MM is separated... should I wait this out?

[windycity]

Our affair started 2 years ago in August. We became really good friends and developed a very close bond. We talk every day, are there for each other, confide in one another, etc. I can count in one hand how often we have been physically intimate, so it's mostly an emotional affair, I guess is what you'd call it?

 

Some background: His relationship with his wife ended years ago, but they stayed together for their kids who are 10 and 4 years old. They have been together since high school. He married her when she got pregnant right after they graduated from university. Things fell apart when the baby was born, but they kept trying to make it work. They even had the second baby thinking it would "fix" their marriage, but it only made things worse. They separated when the baby was 2.

 

We started getting close a year after he moved out. His 10 year old didn't take the separation very well and started acting out at home and at school. It got to be too much and when his lease his was up, he moved back in.

 

He had said he loves me and that he hopes I understand that this is only a temporary arrangement. In a weird way, I did understand. And I respect that he wants to make things better for his children.

 

It bothers me that he is just separated, not divorced. He is still a married man and I am still the other woman. He says being legally married doesn't mean anything to him anymore. With how crazy things have been with the separation and how his kids were taking it, he just couldn't deal with the stress of officially filing, like all the fights with his ex, going through a custody battle and dividing assets. He said he wanted to take it one step at a time, starting with his kids' well-being and figuring out what to do with his 10 year old.

 

On Valentine's Day we talked about everything again and he said he had planned on moving out by this summer. Last week he made a deposit on a place and it should be ready to go in 6 weeks. He says once he moves out, he will file the divorce papers. He doesn't feel right filing them while they are under the same roof.

 

Another issue is that his ex's parents are very conservative and don't approve of them getting a divorce. They also have a reputation in the community to protect. He says that stuff doesn't make a difference to him anymore, but to give him time to break it to them. They've were his parents too for more than half his life, so he feels the need to make things "proper."

 

I believe that he *wants* to end his marriage and officially start a life and a future with me. But I worry that I don't actually know when that will be. How do I know that he won't just move back in again when it gets tough? Or that he won't back out of filing because of their kids or finances or his ex's family's reputation or whatever other reason? I have this fear that a year or two from now he'd still be married and I'd have wasted so much time.

 

Should I wait and see how it plays out? He should be moving in to his new place towards the end of July, and if he files soon the divorce will be finalized by the end of the year.

Edited June 10, 2017 by windycity

[Overtaxed]

I don't see why not (wait it out). If he's really separated, then I'd consider it, he's heading for a D. Just don't get too invested, separation does sometimes lead to D, but sometimes it also leads to R.

[minimariah]

We started getting close a year after he moved out.

 

hmmmmmm...

 

but the timeline doesn't fit - the baby is 4 NOW, they separated when the baby was 2. you say the A has been going on for 2 years - so you got close as soon as he moved out, no?

 

doesn't really matter - just me noticing & being devil's advocate.

 

Should I wait and see how it plays out?

 

yes. him making a deposit is a good sign.

i don't know - do YOU feel like waiting is a good idea?

 

He should be moving in to his new place towards the end of July, and if he files soon the divorce will be finalized by the end of the year.

 

hmmmm... this sounds VERY optimistic to me. not sure where you live & what's up with the law but if he's preparing for a custody & assets battle... i don't think it will be that fast. does he agree with the ex on the important questions...? will he - for example - fight for full custody or for the house, assets, whatever...? i think that, in most countries, dividing assets is a special process but if they don't agree on the custody...? it will take a lot longer than just three or four months to get divorced.

 

this part i don't understand:

 

He says that stuff doesn't make a difference to him anymore, but to give him time to break it to them. They've were his parents too for more than half his life, so he feels the need to make things "proper."

 

well - he DID separare & he was out of the house. surely, they were aware of this...? so there wouldn't be need to BREAK anything to them, really. unless they have no idea about the separation?

 

he made a typical mistake - when the kids start acting out, you go to a therapist... not move back in. this way, him leaving AGAIN will for sure have the kid act out AGAIN + it won't be fun when he introduces the new person (you). very typical mistake in steps. and i'd also advise you to let go of their marriage & explaining how and why it fell apart - another typical trap for the other person; you don't know anything about their dynamics & it is none of your business anyway.

Edited June 10, 2017 by minimariah

[aileD]

Yes. Wait urban out, but do so from s place of no contact.

 

Did you verify anything he's said? With his wife? If the marriage has been over than surely she wouldn't mind him dating. All this stuff he said, how do you know it's true?

 

The bad thing is, he went back once before.....that doesn't bode well. He may go back again. He may have intentions of leaving but not have the strength to fully follow through.

 

Plus regardless of anything, his wife and family deserve the respect of the end of this marriage to be about them and not about you. Give them all time to handle things alone. Plus not having you around---if he loves you immensely--will motivate him to actually get things done this time.

 

Other wise you're going to probably get caught in a back and forth again.

[elaine567]

He is not separated yet.

 

He is still a married man and I am still the other woman.

^^^ The bottom line.

[somanymistakes]

If he moved back into the house, even just for the kids, he's legally no longer separated and you need to steer clear.

 

As for talking to the wife, it might be a good idea to ensure she KNOWS they separated (we have had cases of men taking separate residences 'for work' and the spouse buying it!) but just because they're splitting up does not mean she'll surely be fine with him dating, she might still be furious! OTOH it's a good idea to know that, if you intend to be serious with this guy, because if they do divorce his ex is likely to be involved in his life.

[elaine567]

I think he has given you a whole load of reasons here as to why he will likely stay put and I am not really convinced that anything has really changed to make him leave for good this time.

 

Small children, one in particular suffered when he left the first time. Few parents want to hurt their kids. (Do you have any proof the 10 year old was acting up or did he simply tell you that to give him an excuse to go back home to his wife).

Custody battles scare him.

High school sweethearts - loads of shared history. He may tell you they are just going through the motions, or they are always fighting or any other number of negative things about their marriage, but they may not be true.

Conservative family with individual and family reputations on the line here.

Money and assets to protect

 

vs

 

a 2 year affair,

a potential messy costly divorce,

a custody battle

His "reputation" may be in tatters and he may be a great disappointment to the wider conservative community that he is part of at the moment...

 

===

Does his wife know about you?

Does she know "her marriage ended years ago" or does she believe they are going through a rough patch and she is desperately trying to fix their marriage? Was the previous separation an official separation, a trial separation or was it just "space"?

He is telling you he loves you and he will leave, but what is he telling her?

Yes, he has placed a deposit, but that is the easy part, has he actually made any plans to leave for good, as in told his wife and kids, consulted an attorney...

 

Do you actually know him well enough to pledge a big chunk of your life to him?

He is after all a cheater, will you ever be able to trust him completely?

Will he in fact choose you after all of this, or are you just the exit affair to give him the courage to get out of his marriage and once "free" he will forget about you?

Or will he be happy just stringing you along for years as his OW with excuse after excuse... some men do.

 

I have no answers for you as to the future here, who knows? but I suggest you try and back up everything he says to you with hard evidence.

So many OWs trust their MM totally, to find later on that it was just lies to keep her sweet and on board. He tells both women what they want to hear.

Be careful.

[anika99]

Since he is moving out in 6 weeks I don't see a reason for you not to wait and see if that part really happens. However if your security and happiness is contingent on him being divorced by the end of the year then I don't think you are going to be very happy.

 

Dating a newly seperated or divorcing man is risky business even in the best of circumstances and there are no guarantees. Yes sometimes they ultimately decide to reconcile with their spouse and go back. I had a friend that went back to his family and marriage 5yrs after they seperated. Sometimes the seperated/divorcing man decides they want to be alone for awhile, sometimes they decide they actually don't want to be tied down to a new relationship when they realize they're now free to play the field. They will latch onto whoever wants to whoever what's to hold their hand through the pain of their divorce and then when that crisis is over decide that they don't want to be with that person either. And sometimes they actually do get divorced and really commit to the new person and go on to have a long relationship together.

 

So anything can happen but there is no way to know what will happen and there's no point in asking the seperated/divorcing man what will happen because he doesn't know either. What he says today can change tomorrow. If you are going to be involved with a divorcing man then you have to be okay with taking it one day at a time and living in the moment. You have to be okay with knowing that your relationship with him may or may not last. You have to be okay with letting him handle his divorce in his own way on his own timeline. If you are gong to try to run the show by insisting he must do this and that on your schedule in order to make you happy then you are in for misery. It sounds like you are in a big hurry for him to seperate and divorce quickly but you have to accept that you have no say or control over his marriage or his divorce. If you can't accept that then you probably shouldn't wait.

[MidnightBlue1980]

I wasted 3 years with a guy in this exact situation, except when he moved back it was to his parents, of course that was a fact I could never verify. But in all other aspects it seemed like a regular relationship, except for the fact he was still legally married. And that is the thing - even if the wife doesn't care and knows (big if), divorce moves extremely slowly with kids, and you could waste years of your life. Years which you could be meeting someone new who you did not have the beginning of your relationship marked by an affair. You could get married and have a regular life.

 

I'd wait the 6 weeks, you probably won't need 6 whole weeks as if he signs a lease, he probably has it already and moving does not happen overnight. But I would not wait around longer. It could be a total lie and he is engaging in false reconciliation with his wife.

 

In my situation after 3 years, I moved on and looking back I thank my stars I did not "win" this guy. Not only because I went on to meet my now husband and have a family but because the guy was a total manipulative liar without a conscience or soul.

 

That was over 10 years ago. The guy by the way? Still married.

[misspalmy]

I think he will end up back with her, or using it was back up. remerber hes a lair

[misspalmy]

I wasted 3 years with a guy in this exact situation, except when he moved back it was to his parents, of course that was a fact I could never verify. But in all other aspects it seemed like a regular relationship, except for the fact he was still legally married. And that is the thing - even if the wife doesn't care and knows (big if), divorce moves extremely slowly with kids, and you could waste years of your life. Years which you could be meeting someone new who you did not have the beginning of your relationship marked by an affair. You could get married and have a regular life.

 

I'd wait the 6 weeks, you probably won't need 6 whole weeks as if he signs a lease, he probably has it already and moving does not happen overnight. But I would not wait around longer. It could be a total lie and he is engaging in false reconciliation with his wife.

 

In my situation after 3 years, I moved on and looking back I thank my stars I did not "win" this guy. Not only because I went on to meet my now husband and have a family but because the guy was a total manipulative liar without a conscience or soul.

 

That was over 10 years ago. The guy by the way? Still married.

 

did the wife ever find out?

[isolatedgothic]

You say that he says he will never marry again...so what does that mean for you? Should he actually leave his wife and children, does that mean you'll be his girlfriend for life? Or until you decide you love him enough to marry him, and he will refuse?

 

Men say what they mean. Think about if that is good enough for you, for life.

 

I like how others are warning you to leave him alone till he gets all this sorted out. That is truly the best thing in the world.

[whichwayisup]

But he is still 'living life' with his wife. He is telling you one thing but doing another. Time will tell if he actually has a plan to follow through on his promises to you or if it's just words.

 

You make a deadline for yourself that way if he doesn't move, you end it and tell him to call you when he's officially divorced and actually able to commit to you and date you in a proper way.

 

Question, are you prepared to be step mom to his children? Just know that his (ex) wife will always be in the picture on some level because of their kids.

[goodyblue]

I think, since he is back home, you need to wait and see if he actually divorced. When men are done, they usually mean it so the back and forth doesn't bode well.

 

Not only thaT, what are your PLANS oncE he does move out? You need to live separately, date, let his kids adjust. Does he talk about this stuff? Do you have a plan?

 

This is what you need to consider. And don't interact with his wife.

[BaileyB]

I wouldn't.

 

I would never trust him not to go back to his family, or to find another woman and do to me exactly what he has done to his wife. No way!

[windycity]

hmmmmmm...

 

but the timeline doesn't fit - the baby is 4 NOW, they separated when the baby was 2. you say the A has been going on for 2 years - so you got close as soon as he moved out, no?

 

doesn't really matter - just me noticing & being devil's advocate.

 

I probably messed up the timeline by counting the duration of the pregnancy as part of the baby's age. Wrote this out in the middle of the night. It was definitely a year after he moved out.

 

 

yes. him making a deposit is a good sign.

i don't know - do YOU feel like waiting is a good idea?

 

I don't know? I'd say yes, but I just hve some fears and reservations because he already moved back once. I know how much he loves his kids, so making a deposit or even moving out for the second time doesn't mean he won't move back in again.

 

hmmmm... this sounds VERY optimistic to me. not sure where you live & what's up with the law but if he's preparing for a custody & assets battle... i don't think it will be that fast. does he agree with the ex on the important questions...? will he - for example - fight for full custody or for the house, assets, whatever...? i think that, in most countries, dividing assets is a special process but if they don't agree on the custody...? it will take a lot longer than just three or four months to get divorced.

 

They have a verbal custody agreement. Same one as they agreed to when he first moved out. This is my worry too that if or when he files it won't be as smooth as he's making it out to be.

 

this part i don't understand:

 

 

 

well - he DID separare & he was out of the house. surely, they were aware of this...? so there wouldn't be need to BREAK anything to them, really. unless they have no idea about the separation?

 

Aware yes. they interpreted it as a cooling off period, "separate and figure things out so you can get back together again." Her family is also very religious so divorce is a whole other level.

 

he made a typical mistake - when the kids start acting out, you go to a therapist... not move back in. this way, him leaving AGAIN will for sure have the kid act out AGAIN + it won't be fun when he introduces the new person (you). very typical mistake in steps. and i'd also advise you to let go of their marriage & explaining how and why it fell apart - another typical trap for the other person; you don't know anything about their dynamics & it is none of your business anyway.

 

I told him the same thing and suggested his kid go to therapy. He was against it at first, but after a couple months he did take my suggestion.

 

I disagree, I think it's important for me to know what happened to their marriage because it helped me understand his situation and thought process, as well as their dynamics. If he hadn't shared those things with me, I'd likely assume he was just lying about everything. I am curious why you say it's a trap though.

 

Thanks for the thoughtful and thorough response.

[windycity]

If he moved back into the house, even just for the kids, he's legally no longer separated and you need to steer clear.

 

As for talking to the wife, it might be a good idea to ensure she KNOWS they separated (we have had cases of men taking separate residences 'for work' and the spouse buying it!) but just because they're splitting up does not mean she'll surely be fine with him dating, she might still be furious! OTOH it's a good idea to know that, if you intend to be serious with this guy, because if they do divorce his ex is likely to be involved in his life.

 

I have no intention of talking to his wife. They are for sure separated, but you are right, legally they're not. He didn't think it through when he moved back in. He just wanted to make it better for his kid. I've accepted that his ex will be a part of his life post-divorce. They actually have a great co-parenting relationship, but it did not work at all as a married couple.

[windycity]

But he is still 'living life' with his wife. He is telling you one thing but doing another. Time will tell if he actually has a plan to follow through on his promises to you or if it's just words.

 

You make a deadline for yourself that way if he doesn't move, you end it and tell him to call you when he's officially divorced and actually able to commit to you and date you in a proper way.

 

Question, are you prepared to be step mom to his children? Just know that his (ex) wife will always be in the picture on some level because of their kids.

 

He's not really living life with her. They lead very separate lives outside of co-parenting.

 

A personal deadline is a good idea. I guess I just have to figure out when that will be.

 

I'm at peace with his ex wife being in the picture forever. I don't expect her to go anywhere. If anything I admire their relationship as parents.

[MidnightBlue1980]

did the wife ever find out?

 

I don't know. She knew about the woman before me. I'm sure she had her suspicions. But the current wife was the other woman when this guy was married to his first wife. The OW got pregnant, left her husband, he had to divorce his wife and they married. He proceeded to cheat on the 2nd wife through the pregnancies and marriage. The kids thing though, that bound him.

 

I know people think, what was wrong with me knowing all this, to get involved with him for 3 years, but I am telling you - these guys, they are professionals.

[travelbug1996]

How are they separated but they live together?? If they live together they are together as a family and probably having sex as a married couple. I hope I read that wrong.

 

If he is living with his wife back off and go no contact, He is playing you.

 

 

If they live separate lives does he get to stay all night with you? Who did he spend Valentine's day with?

Edited June 11, 2017 by travelbug1996

[windycity]

How are they separated but they live together?? If they live together they are together as a family and probably having sex as a married couple. I hope I read that wrong.

 

If he is living with his wife back off and go no contact, He is playing you.

 

 

If they live separate lives does he get to stay all night with you? Who did he spend Valentine's day with?

 

Their relationship isn't like that and is very much over. They have separate rooms, separate lives, etc. and are living together as co-parents. Valentines, birthdays and such have been spent with me.

 

My fear is that he won't have the courage to go through with moving out or with the divorce. Or if he does, he'll just move back in when it gets hard again.

[whichwayisup]

Their relationship isn't like that and is very much over. They have separate rooms, separate lives, etc. and are living together as co-parents. Valentines, birthdays and such have been spent with me.

 

My fear is that he won't have the courage to go through with moving out or with the divorce. Or if he does, he'll just move back in when it gets hard again.

 

I don't believe this. If they are 'only' together for their kids, don't you think they DO go out on family outings with the kids? Celebrate birthdays them? See the extended family's? Seems no different than a typical MM telling his OW what she wants to hear. I mean if he told you they were sleeping in the same room how would you feel?

[BTDT2012]

If he is living with his wife, he is not separated. If his wife is in the dark about your relationship with him and they are living together, he is not separated. When my WH moved back in after we separated, we did not initially share a bedroom.

[aileD]

If he's separated but living together for the comfort of a child , he should have no problem bringing you out in public, and taking you on dates. He shouldn't have a problem bringing you to his house when his kids aren't around. He should have no problem introducing you as his girlfriend to his fsmily. Does he do these things?

 

I know you don't WANT to talk to his wife. But honestly, it's the only respectful thing to do. To say to her "I know you two are separated and have a great and unique co-parenting situation. I would like to know if there's a way for me to fit into that dynamic as his girlfriend that doesn't jeopardize your parenting relationship"

[anika99]

Their relationship isn't like that and is very much over. They have separate rooms, separate lives, etc. and are living together as co-parents. Valentines, birthdays and such have been spent with me.

 

My fear is that he won't have the courage to go through with moving out or with the divorce. Or if he does, he'll just move back in when it gets hard again.

 

Have to admit this sounds pretty fishy to me. If he's leading a completely seperate life then what exactly was the point of moving back in? At the very least they are living together as a family. Eating together, going out together, etc. And you've never met or spoken with his wife? It really sounds like he is keeping you a secret. Who have you met? Has he introduced you to his children, his family or his friends?

 

You will know if he is serious about moving out if he does so in the next six weeks but I don't know that you should trust him not to go back again in the future or that you should put much faith in him being divorced by the end of the year.