Hello Everyone,
First I just want to say hello and it looks like I'm not the only one out there with marriage problems.
To start off my sign on name is pwsx3 because I am the 3rd PWS with the same initials. My grandpa was phil, my dad is Paul, I'm Perry, and my 16 year old is Patrick and we all have middle names that start with "W".
I have been married for 25 years this March and the wife is wanting to move out on a "trial separation" and at first I didn't want anything to do with it but after talking to a lot of friends/people I have learned I can not stop it and this is something she feels she needs to do so the best thing is to except it and while she is finding herself to work on making myself better.
We have been going off and on to a counosler and I have learned that I was working on the wrong things for our marriage and the only thing that did was make me bitter, which made our relationship worse.
My wife is going into this trial separation as her finding her space (you gals can help me understand that part) getting time to think, etc.
We got married at a young age & both moved from our parents houses into our relationship so Teri feels she has been under her dad's thumb while growing up and she has been under my thumb ever since and can't make her own decisions, come & go when she wants to.
16 years ago I did cheat on Teri and we went to counsoling back then for that and she said she forgave me, but I feel that she still hasn't let it go. I regret that I did it but it happened and I can't change the past. I guess one other time back around the same time I told her that if she ever left me that she would never see our son & she said that has been held over her head all these years.
I have been doing a lot of work in the last month on figuring out what is going on because she says I'm also controlling. Teri is overweight and I used to get after her for eating late at night, she would buy things without discussing it and I would get mad and these are things I can work on and I have been working on.
I have a new saying that I am trying to live by and that is;
If it doesn't directly relate to me, LET IT GO!!!!
and that has helped in trying to tell Teri what is good or bad for her.
Our biggest problem is we don't really have the money for the separation but I feel we need to figure it out so Teri can go out and find herself and what she wants. I figure I don't have anything to loose with a "trial separation" because if we don't try that then she will just get a divorce and then it's over.
Today I am strong and ready for this to move forward, but I know the closer it gets the less I'll feel like eating, my stomic will be in knots, etc. etc. but it is something I need to do.
Hopefully some of you have gone thru this and will be able to help me stay strong and hopefully people have heard or can tell me stories of couples that have tried the trial separation and that it worked and they are back together.
The neighbor told me she knew of two couples that did a separation and they are back together better then before.
I know I need to prepare for the worse, but hope for the best.
Thanks in advance
P.S. I did forget to say I also got the "I love you but I'm not in love with you" talk so I don't know if that means I love you so I don't want to hurt your feelings so we can do a trial separation just so I can get out of the house??????
Or does she really mean it and she will try with time????
I guess I can answer that, only Teri can tell me that.
Last edited by PWSX3; 19th August 2006 at 1:56 PM.
If she wants the separation, your friends are right - you can't do much about it and you need to let her give it a try.
If you were both young when you married, it's very likely what she's telling you is true...she's never been on her own and responsible for her own life. A separation will give her a taste of that...at least the being on her own and making her own decisions and coming and going as she pleases...but it won't give her the full picture, as I'm guessing you'll still be financially responsible for her and she's not planning on getting a job?
I love you, but I'm not in love with you...that can mean a lot of different things. Perhaps she hasn't felt much affection and attention and romance in your marriage, so there's no passion in her heart right now. Getting away might help her regain it, but it's not likely unless you two are also 'dating' and she has an opportunity to feel special again.
as I'm guessing you'll still be financially responsible for her and she's not planning on getting a job?
No she has her own job and with her overtime she makes as much as I do.
We both work in different towns and she is planning on moving to the town she works at, which is 20 miles away from our house now.
It would be unusual for someone to be madly in love after 25 years of ups and downs. She does love you and that's what matters. She probably always will, but it doesn't mean that love will bring her back home.
You will hear all kinds of advice from neighbors (was it really necessary to discuss this with them?) and family members about why she is leaving and what's the best for you. The next thing will be she is going through menopause, she will come back when she comes to her senses, she will realize the grass is not greener on the other side of the fence, and all kinds of primitive reasons.
But the truth is: she left because she has been living in pain for a long time. You think that the 25 years will make it easier for you to reconcile, but the 25 years made it harder for her to make the decision to leave. So if she decided to leave, something in her life must be very wrong.
Teri most likely feels that she has been living as your shadow her whole life. She feels she has sacrificed her best years for you and Patrick. Now when your son has grown up, she decides to live her life for herself. She realizes that Patrick will soon go to college and/or move out and she will stay with you alone. She comes to the point where she would rather live by herself than with you.
She wants to wake up in the morning and not think of how to please you and report to you and answer your questions. and defend herself before you. She wants to breathe freely. She is not 20 anymore and she doesn't have to listen to your commands and complaints. She feels that her life is slipping from her hands and this is her last chance to do something for herself before she gets too old for a new start.
I wouldn't take this separation too lightly if I were you. You didn't mention if you're willing to make some changes in order to make her happy. You seem to only be willing to sit and wait for her to come back. If that's what you're going to do then don't hold your breath.
And while I might be speculating with these assumptions, since I don't know her side of the story, I can't tell you anything, except that you should give her what she wants if you want her back. What she wants might not necessarily be time and space outside the marriage. She might get it within the marriage as well. But she is being realistic and knows what she can and can't get from you.
The only thing I can tell you for sure is that you're far from resolving anything for as long as you're thinking like this:
Quote:
Hopefully some of you have gone thru this and will be able to help me stay strong and hopefully people have heard or can tell me stories of couples that have tried the trial separation and that it worked and they are back together.
The neighbor told me she knew of two couples that did a separation and they are back together better then before.
You want someone to tell you that it will work out by itself. Well I am telling you: it will NOT.
You can't make 3 become 5 unless you add 2. She is missing something that you have to add in the relationship. Or she is sick of something that you need to subtract. Or both.
You seem to be concentrated on yourself and your appetite, instead of her needs. Think about all these years and how much she must have suffered in order to leave you after 25 years. Even if she comes back, if you don't change anything, she won't be happy. Don't you want to make her happy?
She will only come back if she senses a genuine desire to make her happy on your part. If you fail to correct anything, she will never be content with you.
Don't look for happy-ending stories without asking how these couples got back together and what they improved about their relationships. Concentrate on your own improvement and things will fall into place.
I can tell you what every woman wants from her husband: affection, attention, understanding, tolerance, kindness, respect, compassion, and help. What no woman wants is a husband who wants everything to be his way, thinks he is always right, never pronounces the word "sorry" (and actually mean it), who is cold and merciless, who disregards her feelings and needs, makes all decisions for her, makes her feel like she is no good, complains about many things, ignores her when she needs him, etc.
I am not saying you have or haven't been doing any of this. You might make a list of questions or ask her to make a list of the good and bad things about you. Then ask her what she would like to change about you. Then ask her to help you change and work on it together. If you let her go now, it will mean to her that you're letting her go without trying to correct things.
However, if you change for a while just to keep her and then go back to your old self when things get settled, she will lose all faith in you about ever being happy in your marriage. Then she will really leave and never look back. And your promises to change "this time for real" will sound like the story about the boy who cried "Wolf! Wolf!"
You will hear all kinds of advice from neighbors (was it really necessary to discuss this with them?)
I talked to the neihbor because she is a female & has been thru a divorce and just broke up with her boyfriend so I wanted a woman's opinion.
She has helped me in understanding that this is something Teri wants and there is nothing I can do to stop it so I need to except that it is going to happen then like you said work on things that I can do to make myself better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by recordproducer
Teri most likely feels that she has been living as your shadow her whole life. She feels she has sacrificed her best years for you and Patrick. Now when your son has grown up, she decides to live her life for herself. She realizes that Patrick will soon go to college and/or move out and she will stay with you alone. She comes to the point where she would rather live by herself than with you.
She wants to wake up in the morning and not think of how to please you and report to you and answer your questions. and defend herself before you. She wants to breathe freely. She is not 20 anymore and she doesn't have to listen to your commands and complaints. She feels that her life is slipping from her hands and this is her last chance to do something for herself before she gets too old for a new start.
I wouldn't take this separation too lightly if I were you. You didn't mention if you're willing to make some changes in order to make her happy. You seem to only be willing to sit and wait for her to come back. If that's what you're going to do then don't hold your breath.
I think you hit it on the head with this statement and no I'm not just going to set around and wait. She has told me some things I need to work on and I am going to do that. Like I said before I would judge things she did or tell her she was doing it incorrectly so like I said before I'm going to practice;
If it doesn't directly relate to me, LET IT GO!!
If she eats a piece of pie late that will be her choice and I won't say anything about it.
Even after she moves out we are planning on going to counsoling and yes I do plan on working on this because if she doesn't come back I want to learn how to make myself better for myself and hopefully someone else down the road if that happens.
Quote:
Originally Posted by recordproducer
You seem to be concentrated on yourself and your appetite, instead of her needs. Think about all these years and how much she must have suffered in order to leave you after 25 years. Even if she comes back, if you don't change anything, she won't be happy. Don't you want to make her happy?
Don't look for happy-ending stories without asking how these couples got back together and what they improved about their relationships. Concentrate on your own improvement and things will fall into place.
I can tell you what every woman wants from her husband: affection, attention, understanding, tolerance, kindness, respect, compassion, and help.
I am not saying you have or haven't been doing any of this. You might make a list of questions or ask her to make a list of the good and bad things about you. Then ask her what she would like to change about you. Then ask her to help you change and work on it together. If you let her go now, it will mean to her that you're letting her go without trying to correct things.
However, if you change for a while just to keep her and then go back to your old self when things get settled, she will lose all faith in you about ever being happy in your marriage. Then she will really leave and never look back. And your promises to change "this time for real" will sound like the story about the boy who cried "Wolf! Wolf!"
Thank you very much, this is all good information that I need to look at to better myself. Yes I want to make myself better, I guess I really didn't realize that she has been hurting for so long.
I have excepted that she is moving out and that we might not get back together, but like you said if this is so important to her that she is welling to give up not just our family but my relation that she loves then there is something very wrong and I need to fix what I can on my side.
Recordproducer, I just want to say thank you for what you posted because I let Teri read it and she said you hit it on the head!!!!
I am hoping after she moves out (next month) she can clear her head then we can start working on the issues at hand, but first she just wants her space.
I know what I need to work on but I just don't know for sure how to change my habits of 25 years.
I still plan on going to counsoling and hopefully that will help.
Again thanks it helped a lot!!!!
Last night Teri said she was going to go look at a little apartment and asked if I would go with?
She said she stopped on her way home from work and looked at it but almost didn't stop because it looked pretty run down. She decided to check it out and it is an older building in a small town between the town we live in & where she works.
It has one bedroom, livingroom, kitchen and bathroom, but the rent in only $450.00 with utilities so that will help out on our money situation.
They won't take dogs so I'll keep both dogs and Patrick said he will stay with me most of the time because of school.
I know once she moves it's really going to hurt because she was packing up some stuff last night and I really got that bad feeling in my stomic again. I know we are still trying to work things out but I just keep getting that feeling of once she is gone she won't want to come back.
People have suggested that we have Patrick see a counsoler and I don't think his school has one. I know this will have an impact on him even though he tells me there is nothing he can do about it and we keep telling him that none of this has anything to do with him, but it's his mom & dad that need to think things out.
I know once she moves it's really going to hurt because she was packing up some stuff last night and I really got that bad feeling in my stomic again. I know we are still trying to work things out but I just keep getting that feeling of once she is gone she won't want to come back.
I am so sorry, Perry. I feel for you. After 25 years it must be hard.
Actually I was hoping that Teri would work on your marriage together with you. It's alarming that you have that feeling that she is not coming back. It's your intuition.
As much as I understand her, I feel sorry for you too. I wish you all the luck in the world to get back together and be happy like never before.
Keep venting here if you need an ear and a shoulder to cry on.
Actually I was hoping that Teri would work on your marriage together with you. It's alarming that you have that feeling that she is not coming back. It's your intuition.
I guess the reason I feel this way is because I have two female friends that say they were in the same situation and both of them ended in divorce.
Teri keeps telling me she just needs her space to think things out so I see it as her just working on what she needs. She said at this time she doesn't want to work on our relationship.
Like you said I'm thinking selfish again and need to remember once Teri finds who she is and if she misses me then she will be welling to work on our relationship but it's hard to think possitive when I just see the negitive things happening around us that is pulling us apart.
Again thanks for what you wrote it has helped a lot to understand both sides.
I'm thinking selfish again and need to remember once Teri finds who she is and if she misses me then she will be welling to work on our relationship but it's hard to think possitive when I just see the negitive things happening around us that is pulling us apart.
Weird how when a MAN decides he wants to separate and he "needs some space", we just think he's an a*hole who's evading his domestic responsibilities.
But apparently when a WOMAN does it.... she just needs "to find herself".
I think you're being had, PWS. According to Dr. Willard Harley, the founder of Marriagebuilders:
Quote:
....the risks of separation are great. It should be used only as a last resort to help resolve a fatal flaw in marriage. Once separated, couples often never do reconcile, remaining separated for life, or they eventually divorce. A fact unknown to many is that fifteen to twenty percent of all married couples end their lives permanently separated. These, who are not included in divorce statistics, usually feel that they should not legally divorce for religious reasons. But for most practical purposes, they are as divorced as those legally divorced. Their separation did not create the opportunity for reconciliation, but rather, created an even higher barrier between spouses.
Not every offer of "trial" separation is made with honest intent. Sometimes it's made in an effort to keep the other spouse calm and malleable while the exiting spouse makes their getaway.
The added benefit is that it keeps the other guy waiting, kind of like a safety net... while the exiting spouse makes an attempt at establishing life as a single.
The only really GOOD excuse for physical separation that I've read about is as an intervention to allow time for resolving destructive behaviors. In the case of drug abuse, physical abuse, or things of that nature, the destructive behaviors must be addressed before the couple can work on the relationship.
IMHO, I view the ultimatum of "either trial separation or out-and-out divorce" as Emotional Blackmail. If it were me... I'd rather BE divorced than to live with someone who would treat me that way.
A good friend emailed me today and told me that I need to look inside myself to find what I need to change & I just don't know how to start. I thought I had been doing a good job but I wasn't so I am confused.
Does anyone know of a good book that I could read about being controlling and belittling people as she put it, which are two things she said I do and so does Teri?
She also told me to not worry about if we are going to get back together again but to figure out what has been broken and fix that and then see where you are at that point. I guess I have a lot to learn..
Yesterday Teri went and saw our counsoler and then we sat at the table and talked.
At first Teri said she was moving out that our boy could decide who he wanted to stay with and that she figured with me would be better because I was closer to school.
Last night she said she wants to take Patrick because she feels because of me being controlling that I'm a bad infloance on him and that I talk bad about woman which is bad for him.
She suggested that I either move out to an apartment or I move into my folkes basement for 3 months, which if I move in with my folks then I would have money left over that I could still go see the counsoler.
Only reason I would move out is so Patrick would still be in a comfortable place he knows and it's closer to school.
My selfishness comes out and thinks that if Teri stays here that she is getting her cake and eating it too but I know that isn't the attatude to take.
I also thought that if she is still here she wouldn't get the full affect of being on her own, but then that isn't what is the problem, the problem is does she still love me & she just needs to miss me and can she do that living in a place she has lived over 20 years at???
I do have a question and she is still thinking of this as just getting away so she can collect her thoughts, but how do I suppose to move on and distance myself from her so I don't get hurt but still think in 3 months (or whenever) there is a chance we will get back together.
Teri said right now she feels so numb that she doesn't know what is going to happen, but if we don't separate for a while it will be a divorce and I feel I have to give the separation a try.
Thanks!
Just wondering if anyone knows, if I would move out instead of the wife would I loose any rights since I moved out????
I don't want to loose custidy with my boy or end up being taking to the cleaners.
Oh, my God! Now she wants YOU to move out. This is YOUR house too, right? Nobody can kick you out of your house! It's not you the one who wants to find himself outside the marriage. Why would you let your wife throw you out of your own house so she can breathe a little without you? That's completely unfair!
She starting to act unfair and I have a feeling that this will end up with the two of you fighting like a dog and cat. Before she was afraid that you would take Patrick away from her, if you would get divorced. Now she would leave him in a blink of an eye. If you don't move out, she will. He is still a child, for god's sake. He is not 22 and living with his parents; he is a kid! He needs his mother to take care of him. If she leaves, he won't drive to her condo to meet her every day for a couple hours. He will feel abandoned. He will come home from school and his mom won't be there to ask him how he spent the day, kiss him, and give him a meal. Sure, he can get the meal himself... and the kiss ... and the mom's company is available if he needs her. But he will wonder if she needs him!
If I were you, I would stay in the house with Patrick, unless he wants to go with his mom, but I don't think he will. She can't force you to leave your house and your son.
If you were so bad and her attempts to change you were futile then separation certainly won't change you, because - as you stated - you don't know where to start. You can change your behavior toward her, not your inner self and how can you prove you've changed if she is not around? The book you need is Teri's instructions on what she needs from her husband and you won't find it anywhere but in her store.
Do you really talk bad about women? Have you cheated on Teri (cheating that she knows of)? Have you ever been physical abusive with her? Called her bad names? Yelled at her often?
I think separations are generally just the beginning of the end. Ask her if the separation means you can date other people (both of you). I would also ask her if the two of you are going to see each other (go out, have sex, etc.) or is it going to be a no-contact thing.
She doesn't want to work on the marriage so I guess you have no choice but to let her go and find herself. If YOU leave the house then it IS a divorce. If the only solution she accepts is to kick YOU out of the house then the next step will definitely be filing for divorce so you might as well do it immediately.
Please note: The suggestions and advice offered on this web site are opinions only and are not to be used in the place of professional psychological counseling or medical advice. If you or someone close to you is currently in crisis or in an emergency situation, contact your local law enforcement agency or emergency number.
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