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Join Date: Oct 2004
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My girlfriend staying at her guy "friend's" place
*** I'm very sorry about the formatting. I typed this in wordpad, and it seems to automatically add line breaks and I don't know how to get rid of them! I tried Word to no avail... I'll be more careful next time. ***
Hi all,
I'm a noob, first post here. I know it's usually standard practice to lurk around a
bit when one first arrives at a new forum, but I need some relief fast. Anyone got
any Tums? ;-)
The situation I have with my girlfriend has been troubling me all week, and I was
wondering if anyone could either comfort me because I'm out of my tree, or tell me
that the warning signs are there and to be extra careful. (Wish I'd found this place
then!)
Here's the situation (it's LONG, but I like to include details just in case they
might mean something. Sorry if it's boring):
I live in Japan. I am Canadian and my gf is Japanese, not that that really matters
except for some possible language difficulties once in a while.
A couple of weeks ago, she told me that she's going to go to Mexico with her friend
from work. Last week, Monday, she told me that her friend had cancelled and how I'd
feel if she went alone. I told her that I wouldn't like that, that a woman
travelling around Mexico alone isn't safe. (I omitted the part about being jealous
of her getting picked up by every guy that sees her. She's quite good looking, at
least to me, but I can't say for sure how popular she'd be around most other
tourists of Caucasian decent. Some like the Asian look, some don't.)
Anyway, next day, Tuesday, we talk and I ask her what she's decided. She said that
she has changed her mind about Mexico but that she'd still like to go somewhere
since she had already taken the time off. As a guy that likes to travel too, I can
understand this feeling very well. The last thing I wanted to do was try to stop her
from travelling just to ease my jealous fears. I have to trust her. During this
conversation, we discussed the possibility of my going with her somewhere close for
the weekend and that she could continue on her own after I came back. All I had to
do is check prices and if it was reasonably affordable, I'd love to go with her. She
tells me that since she's leaving Saturday, she needs to hurry and make a decision
quickly. As it is, she stands to lose a lot of money if she cancels outright, and
every day she waits will cost her more.
Next day, Wednesday, I find out I've got a meeting at work on the weekend, so I
can't go anywhere with her. I send her a short email telling her that and that I'm
sorry, I would have loved to go with her.
I got no response from her Wednesday night.
(At this point, I should add that in our relationship, I'd been sorta getting the
feeling that maybe I'm not as appreciated as I should be. Meaning that I seemed to
be the only one to go out of my way to do things to make her happy. For example, I
cook her dinner, but she doesn't offer to do the dishes voluntarily. I kind of have
to suggest it, and even then she whines about getting me to help her. I pick her up
and drop her off at her place all the time. When I told her she should take her
bicycle to my place to see me, it was the funniest joke she'd ever heard. But I was
serious, not all the time of course, but once in a while would be nice. I actually
live closer to her than work and she cycles to work every single day. She was never
good at getting back to my emails promptly, etc. So, at around this time, I was
thinking, "screw that. I'm not gonna call or mail again until she gets back to me
somehow." The point is that I was starting to wonder if she was just this aloof
chick who enjoyed the attention and not much else from me, so I wanted to see her
make some effort, at least a little.)
Thursday comes, I give in and email her. I want to know what's going on with her
trip. I ask her if she's decided where she's going and I apologize again for having
the meeting and not being able to go somewhere with her.
She mails back, "I'm might go to Italy, or cancel, not sure. I have to decide by
tomorrow morning."
I write back, "Italy sounds wonderful! I wish I could go... Still might cancel?
Wouldn't you lose a lot of money doing that? Anyway, if you DO go, will we have time
to meet and watch that video we were meaning to?" This was at 9pm. Knowing that
she'd have to pack for her trip if she went, I was hoping she'd tell me, "hey, we
live close, let's meet tonight for a couple of hours."
Her reply comes at 2am. "I've decided to go to Italy! I'm leaving Saturday. Tomorrow
night I'm seeing my mother. Sorry, I don't think we'll have time to meet before I
go. Call you tomorrow."
Now, I'm pissed that she didn't get back to me earlier, that she didn't suggest
meeting tonight while there was still time. That she'll be packing most of Saturday
and didn't suggest that to be a good time either. I'm hurt, and I'm hurt that got
back to me so late. I was awake, but in bed. Again, I thought, she said she's gonna
call, so screw it, I'll wait till she does.
Friday night, she calls me after work, about 9pm. "I bought my ticket to Italy
today! I leave tomorrow!" At this point, I'm feeling worried about her and also
quite jealous of my babe travelling alone, but no sense killing the mood, so I stay
positive, "That's awesome. Italy! I'm so envious!"
Then she tells me that she has a friend who lives there that will show her around.
Good news! Right? So, I gush my enthusiasm that I'm happy she's going somewhere nice
and that she'll have someone to take care of her and show her around.
She proceeds to get upset for two reasons. One, because I didn't email again or call
Wednesday after telling her I had a meeting. She took this to mean that I was very
casual about it all and didn't really care if I went with her or not. I told her
that's not the case, that I was at work and couldn't email something longer because
I was busy. Didn't see the point in writing more later and anyway, I don't know when
she gets home from work, so in fact I was expecting a response from her Wednesday
night! And two, because she thinks I'm not worried about her. I retaliate that she's
got it all wrong, that I told her I didn't want her travelling alone when we were
discussing Mexico, etc. She thinks I was talking just about Mexico... I say that of
course I'm very worried but you've made your decision, etc., I want to support you.
She tells me that she has no time to talk cuz she's expecting an email from her
Italian friend. Conversation ends coldly on both sides.
After getting off the phone, I send her an email telling her that I'm stunned she
said that to me, that I do care, but she didn't seem to consider my feelings in her
decision, that I had wished she would cancel the trip and stay with me but I
couldn't possibly ask her to do that, and that her accusations were bull.
She emails me back at 3am! "Sorry, I was hurt because you always just use email and
never call me. You didn't call again or send another nicer email. I felt you just
rejected our plans lightly and easily."
I email her early in the morning again to tell her that she should not judge my
feelings based on the fact that I often email instead of phoning her. That I'm hurt
she would use that as a yardstick instead of all our other interactions, how I am
with her in general, etc. And I also emphasize that I AM worried and also jealous.
Who is this friend? Guy? Girl? Ex-bf? I don't know anything and you just told me
this with no other info. I get the point across that I'm quite worried, jealous and
also happy to support her decision to travel alone even if it means that I have to
keep these feelings in check and I can't go with her. I finished it with a few
travel tips and telling her to be really careful. (I didn't know what time the
flight left the next morning, so I wasn't sure if I'd get a chance to talk to her
again.)
Saturday morning, 11am. "I never knew that stuff because you never expressed it to
me that way. Now I understand. Thank you. I'll be careful. See ya."
I notice that there's no mention of this 'friend', so I call her, (knowing that she
likes to get calls in the first place, I figure this can't be a bad move.)
I just KNOW this friend is a guy, so even though she begins the conversation by
apologizing about the night before's little spat, I just reply with an "uh-huh" and
move on to asking her if this friend is male. She says yes. I am stumped, don't know
what to say, repeat a few "I see"s and then say that I shouldn't interrupt her as
she's packing. We hang up.
Now, my paranoid spidey sense is often (unfortunately) accurate (if I get it). I
think, there's no way in hell this girl is going to meet a friend in Italy and not
stay at his house.
I send her an email saying I need to see her before she goes, she says ok, I go
over. Again, I'm not feeling good about the way everything is going down, so I enter
the apartment with a fairly cool attitude. It doesn't take long for me to get to my
question. "Are you staying at his place?"
The answer, as we all know, otherwise I wouldn't be writing this, was "yes".
I started out calmly, but it didn't take long for me to get angry about this. I
didn't accuse her of cheating on me, but in Japan at least, for a girl with a bf to
stay at a guy's place is highly, highly unusual. (Unless of course, she wants to
sleep with him.) My emotions were mixed throughout the squabble. I was angry, half
out of jealousy, half out of hurt that she had hidden it from me. The beginning of
the conversation could be characterized mostly by jealousy, and the second half hurt
from being excluded. During the first half, she stated, rather matter-of-factly,
that he is a friend and lives with his parents. What I felt at the time was that she
was making no effort to put my mind at ease. That she wasn't saying it warmly or
comfortingly at all. At some point, she said "well, I could've lied and told you it
was a girl and there would have been no problem, but I wanted to be honest." I
guess, whatever. Eventually, she asked, "well what am I supposed to do now?
Everything is set and I'm leaving in an hour!" To which I answered, "who's fault is
that? You didn't tell me anything until now!" She stopped and said, "fine, I'll stay
in a hotel."
I was sure that this was just to satiate my anger. After all, she could go and stay
at his place and I would be none the wiser. Plus the fact that she hid it from me in
the first place told me that she wouldn't really change her plans, she would just
tell me so and unless I ask to produce receipts, I'll never know. I told her not to
change her plans, that essentially I trust her, but that the real reason I was hurt
is that she didn't tell me and I had to basically 'catch' her at it. She didn't
outright lie, no, but omission in this case is pretty much the same to me. Anyway, I
told her that I don't want her to change her plans because really, it all comes down
to trust. She can tell me what she wants, and even if she DID stay in a hotel, she
could just as easily (maybe moreso) sleep with him there if that's what she was
going to do. Not to mention that if sex with someone else is priority, it can happen
in Japan, etc. I can't be with her 24/7 so trust is all I have and no matter where
she catches her zzz's, trust is something I have to give her or leave the
relationship.
But the fight continued because she didn't apologize or even seem sorry that she
hadn't included my opinion in making her plans. Didn't ask me how I felt. Didn't
consider that I might be jealous or worried. She argued that it was all last minute,
and while that term does apply, she had decided on her plans two nights before. That
gave her, at the very least Friday night to talk to me about it. But she didn't.
Eventually, I got so fed up that we were talking in circles, (she kept repeating
that she had no time to talk about it and didn't really choose to hide it, and I,
knowing that that wasn't a very good excuse was in disbelief that she couldn't at
least say she's sorry and reassure me that there really nothing going on with him),
so I asked, "what's going on with us then?"
I so didn't want to break up, but with the way things were going, I thought a) I
can't trust her, and even moreso, b) I can't be with someone who is so selfish and
inconsiderate whether she sleeps with him or not.
She asked what I meant, break up or stay together? I kinda waffled, didn't give a
straight answer. Fighting resumed.
Positions didn't change for another 1/2 hour and I reached a level of frustration,
hurt and anger that I couldn't handle anymore.
I told her, "you're f*cking wrong and you know it. I can't believe you don't see it,
or if you do that you're not sorry.... (search for words)... ah, screw it. Have a
nice f*cking trip." I grabbed my stuff and walked out.
I was hurting big. I wanted her to come after me so badly. Luckily (?), she did. She
opened the door and asked me to come back. "Why? What the point? We obvioiusly don't
agree and you can see how or why I feel this way," I reply.
She asked, "so, what's going on between us then?"
"You mean break up or stay together?"
"Whatever it is you meant earlier."
(pause, looking into her eyes, anger starting to give way to resignation)
"Do you want to break up?"
"No." Matter of fact. No waffling, no thinking, but also not much emotion.
"Neither do I."
I continued, "Look, it's exactly because I care about you so much and like you so
much that I came here today to resolve this between us and make good before you go.
Then I hear about this guy..."
"Well, if I didn't like you, I'd have told you to leave an hour ago."
We hugged. She cried. I told her that I trust her 100% and that I don't want to
break up at all. That I just wanted her to understand how I feel that she didn't
consider me. She said she was sorry she hadn't talked about it to me first. Things
were good. We kissed and hugged passionately, but there was no time. She had to go.
I brought her to the station and things were golden for that time. We talked about
me missing her. She'll miss me. I'll miss her more. No, she will. No, I *already*
miss her. It's probably the sappiest we've ever been together, and it's definitely
the sappiest I've ever seen her. We said goodbye at the station. She seemed more
'emotional' about her goodbye than I could remember ever seeing her. She passed
through the ticket gate and came around to the barrier to kiss and hug me a few more
times before leaving.
"Write me often. Tell me all about your trip and send me pictures, from your Hotmail
account."
"I will! My flight leaves at eight. Email me, ok?"
"OK."
"Bye."
Later, I called her to wish her off before she boarded. She seemed happy. She talked
about taking a short weekend trip sometime after she gets back. She had to go, we
hung up.
I emailed her phone. Told her to be careful, I wish I could go, I'll miss her and
enjoy your trip. I even said that I'm happy she has a friend to show her around and
take care of her rather than having to be alone all the time.
She wrote back, thanking me, saying that she likes me more now than before and
she'll miss me. Goodbye.
It's now Saturday. She'll be back tomorrow, though I have no idea what time or on
what flight. And she hasn't written me all week...
All week, I have been beside myself with thoughts of her and him sleeping together,
no room for benefits of doubt. Not telling me about the guy. Not admitting guilt or
wrongdoing by doing so. The very fact that she would consider staying at his place,
period. Especially without consulting me as far in advance as she could. Then
there's the 'vacation mentality' to consider. That mentality that one gets of
freedom and adventurousness when traveling in a foreign country where no one knows
you and you have no reputation to worry about or carry back with you. (I've seen
this vacation mentality at work on girls who have boyfriends with my own eyes, er,
hands, and there's no denying that women who wish for a fantasy fling are very, very
vulnerable on vacation. All sorts of things had me convinced that it was not only
likely she'd do this guy, but highly probable.
My friends have tried all week to get their view through my head. That women don't
often mess around just for the adventure of it all. That maybe I doubt myself in
that situation and that I am projecting my own possible behaviors onto her. That
girls do have friends they use for emotional support and what have you, and they
have the guys that turn them on to sleep with. That she did in fact tell me the
truth and if had had bad intentions then she would have avoided the headache by
saying it was girl. That maybe the reason she doesn't seem hung up on comforting me
much is because to her it's really no big deal, and it's no big deal because it's
just a friend and she can't for the world of her imagine anything going on, so
there's nothing to overcompensate for by appearing overly concerned about my
feelings of insecurity and jealousy. That the fact she hasn't written is no big
deal. On vacation, people are busy or preoccupied, or maybe internet cafes are hard
to find in Rome and the guy doesn't have one at home. That if she was messing
around, she might be MORE likely to write, out of guilt. That if she was looking
forward to seeing this guy romantically, she probably wouldn't have cared enough to
fight me for two hours before leaving. That she would probably have let me walk out
on her without coming after me. That she just handled it all really badly, partly
out of trying to avoid a problem, and partly out of insensitivity to my needs. As I
said earlier, she does have a few habits that show some selfishness to her. (This
would certainly be consistent with that, though taken somewhat farther.) That our
relationship is too young (four months) for her to go looking for excitement
elsewhere. That usually happens with couples that have been together for a year or
two.
Now, this is all maybe true. In fact, at the end of our fight, I really truly felt
that she was sincerely sorry for not telling me earlier and that she really didn't
want to lose me. That she sincerely liked me, and that if I were right about that,
then the odds of her wanting a fling would be slight.
And then my paranoia started to plant more seeds. OK, we all know where that road
paved with good intentions leads to... So, maybe she doesn't intend to do anything.
I didn't intend to get into a fight the time I was walking around a rough
neighborhood, but my thougthless actions put me into a situation where it was likely
to happen. Tempting fate, as it were.
So, my mind has been filled with a horrible impending sense of doom all week. I
question whether this guy was ever really a friend. She never told me more than she
met him studying abroad in an Asian country four years ago in university, that he
lives in Rome and he lives with his parents. Is he ugly and she really sees NO
romantic possibility with him? Was he just labelled a 'friend' because she had a
boyfriend at the time, but she had a secret attraction to him? Is he actually an ex?
I can tell you as a guy (and one that knows a lot of guy friends who admit this to
be true) that a man who is 'friends' with an attractive girl is never a 'real'
friend. He may not want a relationship, but he at LEAST *wants to* sleep with her. A
lot of guys are too shy to move past that, true, but the desire is there. (You don't
have to believe it, but it's true.) If he is all that, and she does have the desire
to sleep with him, is being on vacation going to give her the excuse she needs to
try him on for size? Or maybe she'd be ok sober, but what if he makes his moves
after a few glasses of delicious Italian wine and a romantic dinner? Why hasn't she
written me? If she wasn't doing him, then she'd miss me even more (no romance going
on) and would be sure to get to a net cafe to write. What if she DID sleep with him?
Then she might feel guilty and be even MORE intent to email me. (As you can see, I
can't come up with one valid reason for not writing to me.)
Anyway, it's getting kind of late to do anything about this now. She'll be back
tomorrow and I guess I'll have to see what happens, how she acts, etc., and decide
what to do accordingly. But now my mind doesn't know what to make of the possible
outcomes.
When she comes back, if she's overly happy to see me and can't keep her hands off
me, is it because she didn't have sex for a week and is horny as hell for me? Or is
it because she blew him for seven days and feels guilty so she's overcompensating
for it? If she's tired and her normal average self, is it because she didn't do
anything, or because she's a cold hearted b*tch who can do other guys without guilt?
What am I supposed to say to her reason for not writing me, which is sure to be, "I
was very busy and didn't have time." (Didn't have time to go to a cafe for 15
minutes just to tell me you're fine?!)
I'm so lost. I've never felt this jealous and depressed about a gf. I'm usually very
confident (right up until they tell me "i'm seeing someone else"), but this one has
me all shaken up. Then again, none of my exes ever did this kind of thing or
would've handled it this way. My friends say that there is very little that is so
unusual, that she is almost definitely not messing around, maybe just a little
selfish in the way she executed things, but I shouldn't worry about it and just
resume things when she gets back.
Sorry this was so long. Anyone have any opinions about this or advice on how to
handle it?
Thanks!
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