Haunted by wife's past.

[looking_back]

Hello. I could type a book in hopes that this is fully understood but will try to keep it short. I feel the only one who can understand this is me and anyone who would have the same "chemistry" but I will try anyway. I met my wife in 1992 and we started dating, I moved into an apartment in 1995 and even though she kept promising she did not move in with me until we finally were married in 2001. For some reason in 2003 we talked about our sexual past and since that point it keeps resurfacing at various levels. Now she has a very limited past say 5 or 6 partners, but it is sketchy with one night stands and 2 couples in a motel room etc. This has put me under suicide watch in the hospital for a weekend (back in fall 2003) which led to being put on anti-depressants, etc. I have only been with 1 girl prior to my wife and I meeting and we had a relationship (not a one night stand). I feel like I blew it. I find myself trolling dating sites thinking that if I cheat we can move on, etc. Yes, stupid I know. I also know there is plenty of jealousy mixed in there too. I feel I have never been able to complete things or participate in life. I can beat these feelings down, but they resurface. We have gone to counseling and it did not work, it actually hurt things. There are so many edges to this thing that I can't explain them all in one post. Has anyone gone through this who can shed some light on things? I can google and find tons of people who hate their spouses past. I know that she did not do this stuff after we met so it does not matter blah blah blah...... I can tell you it does matter cause I almost ended my life over it a few years back. This truly cripples our relationship and I know that unless we can work through it I will probably want out after the kids are older. I sometimes think the problem is that I did not bring enough of my own baggage into the marriage. I know that my worst times are when I have to come to realize that I will never completely view her with the same eyes as when we met. In my world when you go all the way with a complete stranger and have to sweat it out until your next period it makes me feel stupid for everything I put into the relationship before we did anything in bed. I feel like most people would not have let themselves get to this point and have left the wife and kids, but the same things that make me irrational about something so trivial keeps me tied into this marriage to try and make it work. I hope someone replies, but I am sick of hearing crap like she chose to be with you so that is all that matters (hey, lucky me glad she got it out of her system), or the like. Thanks for reading this far......

[whichwayisup]

Please go talk to a therapist to help you keep this all in perspective. This runs deep, deeper than you realize.

 

All I can tell is, she did marry you. What matters is the NOW. Not the past. The past is what made her who she is today... In and out of bed! And that's a good thing! You have her for the rest of life.. If you can deal with and get over the fact she (like you, like everyone else in this world) has a past.

 

It's up to you to decide...I hope you get help for this...

[You Go Girl]

What if your wife could watch a movie of every masturbatory fantasy you have ever had?

 

Can you get back to your real life now instead of obsessing in the most unhealthy way about her past?

Because meanwhile...your family is being destroyed, and by you, not her.

I really feel for you. You must be in terrible pain. But it is needless pain. The pain that does matter is the pain of ruining your family.

Please do as above poster suggested and get some professional counseling.

[Cinnamon2000]

Would it be better if she slept with 15 men and all those were non-one night stands, but some type of relationship?

[whichwayisup]

Do you have a past? Or was she your first?

 

Maybe the mistake was, going into details.

 

Anyway, please get some counselling in, don't this ruin you and your marriage.

[jenifer1972]

Would there be anything your wife could tell you that would put your mind at rest about these things?

 

If nothing she could possibly say will change anything, I don't see how your marriage can survive. Do you love her? If you do, you must come to grips with this.

 

Because you are very unlikely to find anyone else in your lifetime with a blank romantic slate. The older you get, the more partners you will find in everyone's past.

[looking_back]

What if your wife could watch a movie of every masturbatory fantasy you have ever had?

 

Can you get back to your real life now instead of obsessing in the most unhealthy way about her past?

Because meanwhile...your family is being destroyed, and by you, not her.

I really feel for you. You must be in terrible pain. But it is needless pain. The pain that does matter is the pain of ruining your family.

Please do as above poster suggested and get some professional counseling.

 

We could also play a film of every time my wife has masturbated and also the multiple of guys who she didn't go all the way (fingering, etc). I understand your point it does apply, but I think that in my mind masturbating is a far cry from carrying another complete strangers sperm for a week as it absorbs into your system. When you go all the way you are saying you are fine with having their baby and you better be ready for it or end up on Maury looking like a douche.

 

As far as my family being destroyed that is the whole point of my problem. But as it stands my family with the exception of when I disappeared for a weekend in the hospital (my son was less than a year old) has no clue. My wife never asks (part of the problem I think) and my family as no idea. This whole thing is usually a thought I can put out of my head and this is a very minor relapse since 2003 and I am trying to keep it that way.

 

I agree it is dumb needless pain, but it happens and is real.

 

My experience with professional help has been mixed. The problem I feel is that this problem has many arms to it that can't be covered and unfortunately I am hyper sensitive. Things like the obsession that I noticed with her neighbor who I found out later she had a "thing". Right out of a sit com episode I had to sit through this guys wedding. She keeps all her treasures in a box on the dresser and NOTHING from the beginning of our relationship is in the box ( I asked her) it is scattered through out the house until I save it. College t-shirts from her party time are neatly stored. Anything from vacations we have taken together are on the closet floor. The list goes on and on. Yeah, stupid stuff I know but if the question is put in your mind than it doesn't help. I have found my best therapy so far is the obnoxious pipes from my Harley and body building. Yeah, who would have guessed that big guy on the HD Fatboy is a hyper sensitive puss who cried himself to sleep. Even I find that funny and ironic. Seriously I tried therapy and we tried therapy, we both agreed it was not helping. I did extract some items like the term "reflection" and believe I am guilty of that (the problem is not her sleeping around, but it is easy for me to pick that out when stressed, etc). Have you every been on a busy phone call or watching a dramatic show on TV when someone (kids) bugs you so you go off on them or tell them to be quiet? That would be reflection. That is one term I have used to help my self therapy. Also, being locked up in the hospital was an experience that I will always remember. It was "boy interrupted" and a very eye opening experience. My extraction from that was the statement, "Just because you haven't eaten in a week does not mean your problem is any less serious than someone who was not eaten in a month." Priceless.

[looking_back]

Would it be better if she slept with 15 men and all those were non-one night stands, but some type of relationship?

 

 

Yeah, that would not have been good either, but I can relate to relationships much better than this "bad girl" stuff.

[lonelyandfrustrated]

Armchair diagnosis: you seem to wish you were a 'bad boy', for some reason you appear to find this appealingly masculine, but you shame yourself because you don't have the substance to be one. So you're jealous that your wife is more 'masculine' than you are, she has the risque past that you never had the nerve to have.

 

Armchair remedy: re-define what true-grit, man's-man masculinity means to you. Big muscles and loud bikes are fine things to have, but they don't MAKE a man. In fact, when they are used as a replacement for true masculine power, they're kinda unappealing. If you're a religious person, the Bible has great advice on being a MAN. Even if you're not, you might think of adding God to your life anyhow. Another thing you might try is to make a list of men you admire, and what traits they have that you admire. I'm pretty sure you won't list stuff like "cheated on his wife".

 

How do you think your wife would react to you having your own treasure box on the dresser, filled with photos and keepsakes about her? Does that sound like something a Real Man would do, honor and cherish his wife?

[Cinnamon2000]

Yeah, that would not have been good either, but I can relate to relationships much better than this "bad girl" stuff.

 

Spank her tonight and tell her to never do it again.

[looking_back]

Do you have a past? Or was she your first?

 

Maybe the mistake was, going into details.

 

Anyway, please get some counselling in, don't this ruin you and your marriage.

 

 

I have one partner from a relationship as stated in my original post. I thank my lucky stars everyday that I have my one partner. I could not imagine not having my one. I was not raised within the bounds of anything that carries a name (you know amish, mormon, etc.) but I was raised to respect and put girls up on a pedestal. I feel in today's world that is a HUGE mistake. I was raised to hold doors, bring flowers, and be respectful. That appears to all be a big joke. I am not sure how we should raise our own kids. Seems like a mistake to repeat what I have done.

 

I also know that I am guilty of talking out both sides of my mouth. I just feel like my wife was a good girl taken advantage of at times (the need to reproduce is a real bitch). I dwell on it as I know I can't fix it and it hurts to think she enjoyed it. I am not a control freak in the true sense, but I am hyper sensitive and jealous. Two things that are not good. They are there and these thoughts has been going on for years now. I find myself as becoming more jaded as life moves ahead. I hate that I can't stop her from getting into that van, going into that motel room, being used. Being a guy I know what was done to her, she was easy prey. She was trying to fit in and grow up while being unsure of things herself. I hate it even more to think that she basically wanted that and it did not bother her. That means I don't really know who I married completely. She dressed up in the short skirt and walked to the van willingly. Why would you keep the pictures of a guy who visited you (met on spring break) once and screwed you then disappeared in a special box on your dresser? Nothing from our long relationship has made it into that box. She is as messed up as I am... Yes I agree too many details, but I had the disadvantage of learning things without asking from her brother and when she told me of her escapades she enjoyed it and even got excited.

 

Anyway, thanks for the reply. I talk about counseling in a prior reply post.

[lonelyandfrustrated]

I was raised to respect and put girls up on a pedestal. I feel in today's world that is a HUGE mistake. I was raised to hold doors, bring flowers, and be respectful. That appears to all be a big joke. I am not sure how we should raise our own kids. Seems like a mistake to repeat what I have done.

 

 

Whoa. Okay, tell me, rationally, what is wrong with courtesy and respect???

[looking_back]

Whoa. Okay, tell me, rationally, what is wrong with courtesy and respect???

 

 

Everything when the world is greatly lacking in both. Tell me how did you get lonely and frustrated?

 

To you prior. I do have a metal box I keep things in from our relationship. I even took over the wedding pictures, etc. after watching them get kicked around. I purged all things from my prior relationship out of respect to my wife within days of the break up.

 

I do most all of the cooking, cleaning, planning, and taking care of the kids, along with fixing cars and "man things". YES that is part of the problem. My wife works a draining job and comes home tired, I come home tired and dig in because I let her off the hook because I know her job is mentally draining. My wife is a wonderful person and I do truly LOVE her, that is why I feel it is so tough for me to accept the discovery that she was something that I despised in people for so long.

 

I think you have something against motorcycles and possibly men. The best most charitable people in the world ride bikes, and I don't regret being in better health compared to not working out. It's funny because I actually ride on country roads in the early morning and work out when the gym is empty. I am not trying to provide the world with a man show. I am an adrenaline junky plain and simple. I will admit that when I release the clutch and feel the torque of a v-twin I truly do feel like I am giving the world the finger. I was riding before we met, so that is not a development of the relationship.

 

Hell ya if I could "do it all over again" I would screw everything in sight and bring my baggage to the marriage.

[looking_back]

Spank her tonight and tell her to never do it again.

 

 

Already tried it and it made things worse.

[looking_back]

Would there be anything your wife could tell you that would put your mind at rest about these things?

 

If nothing she could possibly say will change anything, I don't see how your marriage can survive. Do you love her? If you do, you must come to grips with this.

 

Because you are very unlikely to find anyone else in your lifetime with a blank romantic slate. The older you get, the more partners you will find in everyone's past.

 

 

If we ever got divorced I would be done with relationships. Unless a person is complete scum the older the person gets the more partners they have is not true. This "thing" has many arms to it. It is not simply wanting someone with a blank slate.

[lonelyandfrustrated]

Everything when the world is greatly lacking in both.

 

I think you have something against motorcycles and possibly men.

 

 

Hell ya if I could "do it all over again" I would screw everything in sight and bring my baggage to the marriage.

 

I'll just address these three things.

 

1. So you think the remedy to having a world lacking in respect and courtesy is to refuse to add respect and courtesy to the world? That doesn't make sense. That's "Hey, why should I be a good person when there's so much evil in the world? I should be evil, too!"

 

2. I spent six years riding with a motorcycle club. You may refer to these types of clubs as 'gangs', most people do. Great, great people.

 

3. Do you honestly think you would be a better person if you had more baggage? That makes NO SENSE AT ALL. You have a serious issue with desiring to be the worst person possible. Please seek professional help. You seem to have some belief that if YOU are bad, then other people's badness won't hurt you...but you're wrong. Then you'll just feel bad about yourself AND them.

[norajane]

So what bothers you is that your wife is a sexual being and enjoyed casual sex before settling down with you?

 

She really can't change that. She can't erase it, and she's not suddenly going to hate herself for enjoying it as much as you hate her for it.

 

And when you do leave your wife, you will not likely to ever find a woman who has not had sexual experience, unless you go after young teen virgins, which will get you thrown in jail.

 

Meaning, you aren't going to be any happier for the rest of your life unless you deal with your problem - and it is your problem because you will have this issue with any other woman you meet with sexual experience prior to you. It is not limited to this woman, your wife.

 

carrying another complete strangers sperm for a week as it absorbs into your system.

What did your therapists say about your view of sex? Because this is such a weird way to think about it.

 

Hell ya if I could "do it all over again" I would screw everything in sight and bring my baggage to the marriage.

Oh, don't worry. You've brought plenty of baggage into this marriage. It's the kind of baggage that causes you to try to commit suicide and to lose respect for your wife because of the pedestal you put her on instead of seeing her and accepting her for being a sexual human being.

 

And, really, what makes you say her past experiences have created "baggage" that she has brought to the marriage? From what you've said, she wasn't harmed by her experiences in her view. Baggage is when your past experiences cause you to screw up your current relationships because you were emotionally or mentally harmed by them, and may still be emotionally and mentally distressed about them in some way. She doesn't sound harmed or distressed.

 

Is there anything she can do to make you feel better? To some degree, it sounds like you want her to be more sentimental about you. Do you really think that would change your loathing of her past?

 

Honestly, you sound pretty unhappy. Don't martyr yourself for your kids. Get a divorce and free your mind. People divorce all the time and still manage to raise happy, healthy kids. People in bad marriages screw their kids up by staying in them, especially the older and more perceptive the kids become.

[RainDown]

Where to start with all this? You admit you are "hypersensitive" and "jealous". Let's start there. What are you doing about that? I don't see you doing anything about that. You state that you tried counseling, but it didn't work. Fair enough. What's plan B? The hypersensitivity and jealousy are your issues to own; they aren't your wife's problem. Work on fixing them.

 

The other problem you seem to have is extreme selfcenteredness and selfishness. Your wife had a life before she met you. It's not your place to judge it or judge her. You seem to have some pretty serious control issues as well - you want your wife (and her past) to be exactly what you think it should be dammit and nothing else will do. In your eyes, she is flawed forever and nothing she can do will ever undo that. I'm having trouble figuring out why she's wasting her time with YOU. You don't appear to be anywhere near ready to have a genuine relationship on anything other than your terms and the one I feel sympathy for here is your wife.

 

Leave the poor woman alone and work on fixing your hypersensitivity, jealousy, insecurity, selfishness, and control issues.

[looking_back]

I'll just address these three things.

 

1. So you think the remedy to having a world lacking in respect and courtesy is to refuse to add respect and courtesy to the world? That doesn't make sense. That's "Hey, why should I be a good person when there's so much evil in the world? I should be evil, too!"

 

2. I spent six years riding with a motorcycle club. You may refer to these types of clubs as 'gangs', most people do. Great, great people.

 

3. Do you honestly think you would be a better person if you had more baggage? That makes NO SENSE AT ALL. You have a serious issue with desiring to be the worst person possible. Please seek professional help. You seem to have some belief that if YOU are bad, then other people's badness won't hurt you...but you're wrong. Then you'll just feel bad about yourself AND them.

 

 

Cool what did you ride? I go on poker runs and charity rides but do not actually have time for riding in a club.

 

I have spent my whole life literally being hurt by people. It is over and done as in order to not kill myself from the pain of EVERYTHING that has been done ( I actually know my wifes past is a very little thing, but it haunts me all the same at times in my life) I had to step up to the plate for SELF PRESERVATION which includes for my wife and kids. You can not kick a puppy too many times before it is injured, runs away or fights back. Run away is not an option for me and my hopes was to see if someone would have some input that might actually help look at things better. Once again that was naive. I am not becoming evil by definition I am becoming normal by the standards of modern man in order to survive. What do I do that is evil? I have 5 stray cats and grow fields of clover for the deer in the area.

Just like counseling this whole thing has taken a turn off course. To make sure that I am just not wanting to hear the truth tell me what help has been extract for me from this thread thus far. It feels like it just further makes a point.

[norajane]

I have spent my whole life literally being hurt by people. It is over and done as in order to not kill myself from the pain of EVERYTHING that has been done ( I actually know my wifes past is a very little thing, but it haunts me all the same at times in my life) I had to step up to the plate for SELF PRESERVATION

 

See? You have brought a lifetime of baggage into this marriage.

 

It is not over and done because you're using your wife's past as the focal point for that lifetime of hurt. Maybe it's easier to focus on her past instead of dealing with your baggage, but hating her for having casual sex isn't going to make you feel better about your lifetime of hurt.

[dreamingoftigers]

Dude, I feel your pain!

 

I had two sexual partners before I met my husband. He had about 60. It took me YEARS to get over this fact. I was constantly wondering if he was thinking about them all day long, comparing me to them and longing for any one of them.

 

It ate up my mind. He did things that really digusted me like 3 somes and sharing a girl with his friend. I found out after we were married that he had once paid for a bj. All of this before the age of 26.

 

UGH! I couldn't get over how sick this made me. I just looked at him like he was a dirty slut. I often feel like I am at least 57 partners behind in order to catch up to him. I often wonder if it would make me of some more sexual worth to him even.

 

Now that things have gotten weird between us I realize that none of these encounters really meant very much to him at all. A lot of them disgusted him too and he regrets them (many of them happened while he was under the influence). While it doesn't take any of them away I think that I spent more time thinking about it and focusing on it then he did. I don't even think he can possibly remember what most of them even look like anymore.

 

As for your wife, I get the idea that you are dealing with something similar which is that you feel very undervalued to her and that you cannot compete with these memories of Morons Past. I would suspect that your wife doesn't keep mementos because these encounters mean so much to her (I could be wrong) but because she wants to remember something of who she was before she met you (this is very different).

 

If she was so hung up on these guys she would not have married you or had children with you. Furthermore, she is not that person anymore.

 

I suspect you grew up with the same childhood notion that I did, one mate for life (or at least wait until you are in a committed relationship to be with someone). It is a hard thing to accept your spouse's past. I have a feeling that you would be just as jealous if your spouse only had one partner but then you could tell yourself that you had one as well so they cancel each other out. It's a weird idea but I get it.

 

Sounds like you have some heavy trauma too. I would totally look up counselors that do EMDR. It will help with the trauma feelings for your wife and your childhood (I strongly suspect there is something in your childhood too).

 

Furthermore, take a look at The Twelve Steps for Co-dependents. Co-dependents expect those who are in relationships with them to be there emotional regulators. (It isn't just about addiction, by far) If EVERYONE in your life hurts you, hun, is it because YOU have the issue. People do tons of stupid things, tons and tons of stupid things. They just do them, they don't do them to hurt you. You cannot expect anyone else to take care of this for you. READ THE BOOK! Because seriously this problem smacks of co-dependency and you are going to be in some serious pain until you fix it. Being co-dependent was the hardest thing I had to admit to myself.

 

It was hard for me not to be hurt over my partner's past. I am glad someone out there understands what I was feeling too. Most people these days don't seem to get it because there aren't enough people with high sexual standards and expectations.

[EnigmaXOXO]

If you haven’t already, it might be a good idea to use your time online to do a little research on “retroactive jealousy” to discover whether or not it could be an underlying symptom of a more encompassing problem that may or may not have already been diagnosed… such as OCD.

 

Lot’s of information about this online. Interesting stuff! Unfortunately, most are from other medical, psychiatric and relationship sites (considered commercial) so I’m not permitted to post the links for you.

[looking_back]

So what bothers you is that your wife is a sexual being and enjoyed casual sex before settling down with you?

 

She really can't change that. She can't erase it, and she's not suddenly going to hate herself for enjoying it as much as you hate her for it.

 

And when you do leave your wife, you will not likely to ever find a woman who has not had sexual experience, unless you go after young teen virgins, which will get you thrown in jail.

 

Meaning, you aren't going to be any happier for the rest of your life unless you deal with your problem - and it is your problem because you will have this issue with any other woman you meet with sexual experience prior to you. It is not limited to this woman, your wife.

 

What did your therapists say about your view of sex? Because this is such a weird way to think about it.

 

Oh, don't worry. You've brought plenty of baggage into this marriage. It's the kind of baggage that causes you to try to commit suicide and to lose respect for your wife because of the pedestal you put her on instead of seeing her and accepting her for being a sexual human being.

 

And, really, what makes you say her past experiences have created "baggage" that she has brought to the marriage? From what you've said, she wasn't harmed by her experiences in her view. Baggage is when your past experiences cause you to screw up your current relationships because you were emotionally or mentally harmed by them, and may still be emotionally and mentally distressed about them in some way. She doesn't sound harmed or distressed.

 

Is there anything she can do to make you feel better? To some degree, it sounds like you want her to be more sentimental about you. Do you really think that would change your loathing of her past?

 

Honestly, you sound pretty unhappy. Don't martyr yourself for your kids. Get a divorce and free your mind. People divorce all the time and still manage to raise happy, healthy kids. People in bad marriages screw their kids up by staying in them, especially the older and more perceptive the kids become.

 

 

I don't agree with everything you mentioned, but you make plenty of good points. The only thing is my wife AT HOME is lazy and just loses herself in the tv. She is incapable of making a decision on her own most of the time no matter how hard I push for her to do so. If I had taken her through the same voyage she has taken me on she would be typing this. What I am saying is she is a train wreck and I married her. I feel that what she has done to herself is a part of her and it makes me upset. Don't get me wrong PLEASE.... What I am saying is that she has issues (as do I, as does everyone) if you read a prior post I talk about reflection. Well, it is easy for me to pull out the sex and torment myself with that (YES torment MYSELF my wife is enjoying all the benefits of marriage, we NEVER fight we discuss, this is my own battle for now it has not been discussed since 2004 between us) but she has many things that have made her what she has become. She is not horrible but she is not without problems so I take great offense when people act like I am hurting this poor perfect woman who is just simply living her life. She admits that her life would be nothing without me. I helped her get through professional school. I made her feel like something because her dad made her feel like an idiot. I know I should be very happy at that and move on, but that is the problem she does not deal with the issues that affect me and the family. I get upset and it is easy for me to pull out her sexual past to torment once again myself. Yes I basically feel this is a problem of a great communication on my part and a lack of communication on her part. It makes me upset when people let her off the hook. Although the title is sex it is an entire package.

 

As far as my view on sex don't worry about it I am truly a scientist and engineer. I also know the composition of male sperm. I know a lot about the entire body. I am the kid that took everything apart to learn about it.

Before my two year old had 6-hour open heart surgery I learned everything I could about it to cope. It is how I work and I am proud to use my brain.

I also believe that if people viewed things more scientifically they may make different decisions.

[Cinnamon2000]

Already tried it and it made things worse.

 

What do you mean you tried it?

[looking_back]

If you haven’t already, it might be a good idea to use your time online to do a little research on “retroactive jealousy” to discover whether or not it could be an underlying symptom of a more encompassing problem that may or may not have already been diagnosed… such as OCD.

 

Lot’s of information about this online. Interesting stuff! Unfortunately, most are from other medical, psychiatric and relationship sites (considered commercial) so I’m not permitted to post the links for you.

 

 

OMG it has a name finally. I did a google search and this is what I needed. Thank You for not beating me up and making me defensive like so many people seem to do. I feel hope from the last two posts. Once again THANK YOU for giving us something we can work with. OCD was discussed in my past counseling but if I am then I am not typically what you may think of (washing hands, etc.). They never did anything about it any further and I was too ignorant to pursue.