Beyond the affair

[translucentsoul]

Post affair, have you had trouble trusting people?

How about yourself?

 

Once you see how easy cheating can be, does it ever leave your mind?

 

I'm struggling with trusting a new person.

[afoolto no end]

I think people can prove to you they can be trusted, some people do deserve respect and trust.

You can't judge everyone else by someone's else's mistakes

[MidnightBlue1980]

Post affair, have you had trouble trusting people?

How about yourself?

 

Once you see how easy cheating can be, does it ever leave your mind?

 

I'm struggling with trusting a new person.

 

I would say my eyes are opened and I now am very aware of a man paying me too much attention under the guise of friendship or business. What is interesting is the number of men who will throw stuff against the wall to see if it sticks, but when it doesn't, they fade away as fast as they appeared.

 

I'm married though, so it's different. If you are single and dating, you just need to not judge a new person by bad things another did.

[Poppy47]

Yes, yes and yes.

 

It is difficult, knowing how easily xMM got away with year of deception, to believe anybody.

 

In the end, I didn't believe anything he told me. I will never know what was true and what wasn't. It was very confusing and almost drove me insane.

 

I admit that I was complicit in it all and somehow ignored that fact until long after the affair was over.

 

I hope you learn to trust again one day.

 

Poppy.

[Vivir]

As you can see, translucentsoul, you are not alone.

 

I hate to admit it (to myself) that I distrust people; I like to think myself to be objective and open. I realized only recently, when someone attempted to start a relationship with me, that I don't actually trust others right now. Interestingly enough, I openly admit that I don't trust my own judgment.

 

That hurts.

 

But I decided some months back that I can slowly learn to trust myself (again?) by making appropriate choices that lead to good things for me. I can enforce the boundaries that I created. In time, perhaps I will learn to increase the basic trust required to progress with others.

 

I was honest with the person who tried to start a relationship with me. Although he is single and seemingly available and a decent catch, I told him I was not over the hurt from my last experience (with xMM). I told him I didn't mind meeting for lunch or a movie, but I was not in a good enough place to embark on a romantic relationship where I would be responsible for another person. I am still healing. Every day, I have to fight the idea that he is the last chance I will have at finding love, that I should sweep this so-called hurt under the rug and force myself to move on with someone new...

 

So.... there is that trusting myself thing again. This time of healing is what I wanted for myself. Getting to know me, attempting to fall in love with me... being in a really good place before being with another guy...

 

Anyway, that is where I am today.

[What_Did_I_Do]

Yes to all three as well.

 

I went on a few dates with a single guy and almost right from the get-go he was telling me of all his love interests and how all these ladies threw themselves at him and all wanted to sleep with him (of course). Before the A, I would have thought this SG had some serious self-esteem issues, now I just don't trust. I'm wary of everyone.

[freengreen]

I HAD trust issues... but its me who went into the EA not my husband, he is very outgoing and has both sexes as friends, so is my sister, but they never had affairs...so now I am actually starting to trust more and beleive that being outgoing wont start an affair as much as being insecure (me).

 

I still sometimes wonder what he ( AP) is doing but I am ashamed that I do, I am sure eventually I will wear outta it.

 

More than anything its the feeling that I had a ‘clean’ life and now I have got a scar in it ( its a fact and it will be there)... but yeah scars remind us of the lessons we had, so be it.

 

Peace

[cocorico]

Post affair, have you had trouble trusting people?

 

It was the reverse for me. Before the A, I didn’t trust anyone. Through the R I have learned to trust.

[Southwardbound]

Post affair, have you had trouble trusting people?

How about yourself?

 

Once you see how easy cheating can be, does it ever leave your mind?

 

I'm struggling with trusting a new person.

 

Your question makes me think.....

1) Trust means having not only information, but also being aware of how your opposite will react/ act in many different situations.

2)In an any relationship, one partner always has the upper hand concerning what to divulge, or if they are the one who initiates the action. In an affair it's usually the married person who holds all the cards, so to speak. In a marriage, it's often the person with the low sex drive.

 

For example, in the General Relationship section on this board, someone said that it is always the person who has the low sex drives that decides when the couple has sex. In other words - they practice withholding intimacy. They withhold love. The same can be said for cheaters - they withhold information and they withhold love - to all parties involved.

 

*So your question is valid for anyone in any type of relationship, I think.

 

I think when you enter into a relationship it's really important to make sure your compatible - sexually & on the same mental wavelengths. Otherwise, withholding occurs.

 

Cheating occurs because both people involved in that particular relationship give themselves permission to do so. The third party - BS - doesn't have all the information, so they continue to trust their selected mate.

 

Do both parties in the affair completely trust each other? My guess is no. Why? Because one partner withholds.

[jah526]

In the end, I didn't believe anything he told me. I will never know what was true and what wasn't. It was very confusing and almost drove me insane.

 

Yes, this is finally what did it for me, the realization that I couldn't trust anything he said. Should've known that from the start, given that he was the kind of person who was willing to break a trust with his wife...

 

I like to think this has made me more discriminating. I was always willing to give people the benefit of the doubt before. Now, the first red flag and my walls will go up immediately. The people with no red flags are the the ones I choose to be around now.

 

It makes life less exciting, sure. But it also makes it less painful.

[freengreen]

I will never know what was true and what wasn't.

 

Poppy.

This hurts... the same with me.

 

It would be nice to know that although EVERYTHING was a disaster, it was atleast not a lie. But hey!.. its an affair, may be it IS this way :/. Sigh.

[Southern Sun]

Knowing what both my xMM and myself were capable of...yeah, it's sort of like taking a bite of the apple from the tree of knowledge, so to speak.

 

It's not that I didn't know people could do those sorts of things. But experiencing it myself puts a whole different shade on it.

 

It has made me less trusting of people in general, for sure. I am more cynical, more skeptical. I see affairs around me. When I hear of a divorce, I assume that there was likely an affair in the background.

 

I truly regret it all.

[FoundMyStrength]

What others have said rings true for me. I had major trust issues from childhood that had partially healed. The affair broke those stitches wide open. I learned how much I was capable of, how much of the affair was lies and deception, how cruel the decisions are when a MM is choosing which woman is worth hurting and which is not (at least in his warped mind in which hidden affairs don't hurt wives).

 

But by far, the worst lesson was that people can go out and have affairs, say they love someone, be intimate with them, plan and plot futures. Then go home and never say a word to their spouse. The amount of deceit in that action, and the lie his wife lives even now, makes me never want to trust again. My father was a chronic cheater but he was flagrant. My mom knew, I knew, everyone knew. But my MM lives with the secret to this day. Still friends with our ex colleagues, still liking their posts and chatting with them. Still checking my social media every now and then. And they and his wife have no fricking idea what happened.

 

That's simply terrifying to me. Sometimes I don't know if I'll ever really trust anyone again. What if I end up with someone like him?

[Patrice]

Something led you down that road, like it did all of us who post about this.

I had a controlling father and a passive mother. I married a controlling man, who I left after 27 years, and this is when the MM appeared. Watch for times that you are going through things that make you vulnerable - and we all have them. This, I have found to be true many years after - these people prey on people who are hurt, afraid, lonely and haven't discovered their true worth as a person. You owe that to yourself, and you deserve to be treated with dignity and respect. Time heals a lot of it, the commitment to yourself, what you want from your life - and realizing that being in a situation that is so fraught with pain, you never want to experience it again. Hang in there, time will help sort it all out.

[burnt]

Yes.

 

The trust is gone in me completely. There is no naivety or innocence left in the way I see myself, others, and the world. It's a harsh price to pay.

 

Every now and then I hear a woman talking about how amazing her marriage is and how wonderful her husband has been for some 30, 40 years. How wonderful it is to build a life together.

 

Somewhere, at the back of my mind, I think, I wonder if her husband had a secret OW to "help" him out during the dormant years of the marriage. I wonder ... how many secrets he has kept from her without her ever knowing.

 

Blissful ignorance is a wonderful thing.

[Vivir]

I am really loving the responses in this thread (and I assume this bunny is happy and jumping for joy!)

 

Patrice, I agree with so much of what you wrote in your post.

 

Watch for times that you are going through things that make you vulnerable - and we all have them. This, I have found to be true many years after - these people prey on people who are hurt, afraid, lonely and haven't discovered their true worth as a person. You owe that to yourself, and you deserve to be treated with dignity and respect. Time heals a lot of it, the commitment to yourself, what you want from your life - and realizing that being in a situation that is so fraught with pain, you never want to experience it again.

 

Vulnerability is one of the biggest points of entry for an affair, in my opinion. In my experience, I have found that I do myself and others great harm when I walk through my life without consciously thinking. I opine that others are guilty of this as well.

 

With that said, I don't necessarily believe that all married, or otherwise taken, people who enter affairs are preying on the vulnerable; some are just not thinking or acting consciously and allow lines (also known as boundaries) to get blurred. Before they know what hit them, they find themselves wanting what they want while trying not to hurt anyone... rationalizing and justifying and acting deceitfully.

 

And Burnt, wow. You, me, and others who have responded have a lot of what you wrote in common.

Yes.

 

There is no naivety or innocence left in the way I see myself, others, and the world.

 

Every now and then I hear a woman talking about how amazing her marriage is and how wonderful her husband has been for some 30, 40 years. How wonderful it is to build a life together.

 

Somewhere, at the back of my mind, I think, I wonder if her husband had a secret OW to "help" him out during the dormant years of the marriage. I wonder ... how many secrets he has kept from her without her ever knowing.

 

Blissful ignorance is a wonderful thing.

 

I feel that so much of that innocence I once had for so long is very much gone. And I literally cringe when I hear people talking about marriage and families - good or bad! I never cringed before. Sometimes, I even have to leave the room or cut the conversation short if they are speaking with me directly. I am often triggered by these conversations and have a hard time containing my disdain for them. If it is a happy, new marriage or family, I wonder to myself, How long is that gonna last???? If it is a more established marriage or family, I think the same as you, Burnt...

 

I am still working through my issues, processing my hurt...

 

It angers me that a married or taken person will get "help" external to his or her relationship for internal dormancy, problems, or boredom... I literally get the impression that so many of them have this thought, 'Oh, I am done with you now. I know that my behavior, words, and actions created some hope in you, so sorry about that... being with you made me realize I love my spouse. So sorry. Now, go away and let me live happily ever after with my newfound understanding at your expense." I am offended by the idea that some MP think this is OK. I am dismayed that my own alarm bells didn't go off when xMM started in on our boundaries and also at my behavior and actions when I helped him...

 

Why get or stay married if you need external help to be married, raining down hurt on other people?? This is a rhetorical question, of course, and has been debated throughout this forum. I'm just saying... I am still trying to wrap my head around it.

Edited October 18, 2017 by Vivir

[FoundMyStrength]

I literally get the impression that so many of them have this thought, 'Oh, I am done with you now. I know that my behavior, words, and actions created some hope in you, so sorry about that... being with you made me realize I love my spouse. So sorry. Now, go away and let me live happily ever after with my newfound understanding at your expense."

 

This.

 

My xMM definitely fit this mold. He told me so. That he was going to smile more once he got back to his wife and life. That he was going to take my life philosophy and worldview (which, affair aside, is pretty solid and has gotten me through some intense childhood and family stuff) back to his life and wife. That I had changed him and made him a happier person and he would take THAT back to his life and wife.

 

I feel like he stole my trust. But he also -- literally -- stole my happiness and optimism too. (at least for a while)

 

It may not be intentional, but good godd*mn is it selfish.

[Patrice]

Be remindful, that he may try to come back - many of them do. Remember what he has put you through and close the door, time for you to do YOU and be patient with yourself. I think it's the sense of injustice, being lied to, with someone with poor character. Why in the world would you want that in your life permanently.

[Anna-Belle]

It was the reverse for me. Before the A, I didn’t trust anyone. Through the R I have learned to trust.

 

The same is true for me. The EMR was so healing for me. I was a wreck before it started. My MM's consistency and trustworthiness made me heal and trust again.

[Vivir]

Anna-Belle and cocorico, you both wrote that your affairs with MP led to your having trust again. Through older posts, I believe cocorico is now married to her former AP. Of course, our experiences lead us to have varying perspectives.

 

I have to admit that had my affair been short lived (less than 3 months, not greater than six months), I might have felt totally different about it. During those months, I felt a connection to a person that I had not felt in many years. I felt excited by the possibilities. He was extremely affectionate and highly consistent (actually, he remained highly consistent over time) in his communication with me.

 

The overwhelming loss of trust that I now feel came MUCH later.

 

If it had ended before six months, especially, I think I would have continued to hold him in a very high regard. Now, I think I just see the reality, and I prefer that actually - even though it hurts. But that is my reality, and not all of us had a "bad" end where we didn't end up with the object of our affection. And some of us are grateful for an experience where we had an opportunity to learn, connect, love and/or grow; we don't necessarily see it as having been "bad" even if the person is no longer around... and then there are those of us who felt we were used, lied to, taken for a ride... and those of us who dance back and forth along that spectrum.

[What_Did_I_Do]

We all lie in some capacity - those of us with kids....think Santa Claus, Easter Bunny - but these lies were never intended to deliberately hurt a loved one. The WS does this exact thing, lies to their BS, lies to their AP and in all such a deceptive manner. Whatever they need to do to pull it off.

 

I could pick out a liar, liar pants on fire with eyes closed and two hands tied behind my back. But xmm, he was smooth. And after it was all said and done (as Vivir pointed out) the collatoral damage didn't come until later. Not only should I have not trusted him, but somewhere on that winding, twisted A road I lost the ability to trust myself. That is the biggest disappointment. Those A's....the gift that keeps on giving!

[translucentsoul]

Post affair, have you had trouble trusting people?

How about yourself?

 

Once you see how easy cheating can be, does it ever leave your mind?

 

I'm struggling with trusting a new person.

 

 

I truly have no cause not to trust him. Both how he lives his life and his ethics about betrayal, and well, I know where the opportunities could manifest...and he's got none of them.

 

I'm struggling with trusting myself, but it's getting better.

 

We are not exclusive, yet.

 

I went on a date, and I felt like I was cheating. (I was an OW)

Which opened my eyes to my own growth, after I asked the question.

 

I'm feeling a bit more steady.

[Vivir]

FoundMyStrength, I had written this whole long reply to what you wrote and then it disappeared!! I am distraught!

 

I became so upset reading what your xMM did to you I am almost positive he meant this as some sort of compliment. I, like you, viewed it as a type of theft! Why come to me, a person living without love, dangle that carrot, take what I have to give - almost everything I have to give, and as a consolation prize, take it back to a woman with everything already. Why would he do that? I refuse to believe a fairly educated, mature, and somewhat (?) intuitive man doesn't know that this is like pouring salt in a wound... right?

 

On the other hand, some might argue that he and I also stole from his betrayed wife. That this particular theft is more terrible, but from my perspective, he only gave as much as the crumbs that fell to the floor beneath her table. This isn't a good frame of mind. I am getting there, I guess.

 

 

That he was going to smile more once he got back to his wife and life. That he was going to take my life philosophy and worldview (which, affair aside, is pretty solid and has gotten me through some intense childhood and family stuff) back to his life and wife. That I had changed him and made him a happier person and he would take THAT back to his life and wife.

 

I feel like he stole my trust. But he also -- literally -- stole my happiness and optimism too. (at least for a while)

 

It may not be intentional, but good godd*mn is it selfish.

 

Today I had this revealing line of thought while listening to this song ("Get it Together" by Drake ft. Black Coffee and Jorja Smith)... The thought came so fast... and I realize that I said to him without saying, Hey, you say you're not happy in your new marriage, that you don't know what you were thinking getting married so fast... you don't have children together... why not leave the marriage and come to be with me... let's fall in love and live the best life we can live together...

 

And just like that. I realize I was in it by myself. Based on his actions, I choose to believe he knew from the very beginning that everything I gave was all that I had to give and he took and took and took and gave it all away to his marriage, I guess. He knew he wasn't leaving. He always knew. He just didn't tell me. It was a theft. An unnecessary theft. Not only at my expense, but for his entertainment at my expense.

 

I think this is why what your xMM said to you makes me so blithering angry

 

I truly have no cause not to trust him. Both how he lives his life and his ethics about betrayal, and well, I know where the opportunities could manifest...and he's got none of them.

 

I'm struggling with trusting myself, but it's getting better.

 

We are not exclusive, yet.

 

I went on a date, and I felt like I was cheating. (I was an OW)

Which opened my eyes to my own growth, after I asked the question.

 

I'm feeling a bit more steady.

 

1st bold: That is language from the depths of an affair fog if I have ever in my life heard one.

 

2nd bold: I dated another person while an OW, and by God, I wish I had turned my back on xMM at that time and NEVER looked back. The man I was dating, in the little that he showed me... I never knew what I was missing. I was a fool for not turning my back on xMM then. But you know what they say about hindsight...

[translucentsoul]

Vivir, my affairs are over. I had two MM, and it did continue into my next (now over) relationship.

I've cut those ties.

 

Now I'm seeing a man with whom I've been friends with for 11 years. We were in relationships at the same time, and now are both single. We bumped into each other right after I moved home, and it was like wildfire.

 

He's needing to go very slowly, emotionally. I I know why, and accept it. We are not exclusive. (I am adding hopefully: YET)

 

I went on the date with someone I met online. Felt horrid the whole time.

That cleared up some muddle in my own head.

 

The fact that I did it is what made me question my own ability to be faithful, albeit momentarily.

Life without such secrets is so much simpler, and for me, fulfilling. (Although A and Z -the MM- fulfilled at the time)

 

How is "I have no cause to not trust" affair fog?

This is the single guy. And I'm now single.

[jah526]

Vivir,

 

I totally get what you're saying. These guys are so damn selfish and self-absorbed. Mine actually expressed gratitude to me for helping him get through a "bad time" (ie, blue balls) while his wife was pregnant and refusing to have sex with him. Well hey, great for you, buddy. Sheez.

Edited October 23, 2017 by jah526