Cheating Wife

[hurtingbad]

I posted this same message in a different spot, and thought this might be a better place. I would appreciate any insight all of you may have.

My wife and I have been married for almost 11 years. I found out about 6 months ago that she had been talking to some guy on the phone for at least the previous 6 months. She has continued to deny that she has had sex, or even contend that it was an emotional affair. We have now been separated for about 3 months, after among other things I found out her relationship with this man continued. I feel like a real snoop, but I found a journal in her closet where she noted among other things, how this man didn't want to have anything to do with her anymore, and how sad she was about this. She said that "of course all he wanted was sex" and "thank god I didn't get pregnant" and "I cheated on my husband, and acted like a whore." I confronted my wife about finding out this information and she still says that these were "just her feelings at the time" and that it is not an admission of any kind of sexual activity. My question is "Am I crazy, or is her journal an admission of sexual intercourse?" And if so, how do I take things from here? I feel I should probably see a doctor about possible STD's. I am confused as to why my wife continues to be dishonest with me. Should I just end everything now? I do love my wife, but how could I ever trust her again?

[Mz. Pixie]

I'm sorry for your pain.

 

I hate to tell you but from what I've read, yes, she cheated physically. The reason I say this is because I did it during my marriage and I lied about it extensively to cover it up. I'm not proud of my actions and I regret it. Cheaters usually lie to cover up their actions until they cannot lie anymore. Some do it to cover their rears, others to keep from hurting their spouse (mine was the last).

 

You can recover from this and your marriage can. It doesn't sound like your wife is interested in that however. You're separated and she's still seeing this other guy.

 

If you're truly interested google Marriage Builders. Counseling at this point would be a must. Don't expect her to be immediately receptive to your approach because she's in a sort of a fog right now from cheating. There's lots of information on that site for that.

 

The one thing that is important if she wants to make the marriage work and that is for her to stop all communication with the other man. No attempt to save the marriage will work while she is still in any form of contact with him.

 

Good luck!

[ConfusedInOC]

Originally posted by hurtingbad

I posted this same message in a different spot, and thought this might be a better place. I would appreciate any insight all of you may have.

My wife and I have been married for almost 11 years. I found out about 6 months ago that she had been talking to some guy on the phone for at least the previous 6 months. She has continued to deny that she has had sex, or even contend that it was an emotional affair. We have now been separated for about 3 months, after among other things I found out her relationship with this man continued. I feel like a real snoop, but I found a journal in her closet where she noted among other things, how this man didn't want to have anything to do with her anymore, and how sad she was about this. She said that "of course all he wanted was sex" and "thank god I didn't get pregnant" and "I cheated on my husband, and acted like a whore." I confronted my wife about finding out this information and she still says that these were "just her feelings at the time" and that it is not an admission of any kind of sexual activity. My question is "Am I crazy, or is her journal an admission of sexual intercourse?" And if so, how do I take things from here? I feel I should probably see a doctor about possible STD's. I am confused as to why my wife continues to be dishonest with me. Should I just end everything now? I do love my wife, but how could I ever trust her again?

 

Sorry for your pain. Unfortunately it's very obvious they were having sex.

 

You certainly have a good reason in God's eyes to end the marriage. Infidelity is one of the most despicable things you can do to your S/O IMHO, but it's up to you. Do you want to forgive her? If so, that's very big of you.

 

I would suggest starting with Love Must Be Tough - Dr. James Dobson.

 

Best of luck to you.

[hurtingbad]

Thanks for the replies. I have perused the marriagebuilders website extensively. It has been an excellent source for me. I do believe there is an outside chance that we could save our marriage if she could just come clean and be open and honest about what happened and why. We have gone to marriage counseling recently but I don't see any point in continuing until she opens up. It is just so hard still for me to believe that my best friend in the world can continue to hurt me like she does. How did your husband react to learning of your affair? And if you stayed together, how were you able to accomplish it? I have also expressed to her that she needs to stop all communication with this guy, but she seems unwilling or more likely unable to do so. It almost seems like a teenage crush type of thing, where she has built up an enormous infatuation for him. I do know that he doesn't want to have anything to do with her anymore, but I also know that she is thinking about him constantly, and that fact hurts worse than the sex part. She has been emotionally detached from me for a very long time, and it hurts to find out that it was because she was emotionally attached to this other guy. What a F-ing mess!

[whichwayisup]

It almost seems like a teenage crush type of thing, where she has built up an enormous infatuation for him. I do know that he doesn't want to have anything to do with her anymore, but I also know that she is thinking about him constantly, and that fact hurts worse than the sex part. She has been emotionally detached from me for a very long time, and it hurts to find out that it was because she was emotionally attached to this other guy. What a F-ing mess!

 

Yes. That is the main reason why she doesn't "get" it or "understand" the pain she's put you through. She is caught up in the fantasy of this OM and how intense her crush-like feelings are...And that is really addictive! It's like she craves him and beyond that she cannot see...Which is why she isn't thinking as she would if this man wasn't in the picture.

 

She really needs to end it completely, do NO CONTACT and really try hard to get over him and the feelings. She may want to seek out therapy to help her cope because you can't be her shoulder...That isn't fair or right to you.

 

Hang in there.

[cranium]

How did your husband react to learning of your affair? And if you stayed together, how were you able to accomplish it?

 

I, like you, was devastated to learn of MW's A. MW had been emotionally detached from me as well (and me from her) for a time, but it wasn't b/c she was emotionally attached to this other guy, at least not at first. She told me she thought we might need to separate. I wouldn't agree. I asked her if there was anyone else and like Mz. Pixie, she lied extensively. I immediately got us into counseling. Her OM happened to come along in the right place at the right time. Sounds like your W's OM did as well.

 

We had several marriage counseling sessions over a period of 4 months where I was going along under the illusion of working on our communication issues, but she had to be caught in order to reveal why we weren't moving forward. Once I presented her with irrefutable evidence (condom & wrapper) and the A was exposed and ended, we have made great progress. She couldn't deny anymore.

 

MW still works with her OM, but she is open and honest with me regarding any contact they have. We are both committed to our relationship and we are both working to repair the damage.

 

What does your counselor think? Have you discussed in MC what you read in her journal?

 

As wwiu advised in your Other Man/Woman thread, read DazednConfused's thread on Infidelity, or ThumbingMyWay's or mine.

 

Cranium

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t57566

[hurtingbad]

We have not been to counseling since I found the journal. As I said, I don't really see the point in us going back to counseling when she refuses to even acknowledge to me that she had an affair, even though she wrote it down on paper and I read it, she is still telling me "I don't have anything to come clean about." She acts as if I am a complete idiot! I have always heard that cheaters' will always deny, deny, deny to the bitter end. However, I would have thought by now with all that I have learned that she would come clean. She claims that she still loves me, but if she loves me wouldn't she want finally be honest?

[whichwayisup]

Until she feels and understand the consquences of her actions, nothing will change. Sadly, but true.

 

I think maybe TELL her she has NO choice in the matter. If she wants the marriage she MUST go to councilling!Or threaten to expose her A to everybody, including the OM wife if he is married or seeing somebody too. That will make her stop in her tracks cuz it will ruin what she has with him even more. Once completely out in the open they can't hide it and enjoy it anymore.

[jmargel]

Hurtingbad.. about 4 years ago I became friends and had sex with a married woman. The sex was only twice. My intentions were to never have slept with her. Her husband was not there for her, verbally abusive and it got physical towards the end. She didn't wear her wedding ring for years. She just couldn't take anymore of what he was doing. She was faithful to him for 18 years.

 

Her and I started talking I would give her advice day after day how to maybe work things out with him. It was exhausting. This was all done on instant messenger. She only lived a few minutes away. I was trying to help her for about 6 months before we met in person.

 

It was weird meeting her in person after giving her all this advice and being there. My intentions were pure. We met at a park. I sat on the bench next to her and was talking to her about her problems when SHE made the first move. It was the head on the shoulder move then she kissed me. At the time I didn't have any feelings for her but friendship and it just felt awkward.

 

We went to a few places during the next couple of months together but nothing romantic. I didn't want to pursue a married woman especially in the condition she was. When the sex happened (one was just oral), it just felt.... awkward. When I actually had sex with her I stopped. We eventually just went back to chatting online now & then.

 

Weird thing was I didn't know but she had a HUGE crush on me. Asked me if she could come over one night, I was kinda iffy about it but said ok. When she came over she admitted that she was in love with me. It was the hardest thing to do to tell her I didn't love her back. She went totally ballistic. I was not ready for that. Couple days later she IMed me to tell me she was in the hospital, mainly because she couldn't take the rejection.

 

All contact soon stopped after that. She moved on with her life. Not sure where she is at now. But anyways my point is I was the first guy in 18 years that showed an interest in her, even if it was just friendly. She saw something that she lacked for a very long time. She was able to get close to someone and trust them. There is a reason why your wife has done this. She hasn't done this to hurt you, she has done this because something is missing in your marriage. Try to be honest in what both of you have failed at in this marriage so far. Bad communication, not being there for each other, etc..

 

She's not ready to leave this guy because what she's been missing in you she found in him. That's not to be an insult or to put you down. Right now she can't see you having that inside to give her now. That's something you might want to talk about with her. Try to approach it from that angle. What she's done is wrong but one person doesn't cheat on another for no reason at all.

[hurtingbad]

The hardest thing for me to admit, during this time in my life, has been my own shortcomings as a husband. I do realize that I played a part in why she had an affair, and I have expressed this to my wife. Clearly I was not meeting all of her needs. I love my wife very much and don't think for a second that she did this out of spite or anything like that. She was missing something and this guy filled that void. I have throughout our marriage had a communication problem, where I just keep most things bottled up. I have told my wife that I recognize this fault, and am willing to work on it, and other issues. The problem is, she has actually said on one occasion, that it just may be too late. I am beginning to question whether or not she really does love me. How do you know for sure? I believe she cares for me, but I think it is almost more like she would any other family member or friend.

[jmargel]

If she loves you? None of us can answer that. She's not even thinking with a clear head. So the things she's saying to you don't take them too personally. If I were in your situation, tell her that you want to work things out and that you'll be here for her when she's ready to talk and want to move on with counseling. Perhaps you want to do this by yourself first, it does help alot. I've gotten some great advice from mine.

 

Right now she doesn't have faith in your words only actions will speak, so look for a good licensed marriage counselor and go by yourself a few times. Having your wife see this might get her to look at you differently (in a good way).

 

I can imagine this is tough, hang in there.

[Mz. Pixie]

Gosh J- that was a great story.

 

Too often the wife who cheats is thought of as only a whore. I tell my story because that was not the case with me. I'd been faithful for all of those years- up until the last six months of my marriage. My needs had been unmet for years and years. I was verbal about it though, telling him, he just never listened.

 

There is another book by Chapman called Winning back your wife or something like that I suggest you read. It's for men in your situation I believe.

[TMCM]

I do realize that I played a part in why she had an affair, and I have expressed this to my wife. Clearly I was not meeting all of her needs

.

 

The only part you played was in not meeting her emotional needs [chances are good that your emotional needs were not met by her as well] but only she is solely responsible for the choices she took in crossing marital boundaries. Both of you are equally responsible for the bad state of your marriage but only your W is 100% responsible for choosing to have an affair, never forget that.

 

TMCM

[TMCM]

I want to caution you about marriage counseling at this time. IF your W is having an affair, then no amount of counseling is going to help end it and it just might give her justification for saying to herself and others that she 'tried' but that there was no hope for the marriage. In other words, marriage counseling while having an affair is dangerous to the marriage and it is a sham. If she is involved with this OM [other man] from work, then both her heart and mind will not have the energy needed to do her part of the work that will be needed in a marital recovery plan. You MUST calmly, quietly and respectfully convey this to your W and that you would rather find out the truth from her than from other sources.

 

Good luck and keep us updated.

 

TMCM

[cranium]

Originally posted by TMCM: In other words, marriage counseling while having an affair is dangerous to the marriage and it is a sham. If she is involved with this OM [other man] from work, then both her heart and mind will not have the energy needed to do her part of the work that will be needed in a marital recovery plan.

 

Having been in MC while MW was involved in her affair, I know what TMCM is saying. The counseling didn't end the affair. Hell, MW didn't sleep with her OM until after we had been in counseling for 6 weeks. I would have much rather have found out the truth from MW than on my own.

 

The 4 months we were in counseling before I found out were beneficial to us, even though she really wasn't fully there. It did give us an opportunity to work on other emotional needs we were not meeting for each other. I had a tendency to keep things bottled up also, and MC has helped me in that regard.

 

Make sure to take care of yourself. This is also one thing I have learned. I am now eating better, hitting the gym several times a week, etc. Don't lose sight of yourself.

[scarlyjones]

Poor thing

 

It ALWAYS amazes me that people cheat and go WRITE IT DOWN somewhere. Im very sorry for what you're going thru. I'd get myself a good lawyer and get rid of her. You deserve so much better.

[hurtingbad]

I told my wife yesterday that I basically don't want to have anything to do with her until she is ready to come clean. She is still claiming there is nothing to add. Unfortunately, I can't completely cut loose because we have 2 children and are required to see each other for their sake. I really am beginning to feel that no matter what, she is not going to come out with the truth. I have set up a meeting with a counselor for myself. I definately need to discuss some of these issues with a professional and am looking forward to our meeting. I have greatly appreciated all of your input, I can't begin to describe how therapeutic it has been. I do firmly still believe that us going to joint counseling is a complete waste of time until she can come clean and or get over this other man. The lengths to which my wife has gone to deceive me is beginning to slowly unravel the love that I have for her. Don't get me wrong, I will always love her, and I will always try to think of how she was before she changed, but I believe that my patience has reached its limit, and I am just feeling like it is time to move on and forget about the idea of her changing back to what she once was. Does this make any sense?

[fleafly]

I can tell you from my own experience, my wife kept a journal of her affair because she felt she couldnt talk about it with anyone else. I fell your pain man, its not easy picking up a journal and reading about the intimate details, this is something that I always go back to, cant seem to let go. I commend you for staying strong in this **** you are going through. I do have a question for you, do you know who the other man is? My wife intially denied as well, only because she want to protect the OM and his family. Too bad her journal came with pictures, that I later found. Anyways, hang in there, this is a good place for support. You might want to check out my thread as well, its a few pages down the line, it might help explain the emotions you are going through-crazy time, i feel for you.

 

flea

[hurtingbad]

I believe that is the same reason that my wife kept a journal. I am almost certain that she hasn't discussed this matter with those that are closest to her, and I am sure that the guilt that she is feeling must be eating her up inside, and my guess is that the journal is a way of getting some of this off her chest. In the journal, the first 10-15 pages were torn out, and it obviously makes me very curious as to what was on those pages. I have spoken to the guy(at 1st very threatening, since then, not so). He isn't anybody that I know or have ever met, I don't even know what he looks like, just that he is about 5 years younger than me and my wife.

[fleafly]

I will also add this, since we are both in the same situation as far as the journal. I say I have a hard time getting over this only because this is the one true thing that I found devoid of the lies I heard after I found out. My wife wrote things such as " Im running out of excuses to tell (me) so we can be together". Things like this made me realize what a cold and caclulating person she had become. She has shown great remorse since this came out, but I have a hard time figuring out if this is only because when she called the Om and told him I knew, he told her he didnt ever want to talk to her again. I also talked to his wife, and she said that my wife also asked him if things didnt work out wife his wife, could they still be together. My wife denies this, of course.

 

For now I would just try counseling for yourself, work on yourself for awhile. Im on my second go around in counseling myself. When I initially found out, I was so repulsed that I felt the only recourse was to move out, which I did. Ive since been in self destruct mode, doing alot of things that Im am not proud of at all. I often times wake up wondering how the hell my life has gotten to this point in such a short time, and it kills me knowing my kids were so innocently and callously put in the middle of this. I have found a therapist that I think will help me through this, I have seen her only two times but she has opened up alot of things that have really helped me. That said, LISTEN to what people tell you in here, I made the mistake of letting my emotions override my thinking most times, something I regret deeply. Have you read Dazed thread yet? He also wrote an ebook that would help you through this, havent heard from him in awhile though.