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A MM's story - really resonated with me


The Other Man / Woman The other side of the story: Support and discussion for those who find themselves involved with a committed partner.

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Old 30th July 2017, 1:00 PM   #61
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Yes and he says that too, "you deserve more, and you're right to want more" - when I said I wouldn't wait for him.

I'm taking a friend to this party...as mentioned. He's very jealous despite fact I've told him this a platonic friend. Means nothing that he's reacted that way I know. I'm not reading into that other than to think it's a loss of control/power he's worried about perhaps. Or maybe it's less sinister and it's just a concern I am moving on (which I do want to). So I am reading into it (sorry) but not in a rose-tinted way.
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Old 30th July 2017, 1:10 PM   #62
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He has no right to be jealous when you bring a friend to the party. And, with all due respect, if he really felt like you deserved more he wouldn't be waiting at your door to exploit your loneliness and vulnerability. If he really loved you and wanted the best for you, he would let you go so that you could find true love and happiness.

Forgive me, if I'm not remembering well... but, if you haven't seen a counsellor, I would really encourage you to find someone you trust. I think many of your difficulties stem from grief. You may not agree, but grief can really mess with your mind and affect the choices you make for your life. Wishing healing for you.
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Old 30th July 2017, 1:24 PM   #63
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Yeah, agree on the professional therapy suggestion. I know it really helped me, especially in the area of finishing business and concluding forensics. Since none of us are mind-readers, the what-ifs can live on for decades unless one accepts the real and puts the what-ifs to rest. If one wants to live the life of an affair partner, that's a choice. If to live alone, that's a choice. If in a parallel or concurrent relationship, that's a choice. If in a completely separate and discrete relationship, that's a choice. Make a choice, accept it, embrace it and move on.

Once made, if xMM is not part of that choice, then he's departed your life and is zero. Gone, ended, done, over. One of billions you'll never care about nor have contact with. With therapy, it's hard to even remember MW's names, much less anything that occurred or any emotion attached to those memories. It's like reaching for something that's not there. Zero.
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Old 30th July 2017, 2:03 PM   #64
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He's been with his W for 12 years. They got married a year ago. His children are 2.5 and 7 days old.

Before he got married, he said "I feel I should be with her...she's the love of my life". A few days ago, after the birth of his second child, he said "I think it's possible to have different loves of your life at different times. The man I am now feels that way about you and sometimes about her but recently we've not got on much at all and I question whether we'd be together if we didn't have the children now".

So I think when he got married he was fully into that life choice. The second child - I was always wanted a family, more than one child and I want my children to have siblings. It was always the plan i.e. so basically my presence and his growing feelings didn't budge him off that trajectory. Now I think he's feeling the strain having two young children and a tired wife puts on a relationship and looking for the lack of emotional connection with me.

He's cheated on his W before so I think, perhaps, he thinks he can get away with whatever. Further illustrated by his talking to me about our A in front of his child and also wanting me to be part of his main life by wanting me to spend time with him and his wife at their house, at parties, etc.

Even if I "got the spoils" I am aware they're very damaged and unattractive. I am in no doubt he'd treat me in the same way as his W (she has 12 years with him and 2 kids and he still cheats, I would be the old OW not the mother of his kids) if not worse. I need to work towards the future I always wanted. A family of my own with a man who has integrity. I know he's not that man. I just need to write here to sort out my very unruly mind.

Thanks for your patience and support - it's helping me.
Madam,
I want to grab you and shake you ( after I'm done strangling him).

He talks to your about your affair i front of his children?

What an idiot.

Look, I don't know you, and the only data I have is your own words. It sounds like both your brain and heart are screaming at you to walk away. You sound like a lady with a big heart and who is tying your mind up like a pretzel to make this all okay, when you know it's wrong, not just for his wife and children, but for you, and your child as well.

How much of your daily life is spent trying to sort through all of this in your mind? how much emotional energy are you wasting?

Why not take even half the love you are showing this guy and use it on yourself. Aren't you worth far more than all of this heartache?

Hell, I don't even know you and I think you are worth way more than all of this.
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Old 30th July 2017, 2:04 PM   #65
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I know I should listen to him and realise I'm not special enough to him to have eclipsed his W in his affections.
You are looking at it from a female perspective which is totally different skewed from how men view these things. His leaving or not leaving his marriage has absolutely nothing to do with you and his feelings for you. You could be the most special person on the earth to him and it would not make a difference. This thinking is what is causing you the most pain because you keep thinking that there must be something you could do, say or be which would get you what you want. And the thing is, there isn't.

I went through this myself and I didn't understand it till reading all the posts on this board and the other board, plus a few men in my real life who went through very painful divorces they did not want. Men don't leave a marriage for a feeling for a different woman, no matter the feeling. They generally do not make big decisions based on fleeting emotions. They leave a marriage because it does not suit their needs anymore and it is generally a very painful existence - and even then, a lot still won't leave, they hold on even though they are miserable.

Why do they do this? They like being married, they do love their wife or at least it is familiar and comfortable, they tend not to have the social circle women do so it's either this or being alone, they put a lot of value on material wealth and the concept of starting over is horrible to them. They have spent the bulk of their life planning for retirement and they know that to divorce means a huge financial rip in their lives. The men I know in real life, they live with their parents, they are broke, or they live in some total crappy apartment. They are miserable and constantly bemoan the big house they had and hate their wife for how everything ended up. I don't know one woman who is focused on retirement like men do. Don't underestimate how big this is for them. My xmm was okay staying in his sexless marriage with his wife who he did not respect or like because he was not giving her half his money and living in some sh*thole apartment this close to retirement (he was 46 at the time).

And that is because in all cases in my life, the wife filed for divorce. She did not view the starting over part as a negative thing but as an opportunity for growth. I know because I also had a divorce in my early 30s , started over from nothing, not even a car and I was happy. My ex took 8 years in therapy to move on. We didn't even have any kids. I only know one guy who filed and he did not want to, but he was so miserable and went to years of counseling but his wife would not leave her ex alone. So he finally filed, but he is not happy.

So my point is, women tend to follow their heart and make big decisions for "love" whereas men don't. That does not mean we are doing the right thing either. The truth is somewhere in the middle.

My advice to you is to end it. And not because I'm judging you, I'm not. But I know what comes next, she finds out and he drops you. Hard.

Then you will know real pain. Earth shattering pain like you have never known before.

Get out know while you still have the upper hard. Don't go to the party. Cut all contact and don't look back. Trust me that how he treats his wife, he will treat you, but you are right in that it will be worse. That is because she is innocent and you are not. Innocent wife always trumps other woman. You will be blamed for it all. We all are. If you can avoid all that, you will be a lot better off.

And yes, I have made blanket statements. I'm sure some men make decisions out of crazy love and some women don't. This just has been my experience from everything I have read and seen.
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Old 30th July 2017, 2:05 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by Serendipity55 View Post
Yes and he says that too, "you deserve more, and you're right to want more" - when I said I wouldn't wait for him.

I'm taking a friend to this party...as mentioned. He's very jealous despite fact I've told him this a platonic friend. Means nothing that he's reacted that way I know. I'm not reading into that other than to think it's a loss of control/power he's worried about perhaps. Or maybe it's less sinister and it's just a concern I am moving on (which I do want to). So I am reading into it (sorry) but not in a rose-tinted way.
You have a whole board of people on here, ow/om, ws and bs alike who are all telling you that you are worth far better treatment than what he is giving you.

I hope you are in a place where you can take to heart what you're hearing on here.
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Old 30th July 2017, 4:48 PM   #67
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Thank you Midnight - that's very insightful and I'm glad for the benefit of your experience. I had a quick think and most of the divorces I am aware of were instigated by women. My friend is a divorce lawyer so I'll have to ask him what his experience is. I definitely think with my heart and head but I guess I'm guided by emotions - he's a head man...although I did say to him once whether he also stays for financial reasons and he said that wasn't as important in the grand scheme of things - it was his children, "it's all about the kids now" he said. But also probably doesn't want to move out of his house as he always tells me how it's value has doubled in a short space of time. Show off. But I take the point - he will operate on a more pragmatic level than me and also a fundamentally selfish one.

Good to know he'll never ever leave and it's also good to know that it's not that I'm not good enough or even enough - he just values his life as it is above all. Lucky him getting to enjoy it without even a pang of conscience or consequence. I know I sound bitter but that does feel awfully unfair. Did anyone else feel that sense of injustice? He's getting away with it and he's got all he wants.

Thanks everyone else too - I know you're all offering me a huge amount of support and I'm a stranger essentially. I will use your words and I will hold onto them when I'm feeling weak.
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Old 30th July 2017, 5:38 PM   #68
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Let's be honest here - if it is really about his kids, he wouldn't be out chasing another woman when he had a young child at home. He certainly wouldn't be contacting you when he has a week old baby and his wife is recovering from a c-section and caring for a newborn and a small child. He definitely wouldn't be taking time and energy that could be spent with his family - to spend it with you.

I'm sorry, but the reality check is that good fathers, those who are devoted to their children and their families, just don't do this kind of thing... They invest in the well being of their marriage and their family, they don't invest in selfish relationships outside the marriage that put the emotional and financial health and well being of their family at risk.

You have to quit believing his lies... He may think that he is devoted to his children - but his actions tell you otherwise.

And I most definitely agree with Midnights post... Women think with their emotions "if he loves me, he will want to be with me..." Men are much more pragmatic. They value the security and comforts of their family, even if the relationship is not good. And, they take a significant financial hit when they get divorced. Why suffer financially when you can maintain stability and comfort... and have a little fun on the side.

Whether he chooses to leave his wife or not, it has absolutely nothing to do with whether you are good enough or whether he loves you enough. The truth is, he has told you that he will not leave his family and the statistics show that it's unlikely that he will leave his wife for you. Your heart just wanted to believe otherwise (and still does, it would seem).

And, don't fool yourself that it is only men who do this... Women also do this, although their reasons for having an affair may or may not be different (the most common reason being that their emotional needs are not being met at home, someone comes along to show them some attention and make them feel special/wanted and boom!).

And if I may, the fact that he would talk about your affair in front of his child and/or want you to attend social gatherings with his wife and children is twisted. This guy has no conscience and absolutely no remorse for his behavior. It's really shameful.

I can appreciate that you are struggling to come to terms with the situation, but I too want to shake you! You seem like a nice person, who has suffered a traumatic loss and needs to find a new path in life. You have trusted the wrong person and given away your heart unwisely. You simply must gain perspective and make better decisions - for yourself and your daughter. I too hope that you will hear the support and encouragement of a bunch of stranger on the Internet and get yourself some counselling - so that you can create a better future for yourself and your daughter.

Last edited by BaileyB; 30th July 2017 at 5:47 PM..
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Old 30th July 2017, 6:05 PM   #69
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Lots of people have happy, fulfilling relationships with their children in a joint custody situation- this is no secret and the MM probably sees that on a daily basis in his life- why he continues to use this excuse is a question you need to answer for yourself.
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Old 30th July 2017, 9:41 PM   #70
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Did anyone else feel that sense of injustice? He's getting away with it and he's got all he wants.
Yes. That has been a very common theme here. Many of us have felt that feeling, that injustice, that these guys don't feel any sense of wrongdoing and face no consequence for their actions. Sometimes there is a D Day, like in my situation, so I got a little karmic relief, but yes, I occasionally think about how easy it was for him to use me, drop me and go on with this life, as I am sure he is doing right now. I'm long forgotten.

I could give you a big post about how he will get his, end up alone, and all that - but the reality is that there is a good chance that nothing will happen to them. They will never realize how they made another person suffer.

So what can you do then? You can realize that it doesn't always all work out in the end, life isn't a movie, and the best you can do right now is look out for yourself and your own needs. And some guy cheating on his wife is not in line with your own needs. You just put one foot in front of the other and move forward.

You realize the 5 most powerful words in the English language are: I Am Not A Victim. You are choosing this and you can un-choose it. You have control over your actions, maybe not your feelings, but change your thoughts, change your actions and your feelings will follow behind.

There is no magic pill but you need to decide, today is the day. Because otherwise you will be right here 6 months from now. 6 years from now. It happens.

If you end it and don't look back, I promise you that one day, you won't really care that he didn't get his. It won't matter because you are too busy living your life. Doesn't that sound nice?
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Old 30th July 2017, 9:50 PM   #71
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Good to know he'll never ever leave and it's also good to know that it's not that I'm not good enough or even enough - he just values his life as it is above all. Lucky him getting to enjoy it without even a pang of conscience or consequence. I know I sound bitter but that does feel awfully unfair. Did anyone else feel that sense of injustice? He's getting away with it and he's got all he wants.
Yes, I feel every ounce of this. It occupies a ridiculous proportion of my waking energy and thoughts, honestly. We are the ones who make the sacrifices and bear the burdens and live with the consequences. They never felt what we did and likely have no idea what we've gone through. Either we've never flat-out told them, or perhaps we have but they still don't comprehend it because they weren't as invested as we were.

It's not fair, but... life isn't, always.
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Old 30th July 2017, 10:42 PM   #72
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Did anyone else feel that sense of injustice? He's getting away with it and he's got all he wants.
No, I don't feel that because I was the one who ended it. I feel proud of myself for extricating myself from that situation. But I know he now has to do the hard work of either 1) finding and grooming a new victim, or 2) working on his marriage.

(fwiw, I'm betting on #1)
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Old 31st July 2017, 4:44 AM   #73
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I suppose, without me, he doesn't have everything he wants because he also wants me as the OW...I also know I won't care about the injustice of it all when I'm clear of it and have benefit of hindsight.

As someone posted on the MM's Story thread...the MM continues to live within the parameters of his M (which if he chooses to ignore the problems and truly does love his OW as well as his W will be unfulfilling on some level...maybe) whereas the OW has the opportunity to meet new people and move on, to become involved with a man with integrity and conscience.

He really lashed out when he found out I was bringing a friend to this party. He was peeved that (a) it is a man; and (b) he thought I'd told someone else about the A (I haven't but he knows I told a close gf). He didn't care at all that the reason for me bringing a plus one was for moral support in case he brings his W (he won't tell me if he is or isn't - maybe he doesn't know yet). He didn't even care when I said I need support as I'm not sure how I will feel/react. His reply was "react how you want to react...you have just told me what you do is 'none of my business'". Why do you speak to me like that?"...I admit I was angry so I did say "I don't need to run decisions past you, what I do is my concern". I know this sounds very petty and an embarrassing exchange between two adults but it illustrates, I think, his true colours. His lack of care...his anger is purely derived from self-interest, selfish concerns. Couldn't give a toss about my feelings or his W's or putting us both in a very invidious situation.
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Old 31st July 2017, 6:24 AM   #74
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He really lashed out when he found out I was bringing a friend to this party. He was peeved that (a) it is a man; and (b) he thought I'd told someone else about the A (I haven't but he knows I told a close gf). He didn't care at all that the reason for me bringing a plus one was for moral support in case he brings his W (he won't tell me if he is or isn't - maybe he doesn't know yet). He didn't even care when I said I need support as I'm not sure how I will feel/react. His reply was "react how you want to react...you have just told me what you do is 'none of my business'". Why do you speak to me like that?"...I admit I was angry so I did say "I don't need to run decisions past you, what I do is my concern". I know this sounds very petty and an embarrassing exchange between two adults but it illustrates, I think, his true colours. His lack of care...his anger is purely derived from self-interest, selfish concerns. Couldn't give a toss about my feelings or his W's or putting us both in a very invidious situation.
I don't think it's petty at all. I think it's very significant. You're rebalancing the relationship which was previously skewed heavily in his favor; you're re-calibrating, and he doesn't like losing that advantage. Wasn't he the one who wanted to involve you more with his W and family? Well, here's his chance. If I were you I'd bring around dates & male friends at every opportunity. Let him stew in his own juices. What's good for the goose.
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Old 31st July 2017, 7:17 AM   #75
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Absolutely, he doesn't like the fact that he is not the person holding all the cards any more... His anger , directed at you, is an attempt to intimidate you and regain control of the relationship. I say, bring that man along if that's what you need to get through the day. What is good for the goose...
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