Perhaps I misunderstood the point of your original post - your concern is having your step-daughter living with you because you feel that she will be a bad influence on your 11 y/o daughter.
That's a tough one. You can't really tell your husband that his daughter can't come home if she needs to. What you can do, is to sit down with your husband and discuss your concerns with him and together decide on some boundaries for both of your daughters. Then each of you sit down with your daughter and set thouse boundaries in place and disucss any concerns that they have over this. At that point you can discuss the cultural or racial differences, and concerns you have over the types of boys that your daughter may date someday.
That's the best thing I can think of to do without risking the destruction of your marriage. If you are adament about it though, you may just have to consider leaving the marriage. Your daughter comes first.
Yeah, if its about your marriage, then do what you think is best for your daughter. However, just because you get out out of the situation doesn't mean that she won't dress in the hip-hop fashions, listen to the music, or date people of color.
The only way to do that is to raise her like Skinner did his little girl, in a black box.
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I'm choosing to have no contact with the threads involving no contact. Is that healthy?
I'm curious about something.....why did you feel it neccessary to express that you're middle class? Are you suggesting that anyone below middle class wouldn't have the same standards? Because I just want to let you know that according to our tax bracket, I'm considered upper class and my standards seem to be lower than yours. Or at least not as shallow.
I understand your concerns mainly because you may have been, "burned", by some bad examples and you are trying to do that which is best for your daughter. But you also need to give your flesh and blood some credit. Don't you think that with what you have already taught her through the years that she would be able to decide what is best for her and what is not?
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"The conscience water saw it's maker, and blushed" - Water to Wine......
Whether you like it or not, your daughter is going to grow to form her own opinions. Rather than focus on discouraging her from dating outside of her race (which, btw, will only likely encourage her to do it, and I speak from experience there), why not start encouraging her to look for positive attributes in both friends and dating partners that have nothing to do with their race. Emphasize the importance of finding friends and partners in the future who are driven, and caring, and generous and who will be good confidants and good influences. If you concentrate on discouraging her from any race, believe me, you will regret it. Aside from the fact that I think that's the wrong thing to do anyway, it would likely only end up being used as a handy tool in cases of rebellion.
You all have missed my point and that's probably my fault. I have chosen the wrong words to discribe what I'm feeling and the direction of help i was looking for. Twisting my words to form such a negative opinion of me, has not helped me at all. Mitilda had the best adivce. You have helped me see what my problem is and I will be changing my approach with my daughter. Thank you. The rest of you, thanks anyway.
Thank you also hokeyreligions, yellowlioness and girlie. You are more in line with my concern. I will take your advice to heart and probably do some of what you suggest. Thank you. I am finding raising a daughter should have come with direction.
Good luck to you. Raising a daughter is difficult...just ask my parents. But I think if you focus on teaching them values, and things like the importance of education and independence and of being or growing into a strong woman, you will find that their choice in partners and friends will be more likely to be good individuals and good influences, of any race, and I believe that's what's important. That's been my experience anyway.
Twisting my words to form such a negative opinion of me, has not helped me at all.
I'm sorry to have offended you, but you offended me. Plus, I didn't twist your words. I quoted you. Big difference.
If you don't want people to think you are a racist, you should refrain from making broad, negative generalizations on entire races on a public internet forum.
And as for forming an opinion of you, I didn't. I can't. I don't know you. I did however form an opinion on your views, based only on what you've actually said.
You are more then welcome for the last set of advice. I hope it helps. I know that I sound snippy, but seeing as how I have a bi-racial family, I'm sure you can understand.
Last edited by YellowLioness; 25th August 2004 at 3:46 PM..
Reason: sllooooooooow brain
Girlie you hid the nail on the head. I know discouraging her from a specfic race is wrong, despite what others on this forum have formed as an opinion of me. Which is why i am having such a difficult time with how i'm feeling. You have given me some insite on how to appoach the issue. Thank you
I haven't formed an opinion on you so to speak. I do have some poor opinions on how you wrote out your feelings though. I'm sure that you're a good mother, (It's obvious with the concern you have for your daughter).
The way you spoke is what I found offensive and shallow. Not that you are......I mean, I'm sure if you could turn back the clock you would've wrote it differently....(How many times I've wished I could do the same).
Please don't think that we have formed a negative opinion of you. We all have to suffer through the blows we give each other, and believe me, some of them really hurt!!!! But the ultimate goal on this forum, IMHO, is to help each other out and point out different points of view, explore our options, get feedback from unbias minds.....
For what its worth, I didn't see blatent racism in your original or follow-up posts. I read them in a totally different way from how others saw them.
The way I read your post is that your step-daughters have chosen men who did not make good husbands and fathers and they are black, and you associate black people in your area with that type of person. You know you sound prejudicial - you even said so yourself, and when you pointed that out I figured you were having trouble getting your point across. I misunderstood too at first. It is very difficult to get past our prejudices. I thought about my daughter dating boys from other races and backgrounds and I can't explain it, but it 'felt' different to me than it would have if she were to date boys of her own race and background.
Just as it would have felt different to think of her with someone from the 'poor side of town' because I would be worried about them supporting her, or dating someone from the rich side- I would be concerned that his family and social circle might not accept or welcome her. I don't know because I can't explain it either -- it just feels different. I'm sure I would have got past that if my daughter, or son for that matter, had relationships outside of their own race/culture. Parenting is difficult.
I know that this is something that lots of parents -- of all races -- think about in regards to their children and their children's dates and relationships. It doesn't make us wrong or racist, it just makes us parents.
You acknowledged that the type of person you don't want your daughter to associate with comes in all colors. And 11 years old is a crucial time for your daughter. She is going to be more aware of the interaction between boys and girls and relationships and she will retain more of what she learns. You don't want someone around who may un-teach what you are trying to instill in your daughter.
Think of the positive though -- you married a man who has children who date the type of men you don't want for your daughter. And you are not telling your daughter that she can't have black friends. That shows that you can be open-minded and tolerant and accepting of other cultures. Now you have to communicate with her about sex and relationships and the charastics to look for and stay away from and WHY. Maybe, the step-daughter moving in will be a positive and will help in your communication with your daughter, and help you to cope with your own feelings and preconceptions. But get those groundrules agreed upon! I would say that in any case when someone is moving into the home.
The color of a person's skin doesn't disclose if they are a good husband/father or not. I think that if you feel so strongly about interracial marriage you should have thought a bit more before you married your husband. It is obvious your views are completely different. Two of his daughters are in interracial marriages and you can't keep them out of his house, unless you want to be known as the wicked racist step-mother. Just talk to you daughter about how you feel, but don't keep her away from her step-siblings.
I understand you want your daughter to be with a well-rounded guy.. not thug-like.. BUT.. if you tell your daughter that she can't date black men.. she will inspite of you.. or she will find a white thug-like guy that you may not like...
Now I understand your point of view svw1323, my advice for you is to talk to your daughter about self-respect and self-worth.. You have to make sure she knows that she needs to find a person that treats her with more respect than she gives herself.. I have told her that a lot of guys want different things from girls at her age.. and the guys that really like her will not make her do anything she doesn't want to.. I have told her that she doesn't need to rush into a relationship because its alot of pressure and at her age the guys are not worth it.. teenage relationships do not last long and they don't go anywhere because they are not mature enough to know the seriousness of their actions.. teenage boys are driven by hormones.. no teenage girl needs to deal with that and they should wait until they find a nice guy that treats them the way they want to be treated.. and they should wait until they find that kind of guy..
I've had talks like this with my younger sister.. I have had many talks with her and she knows that she can come to me with any questions.. and you have to make sure you make your daughter feel this way with you.. and then she will take more advice from you..
I think you are worried not about the race but about the image.. yes in the media alot of black men are protrayed as thugs less than white men are.. but you can't generalize.. and you can't tell your daughter not to date black.. because she might just bring home a white man, who is a dropout, thug, gang member, who treats her like he's her pimp.. and she'll say.. "i thought you would like him, cause he's not black.." thats why i think people are criticizing you on here.. because their is no logic in your post.. black men aren't bad.. but you don't want your daughter to date a black man like the thug-like guys, which there is nothing wrong with that.. but white or black doesn't matter..
do not mention anything racist to your daughter or she will prove you wrong and show you.. imagine that your post is the conversation with your daughter, because that is the type of reaction you will get from her if you tell her not to date black men..
Never tell her not to see this guy and so on.. Tell her she deserves more.. Tell her she is worth more and she needs to show guys how to treat her.. Most teenage girls believe if you give a guy what he wants he will be by her side.. (unfortunate but they believe this) so tell her its not true and tell her the only way to keep a guy is to not give them what they want (at her age this is what she needs to hear) because if that guy is still with her in the end of the day, then he truly cares for her..
I've had many talks with my sister.. she's in early teens... She comes to me for answers because i don't say she can't do things like my mom or sister... I tell her how it is and what she should do.. and how guys will treat her at her age.. I Tell her that she deserves alot.. and the only way to get what she wants is not to accept anything less...
One thing i told my sister was, lol, was that the more guys she turns down, the more guys will like her, Don't guys always want something they can't have.. and it'll give her more to choose from and a better chance to get a nice guy.. She really thought about that one..
You may never allow yourself to believe that any generalization can be correct. Some black people are thugs. Some white, red, yellow, and whatever other color there are people are thugs. You must judge every human on his own merits, his personality, and how he lives his life, not on his colour, height, possession or lack thereof of hair, nationality or anything else.
Antoine de Saint-Exupery said it best:
It is only with the heart that one can see rightly. What is essential is invisible to the eye.
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But I think if you focus on teaching them values, and things like the importance of education and independence and of being or growing into a strong woman, you will find that their choice in partners and friends will be more likely to be good individuals and good influences, of any race, and I believe that's what's important. That's been my experience anyway.
Moose, you are eloquent
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