attitude (the insecurity over it will compound things) to it and see how you go just being upfront. Explain your past health issues, maybe even exaggerate them to be worse if you want. Try bump up your social networking presence though so it supports the change in you you are going to have to sell.

 

If you have a run where the women are going cold on you after the information comes out on date 2, 3 or 4 then go for the lie. Lying is no sure thing though. One of my mates friends struggled to get LTRs up to his late 20s. He picked up the stigma and lied. It worked and he got a gf, until he went to a party and some smartarse made jokes about him finally getting a gf. She found out the truth and broke up with him. Similar thing happened on the next gf when someone made a comment, and it hit him hard but also his confidence had picked up knowing he can get pretty gfs. He used those gfs in his recent history (and extended the relationship time), and his close friends & family members went along with it & were vague about discussing his history to any new woman, and he was off and running on the next one. If you lie its going to be much harder to cover than it is for a woman to leave out her sleeping around past.

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I do think that there might be a trend where more attractive women might have higher standards The two therapists I seen who seemed to have negative views of my not having had a relationship were both attractive, and one of those seemed to be superficial and had a very good looking partner. To make matters worse I was only in my twenties at that time.

 

If your point is that a woman will need to meet your family then I am in trouble. My mum passed, I don't talk to my dad, and see my sister sometimes just once a week. If women are all about meeting families and asking questions then I guess that is another hurdle. One of the one night stands I had I could state was a longer relationship as I got to know the woman a little and kind of know what she is about. In truth the whole thing seems like a superficial game - it is nothing to do with who you are, but who you are on paper.

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No they wont necessarily will need to meet your family especially in the dating stage, but at some point most will want to, even if its just at Christmas. If you told your gf that your last ex was called Sally and you dated for 3 yrs and you end up at your sisters for place for dinner with your gf, and your gf asks your sister just a casual question about Sally, you ideally don't want your sister, to say 'huh who the hell is Sally'. Get it. Like wise same scenario with your close friends. Yes use your ONS or girl you got to know well that you had a crush on, as your phoney gfs...if you go down that path.

 

Yes, more attractive women have more options and will tend to have more things on their tick off list and more things on their deal breaker/red flag list. Your lack of experience hurt you already but it could likely do so in this aspect too unfortunately. It doesn't necessarily have to be that way. I knew a guy that lost his virginity just shy of 27. He had a bowel condition and was skinny, finally got diagnosed, treated and put on weight. He hit the gym, then vitamin s, and got real BIG. He's in triple digits now with bed partners and I'm sure his V at 27 won't matter at all even if he told the women. You have to not be the same person that struggled in your 20s if you are to disconnect from that legacy. Apart from other changes you might be making, hit the gym - it will help build up your confidence + make your more desirable + it will help offset your past, as superficial as the advice seems.

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I go to the gym. It makes me a slim athletic build - like a sprinter at best, but I find none of that carries over to dating or my general self-perception. The reason I find it hard to break away from who I was in my 20s is that women will judge me for it now. They want "honesty" and a dating history so that they can judge and possibly reject.

 

Your friend's story is a good one. I am thinking of getting cosmetic surgery, but I am not sure that would change my view of myself.

 

Whether my sister would lie on my behalf is unknown to me, but I always resented her intrusion into my private life Even in my teenage years she was trying to find out from my friends if I had dated. I found this to be an invasion of privacy at the time.

 

I also don't like the idea of a woman meeting your family in case she has a negative view of them and then decides that reflects on you in some way. I think some people in merry old England still make that judgement.

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Approaching women in such situations is always going to be difficult because you have the friends to contend with too.

I have been with women who have been aggressive and laughed in men's faces when they approach them in a bar. They do it basically to amuse their friends. However I have also been told later "He was pretty cute wasn't he, I wonder where he usually hangs out?" - it is all a game, do not take it deadly seriously.

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I am thinking of getting cosmetic surgery, but I am not sure that would change my view of myself.

Correct. If you believed the media only "perfect" people are successful in attracting the opposite sex.

BUT, people with big noses get dates, people with flat chests get dates, people with squint teeth get dates, people with all sorts of "bad" physical attributes get dates. It is not just about looks, it is about meeting people you have a connection with.

Plastic surgery may help if you have a long-standing issue with one part of your body, that you are obsessing about, but otherwise plastic surgery can go wrong and plastic surgery will not by itself boost your confidence.

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What do you actually do in your spare time Ethan, apart from I am presuming work and the gym, what hobbies or interests do you have?

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If there is such a thing as a "mature" person I suppose I never arrived. I suffered from anxiety / depression etc. throughout my twenties and was fairly isolated despite having studied and worked in an office job for a few years. I spent my twenties trying to solve the problems I got from a bad childhood (domestic violence, some sexual abuse), but I did not succeed.

 

I have very little experience with women. In my early thirties I panicked and tried cold approaching women in bars or in the street. I ended up with a couple of one night stands and a couple of dates, but no relationship came out of this.

 

I found the rejections from women hard to take. Some of them can be very harsh or annoyed if you are not naturally confident. I felt like these women saw me as very unattractive - the way I see myself on my worst days, but being snapped at for introducing yourself to someone is tough. Other women would talk to me, but my lack of confidence or anything interesting to say led them to back off.

 

It is difficult enough for me to try and meet women, but I now feel I am carrying around a stigma and that if women knew I had never had a relationship or had seen therapists for a couple of years they would automatically think of me as a loser and not the type of person they would want in their lives.

 

I stopped trying to meet women in clubs or bars two years ago while I was having therapy, but I don't feel I have changed much in confidence. I can approach women but some of them will see the lack of confidence, or the inability to make interesting conversation, and get annoyed. The lack of any relationship probably just makes me more nervous when approaching women. It is an extra thing I feel I have to hide.

 

I know I can get dates if I approach enough women (a lot), but feel bad about doing it because I don't generally feel happy in myself. It is like I am trying to put on a confident guy act, and occasionally it works, but deep down it is not me. I am feeling down at the moment, but am trying to get some professional photos done so I can improve my self image and try social networking / dating sites. But I don't want to restrict myself to that. I hope to be able to socialise again and meet women.

 

I feel ya man. In fact you had one thing I never had, a couple one night stands. Almost everytime I was placed in the "Friends only" zone and everytime I struck out. Hell, I gave up on the idea of dating even though my family and friends keep pressuring me into trying online dating. You can determine your next move. Look at it this way, you had a couple one night stands so women do see something positive in you so go from there. Don't change who or what you are for any girl or woman, but build on what you have and mold that to the image that you want yourself to be, the confidence will eventually come naturally.

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Approaching women in such situations is always going to be difficult because you have the friends to contend with too.

I have been with women who have been aggressive and laughed in men's faces when they approach them in a bar. They do it basically to amuse their friends. However I have also been told later "He was pretty cute wasn't he, I wonder where he usually hangs out?" - it is all a game, do not take it deadly seriously.

 

Hi Elaine, thanks for the post. Well it's good to hear this from a woman. I know this kind of stuff goes on, and some of the behaviour I have seen from women in clubs was very unreasonable. However, women in general seem to rationalise other women's behaviour by saying "Oh, she only reacted like that because guys were annoying her all night". This sometimes is true, but sometimes isn't. By the way I don't think men have a right to annoy women and expect politeness in return.

 

I have somehow internalised the negative reactions, and now feel like I am a burden on a woman if I talk to them anywhere - even at work. My therapist said I am carrying around an image of women in my mind wherever I go. The strange thing is I have been on websites where women have complained of guys not approaching them, or responding to their flirting. Yet my bad experiences with women seem to have left a mark I am battling with. I just need more positive experiences.

 

As for the looks issue. I think I am average at best, but I am tall. For that reason I am not doing online dating but will try speed dating at some point, and maybe going to bars again. I am hoping to get some portrait photos done soon. I suppose when I have been rejected by women I have taken it badly in terms of self image.

 

What do you actually do in your spare time Ethan, apart from I am presuming work and the gym, what hobbies or interests do you have?

 

I play an instrument but don't have much motivation for that these days, but most of the friends I have had recently and courses I have done have revolved around self-improvement. Things like improv, vocal techniques for actors, beginner's acting etc. oh, and photography. I definitely need more of a social life and more friends - I have only one or two friends who are not eve close friends. Making friends isn't easy without confidence.

 

Bigbluebox, thanks for the post. There is always a positive way to look at things. I am struggling through a difficult patch right now. As I said above nothing will solve this except positive interactions with women.

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Hi Elaine, thanks for the post. Well it's good to hear this from a woman. I know this kind of stuff goes on, and some of the behaviour I have seen from women in clubs was very unreasonable. However, women in general seem to rationalise other women's behaviour by saying "Oh, she only reacted like that because guys were annoying her all night". This sometimes is true, but sometimes isn't. By the way I don't think men have a right to annoy women and expect politeness in return.

 

I have somehow internalised the negative reactions, and now feel like I am a burden on a woman if I talk to them anywhere - even at work. My therapist said I am carrying around an image of women in my mind wherever I go. The strange thing is I have been on websites where women have complained of guys not approaching them, or responding to their flirting. Yet my bad experiences with women seem to have left a mark I am battling with. I just need more positive experiences.

 

As for the looks issue. I think I am average at best, but I am tall. For that reason I am not doing online dating but will try speed dating at some point, and maybe going to bars again. I am hoping to get some portrait photos done soon. I suppose when I have been rejected by women I have taken it badly in terms of self image.

 

I play an instrument but don't have much motivation for that these days, but most of the friends I have had recently and courses I have done have revolved around self-improvement. Things like improv, vocal techniques for actors, beginner's acting etc. oh, and photography. I definitely need more of a social life and more friends - I have only one or two friends who are not eve close friends. Making friends isn't easy without confidence.

 

Bigbluebox, thanks for the post. There is always a positive way to look at things. I am struggling through a difficult patch right now. As I said above nothing will solve this except positive interactions with women.

 

If you have done some acting, even if it was just a course, then what about your local amateur dramatics, or musical theatre; usually lots of women and gay guys(sorry for the generalisation but often true) and very social too. I don't mean you have to be the leading star, but there are loads of roles you could do on or off stage.

Being around extrovert people may bring you out of your shell too. I am not saying you wil meet the girl of your dreams there but you need to practice your social skills and much easier to do that with people who are not introverted and quiet. They may be able to introduce you to a suitable woman too, the more people you know...

 

It seems to be a fact of life that nothing comes along when we are desperate, relax and things will come to you.

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Good job on putting yourself out there and working on yourself. TBS don't reveal this unless you meet someone who could be the one. Most women will not like your resume (same for sexes reversed). We're a society of bell curves and the further away from the fat part the weirder we are. My history is relatively similar.

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Acting is an interesting one because the course I done felt like it was elementary - not quite up to a decent standard to join a society. I will check out amateur dramatics. I tried a photography club but the average age was quite old. I have also tried meditation classes but again it feels to me like talking to women there is hitting on them. I have only ever tried brief small talk there.

 

Meeting extrovert people in my age range or younger is nearly impossible. I agree it would be a massive help. There is a saying that you are only as good as the four best people around you. I think there is some truth in it. But I guess the nature of things is that extroverts will already have friends so won't be looking for any.

 

SJC2008, I don't want to get into the politics of it, but I agree a woman should not have to tell a guy how many partners she has had. I just find it strange that some women on this forum have argued that they should be able to hide their own history but should be entitled to know about the man's. I read a comment from a woman on another forum to the effect of "Women want men to be honest so they can reject them". That's how it feels to me.

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