First post - issue about marriage/commitment

[tripleaxel13]

This is my first post here, so first off, hi everyone I've poked around these forums for a long time now, and I have been having an issue I'd love some advice on - it's been hurting me a lot.

 

I've been engaged before, and it was in a situation that was severely unhealthy for me (he abused me and one day, I opened my eyes to what was happening and stood up for myself). At that time, I was more in love with the idea of marriage than the actual man.

 

It's been a few years since then, and for a few years, I have been dating an amazing man who treats me right and doesn't hurt me. He's been there through everything, we've been through family problems together, we unfortunately lost a baby (it was unplanned but we had agreed that we were going to raise it and love it, and then that happened), and he's just been awesome. Since that last failed relationship, I've seen some other men, gotten my confidence up, lost a ton of weight, and started feeling much better about who I am. I was in an amazing place when I met him, and that just continued as we started seeing each other. He does not make me submit to him, but treats me as an equal and encourages me to have a strong mind of my own.

 

Now to the problem.

 

I am 26 and so is he. I have had some serious and non-serious relationships in my life so far. I've been in love before, but nothing quite like this guy. We work perfectly together, we do live together, we actually moved to Thailand to teach together. We have a very successful relationship. I could never actually picture marriage with that other man, but with this man, the thought comes so naturally and just seems so right. However, when faced with questions of the future and marriage, he is extremely unsure. He told me, finally, that he does not believe in marriage as an institution, that he believes it has been romanticized and it never used to be about love and he believes it's only of legal benefit now.

 

That alone wouldn't be a huge problem, even though I've always dreamed of a beautiful proposal and being married (not the wedding itself, I'd want something small anyway, something intimate). It's the fact that even though we have a successful relationship, work well together, and face any problems pretty rationally, whenever I ask about the future together, he almost never gives me a straight answer and when he does kind of answer me, he says, "We'll see how it goes."

 

There was one time in particular that he asked me to load a website but had his e-journal open on the main screen. I'd never read it on my own, but my name caught my eye and what I saw wasn't particularly wonderful. It mentioned how he does love me a lot, but he wasn't necessarily done "scouring the land," girl-wise, when he met me. He mentioned again that he loves me, but then went on again to say that he doesn't think he could "pull 10's" but he believes he could do better in the looks department - that I'm not ugly, but not good-looking either.

 

He knows I saw this, and we did talk about it when he realized I saw it, and he didn't really know what to say other than feeling terrible that I had to stumble upon something so negative (I actually stumbled upon it on our anniversary, and initially I thought it was a love letter for our anniversary, go figure). I know this is a big struggle for him, I can see the pain he feels when I ask him and he truly can't answer. He hates seeing me hurt because of his selfishness and inability to answer (those were his words). He says he does love me so much, I mean, we did move to Thailand together. We're originally from New York, so that was a huge move, so it's surprising and honestly hurtful to me that he can't give me any assurance at all that he at least wants to stay with me long-term.

 

I'm just so confused. He tells me he loves me, he has even cried to me saying he doesn't want to lose me, but when I ask him about the future - marriage, commitment, seeing future plans with me - he can't even say something like "I want to be with you for a long time," or "You don't have to be afraid of losing me, I'm not going to leave you." When I tell him I'm scared I'll lose him in the future, he has never once consoled me or gave me assurance that I won't lose him. He says he can't say those things.

 

I was just hoping someone had advice for my long rant. He is an amazing person, would NEVER say any of that to my face (or hurt me in any way), but the lack of assurance hurts, and I just don't know what to do/say sometimes. I bring it up far too often because it hurts me, and I can tell he gets frustrated as well because it's always being talked about. Has anyone else had this kind of situation and ended up getting through? He is very adamant about being against marriage, which does hurt me a bit, but the overall commitment issue kills me. He cries at the thought of losing me, but when I ask him if I'll lose him, his answer just makes me more scared. He says to be here with him now and to not think of the future at all, but sometimes you just want the person you love to hold you and tell you he's with you for the long run and that he'll never hurt you, you know?

 

Thank you so much, this has been weighing on me for a long time and it's nice to see if I can get some advice on the issue/vent about it a bit

[It-is-what-it-is.]

I wish I could give you hope but what you describe isn't good. So I am going to be blunt.

 

You are the right girl for now, but he does not intend to be with you forever. He has told you in numerous ways and you have read his private thoughts about it. Believe what he says.

 

I know you love him, but will you love him if he leaves you 5 years from now when he finds someone more (whatever more means) ?

 

It is possible, not probable, but possible, that he might need to lose you to see your value.

 

But honestly, at your age, I would be looking for your next independent step without him.

 

You have desires to get married and have children and you may need to look elsewhere to find someone to have that with, I would not assume you will have that with him. Please be very careful not to get pregnant.

 

My advice to you is this...stop talking about it. Don't bring it up, don't discuss it with him at all. Talk about your feelings here or create a journal.

 

Start to plan a life without him. Where to go, where to live, etc. start to think about it in real terms. I assume your teaching gig will be up at some point so think about that target date.

 

Make friends, invest in yourself, begin to develop a solid confident you apart from him.

 

At some point you can bring it up (weeks or months from now) and you can discuss it again.

 

But I think he loves you, but that he is not going to ever commit to you long term and when/if he meets someone he will cheat or be gone.

 

Don't you deserve more?

 

IIWII

[georgia girl]

My heart broke for you when I read your post. You are so far from home, your own culture and to not have the security you need is so very sad.

 

My husband and I initially went through something similar and I'm sorry to say that we broke up over it. We are older - in our late 30's - when we were dating. At one point, he said he wasn't ready to commit to me. I was crushed. Then, I walked away and I literally went silent on him. I was so hurt, so absolutely devastated that I just couldn't see/hear from him.

 

In my case, he immediately regretted it and did try to contact me. It took him a month and the intervention of a very good friend for me to even acknowledge him. We ultimately went out for the most awkward lunch and restarted our relationship.

 

Today, we have been married for four years. I can't imagine ever being happier. He makes me feel secure, confident and absolutely adored. I can't believe I get to live this way. It's just amazing.

 

Please, please take care. Consider your options carefully. You are away from home, but when your teaching commitment is up, perhaps you should go home and at least have some "down time" without him. Then, you can find your own bearings again and determine if the risk of the unknown - if he'll ever come around - is okay for you. If it isn't, you may have to walk away - at least for a little while.

 

And understand, that for a man, the search for a partner is instinctive. It's about the hunt and the thrill of that hunt is very intrinsic. You may be the one for him, but he's mourning the loss of the hunt. That could be a very normal part of his process towards commitment. For my husband, it was. It had nothing to do with me or his love for me, but that he realized that there was no more adventure in dating to be had. It was a hurdle for him to get over and in couples' counseling, we learned that this is not a unique issue. This is part of the process a man goes through when he makes a commitment. For a woman, it's different. When we commit, we prepare for a homelife. We see that as the new challenge. So, as members of the opposite sex, we have different approaches to this part of our lives.

 

But, can I promise you one thing? You will live to love again. Whether its him or the next guy or the guy after that. The right one always comes along.

 

Hugs, GG

[tripleaxel13]

Thanks so much for the great responses, this whole thing confuses me a lot, so it's nice to see such support and advice.

 

IIWII - I appreciate blunt advice so much, it helps to hear a truly honest opinion. I have to agree with a bunch of what you say, too. It's not like he doesn't love me, but I do need to make sure I don't lose sight of myself and that if he does leave, that I'll have a stable plan which doesn't end in me crumbling in pain from my loss. I have been working hard on my confidence for a while, and I want to be able to sustain that confidence regardless

 

Our contract does end, the school might want to hire us on for a bit more, which would be great, but you're right, it's good to have a target date to work with. I remember his best friend even came to me and said, "Ya know, I talked to him, he really loves you, but he can't stop thinking with the 'picking up women is fun' part of his brain." And he mentioned that he joked with my boyfriend that if he still wants to "play the field" more, he can always dump me when we get back from Asia. Apparently my boyfriend replied with "I dunno." That does hurt :/ But shortly after it was followed up by, "I'm so happy I get to go to thailand with my sweet girl." So it's confusing! lol

 

And thank you so much for the story, Georgia Girl, it's nice to hear a story similar to mine that worked out. I imagine a marriage between him and I would be quite the same - other than this problem, we have an amazing relationship! With the way he reacts to the thought of losing me, I think it would have a similar affect on him if he was without me for a bit, but I can't be sure.

 

It is scary, the culture is so different here, we're in a rural town where we are the only two foreigners living here, and having comfort and security of the future at home feels essential and yet I don't have it. He has the comfort of knowing I'm in it for the long run, but I don't, and it does wear at me a bit.

 

And thanks so much, tomtucker! I know it's gotta be hard for him, he made a lot of his early 20's about learning how to successfully pick many women up, so to have that gone is a big change for him. My grandparents were married for 72 years and I remember grandpa saying sometimes he wondered if there was someone better out there too, even though he loved my grandma to pieces.

 

He did say a bit factor was my lack of confidence, which I truthfully have been struggling with (but like I said, I'm working on). It's hard because each time I say "I look pretty good in this skirt" or like, "I lost another pound, yay!" I stop and can only remember reading about how he thought I was weirdly shaped in some places and what he said about my looks :/

 

He was able to promise me he wouldn't cheat on me, and I do think I can trust that. When we lost the baby, not too long after, he did say, "When we have a baby, it'll be planned and we'll be in the position to really take care of it." And when I questioned his use of the word "when" rather than "if," he said he said what he meant. Maybe it was just because he was emotional at the time (that would make sense).

 

I'll definitely work at being confident, that's very important to me Thank you guys so much for the advice so far, it's been very helpful.

[Janesays]

I think this may be a case of him not knowing what he has until it's gone. So if I were you, I'd be gone. Without looking back.

 

For the record, I have been in this position and the man did come crawling back promising me love and forever. I couldn't bring myself to take him back, though, because in my heart I knew I deserved someone who would not lose me so easily. You deserve that too.

 

I waited for the man who treated me like he couldn't live without me from the very beginning. Best decision I ever made.

 

Old wishy washy guy can suck it!

[Nyla]

My husband was VERY wishy washy when we were dating. I stopped the make up/break up cycle by finally telling him to stop contacting me until he grew up. I told my then boyfriend that while I loved him and wanted to be with him forever, I wasn't going to wait around for him to make up his mind and stop being a selfish and immature idiot.

 

I had fun without him. He would call me with all his regrets and I would tell him that I was going out on a date, so I didn't have time to talk. He needed to know that I could easily move on without him. When my husband realized that I wasn't going to take him back or stay at home crying, he had a lot of time to think about what he wanted in the long term. He had some issues within himself that kept him from making a commitment.

 

You should not have made such a huge move without the commitment you wanted. My husband wanted me to move to another province with him when we were going out. I refused to leave all my friends and family with no engagement or marriage. It appears that your boyfriend does not want to commit to you, so you have a decision to make. Hopefully Janesays and I are right about your man needing to see what life is like without you.

[tripleaxel13]

I have thought about that, Nyla. It was a HUGE move to make with no commitment. I'm fairly sure I actually wouldn't have moved in permanently with him yet if it was just us moving in with each other in America. I guess in a way, I see it as traveling, and that we didn't move here permanently - it's just an extended trip. Still, I do wonder if it was the right thing.

 

I do know of one relationship where she ended things with him because she did not want to wait for him, not only because he would not give her an answer on whether or not he would commit, but because she was 18 and new to college (and he was just leaving), and she didn't want a LDR (so it wasn't only him). I also know of one of his past relationships (his first really serious one, I think), where he said forever to her because he "had no real reason not to" and she broke up with him, leaving him destroyed for a long time. Maybe this is one of the reasons that he's afraid to do so? He says I am different, and that the other relationships were nothing like this one, but he's still being severely wishy washy about the whole deal.

 

I do feel as if you and janesays are right, I think he'd be shocked and have to really stop and re-think things if I was not there. I do admit, I have made things fairly easy for him. I do a lot for him (nothing I don't want to do, I'm just happy to put effort into the relationship), and sometimes it doesn't seem like he really sees it. I do wonder if his own pride would stop him from admitting his real feelings about being with me (things like "I don't need her if she's not willing to wait and be patient for me to answer" - I do agree that it would have been harsh to leave him immediately, but not to wait and wait and wait), but at that point, heck, I'm better off if he feels that way, lol.

 

We still are out here for a while, and the relationship is still really great. I just gotta figure out exactly what to say to him when I DO bring it up again. While getting a commitment would be amazing, I don't want it to be because he wants to please me, so I want to make sure that if it happens, he means it. Thanks again so much for the responses!! <3

[It-is-what-it-is.]

I think one of the most common mistakes we women make is to not take what our BFs/SO/H say at face value. We hear the words, so we turn them inside out, dissect them, reinterpret them and attribute complex motives to them.

 

Then we think about how to change them.

 

Reality is this. You are there and you have heard his words.

 

He thinks he can do better than you.

 

He loves and cares about you but doesn't see a permanent commitment to YOU.

 

He regrets you found out that he feels that way, and is sorry to have hurt you, but it is the way he feels.

 

Will he change his mind? Maybe.

Does he need to lose you to realize it? Probably

Will he ALWAYS feel like he settled? Probably

 

I don't say these things to hurt you, I just know how much time we waste trying to convince someone to love us, when there are others who would gladly love and cherish us forever.

 

My suggestion, for what it's worth.

 

Stop bringing it up, and stop talking about the future with him, stop rehashing your hurt and hoping he sees the perfection of your relationship.

 

You have this long extended vacation together, but assume you will be breaking up when this contract is over. No long term purchases, no future planning. Just assume what you have is in this window.

 

Start looking at options for when this is over, where you want to live. Go back to NYC, CT, extend your contract there, move to Paris...whatever. Work on our résumé, look at solo housing options. IF he asks, you can tell him you are looking into opportunities for you when the contract is up.

 

IF he asks, you can tell him that you assume that the relationship is time boxed and will be over when the contract is over. You will be "friends" but that your futures are not tied, and you don't want to keep him from finding what he is looking for. You also want to explore relationships with people who will feel that you are the perfect person for them and not be thinking they settled for you.

 

Don't be mad about it, appreciate that he has been honest with you. And when he could have lied and told you nice words to make you feel better he didn't, so he wouldn't give you false hope. Appreciate that. But believe him when he says he cannot commit to you, that he thinks he deserves better.

 

Have fun, be fun while you are there, think of it as a vacation, not playing house for the future.

 

Keep in touch with friends, make friends, build an independent life.

 

Save money.

 

There IS someone who will love you totally and completely and will not be searching for someone better. You have not found him yet.

 

IIWII

[nescafe1982]

 

There IS someone who will love you totally and completely and will not be searching for someone better. You have not found him yet.

 

IIWII

 

IIWII, I just have to say I always nod in deep assent to your advice. I agree 100%. OP, you could have been me 4 years ago, your story sounds so familiar. I think it's time for you to make waves: build an independent life, and don't settle for a man who treats you like an option.